If you wanna know how I've launched all my content, I ripped the audio from my presentation at Russell Brunson's Inner Circle...

Hey, what's going on, everyone? It's Steve Larsen. You're listening to Sales Funnel Radio and I'm excited for this episode. What I did for this episode is I wanted to rip the audio from the presentation that I gave at the Inner Circle.

We just barely had the Inner Circle, and it was packed. It was one of the bigger groups. It was a bunch of fun, just absolutely loved it.

I thought I'd rip from you guys the presentation. If you don't know the way that those presentations are handled, everybody gets up and everybody speaks, but the way it is ... One of the reasons I like this Mastermind so much ... I've seen others, I've watched ...

What I like is everybody's very giving, and so what we do is we stand up and everybody gives something incredible to the group; either something that's working, some cool hacks, something that's cutting edge, something that's just jaw-dropping, "Oh, my gosh! That's incredible."

You know what I mean?

Then, at the end of it there's an ask and you ask, "Hey, these are the things I'm struggling with. Could you guys help me with X, Y, and Z?" That combination between the two where you've given before you ask is amazing. We obviously see that in selling to our customers and selling to everybody.

The more you can give, obviously, create this feeling of reciprocity, well, it's no different inside of the Inner Circle.

What I did is I ripped the audio from my presentation. We only have 22 minutes, it's really, really fast, so I would love to dive more deeply into this at some point, as this is a topic that I've been obsessing over recently. Anyways, this is cool stuff, and this is how I launched my podcast.

A lot of you guys continue to ask me those questions...

If you have never heard the episode 60 and 61 of Sales Funnel Radio, it will walk you through my content strategy, how I handle it all, but I think you'll like from the standpoint of, as far as how I stack together my episodes when I launch my shows. This is super powerful.

I've had a lot of students now who are actually in top-rankings of iTunes with their podcasts, because of the same strategy that I teach with these, so this is powerful stuff.

Know that there is a lot of data behind it, there's a lot of success stories behind it. I know the strategy works, this is how I launched my own stuff.

Anyway, take notes if you were thinking ... Especially, if you're going to do a blog, or a podcast or whatever, it doesn't matter if you're going to do a podcast or not. This is any type of content strategy, as far as what do you say? What are you doing? How do you call your shot?

How do you become the guru on the mountain without being perceived as an idiot or a jerk or self-centered?

This is how you do it, and I'm excited for this episode. Anyways, we'll cut over to the show here and this is the audio again of my presentation to the Inner Circle. Thanks for listening.

I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today, and now I've left my 9:00 to 5:00 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels.

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

Hey, I'm excited for this, though. I have waited so freaking long to be a part of this group. It's cool. I'm like a combo of really introspective moment, look back, and like, "Yeah," at the same time. That's what I feel like, anyway.

It's been a long road, though. When I first saw that email come in from Russell I was walking through the basketball gym, and I started reading the email. I'm like, my face as I'm reading it goes like, "Oh, it's from Russell," and that's when my face starts going, I was like, "No!"

I stopped and I responded to him that the Inner Circle is closing. I was like, "Don't close, I'm on my way! I don't have $25,000."

I showed him the email like six months ago. He was like, "You know it was an autoresponder, right?" I was like, "Yeah, I know. I just needed to ..." because I didn't see that. Anyway, so it's a good email, though. [inaudible 00:04:01] I could show you some day.

I want to show you my support team for how I got here. This is my support team.

That's Maya. I call her Thigh master, because her thighs are like the two-year-old 12-ounce steaks. Do you know what I mean? Chewy thigh. Anyway, she's the Thigh master. That's Brnley. I call her Pack and Play, because she will randomly dive at me off of couches with no warning.

Anyway, she's awesome, playful. Here's my wife. I call her Princess Babe. That's been the name in my phone since we dated, because ... well, duh.

The whole thing started though when I was ... I really wanted to go to Funnel Hacking Live in 2016. I had no cash for it. I started bootstrapping my way there and I started trading funnels for plane tickets. Funnels for hotel nights. Funnels for event nights. Things like that.

I remember I was riding my ... I was riding ... Do you know those city bikes in San Diego? You can rent them or whatever, slide a card in. What money I had, I did not want to go and actually spend money on a cab. We were living off loans. I had been building funnels for companies and making them successful. I just hadn't charged for stuff yet,

I was just trying to make my story...

I was staying on the other side of San Diego, and I had my luggage over my shoulder riding my bike over to Funnel Hacking Live through the city, around the bay. That's how I did it.

As I was riding the bike over there, I was like, "I'm going to do whatever this man tells me to do, but I will never publish." That was the sentence that came out of my noggin. I was like, "I'm never, ever, ever going to do this publishing game. I do not want to be one of those publishing people. I will not become a character on Facebook Live. I'm not doing any of that. I'm not doing it." The first-

Character in a comic book.

Right? The first day ... Right? I know! Then the first day, and part of it was because I was voted the nicest kid in high school in my graduating class, but it was because I was shy. I had this near clinical fear of adults and massive anxiety; huge insecurities, I've dealt with a lot. Even into my early 20s. It's true. That's why I was like, "I'm never going to do that."

The first thing he says is, "Everyone should start publishing a lot." I was, "Crap! It's the thing I don't want to do!" I gave a lot to get there. We take the picture.

Two day later I was interviewing here, and two days after that graduated, two days after that I was sitting next to The Man.

I'm seeing Russell going on the camera, "What's up everybody?" Then, he's over on podcast, "What's up everybody?" Then on blog typing, "What's up everybody?" I'm like, "There's something to this publishing thing. I've got to do this." Since then, I want to ... I didn't ... I spent three hours trying to figure out the question to ask you guys on Wednesday.

I realized, sitting here, you guys already answered it. I was like, "Dang it," but I couldn't believe how many of you are not publishing, because I started with, not just with no email list, there was no list.

No one knew who I was. I want to show you how I launched these two podcasts, because today we should cross 160,000 downloads. It's freaking nuts. It's the content strategy behind it.

I'm going to show you guys real quick the strategy behind it. I just want you to know that it works. Here is, as of six weeks ago, six people I brought through, they're in the top, if not 100, then 25 for the MLM category in iTunes now. I'm going between number one and number two on Stitcher. Darn you, [Simon Chan 00:07:24]. I will beat him. I'm number six in that category. Then, if you look at the Sales Funnel side. I want to show you how I did it as a seriously shy person.

Everyone of you have to do this. If you guys have massive businesses with these cool audiences, you are sitting on a goldmine. I want to show you real quick how I did it. With Sales Funnel Radio, the way I started it, that was when I started about a year and a half ago. There's been no ad spend on any of these. Can't spend it profitably yet, so I'm not.

Anyways, if you think about this is the concept I came up with as I was launching this. I was so scared I didn't know what to talk about. I chose not to talk. What I did is I thought, I'm going to reach two levels up at all time. If I go through and I say, "If this I me and my level of influence as a brand new person, and there's someone who's a little bit above me, someone who's a little bit above me," and it's like C-list influencers; people who have sway.

People with lists...

You think through, "Oh, my gosh. There's someone above them. Someone above them. Then there's Russell Brunson. Wow!" Let's say it's Tony Robbins, which in my mind I've switched now. "The Pope!" We got at the very top ... Who's at the top?

Batman. Okay? All right. You think through that. I thought, "What if I get other people to do the talking for me and I just provide the platform?" I'm just the platform. It is ridiculous what it has done for me. The Dream 100 comes to you when you are able to boost their status.

I started getting a whole bunch of people to just get on my show. This is the pattern that I used to launch that first show.

My very first episode wasn't even me talking. I was so scared. I was like, "Who's two levels above?" Then when I felt like I had reached up, I reached another two. I reached another two. I didn't want to be ... and it's no hit against John Lee Dumas, but that's all he does; interview, interview, interview.

I don't want to get asked just interview questions. I also want to be seen and positioned as an expert when I do, so I lace in podcasts with myself and what I'm learning.

I was sitting with a student in Dallas a little bit ago, a month ago, and we were chatting. He goes, "What are you going to do on episode 157?" I don't know, I'll figure that out when I end 156. He was like, "Well, aren't you going to run out of things to say?" I had this realization.

You think I already know what I'm going to talk about. The huge secret is that you're learning with me. I can't batch four months of content, because I don't know if I'm going to be able to scrunch four months of learning into that amount of time. That's not my style. When I saw ... Anyway.

When I saw [Peng Joon 00:09:53] do his thing, I was like, "Oh, we're super close to that already." I got six people. We have the sweet concept machine that's been moving and just a few tweaks and we're super close to what he's been doing. This is how I launched the first one.

The second one I did, this was amazing, was, I thought through ... If you think through what the perfect webinar script is, it's not just for webinars. It is the basis of persuasion. What I started thinking through is, oh my gosh, what if I just took the first part of the perfect webinar script and I write an ordinance story for the audience I want to be buying from me later.

The audience that I believe will listen to me. This is in an MLM space, and I took some concepts that everyone believes you need to be successful in that space. "Talk to friends and family. Lose all your relationships." I go through and I just  rocks at them as hard as I can.

I literally wrote a webinar script and I wrote an ordinance story, the three more stories for the secrets and I turned them sideways; so episode number one was the ordinance story, episode number two was this story only for secret number one. The next episode's only the story for secret number two, only secret number three.

Then, that let me go through ... By then, they're so freaking sold, so sold. I haven't even sold them anything, but I have tons of people who reach out to me consistently. Many of you have already. You're in here. They're like, "I listen to your podcast. It's amazing. When are you going to ask for my money somewhere?" I'm like, "Well, you just wait."

Anyways, this is what I thought, is what if I combined them? That's what I've been teaching to my students lately and it is killing it. They're all over on iTunes and because what they've essentially done is sold their audience on why they should continue subscribing and listening.

I combine them. Instead what I do, is I say, okay the first five episodes is going to be literally a sideways webinar. The next after that, I go through and I call my shot publicly and I say, "I have not done the thing that I'm here to show you that I've done yet. Instead, I want to show you that I'm just a few steps ahead and I will document my entire journey, both the successes and the failures.

You won't want to miss this. If you don't want to go through the same pain yourself, follow me and sidestep it." It is crazy what happens.

We're not at 3,000 or 4,000 downloads a day, but we're about 800-ish now. It's been awesome what that does. It's ridiculous. People feel like they know you so well when you get vulnerable with them. I talk about all this stuff. I talk about how shy I was as a kid. I talk about Russell was going, "What's happening you guys? What's happening guys? What's happening guys?"

I learned this and that. It's really cool to see if you take the standpoint of a reporter and become the expert in front of them, crazy what that does.

Here's the funnel that I kind of made up, but it works super well. I went through and I figured out, on all the end of my podcasts as well ... I'm going to hurry because there's something I want to ask you guys. I create this ridiculous bait. Something that is so insatiable and I say, go to blah-blah-blah.com and check it out. It's a free course, and when they go opt in, what they're actually doing, on the very first thing is my ordinance story again, that's the first video.

Then I tell them, if you opt in, I'll give you this cool free course. Thank you so much. It's like a 72% off  on the thing, still, it's crazy, crazy. I haven't sold anything to them yet. I pre-frame the crap out of them, though.

Over the next six days, it's essentially a product launch funnel. They don't know it. "It's a free course," but it's a product launch funnel. Underneath every video is the option for them to go learn and experience more from me. It just goes through my webinar registration page and I sell. My best sales, my best customers, my best advocates, Dream 100 people, future affiliates, all come from my podcast, not my ads. My hardest customers come from my ads. Anyway.

That's super cool. I have a four-and-a-half-hour course I created on this.  Which as a gift to all of you guys, I will give it to all of you.

It's super cool, if I may say so myself. It's pretty epic. It blows me away. I'm like, "Holy crap! A lot of you guys aren't publishing." I didn't even know how to get as big as you have been without doing this stuff. I'm excited for you to plug that in. If you have any questions, ask campaign.

Can I ask really quick, you just ...them, like, "Ha!" Your hardest customers come from your ads. Your easiest customers come from your content ... Anyway, it just makes you think the frame they go through. It makes me want to take all my crappy hard ad customers and shove them to something like a podcast so that they become good customers and then we sell that at that point.

Anyway. That's-

Well, what I realized ... I studied Ryan Holiday like a beast. When you think about it, what controls public opinion? Publications do. Right? All of our ideas, our cultural ideas, come from the news.

Whoever controls content, controls ideas. What I'm doing is creating ... I have the funnel going, which is awesome and it's doing really well, but I'm creating a content machine that can go through and it is repurposing the crap out of everything that I do to the nth degree.

I've figured out I spend about $20,000 a month in hard cost in just my content machine only, because it spreads the ideas.

I'm trying to change the MLM industry. I will not do that on my own, so instead I create mini-me's, teach them how to do it as well. When we are the only ones talking, the highest ranked on iTunes across blogs and everywhere, we affect ideas and belief. That's what I'm doing.

Real quick, I want to ... I got to go. The reason this works is because story amplifies value. When you think about your offers, your offer has generic value inside of it. This American flag, what's the material cost for this flag? $20? Meaning retail value, probably about $20, maybe a dollar to actually manufacture. Watch.

This certificate is from a senator ordering that this flag be flown on the White House for me specifically. Now, how much value just got added to this? It's worth way more than $20. I'll not trade it for that either. Isn't it interesting? Most the reason why you can't sell your thing for what you want to when you start doing things on a..., "Oh, my gosh. They just don't believe me."

It's because your story suck. They don't understand yet. There's already inherent value in the flag, but what amplifies and explodes on multiples and exponential curve is story, because story gives context.

Just one more thing before I ... I got to show you what I'm stuck on, because ... Dark example, a man walks down an alley. He shoots another man, and he dies. Context, it's a war zone.

Shifted everything. Story creates context. Context amplifies value...

Anyway. Is that helpful?

Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

Freaking, geek out on this stuff like crazy. It's the fastest 22 minutes of my life. Oh, my gosh. I already talk fast, I'm winded. Okay.

Wow. Thanks for listening. Yeah, please remember to write and subscribe.

Hey, you want me to speak at your next event or Mastermind? Let me know what I can share that would be most valuable by going to SteveJLarsen.com and book my time now.

I'm STOKED that Peng got on my show. Come learn how he transformed both his audience and himself in his crazy story...

What's going on everyone, it's Steve Larsen and you are listening to Sales Funnel Radio. This episode is a little bit different. I had the incredible honor of having Peng Joon on the show with me.

And if you don't know who he is I've heard him described many times as the Tony Robbins of Asia, actually by a lot of other big people.

Anyways, he's very, very impressive...

Millions and millions of followers. This was a huge honor to have him on.

What I was trying to do is I was trying to do a Zoom interview so that I could record him, and I together, so you could see our faces and have the first video episode of Sales Funnel Radio.

The issue is that he is in Malaysia, and I am here in Boise Idaho. We both have fast internets. I think literally the fact that we were on the other side of the world from each other, the internet was not agreeing with that. So anyways, I had ripped the audio from it instead and just do audio only.

This interview is incredible you guys. How should I say this? The quality of my life, but also the direct thickness of my wall has been impacted directly from Peng Joon, and especially what he taught at Funnel Hacking live, and the things that he's doing.

I watched him for quite some time and he is very, very, impressive. I was incredibly honored to have him on.

So anyways, excited for the interview. Please definitely take notes, and if there's little glitches or whatever here and there with the sound, or the interview I apologize with that. Again, a lot of it had to do with just I was being on the other side of the world.

We eventually had to turn off our video, and just do an audio interview. So if it's a little glitchy here and there I apologize, but this is worth your time to learn and listen of what he's doing.

In fact, much of the inner circle now is calling their own content strategy they coined it the Peng Joon method. It is because of how powerful this stuff has been in their own content curation and generation, and spreading it all over the world.

Guys, I'm just very thankful for you guys being here and listening to Sales Funnel Radio. Please go take notes and welcome to this episode with Peng Joon.

I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. Now I left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt completely from scratch?...

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business. Using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

Alright guys, hey I'm excited for this. This is gonna be so much fun. I've had this individual on my list of people that would be a dream to interview for actually a long time. There's an actual list, and I'm blown away right now.

I'm gonna try not to blush too much. This is gonna be a bunch of fun. I actually have on here, Peng Joon.

He has such a gigantic following, and the way that he's done is actually amazing to me, totally astounding. And has had a direct impact on literally the way that I do my personal business, as well as I know a lot of you guys as well, so this is gonna be a bunch of fun to dive on in.

Anyways, without further ado I welcome you to the show. How's it going Peng?

Peng Joon: Hey, I'm good.

Steve Larsen: Thanks for taking the time over there I know it's a historical day like you said.

Peng Joon: That's right. I'm just so excited. It's one in the morning right now, but I don't think I'm gonna be sleeping any time soon, because I'm just so excited. History made here in Malaysia.

Steve Larsen: So cool. You just went and voted, and waiting for results is that what it is right now, everyone's waiting?

Peng Joon: Yes, that's right.

Steve Larsen: That's so cool. Thanks for taking the time to do this especially during such a big day over there as well. For everyone else, first of all if you're not following Peng, he's one of the go to people. I watch everything he does, okay.

Go follow him. Go do everything he says to...

How did you get started with this whole thing? You kind of talked a little bit about it at Funnel Hacking live, and you were showing a video of how you first started out on stage. It was amazing.

I think it broke everyone's beliefs on the ability to be successful like this. Can you just for everyone else you mind just talking a little bit about that what you were doing?

Peng Joon: So here's the quick back story. For my entire life I've always been this really shy, introverted kid. When I start off with my online journey I just wanted to be anonymous and make money online without speaking to anyone ever.

So what I did was back then I was really struggling. And here in Malaysia things are really different. My first pay slip, I actually got my first job for was about 300 U.S. dollars and it was my monthly pay cheque.

I worked on that job for nearly two years before I realized I need to do something different.

So what I did was I didn't realize I had a strength back then, but I was really passionate about computer games.

I created my first ever digital product which is really like a 32 page World of Warcraft ebook, that was it.

It did well. It enabled me to, and I started scaling to all these other gaming websites and guides, and because I didn't want to be branded as Peng Joon, because I had this limiting believed that I thought to myself nobody would ever buy a product from someone called Peng Joon.

So a lot of these sites I branded under my pen name Tony Sanders which really, true story was Tony Robinson, Colonel Sanders. It was Tony Sanders.

Basically, the turning point was when I had all these different niche websites, and I owned several dating websites in the dating niche as well.

So I was also branded Tony Sanders, and one day without me realizing it I actually set a huge broadcast for a dating offer to my entire gaming list. So I got 400,000 gamers receiving a dating offer, and the spam complaints was really high, and I was using AWeber back then, and they literally shut me down.

And I couldn't believe it because I was paying I think $2500 a month On my bill, and I would never thought they would shut me down, but they did. And used to give me a copy of my email list, and we went back and forth for probably over 10 days.

This is the terms of service it stated here that if you shut me down we are not obligated to give you an email list.

So I really lost my entire business overnight. Because of that, I realized you know what this is an opportunity for me to do something different, and I want to be able to share with other people what I did in my gaming, and all these different niche websites that I did.

So I thought why not teach other people how they too can market what they know based on their life experience, their passion, and learn, monetize what they knew.

So that was the first time ever I actually stepped out of my comfort zone, and decided to ... But I was really shy and introverted, and I still am, but what I did I wanted to improve myself, so I started going all these different speaker trainer events.

I started practicing in front of a camera, in front of the mirror...

It was a journey. That has allowed me to, so it was a lot of journey of self-discovery getting a lot of past my fears, limiting beliefs, and all that kind of stuff. That has enabled me to now speak in many different countries, and more than 20 countries now.

Doing events, doing workshops, retreats all that kind of stuff...

Steve Larsen: There had to have been this moment then, because I actually was very similar. I was so shy. I got the nicest kid award, because no one heard me speak. You know what I mean? I actually really, really it was one of the reasons I wanted to talk to you about this, and ask you about it.

It's actually one of the biggest questions my audience wanted me to ask you as well. When you had this ... I was so afraid to talk to people. If you had the same kind of thing I remember there was this moment for me where I just realized of this self-awareness. “Oh my gosh, I'm shy."

And I didn't know that for a while...

Holy crap. I had to actually start actually doing things kind of like what you did. Was there a moment when you realized, oh my gosh I need to become, I had to become something. I want to shape and shift the way I am. Is there a moment you can think about-

Peng Joon: Oh yeah I remember the moment so vividly. It's basically when I did my first ever event. So back then, after I did all of those different events. For a long time this event organizer, Success Resources, they've always wanted me to speak on their stages. But I always said no, because speaking is not for me...

Eventually, I took a leap of faith and I did my first event...

So back then after going to all these different speaker things and stuff that was when I realized they talked about the stack. Back then it was pretty old school. You would use a flip chart, and you right down the offer and the price, and then you would kind of cross things out.

You give out the bonus, and you say things like, “For first 17 people go to the back room and sign up you get all these different things.” So I did that in my first event, and it was in this huge, it was at the Singapore Expo Hall it was this huge room.

There was about 900 people there. Right after I did my stack and offer my bonus and I said, “For first 17 people go to the back of the room, and sign up.” It was all quiet they were all you know.

My mind was racing, because when I was attending all these different speaker trainer events what would happen is people, all the other participants, do a similarly a table rush, they all stand up go to back room, and give you confidence.

But when I did it for real nothing happened. It was weird, it was awkward. So back then those things were very different to all those, no music, and when I had to walk to the back room.

Just imagine this...

Room of 900 people, huge expo hall, I had to walk back and awkwardly smile to everybody as I walked. It was like the walk of shame. I walked back.

I remember this one of the staff who was working there she asked me, “So Peng Joon do you know how you did?”

And I said, “No so how many people signed up?” I noticed she was avoiding eye contact, and that's when she said, “Yeah well nobody signed up.”

I went back stage and I was sitting down there, and I realized, first of all I was very disappointed. Disappointed in myself, because at that point in time I truly believed that I did my best. I didn't wing it. I spent tens and thousands of dollars attending all these different events and seminars.

I practiced in front of camera, in front of mirror, but doing my best just wasn't good enough. And at the same time I disappointed the audience the value of what I had to offer. The irony was so many people coming up to me Peng Joon it was an amazing presentation.

But nobody bought anything...

That was when I told myself I think speaking is probably not for me.

So I was about to leave the event. The CEO of Success Resources, Richard Tan, he was there. I went up to him I said, “Thank you for inviting me to your event, but as you can see speaking is probably not for me. I might come back to be a conference speaker, but maybe not a sales speaker. What do you want me to do?”

So I was about to leave the event, here is what he told me. He said, “You know Peng Joon we been around for more than 20 years. We worked with the best of the best. We work with people like Tony Robbins, Richard Branson, Robert Kiyosaki, and all these guys.

Worked with best, best and worked with many average speakers that we have seen come and go. And I can tell you right now this is when an average speaker will quit. So you decide if you are average.”

And those words were so powerful...

I really realized that my entire life speaking really was one of those fears that was just one of those things that I could never do, because all of these things I tell myself like I'm not a people person, I'm introverted, I'm shy, and all these different reasons.

I realized, and I asked myself, “What if I could conquer this one fear that I thought I could never do. Then I will be unstoppable.” It was just one moment of decision where I told myself I'm never gonna quit until I really become world class at this.

And that I just continued practicing. I attended more events. I continued just practicing, and eventually I sucked less and less, and eventually I became good. That was the journey...

Steve Larsen: Was there a moment where you were able to sit back and go, “Oh my gosh I actually think this possible.” He said I'm going to be I don't want you to be average go off and do it. You said, “Oh my gosh okay we'll go do it.” And you started moving forward.

When was the moment though where you felt this period of self confidence? It seems to me most entrepreneurs actually know what to do next. They just don't have any confidence to do it.

It's much of a personal development thing as it like hey here's how you make a dollar. Here's how you make money. So is there a moment where you had, you know what I mean, like that first real success where you're like, "I could actually do this"?

Peng Joon: Yes. And I think back then so this was like I think the first time I had it was a few shifts. Number one, the importance of telling your story, which is your struggles as well as your successes.

For me back then all I wanted to do is, my mindset was as long as I went on stage on a platform, and as long as I gave them great value. I will go stream the content give them as much as they can so that they can understand the value that I'll be able to give them on the backend in my offer.

I passed the stories and the struggles of the back story. It was so crucial.

On top of that, and you know this, is that it came from the angle of just teaching. Without really coming from the angle of answering objections, objections about the opportunity. Objections about the limiting beliefs.

Objections about the external. So that was the difference.

Steve Larsen: That's interesting. So a focus itself on when you understood now how to actually go for the objections, and rather than just teach itself. Actually get into the mind of the person. That's interesting. I never heard anyone say that would be one of the things that ...

Peng Joon: 100%. The difference between a world-class speaker/closer, and average one is that a closer understand that the entire presentation is a close. Right from the start, the open, the content, the stack, the close. The entire thing is a close.

To really be able to serve an audience at the highest level it's not about the steps. Even though it might be intuitive to think that it's about the steps it's about the content.

If you really think about it you might be able to give them all the steps, but if you are not covering the objections, their self-limiting beliefs, their attitude, the environment that they're in.

Let's say we're in fitness. I'm teaching people how to get sick, tight abs. So if I taught them the steps, and we all know the steps are. The steps is just eat right, exercise daily. So everybody knows what the steps are.

Everybody wants to get healthy. Everybody wants to look good naked. But reason why people don't do the steps is because of the other 80% which is the why, the desire, their attitude towards it. All that kind of stuff.

The objections that they might have, and therefore in order to really serve the audience at the highest level it's not about just teaching the steps, but rather the other 80%, the mindset and attitude behind it that will make all the difference.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. I appreciate you saying that. So those are the things you identified in your own head started doing to yourself what you do to customers.

That's what pushed you forward...

I want to ask real quick about the way that you do your content, because the content that you create is incredible. I know you batch a lot, you put a lot of it together.

To go from someone who's shy, and introverted to somebody who you are now. You have books that you written, you're an author. You have millions of followers.

Dude, you are so ... and you are in front of massive audiences that you're teaching. You write books about the things that freaked you out at one point. That's amazing.

Could you talk a little bit about how you realized you needed to go heavy into the content creation side of this?

Peng Joon: Yeah. We all know that the algorithm on all these different social media platforms are constantly changing. It's harder, and harder to get rich, especially if it's organic.

For the longest time marketers have always said that the first step you need to be doing in order to get people into your funnel is to collect their name and email address. That's like the golden rule of marketers for the longest time.

But here's the problem. The problem with that is, first of all, that could have been effective maybe fives years ago, but to me a person is going to be a lot more reluctant to give you their name and email address in the first encounter.

And also it's gonna be a lot more expensive...

So to go about that the new way of doing things is really to lead that entire relationship with the value first. To be able to put out content out there where people don't have to ... where there isn't a catch.

Where they don't have to give you a name and email first in order to get value.

So you are able to lead with that, which again putting out content on social media, reaching people who don't know who you are, so you give them value first, and then we target them later for the main email address it becomes a whole lot cheaper.

That relationship is gonna be totally different because it started off with you giving value. That's different.

The rules of the game has changed. It's basically the first thing you need to be doing now is rather than starting off a relationship by getting a person's name and email address, it should be starting that entire process by getting people pixeled in, or into a custom audience where they have engaged their page like, commented, or shared anything on your page, or watched specific videos of more than say 50%.

And then we target them for the opt-in. I know it's a little bit technical here depending on, yeah but that's how it should be done.

Steve Larsen: Makes total sense. Makes total sense. They are already pre-framed what you're gonna talk about. They already pre-framed who you are. False beliefs have already shattered that you didn't even know you're solving. That's amazing.

Peng Joon: And you think about it, it's kind of like going into a club. Getting somebody's name, and email first is really like going into a club, and try to get somebody's name, and phone number in the first five minutes of your conversation.

Maybe some pick-up artists can do it, but it's gonna be tough. However, if after the conversation... with value first that's kind of like perhaps going to a club, and ...who has interest, who's looking at you, and then talking to them. And then building value, building relationship, and then asking them for their...it's going to be easier.

Steve Larsen: So Peng Joon is coming out with a dating tips book very soon with that very strategy right? Sorry for the lag in the internet a little bit everybody.

Peng Joon: ...

Steve Larsen: You are right there? Okay got you.

Peng Joon: ...

Steve Larsen: Awesome. So I wanted to ask you also real quick. Let's say you're a new entrepreneur just starting out. Let's say you redoing this you are starting over again. How much emphasis would you focus on just amassing, because I get this question all the time.

How much focus would you give on amassing a huge following versus making a product that's selling? Would you put one before the other, would you do them in tandem?

Peng Joon: [inaudible 00:21:06] So I mentioned this strategy. One of the thing I always want to make it really clear. The priority for somebody that's starting out should always be building their funnel first.

Be clear about what they are selling, what their offer is, building the funnel before they start messing around with traffic, or social media, or podcasting, or anything like that.

People get caught up with all these distractions they think they need to put up content in bulk they need to do...Facebook when in fact for new entrepreneurs one of the things that they get distracted by is people telling them that they need to do all these different latest tactics and strategies which is like Facebook, or Instagram, or podcasting, and doing a blog post.

When in fact, if you are first starting out the only focus you should have is your funnel. It's getting clear what you're selling, what your offer is, and building up that funnel for that offer.

The best way to tell if you have a funnel is to ask yourself this morning when you woke up, whether you made any sales while you were asleep. And you if you didn't make any sales where you sleep last night means that you don't have a funnel. That should be your core focus before you start dabbling into all these other traffic generating strategies.

Steve Larsen: That's so powerful that you say that, absolutely. Someone has reached out, and they are like, “Well I'm gonna grow this huge following I'm brand new.” I'm like what are they gonna follow you for though?

So at what end what's the end goal there, so when did you know your business was ready for this brilliant content machine that you have?

Peng Joon: I think it was just the progression. There wasn't really a moment in time when ... And I don't think it really happens for anybody where we just wake up and say today is the day we're ready. It's just through little progress every single day, and the little victories along the way. So yeah I don't think there was a moment, and time specifically.

Steve Larsen: Sure. I know that you gave an entire presentation on this on Funnel Hacking Live. Not trying to ask you to do that as well. Can you talk through your process just a little bit at a high level what you do to actually generate all this content?

Peng Joon: So it all begins with the pillar content, which is a video. Shooting a video where you begin with the end in mind, which means you are gonna use highly engaging content as titles, where you will look at, and there are many tools for this [Bust a Move 00:23:44] is one of them, while you look at what content in your market industries already proven to convert by looking at the conversations people already having.

Creating videos based on that topic, and you want to be creating topics that has some sort of polarity, rather than using safe neutral topics.

So what I mean by that is so if you are in a topic of, say wealth. So rather than a safe topic which is how to make more money, a much more powerful video would be here is the reason why you are broke.

That's gonna offend some people, but the people that's gonna be into it is gonna be a lot more engaged. We need to understand that there's no money in neutrality. It's either they love you, or hate you, but there's no money in neutral. Start off with that, and by saying that I'm not talking about intentionally creating videos that offend people.

I'm not a polarizing person, but I'm talking about taking a stand for something, and not being safe about it. If you take a look at all the books, you take books like 'Rich Dad, Poor Dad', when it was created that goes against every single safe principle when it comes to wealth, and investment when it was written. That's why it did well.

So that's the first step. Creating videos, based on topics as high engagements, and then after that I got a nine step process, but it's basically about repurposing it so that it goes into your blog posts, it goes into youtube, it goes to Facebook, and Instagram.

I call this strategy the Content Multiplier Formula, which is basically having all your content put into all these different platforms where the content matches the context of the platform.

Steve Larsen: Which I think is so interesting, because it's not like you go on ... most people get on Facebook to get distracted. They are not getting on there to ... a very different intent than I go on youtube for, which is to usually some kind of how to thing, or maybe some other piece of entertainment or whatever. That's very fascinating, so you match content to the context of the platform that's fast.

Peng Joon: And that's so crucial, because what I see some marketers do is they post the same piece of content onto all platforms failing to understand that people go onto these different platforms for different reasons.

So it can still stem from the same pillar content, but you want to repurpose it in a way that matches the context of the platform.

Steve Larsen: Amazing. You obviously have this down it's a science now for you. Every time I see you on Instagram, or wherever you don't seem like a lot of the classic A type personalities, or entrepreneurs out there where it's like they are usually stressed out of their brain.

You got this down so well for how you done it, and the way you multiply content and match it. How do you go actually out, and start actually multiplying all that content that way? You must have a massive team.

Peng Joon: Out of 12 people that works for me in my team in-house not including the people that we outsource to, but in the grand scheme of things we are really lean, and it's not a really big team.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome.

Peng Joon: So no, you don't have to have a lot of people doing all of that. In fact, chances are if you give them the right system, and the strategy, and the steps to follow you probably just need three people if you are really pumping out with current content. And that's like a lot. The video guy, the graphics, and one content writer.

Steve Larsen: Wow, interesting okay. Video graphics, and a content writer themselves. They'll go out, and repurpose all the stuff. For you I know when you spend three days with 90 videos that you create.

Peng Joon: 120, yeah.

Steve Larsen: You got 120, oh I thought it was 90.

Peng Joon: Yeah 40 videos a day.

Steve Larsen: What? That's so crazy that's amazing, and these are three, five minute videos something like that?

Peng Joon: Yes. Three to five minutes works best. Sometimes it can be shorter, but three minutes would be the average.

Steve Larsen: Wow, okay. Three, five minute videos. That's actually what triggers from that pillar content, the rest of the machine that you created. Fascinating.

Peng Joon: Yes.

Steve Larsen: Fascinating. Thanks for your time today. Again everyone, sorry for the little bit of lag in the internet there. We are talking on the other side of the world right now, so which is pretty awesome.

I know that you have this ... you are such an expert at it now, you wrote a book. I love the actual sales video I've watched it many times that you have for it. Very, very fascinating. I encourage everyone to go get it, but do you mind talking a little bit about why you wrote the book, 'Platform Closing'?

Peng Joon: So I realized there were a lot of people like me that struggled, like they have a nice message to share, but because of all these different limitations, or maybe they just didn't know how when it comes to speaking, and presenting.

It doesn't need to be live events it could be through sales videos, or webinars. I wanted to show people how to do it, because there wasn't one book that really specifically showed people how to speak, inspire, sell on all these different platforms.

I wanted to be able to show people as well that it's not about talent, because that's what many people think. They think that oh because I'm not like that therefore I can't do it. People might look, say Peng Joon ... speak and sell, but I'm not like you.

I'm not extroverted, and therefore I... So I wanted people to see that look that I know that's like a lot of people out there.

They are not doing it, because just like me they're either too afraid, they have that fear, they are introverted, and therefore they never even begin. So that's why I wrote that book.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. That's amazing. And it's only been out for a little while right, it's very recent.

Peng Joon: It's about six weeks in since I published it.

Steve Larsen: Awesome, that's awesome. I guess is that the best place for people to come follow you, and learn more about you? That book right there?

Peng Joon: So if you always wanted to learn how to sell, inspire, and present you can go platformclosing.com. It's a free book you just need to cover shipping.

Steve Larsen: Man, thank you so much for your time on this I appreciate it so much. You really are an inspiration, not just to me, but a lot of people in my audience as well I know they are just gonna love this. Thanks so much. Anything else you'd like to share with us?

Peng Joon: I think at the end of it all, you just need to get started. I think I want to leave with this. I think that one of the major things that really separates successful people is this one main thing.

So when it comes to one thing to do a task. We all have these dreams and aspirations. The difference between a successful person, unsuccessful person is this. We might want to do something, but we only tell ourselves these three things.

It's the road blocks that we have is just these three things...

It's either number one, we don't have the time or money. Just the lack of the resource. Now here's the difference. An unsuccessful person, that's where they stop. They let that reason why they can't do it.

While a successful person would say, “So how can I raise this money? How can I put it on Kickstarter? How can I pitch it to an investor who might be believing in my dream as well so I can start this project?”

Or it could be if you don't have the time it's, “How can I find an extra hour? How can I be more productive with my time? How can I shut off social medial?” Perhaps it could be stop watching Game of Thrones or something.

But to be more resourceful, know how to get the resources. That's the first one.

Number two, it's basically where they say, “I want to be able to do this, but I don't know how.” And this is where again, a not successful person this is where they stop.

While a successful person would say, “Okay I want to be able to do this, but I don't know how.” Same starting point, but now they say, “What I add it in my agenda now so that I can find out how. I'll watch the youtube videos, I'll read the books, I'll attend the seminars so that I can learn how."

Number three, I want to be able to do this, but I'm not like that. They might look at me and say, "You know Peng Joon won't be able to do [inaudible 00:32:55]." You don't get it. I'm not like that. I'm not an outgoing person, I'm not extroverted.

Again this is when unsuccessful person will stop. They let that to be the reason to why they can't do it. While a successful person would say, “I understand that in order to scale my business I need to learn how to speak, and present.” But I'm not like that. So how can I become more like that? How can I add it in my agenda, and catch myself out of my comfort zone so that I can become more like that.

I think that in anything we do whether it's building funnels, whether it's speaking, whether it's selling, all of that. The difference is in just the way we think about it. And that's really the differentiator between successful people, and non-successful people.

Steve Larsen: That is incredible. So number one, I don't have the resources or time versus how can I get the resources and time. Number two, I don't know how versus I'm gonna find out how. Number three, I'm not like that versus I'm gonna become that. That is just amazing.

Thank you so much for your time today, Peng Joon, especially there in a historic day in Malaysia. Thanks for the viable interview here, and what you shared.

Peng Joon: I enjoyed being here. Thank you for having me.

Steve Larsen: Boom. Just try to tell me you didn't like that. Hey, whoever controls content, controls the game. Want to interview me, or get interviewed yourself? Grab a time now at stevejlarsen.com.

Social Media is constantly evolving. Listen and learn about what it takes to make it as an Entrepreneur in today's content saturated world...

What's going on everyone? This is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to a special episode of Sales Funnel Radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today, and now I've left my 9 to 5 to take the plunge and build my million-dollar business. The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

What's up guys? I'm super excited for you to be here. This is going to be a massive treat for you. I've got to tell you, the topic we're going to go through today and frankly the person that I've brought on today, at first this topic I discredited just a little bit. I'm not going to lie, which is shame on me, poopoo on me, right, but I'm very excited for you guys to learn more about this. The longer I've been doing this game, the longer I've been part of this, the more I've looked at what this person's doing, it's just with sheer awe.

I cannot believe everything that he gets done, and I'm very excited. I'm super honored, actually, to have him on the show. It's going to be great. Anyway, I want to welcome to the show, though, Mr. Josh Forti. How are you doing man?

Josh Forti: Hey Steven. Good to be on here. Thanks so much for having me on. I appreciate it.

Steve Larsen: I'm super excited. I was thinking right before you got on here, I was thinking through kind of the different times we've brushed shoulders.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: But not really actually spoke. You know, I know you came to the Viral Video launch. You had an invite for that for sure. I saw you over there taking pictures with Gary V., and I was exhausted by the time that event came up.

I barely remember anything. Everything was hazy...

Josh Forti: I got roasted by Gary V. at the Viral Video event.

Steve Larsen: I remember that. He was standing right there.

Josh Forti: Remember that?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. He roasted you hard, man.

Josh Forti: That's right. That's right. I think you handed me the microphone for that, too.

Steve Larsen: Yep. Yeah. I had no idea we'd work this much together and have you on the show.

Josh Forti: Who knew, who knew?

Steve Larsen: Who knew? Yeah. And then it was really, right, we did that Mastermind together.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: And I heard you speak and I swear gold was just spraying everybody in the audience, just all over the place. I could not believe what you were saying. It was amazing. It was incredible. This whole other side of the funnel where the person is the funnel and really diving into personal branding.

You're clearly, in my mind, I actually believe that you're like the foremost expert on personal brand creation. I'm just so honored to have you here...

Josh Forti: Oh man, well I really appreciate, really appreciate that, and I don't know if I'm the number one, but I certainly try to be. Yeah, we've had a lot of fun with it.

Steve Larsen: I'll say it for you.

Josh Forti: Okay. You can say it for me. I like that. I like that. Yeah. We've had a lot of fun with it.

Steve Larsen: Honestly, it was when we were standing outside right after that Mastermind and I saw not just that you were like, I mean, dude, you're very smart. You get a lot of stuff done. You're a go-getter and a hustler, but then also you're intent on helping the world. That's when I was like, man, I've got to get close to this guy. That wasn't long ago. That was like a month ago.

Josh Forti: It feels like it. It was a little longer than that. I think it was, back in January. That was in Vegas.

Steve Larsen: Oh, that's true.

Josh Forti: Right? That's when that was. We spoke there. That's when we first officially met. We had brushed into each other like you said, but we officially met. We spoke on the same stage. I remember at the event someone was like, Steven Larsen's going to be speaking. I was like, well, if it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. So, I'm super happy that we got to meet up there and, yeah, form a friendship that eventually led to us speaking together again down at the Mastermind before Funnel Hacking Live.

Steve Larsen: Oh, yeah, that's right. That's awesome. That's awesome. Yeah. You know, so for those in the audience who may not know who you are, how did you actually get into this, this area of personal branding? I think the area, like I've had such an issue with it just because I've not ever known really what it is. It seems a little bit fluffy and you're so clear on how to do it. How did you get into this?

Josh Forti: That's a great question. So, actually I grew up through high school, I was home schooled and I grew up on a farm. I had no online presence at all. In fact, I wasn't even allowed to have texting on my phone until I was 18, so like really knew nothing.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: I got into insurance. Long story short, dropped out of college, got into insurance sales and realized that the internet marketing space was this huge trend that a lot of these businesses that we were working with were totally missing out on.

And so I went from there and I was like, man I've got to start studying this, so I started studying e-com and started studying all the different things and blue like several thousand dollars with no success, no results whatsoever. I was like, man, it can't be this hard. I mean, like I've got to figure out a way for me. How I started into it was I was just trying to figure out a way to grow an audience so that I could test like landing pages.

Even if I was giving it away for free, I just wanted to be able to test it without having to pay for it...

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: And get the audience's response. Tell me what I was doing right, tell me what I was doing wrong so that I could service them better without having to pay thousands of dollars up front for not getting any results. So, I actually started on the Instagram platform. I thought that was, for me, the fastest way to like grow an audience.

I didn't really understand Facebook at the time. We hear all the time, organic range on Facebook is dead...

Not entirely true, but I started on the Instagram platform and played around with just some different accounts. I bought a course on it. I loved the Instagram game and I loved everything that was there. It is. It's a game.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: Just finding the little trends and pieces there. I launched a company with a business partner of mine, and together we grew and managed several million followers on the Instagram platform. aCtually, it was just the beginning of last year we decided we had kind of different visions for the company. He wanted to go kind of more the agency route and specifically just servicing that, and I really wanted to help like people launch like Instagram accounts.

I wanted to like give back the information that we had and like really help that and you know, different strokes for different folks. So he went one way and I ended up selling the agency that we had built to him. That allowed me a whole new world of opportunity. I was out on my own. I had contacts and I'd just sold a company. I went out and invested in a couple different coaches and some programs and really just dove into all things branding and social media.

I read Expert Secrets and Dotcom Secrets and everything that Russell talks about and came up, and I'm only 24 years old right now, and so just studied and studied and worked and applied and worked and launched a Facebook group shortly before I sold my company, about, I don't know, six months or so before I sold the company out and have not run a single dime of paid traffic to it. It's about 18 months old.

Steve Larsen: Wow.

Josh Forti: We just hit 30,000 members in it.

Steve Larsen: Holy crap.

Josh Forti: Being able to use a lot of the tactics that Russell talks about in marketing with the attractive character and really being authentic with your audience and really going out there and showing them the behind the scenes, a lot of people are like, man, you know, you are authentic or you're showing them the good, the bad and the ugly, like they're never going to buy from you, right?

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Josh Forti: And the thing is, we live in the world of experts, but we also live in the world of influencers, right?

Like, you do need to be an expert at what you do, but you have to understand that if you have a single follower, you're more credible than the person without one, right?

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: And so if you're one step ahead of whatever it is that you're doing and you show them the good, the bad and the ugly, what that does is it builds trust, so people can go out. We live in an overwhelming world of information.

I can go onto YouTube and figure out absolutely anything, so if you're full of crap, I'm eventually going to figure it out, so if you're lying to me, you know, I'm eventually going to see that, where if you just show, hey, this works, this doesn't, here's what we're doing over here, here's what we're doing over here, people love that and people eat it up because then they know that you're going to be honest with them. We've had so much success with that.

In fact, I've done, this is a funny fact, two six-figure businesses now and I've never spent a single penny on paid advertising for either one of those.

Steve Larsen: That's so cool. I mean, seriously man, congrats! That's incredible.

Josh Forti: I appreciate that, man. Does that kind of give you a background there of everything?

Steve Larsen: Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. I guess, when did you realize that you were getting it, you know what I mean? When did it start clicking?

Josh Forti: Well, I must say, my parents always taught me to work hard. I grew up on a farm. I was homeschooled, and I have seven siblings, so you kind of partner all those things together and you realize you just kind of have to work hard in life.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: I wouldn't say I felt ... I still don't know if I get it, Steven.

Steve Larsen: Sure. I know we're all still getting it.

Josh Forti: Yeah, yeah. I think that the point in my life where I understood that I got it was when I realized that I was willing to go learn and do above and beyond what everyone else was willing to go learn and do.

When everybody else was out at the movies, and I have nothing against going out to the movies or taking a night off, but I spent two years of my life studying and going to conferences, seminars and things like that and when I came back and when I realized that just simply being around those type of people and just simply being immersed in that versus being immersed in say pop culture of like movies or music or whatever that thing was, you know more about that.

For me, that was a really like a first step in the right direction for me because, I mean, we as an entrepreneurs, I really believe that we all, at some point or another, struggle with a lot of self-doubt.

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Josh Forti: While I'm a very confident person in myself and what I can do, being around those type of people and realizing that, hey, I'm at least making actions and decisions that drive me in the direction that I want to get close to was an encouraging reminder to me.

So that was kind of the first step in the right direction and then as far as like making it, what do you mean, like having it figured it out? Like, specifically when I thought I knew Instagram or when I thought I could do this or like what specifically?

Steve Larsen: Sure, sure. I just like to ask that because we all kind of go a different route with it, which is kind of cool, but, yeah, really with Instagram, when you realized that like, oh my gosh, this personal branding thing like it's suddenly is clicking, you know. I see the path at least far enough where I can have results for the people and make money with it.

Josh Forti: Yeah. I'm going to take us back to Funnel Hacking Live.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: Remember when Russell was on stage and for those of you that weren't able to attend, uh, you missed out, but he was on stage, and on Friday he was talking about, and really, the whole theme of the conference was if you just follow a proven formula for success, you will be successful with it. Remember when he was talking about that?

Steve Larsen: Oh, yeah.

Josh Forti: Yeah. So, I think I realized that I had figured it out when I was first able to duplicate my results and so on Instagram I grew my first account to, I think it was 30,000 or 35,000 followers, and I got the idea that I was like, well, I did it once. I wonder if I could do it again.

So, I do everything kind of over the top, so I went and opened like eight other accounts...

Steve Larsen: Love it.

Josh Forti: And tried to do it on eight different accounts and figured out the niches. I think five of them stuck, and so I had five or six accounts at this time and all of the sudden all of them were at 10,000 and then 15,000 and then 20,000 and then 30,000, and then I realized this is just a system.

Like, it's a formula and when I realized that there was just a formula for growing accounts and a formula for growing social media, people often complicate it and they're like, oh, you know every platform's different, every platform's this. They are, and the content that you post on those platforms may be different types of content, but the concepts of social media, of the goals that you're trying to accomplish are all the same.

Once I figured out that formula I knew I was set. I was like, there's nothing I can't do on social media now if I have either A) The time or B) The budget. If I have one of those two things, I can do anything. I think that's when I figured out that there was a proven formula that I could just duplicate over and over and it looks different for each account, looks different for each niche that you're in, but the formula of what you're trying to accomplish is the same.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. That's super powerful. It's powerful insight for sure. I just want to ask too, so, okay, you obviously are like me and you're constantly diving deep into the thing you're trying to be like the best at. You're constantly learning.

I'm sure you're constantly moving as forward as fast as you can. Out of your own curiosity too. It's like no one's forcing you. I'm sure you're the same...

When you were diving deep into this stuff and you start getting into social media, you get into personal branding, how did you choose what to learn and what not to learn?

Josh Forti: Oh man. That is such a tough question.

Steve Larsen: I know. Sorry.

Josh Forti: No, no, no. This is really good. You know what's interesting is the reason that I got into personal branding I think is because of this question right here.

Steve Larsen: Interesting.

Josh Forti: Because you think about it and you go, who do we learn from? I look at the people that I modeled after. The only people that I followed were people that I wanted to become like because in my opinion and especially in the way of the world that we're going right now, if you're taking advice from people that are not doing what it is that you're trying to learn and you can't relate with what they're trying to do, why would you take advice from them.

That's like the mentality that's going through my head at the time that I'm starting...

Steve Larsen: I believe that.

Josh Forti: And so as I looked back, like who did I model? I modeled after Russell Brunson. I modeled after Tai Lopez. I modeled after Gary Vaynerchuk. I modeled after Grant Cardone.

Those are my four big top influencers in all of marketing right now. If you were to say, Josh, who are the top four? Those are them. What do they all have? They all have a personal brand. They've all gone out there and established what it is that they've done, and so, I think for me, I look at the person as who they are. Now, do I agree with everything Tai Lopez does?

Absolutely not...

Or Russell or Grant or whoever, but because they have elements in their business that I want to model after and I like who they are as a person in that area, I'm going to go and I'm going to learn from them.

So, for me, I decide what I'm going to learn or not learn by actually studying what the person stands for and looking at the life that they have. I hardly ever buy, even like a lead magnet or download anything for free until I go out and actually study who that person is. And so I just got a book in the mail, Millionaire Success Habits by Dean I can't pronounce his last name.

Steve Larsen: Graziosi.

Josh Forti: Yeah. But I saw his ad probably 100 times before I bought his book. I finally sat down and was like, okay, who is this guy. I went and I looked at his brand and I looked at what he was and I looked at what he stood for and that's the power of personal branding. Everything that I do and everything, like if I choose to study someone or something or learn or not learn, I look at who they are as a person because I think that's really important to me.

So, I got into personal branding for that matter because I was like, if someone's going to look at my content, whether it's a physical product, a digital product, free paid whatever, I want them to be able to come look back at me and know exactly what I stand for and if that aligns with what they are going to be doing then they are going to come learn from me and be up front about it.

Having that personal brand, I mean, I can't tell you how many people I've asked and say, why do you use click funnels? The click funnel platform is awesome and I love it and it's so much fun, but a large majority of the people were like, I wasn't that interested in click funnels at the beginning. I was interested in Russell Brunson and then he showed me click funnels and it was like, oh my gosh!

This is awesome...

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: But it was Russell that brought them in and that's the power of a personal brand, and I think that we really need to realize in the online space if you don't have a personal brand you're either on your way out or already dead. You're just becoming irrelevant after awhile.

Steve Larsen: I completely believe what you just said right there. That's so true. As far as from a top level, I just want to ask a few questions here because you think of like, I mean, you service a lot of like these funnel builders of that community as well. You've helped a whole bunch of people like that.

You've helped some massive individuals...

Josh Forti: There's definitely been some Instagram touchpoints with some big, yeah, big influencers in that area as well as a lot of people in my inner circle and a lot of people in really all areas and all industries, yeah.

Steve Larsen: You've been all over the place. You're very much, and what's interesting too, I mean, when I think about, like, what I do, right, I go through and I help people get their phone off the ground, their message, their offer and get that out the door and, yes, totally, I mean, you obviously don't need a personal brand to go get that off the ground, but the personal brand becomes this vehicle that just explodes and accelerates in this ridiculous way.

I want to ask a little more how someone actually does that, but how do you define a personal brand? You know what I mean? Like, what do you even say that actually is?

Josh Forti: Yeah. Yeah. So, summed up in a very short phrase I say, your business is what you do, your brand is what you stand for.

Steve Larsen: Cool.

Josh Forti: If you think about that, in the message of personal branding, we're shifting as a society and I think we really need to understand that while we still definitely have big corporations and big things like that, we're going very much to a freelance society, to an online marketing society and things like that and really you have to go make a name for yourself, and it's expected because it's so simple. I say that hesitantly, simple to do.

Not easy, but the concepts there are simple. It's almost like required, like as a prerequisite...

What I tell people is you want someone to be able to look at you and your profile and content online and know exactly what you do, what you stand for and how you're going to go about doing that because if I can't look at your profile and know not only what you do, but really like the vibe that you stand for and who you are as a human, I'm not near as likely trust you as if I know who you are and what you stand for, right.

If you don't give me that information, like, yeah, you might be great at eCommerce, but if I don't know your personality, if I don't know if you get my agenda, there's so much information.

People look for what they can relate to. And so if they don't understand what it is that you stand for or if you're relatable or not, then you don't have a very good chance of them buying from you. That personal brand is your message and your statement of what it is that you stand for and your statement of the type of person that you're trying to attract and sell to.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. It's not really enough to just be, I mean, you can get by for a while just being amazing, but, I mean, after a while people want to know who you are as a person. It makes total sense. Okay. I've never heard it explained that way. How does somebody go about doing this?

Obviously, they hire you...

They give you a whole lot of money, which everyone should, but like what are the most important parts of this? I know we can take it to the enth degree, but I mean, is there like a base level someone should at least have?

Josh Forti: Well, I think the first thing that everyone needs to do is they need to define themselves and understand their why. Before you go into anything else, I think the most important thing is understanding your why and if you don't start with your why I think everything else really gets kind of pushed off track.

So a lot of people are like, oh, man, my why is I want to go out there and use entrepreneurship skills to change the world. That's not your why. When I sit down with people to find out what that why is I tell them, you should be able to tell me your why and I have no clue what you do.

Steve Larsen: Cool.

Josh Forti: Because if I can go and hear just like your vision and your purpose and passion in life, there's a lot of different ways to make something happen, right.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: And, so I can change the world in eCommerce. I can change the world in sports. I can change the world in the oil fields, but if I don't know what my why is, if you can't clearly identify what that why is then I think that you're really off track, because everything needs to lead back up to that.

I think step number one is identify what your why is and then step number two after that is very clearly defined, and I cannot stress the importance of that enough, very clearly defined.

Then, step number two from there is you need to pick the avenue or the industry that you're going to get into to make that why happen. And so your what is kind of what you believe in and who you're going to go about implementing that vision to the world.

I'm not talking about the product necessarily. I'm talking about the avenue or the vehicle that you're going to use to get that why message out there. Once you kind of determine what that is going to be, then you can go out and start crafting your brand from there.

So, start with why and then from there go to the how and then go to the what from there. Start with why, how and then what.

From there, you have to understand you need to publish a lot of content.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Everyone hear that. I know I shove it down your throat, but say it again, baby, whew!

Josh Forti: Yeah, like publish your face off. I've heard you say it before and I know that's your saying, but it cannot be more true because in a world of unlimited information you have to be able to stand out from all your competitors and from everybody else that's out there that's putting out similar information.

If you expect to be seen, if you expect people to build trust, then what do they say, 8 to 12 times before someone is willing to buy from you?

Most of you guys and most of the people out there who are putting out content, it's like, I'm going to put out one video a week. I'm going to post one status a day. Those are not even rookie numbers, you know what I'm saying.

Like, you've got to step it up to where you need to be omnipresent. I need to be able to see you, and I'm just going to take it back again to the Gary Vaynerchuk, the Russell Brunson, the Greg Cardone, Tai Lopez.

Go look at their YouTube channels, their Instagram page, everything that they're doing. Those people put out way more content than you do, and way more content than almost every other person out there.

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Josh Forti: And so you don't even have to be that good, and I say that hesitantly. Be good. Be an expert.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: But if you can produce more content to the next guy, you don't even have to be an expert, you know. Your message is out there in front of everybody else and so if you start with why and you craft all of your content around making that why come true and showing people your vision with that why and whatever avenue or venue it is, whether it's entrepreneurship or fitness or music or what have you and publish a lot of content to move that forward, you're going to have an audience.

Steve Larsen: That's huge. Completely believe that. Just there's power in just being present, just being out there when people are ready to look and ready to see you, fresh stuff that's available.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: Um, okay ...

Josh Forti: Oh, sorry. Go ahead.

Steve Larsen: No. Go for it.

Josh Forti: I was going to say, the one other thing that I would mention in there that I think is really important for entrepreneurs, especially for entrepreneurs in the business space and for people that are trying to grow a personal brand and trying to grow an audience, you've got to pick something and be all about it because I see so many people.

In fact, I just got off a phone call earlier today with a lady who she's really smart. She's really talented and she's got seven different projects that she's been working on, and she's been working on seven different projects for the last 20 years, and they're still not, you know, nothing's still happening.

Steve Larsen: That's because there's seven of them.

Josh Forti: I asked her, I said ... Right, and I'm like, so which one are you going to pick. She's like, well, I love them all. I'm like, and for the last 20 years you've gone nowhere. I mean, she's dumped money into them and she's dumped time, and her videos are good. Her content is good, things like that, but people don't know what she's about. It's 22 different things.

Well, in her case, seven different things. Pick what it is that you're going to do and be about that and then once you have an audience and once you've grown you can kind of push your audience from one to the next or kind of incorporate different brands and things like that, but if people don't know the one thing that you are about, then they're not going to follow you.

You know, what's Russell Brunson known for? Funnels...

Steve Larsen: Funnels.

Josh Forti: Funnels. Right. Think about that when you're building your brand as well.

Steve Larsen: I totally love that. Oh, man. So huge. Gain the clarity and then move on. When you take somebody who's, I don't know, I'm trying to figure out how to ask this.

When you take somebody who's just starting out, right, what are some of the basic things somebody could go do once they have the why, how and what?

They figure those things out, they're publishing frequently. I guess what's the routine look like for them?

Josh Forti: Yeah. For sure. I'm not going to pick a specific platform here.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: I mean, I'm going to kind of give you an overview basis of what we'll look for. Russell Brunson talks about this in his book, Dotcom Secrets, but when you're publishing content you want to make sure that you're getting your content in front of the right audience.

Different social media platforms do this differently. You know, on Instagram it's more hashtags and on, you know, Facebook it's more groups and things like that, but that's very important because if you can go and get your message in front of the right audience and always push them back to a centralized location, that's really, really important and you're going to start growing an audience that way.

The first thing I would say is make sure that you're getting your message in front of the right people and then second, kind of like what we talked about when we went over your stuff is have a centralized hub of where you're pushing everyone to, so for me and a lot of my clients that I work with, that's a Facebook group because that's the most interactive way for us to be able to communicate to our clients.

Maybe for some people that's an Instagram page or whatnot, but once you have them in that centralized hub where everything is pushing, also push them back out to other platforms as well.

All of your content, all of your most valuable information is going to be at your centralized hub, but then you want to be able to cross-promote, because if someone comes in from YouTube, it's like, okay, they're coming in from YouTube and have an Instagram channel and a Facebook page and a Facebook group and a Snapchat and a Twitter, like where do I push them.

I always push them back to wherever my centralized location is. All right, for me that's the Facebook group.

And then from the Facebook group I then diversify to different platforms and push them from there, but I want to make sure that they're all in my Facebook group because that is where my most valuable content is.

That's where I know my warmest leads are going to be and that's where I'm going to get a majority of my traffic from. Does that make sense?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Totally. Okay. That makes sense. You've got centralized hub.

Josh Forti: Yeah. To have that centralized hub to where people know because it's like, okay, Instagram is great, but would I go to Instagram to be able to get in contact with Steven Larsen?

Probably not...

Would I go to Instagram to watch a full-time tutorial about that?

Would I go to Instagram for this?

No, but I would go to Instagram for valuable tips, for motivational tips and to stay in touch with that side of your life. Whereas YouTube I would go for more how-to's, but there's probably no information for me to get a hold of you or interact with you. I can't message you or anything.

What I have found is a Facebook group is the most valuable place because it encompasses everything, posts, videos, text and video and image. It allows people to interact with you, you to interact with them and them to interact with each other and there's multiple places where you can put information, contact information and push them to different lead magnets.

So, I take all of my traffic, I send them there and then I take my traffic from there and I go, hey, if you want to learn more about blah, blah, blah, make sure you subscribe to my YouTube channel and that way all of my Instagram traffic that I've just gotten off of Instagram and into my group, now I have it on Instagram and in my group and now I'm pushing them out to a third platform so I can now have them in three different places as well.

Steve Larsen: You have like the main communication hub, but as needed you can shove them to the rest of the things you're doing in your marketing or campaigns or whatever else you're doing.

Josh Forti: Yes, and it's very important to diversify on social media, but I do like to have my one main hub where everything goes because it's just so much easier than, especially when you're starting out.

Now, as you continue to scale and you've got $10,000, $20,000, $50,000 a month behind you, then you can talk about different things, but in the beginning when you're starting out and you're just trying to grow an organic audience. We have a course coming out called Six-Figure Audiences.

Steve Larsen: Sweet.

Josh Forti: It's going to be so cool. I'm so excited about that, but it really talks about having that main hub and then diversifying from there. That's how people know where you're at most and for people like us, people like you, we don't have time to be posting and going live on four different platforms.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: Go live on one and push everyone to that one and then diversify the content out from there.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. Okay, so say somebody who's maybe brand new or has an existing business and they're starting to set these things up. Got the centralized place. Got the message.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: When can you tell? Like, what are the things that need to be in place in order for the person to, I guess, blow up for lack of a better term? Like, when can you tell that someone's about to just go nuts?

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: Most likely.

Josh Forti: Yeah. When their branding is consistent across all their platforms, that's really important. If I can click on your Facebook profile and see that that is optimized and clean and clear, has a clear call of action in the timeline photo, things like that, you have a Facebook that's growing and is there as well. Your Instagram, no matter how big it is, I don't care how big your pages are, right, I don't care how many followers they have.

I care about the quality of the content that you're putting upon those pages. When they're all set up right and well and I actually, I really look a lot at the engagement and the copy and the type of content that you put out, whether that be written or video, my favorite is video.

I overwhelmingly do more video than anything else because it is the most engaging, especially live video, but if their content is engaging, even at a small amount and they have clear branding across all platforms, that says to me, okay, this person knows enough to at least understand that this is important and that maybe they're just missing the traffic piece right now, but they can figure that out and I would encourage everyone to optimize all your profiles no matter if you have followers or not.

I mean, Twitter is like I never am on Twitter, and I only have like 2,000 followers on there, but it's still optimized to if anybody were to click on my Twitter they could come back and find my other social media profiles and things like that.

So, when everyone's optimized across that platform, when they're putting out good consistent content every single day and it's branded there, I think that says to me, okay, this person is doing the right things from that standpoint, but then on a more like psychological side standpoint, things that are maybe a little bit harder to teach, if I can see that your brand has a very clear message and it is speaking directly to your target audience, that's probably the most, like the number one telltale sign of being able to say, okay, this person really has dialed in their audience.

When you go, like we've worked with all sorts of people, the people that have the clearest message to their audience are the ones that grow the fastest, hands down, almost without question unless you're running massive amounts of pay traffic. From an organic-grow standpoint, from an audience creation standpoint and a brand standpoint, the more precise that you can get with your message across all platforms with that branded, says to me okay, you're ready to blow up.

And, going back to your original question, a great way to do that is through interviews. Once you have everything set up, podcast interviews like this, livestream interviews in other groups. I cannot stress enough the importance of cross promotion within the marketplace with other influencers.

Steve Larsen: That's huge. Oh man. That's a gold mine everybody. We should be charging for this. This is awesome. Please be writing notes.

Super awesome...

Hey, so this is me with the direct-response marketer in me, when's the best scenario for me to be grabbing contact information, you know, opt-ins, email addresses, stuff like that so I can continue to remarket to them or is the fact that they're on my page, is that my opt-in?

Josh Forti: Yeah. That's a great question. Common misconception there says, oh, if they're in my Facebook group, I don't need them on my email list. You're wrong.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: I don't ever think you can have people in enough places.

Steve Larsen: Sure. Sure.

Josh Forti: If I have them on YouTube and Facebook and Instagram and my email list I can still get on a chat bot, you know. I think that from a timing standpoint, right away.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: You need to have, and that's part of putting out content. As soon as I hit your page, like if I want more information, it's not for everyone. We know that, but if I want more information and it's not there, you just lost money. That's pretty much the only way there is to look at it. Being able to provide information in exchange for contact information as soon as they hit your page.

That's why I tell people, and I know we've talked about this as well, cover photos on timelines for people's profile pictures or in people's Facebook groups. Have call-to-actions. You look at a lot of the big influencers. You to in there and you hit their cover photo or you hit the cover of their timeline photo and it's get my free book, get my free this.

That's amazing advertising and it's free advertising space. Take advantage of that. Any place that you can go and provide awesome amounts of value, get their contact information.

I don't think there's such thing as having them in too many places...

Steve Larsen: Sure. Completely makes sense to me. Yeah. Absolutely. You like to do a lot of eBooks and stuff that's easy to fulfill on.

You're still giving value, but that's what's actually getting them on the list that way and remarket afterwards?

Josh Forti: Yeah. Anything from eBooks, webinars. I actually really like to be doing a lot of like free training stuff.

Steve Larsen: Oh, cool.

Josh Forti: Where I'll just go live on my Facebook group and so, you know, when I go live now we'll have 1,000 viewers, right or 1,000 people, 1,200 people that will watch that, and so you know, throughout there I'll just be like if you want more information on this specific training, you know, drop a comment below and we'll send it over to you or click this link below and go to that.

It could be anything from the recording of that training. It could be an eBook. Any form of free magnet. I know you talk a lot about that.

The other thing that I think is a misconception from a lot of people is they think that providing value is only free information and that like you shouldn't pitch right away with your audience. I actually used to believe that and when I first started my audience..

I didn't pitch at all and it was like 30 days on my email sequence before I would pitch anything or at least two to three weeks, and the problem that we'd run into with that, and we made a shift as soon as we realized, I mean, certainly we don't do that anymore...

I mean, you train your audience and your audience is either a buying audience or it's a not-buying audience. If you can establish right away that you are there to provide massive amounts of value, that you're there for the right reasons, you clearly identified your why, you know, all those things with your branding and with your message, charging right away upfront, like having an eBook with an upsell, you know, $37, $97 or a pitch to a webinar.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: That's fine. People don't always expect to get things for free, and the people that do aren't usually your ideal customer. I think that's really important to remember that provide a lot of free information.

Give them opportunity to only take advantage of free information, but having paid content, paid products and things like that, that is not a bad thing and, in fact, if anything it probably will increase the value of your audience when done right.

Steve Larsen: Sure. Completely makes sense. Yeah, absolutely. That's somewhat of a locked gate, you know, between the good people and those who are there to just freeload a little bit.

Josh Forti: Right.

Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. Okay, cool. Cool, cool. Let's say, okay, someone's gone through and they've set the stuff up because they've got like consistency in the message, putting all the platforms together, they've got a hub. What would you say? I know I'm just kind of grilling you, man, but this is awesome stuff.

Josh Forti: Yeah, yeah.

Steve Larsen: Easiest free ways to grow your following?

Josh Forti: Facebook group and Instagram page.

Steve Larsen: Okay.

Josh Forti: Those are going to be your two fastest-growing organic-growth platforms for free. With very rare exception, if you're like a ridiculously awesome video editor and you can produce a YouTube video absolutely every single day, then maybe that's an exception, but for most of us it's the Instagram platform and a Facebook group.

Two reasons for this. One, Instagram is still the fastest-growing platform on social media right now. It's the hottest and it's getting the most users per day over any other platform. They're almost at a billion users there, so half the size of Facebook already.

There is no way to pay the Instagram platform itself for followers like it is on Facebook. Right. I can run ads with like swipe up ads, like swipe up here. Go to this link and have that link back to my page and things like that, but there's no ad that I can run that's like, hey, Instagram, I want more followers and I want to target these people, I want these people to follow my page.

Because of that, the Instagram algorithm still allows us to majorly capitalize on viral content, on Instagram networks, on engagement groups and things like that. So, posting good content, using hashtags. If you're in my group, Social Media for Entrepreneurs, you can go and we give a lot of free trainings on Instagram and social media like this a lot.

Hashtags are important...

The captions are important...

Getting into different engagement groups or plugging into different networks with shout-for-shouts and things like that. You can still majorly take advantage of a lot of those things and grow 10,000 followers in even a month. I mean, that's not impossible.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing.

Josh Forti: It's totally doable, even for the beginner. A Facebook group, on the other hand, typically speaking, it's going to grow a little bit slower. You're not going to get 10,000 members in there in a month organically; however, the quality of your lead is a lot higher because it's important to remember on Instagram, and this is kind of a gold nugget here for those of you who are taking notes and listening, especially in the marketing space.

Instagram followers are not buyers. Now, you might be like, Josh, okay, what the heck?

Why would you preach Instagram then? You get a ridiculous amount of free traffic from Instagram and you need to push them off the platform. Instagram is amazing for free offers, free webinars, free eBooks, things like that, but very rarely do people buy on the Instagram platform. In fact, the same person on Instagram and Facebook I think is like eight times or something like that more likely to buy on the Facebook platform to a paid offer than they are on Instagram.

Steve Larsen: Holy crap.

Josh Forti: I don't remember what the exact thing is. However, it is probably eight times cheaper to get them on the Instagram platform and then just push them off to another platform, either on your email list or into your Facebook group. That's why on every single lead magnet that I ever create the last page of that lead magnet is a call-to-action to my Facebook group.

That's true for both pay traffic and organic traffic, but particularly on Instagram you want to get them and get them off as fast as you can. We're seeing a little bit less of that. Instagram is starting to make some changes, but as of now that is still very much the case.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: Whereas Facebook, the quality of your follower is going to be much higher, a little bit harder to acquire one, but once you have that member in your group or that follower on your page, they are much higher and Facebook is making a really big push for Facebook groups right now. It's never been easier to grow a Facebook group. Everyone's like, ah, the trend is over.

I'm like, oh, no, no. The trend is just starting. To be able to capitalize upon that and really take advantage, yes, obviously, we're already partly up the wave and so it's not as easy as it was six months ago, but I mean we're still launching Facebook groups and getting 1,000 members in a month, all organically and 2,000 members in three or four months.

I tell people the more active you are in a Facebook group the more Facebook will promote you and so if you can be active and you can get your members to be active then Facebook is going to recommend your group to so many other people. Do that and being very, very active in your group, having a clearcut message to that, constantly going live and posting statuses and getting people to engage, answering questions, and then having what we call lots of hoses to fill up the pool. Think of it as a swimming pool, and I got this from my buddy Arnie Getsky, you know, think of your Facebook group as a swimming pool.

If you have one hose in it and if leads are only coming in from one source, it's probably going to fill pretty slow, but if on the end of every lead magnet, whether it's an eBook or a webinar training or even paid courses, and in your email lists your constantly pushing and promoting to your group from all your other social media platforms, now you have six or seven hoses in there.

It's going to grow six or seven times faster...

Steve Larsen: That's a great way to think of it. That's going to make me go rethink what I'm doing at the end of every one of my thank you pages now. I've got to refix some of those things. That's interesting.

So, let's say, lots of free ways, lots of cool ways, and, again, like you said, you pull them from one platform, you can push them to another...

Josh Forti: Right.

Steve Larsen: That's huge about Instagram by the way. That's so cool. Gaining them there but pushing them to Facebook through actual purchasing. Those are free methods, right. What are some of your favorite paid methods for growing it? Let's say you've got some cash you're able to dump behind it. Hire you.

Josh Forti: Facebook ads for sure. Yeah. That's an option for sure. You know, it's really interesting because paid strategies are often not always the best strategies for growing an audience.

Like, in many cases they are, but don't just think because there's money behind it, it can't be done organically...

Interviews, especially with bigger pages, is my favorite way to grow an audience, honestly, getting on podcasts and things like this is honestly my favorite way, but from a paid perspective my two favorite ways are going to be paid Facebook ads and influencer shout-outs on Instagram.

Steve Larsen: Okay.

Josh Forti: Instagram traffic is cheap. It is probably some of the cheapest traffic that you're ever going to get, so a lot of people think paid traffic, they think paying the platform itself. Find an influencer in your industry and in your niche that has similar products or services to whatever it is that you're promoting.

On Instagram it's really easy to find big pages with a lot of followers, a million, half-million, two-million followers in the motivational niche or the quote niche or an entrepreneur space and purchase shout-outs from them for really pennies of what you'd pay elsewhere for the amount of exposure that you're going to be getting. If you have a good offer, usually we do something like a giveaway of some sort, usually a physical product tied in with cash, not just cash only...

We've found that cash doesn't convert as well as if you do have a physical product with it. Pushing them to either your page or to an offer or to your Instagram account or to your Facebook group, that works really well. And so partnering up with influencers to get exposure is huge.

I know we talked about this a little bit both in Vegas and down in Orlando, but make sure that every one of your pages is pixeled with a Facebook pixel and I hardly ever run a Facebook ad before running that offer first on Instagram...

Steve Larsen: Really?

Josh Forti: What I mean by that is if I'm shooting out of the dark, right, and I'm going out there and I am like trying to figure out what's going to work. I don't know who my target audience is, now this is for beginners, all right. I have no pixels. I have no audience creation. I'm just starting out. What I'm going to do is I'm going to go and I'm going to take my offer. Usually it's a free offer because I'm going to Instagram with it and I pixeled all the pages and I'll go and for the people that hit my offer I'm going to get lots and lots of traffic on that page. So for $500 on you know Facebook, I might get opt-ins for like $5 and I might get 100 opt-ins. For $500 on you know Instagram I can get opt-ins for $2 or $1, depending on the audience.

So, all those people are going to hit the page plus all the people that hit the page that didn't opt-in, now I have an audience created and I have an audience created of people that just hit the page and are interested and then another audience created of people that actually opted in, right, because I have that page pixeled too.

Now, I can actually create lookalike audiences on Facebook or re-target those specific people on Facebook for those that didn't buy or that I want to target them with a similar product and I'm going to get higher conversions right off the bat and I'm going to be able to play around right at the beginning. If you are just getting started in paid traffic and you have under a $3,000-4,000 budget total, to play around with this, I'd highly recommend throwing $500 or $1,000 at an Instagram, a couple of Instagram shout-outs.

Typically, story shout-outs work best, story with a swipe-up feature...

Steve Larsen: Oh, cool.

Josh Forti: That usually works better than a post...

Doing things like that, getting a lot of data, pixeling up those pixels, getting them firing off so that you have an audience and then going over there and retargeting on Facebook for Facebook ads for different offers like that.

Steve Larsen: That's an amazing strategy. That's so cool. Pulling from that.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: Oh, man. Then you're retargeting them and okay. Cool. Cool.

Josh Forti: You can create lookalike audiences from there and whatnot. And then as far as growing a Facebook group, so important thing to note is it against Facebook's terms of service to run a Facebook ad directly to a Facebook group. Just FYI.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: We had an account shut down. We learned the hard way. Avoid that. However, if you did want to grow a Facebook group and you do want to, man, I really want to focus on a Facebook group, one of the strategies, like I said, that we have found is just get your highest converting free offer.

Like, something that's going to opt-in at like 60-70% that everybody's opting in at, and then maybe your thank you page, basically a sales page to join a free group.

Steve Larsen: Clever.

Josh Forti: That's going to be the fastest way to be able to, so instead of an upsell, if you're like, man, I've got $3,000 to dump at advertising for my group, how am I going to do that best?

If you want to run paid traffic just find your highest converting landing page, put the thank you page as basically a sales page for that group and then as long as that group is on the second page and not on the first page that they click on, you should be fine and then you can promote people to that group that way.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. It's a little gray hat action. Zuckerberg, you hear that? Just kidding.

Josh Forti: A little bit. I'm sure he's listening, so, you know.

Steve Larsen: He's everywhere. We've got Zucker in the air.

Josh Forti: That's right. That's right.

Steve Larsen: Hey. That's super cool. Just a final question here. I guess is there some kind of platform that helps people be able to pull this off and do this? I don't know, something that you like or are you literally kind of manually going through and doing all this stuff, pushing all these different platforms and stuff? Is there a tool that you're using?

Josh Forti: As far as like the content, like pushing out the content or creating the content or getting the data or like what specifically?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I guess not so much curating, pushing it around though.

Josh Forti: Oh, gosh. We have a team, different BA's or whatnot.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: I think that's probably going to be the best way for most people is just diversifying content from there, different transcripts and things like that. As far as like pushing it out, like there are different schedulers, like you can schedule content on Instagram, Onlypult and Groom both are like, if you want to schedule content to be automatically posted. Those ones both work for Instagram.

Typically speaking, the reach is a little bit lower because Instagram knows, but they have said, yeah, you can do that. For Facebook we use like Buffer or Hootsuite. Once again, in my experience, reach is lower, so I always like to just post things. For me, I really value the exposure.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: I really value reaching the maximum amount of people that I can reach. I post everything manually. My BA's don't use schedulers. I don't use schedulers. Everything that you see is done from a real person. As far as analytics and like data is concerned, the Instagram platform, social info is actually mine, so you know, slightly partial, but we have crafted and we coded.

We've been working on this for the last eight months...

We've been tweaking and tweaking and tweaking it. Social info basically gives you, for the Instagram platform, every piece of data you need from what content is working or not working for influencers to hashtag research to being able to download other people's content to like everything that you need on there to checking if your account is shadow banned, things like that. From an Instagram perspective, if you're trying to grow your Instagram organically, social info, it's my favorite platform for that.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Appreciate that. Thank you so much. Hey, I appreciate it. Where can actually people reach out to you and be following you and be seeing what you're doing?

Josh Forti: Yeah. The best way to stay in touch is just going to be the Facebook group. Use my strategies that I just told you guys.

Post it all to one place. Social Media for Entrepreneurs.

If you got to socialmediaforentrepreneurs.co it will take you right to the group and you'll be able to check that out. And then if you want something for free there is an eBook that I wrote and it's all about how to create a profitable personal brand and actually start generating leads for free with the audience that you have on Facebook and optimizing your Facebook profile and things like that. If you go to joshforti.com/ebook.

My last name is spelled F-O-R-T-I, but joshforti.com/ebook. You can get something for free there. That's a pretty cool book and there's some contact information as well as the thank you pages, a call-to-action to join the Facebook group.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, and what better to go check out a live example of everything we've been talking about then just to go check out the group anyway.

Josh Forti: That's right.

Steve Larsen: Social Media for Entrepreneurs. Awesome stuff. Well, I appreciate it. Thanks so much Josh and thanks for taking the time to do this.

Josh Forti: Absolutely, man. I appreciate you having me on, and I look forward to working with you and making the world a better place.

Steve Larsen: Boom. Just try to tell me you didn't like that. Hey, whoever controls content controls the game. Want to interview me or get interviewed yourself? Grab a time now at stevejlarsen.com.

Click above to listen in iTunes...

I've come to know and be increasingly amazed by Dana. His knowledge and skillset never ending and very impressive. Dive into this episode with notes to learn how he's using the Dream 100...

What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

How's it going everyone, I am super excited for today.

I have a very special guest on. Please go stop whatever else you're doing. Again this is another one. Take a piece of paper out, write down notes, write down inspiring things that come to you. This is the kind of episode that not just has the ability to teach you a lot, but have a direct impact on the thickness of your wallet. I'm very excited for our guest today. I have known him for quite some time.

I'm always extremely impressed with everything that he does. I want to welcome to the show, Dana Derricks. How you doing man?

Dana Derricks: What's up man? Hey, thanks for having me. And for anybody that's listening, if you're in your car, pull over, put your hazards on. Just stop what you're doing. Tell your dog to go away. Your about to get hit with some gold here.

Steve Larsen: This is awesome stuff. Thanks for being on. Anyway, I've been just been super impressed with you. I think honestly the first time we met though was we were redoing the homepage of ClickFunnels and Russel's like ... I remember I came in one day and Russel was like ... He was like, "Hey man. Dude I got Dana Derricks man.

He's going to come on over and he's going to help us rewrite the entire, all the copy for ClickFunnels' homepage." And I was like, "Cool. Wait, who's this?" "He's the goat farmer." I was like, "Wait there's a guy ... There's a goat farmer who's an internet marketer?"

He's like, "Yeah yeah yeah yeah." And then you came out and you showed up, and you had overalls and like, sweet straw farmer hats. And I was like, "This guys is the man." And like ever since then I've just been diving into your stuff. I'm super impressed with what you do.

Dana Derricks: Dude, thanks man. I'm glad I have one fan.

Steve Larsen: Whatever.

Dana Derricks: No, that was so much fun and don't forget what ... By the end of that trip, what did you end up wearing home?

Steve Larsen: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. So he came in one day, just so everyone on the show ... He came in one day, it was one of the last days, and he had a full chicken suit costume for me. What was ... You gave Dave a massive bear. Russell had ... He was the gorilla right?

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Russell was a gorilla, Dave was a bear, you were the chicken.

Steve Larsen: That's right. And I thought that it'd be funny to ride that on my motorcycle home. So I did. And we'll put that -

Dana Derricks: And...

Steve Larsen: In the show notes.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Please. And can we put the picture? Can we dig up the picture too?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I'll go find the picture. I'm just writing that down.

Dana Derricks: Oh man. So good.

Steve Larsen: Chicken.

Dana Derricks: Such a good sport everybody. Steve Larsen, everybody.

Steve Larsen: Oh thanks man. Appreciate it. Well hey, just so ... If you guys don't know, if you're not aware, Dana Derricks is one of the, I would say foremost experts on this whole concept that I feel like is extremely kind of gray, cloudy. A lot of people don't understand it, but it's this whole thing around the Dream 100 and how to actually implement it.

And I mean you literally wrote a book on it right? And when did that come out?

Dana Derricks: When did the book come out?

Steve Larsen: Yeah yeah.

Dana Derricks: I think it's been out for about eight months. So probably about towards the end of last, of 2017.

Steve Larsen: Okay cool. Now before, before you were doing Dream 100 ... So I mean, first of all, how did you become an advocate of Dream 100? How did you start doing it yourself?

Was it ... I mean, I know the story, but for everyone else who's listening, like how does a goat farmer who's also a copywriter, who's also an internet marketer overall product creator, go directly into Dream 100 stuff as well? Could you give us a little backstory there?

Dana Derricks: I know. Everybody at this point is probably thinking, "Stephen, what is wrong with you? Where did you find this guy?"

Steve Larsen: "Who is this guy?"

Dana Derricks: Yeah. "What's happening?" So yeah. So I guess a little bit of a backstory that got me into the Dream 100 was I'm the type of guy that's going to try everything, and then figure out what works and what doesn't. And when I figure out something doesn't work, I just keep moving. Like, so I always say like honestly, there's two things about me that work well.

Like, number one I'm too dumb to overthink things so I don't get paralyzed by that. And then number two, for every ten things I try, one of them works and I'm thrilled. Like I'm so grateful for the other nine that didn't work so that I could get those out of the way to find the one that did. Right? So like for me, like I look at like major league baseball right?

The best in the world, on the planet, go up to the plate and they end up getting a base hit or you know a single, double, triple home run only three out of ten times. Right? Like nobody goes over four out of ten. So what's happening the other seven out of ten times?

They're striking out. They're hitting the ball and getting it caught.

Like bad stuff's happening almost over two thirds of the time. Yet like, us in business we go and try one thing, we step up to the plate and we expect to hit a home run, and then when we don't we're like devastated and never want to step up to the plate again.

So for me, I was not ... I wish I could share this amazing story of how I fell in love with the Dream 100, and it was this love story. But reality is dude, I tried everything. So back in the days of Google SEO, like, Google AdWords, and then YouTube, and then Facebook, and then like all these things I tried and tried and tried, and it just like, it sucked and I failed.

I kept failing, and failing, and then I realized, "Wait a minute." I was already doing the Dream 100 before I even knew what it was, and that was the only thing that ever worked for me. So that's why I got obsessed, doubled down, wrote a book about it, and all that other good stuff.

Steve Larsen: I mean, how did you first find out about it though? Was it straight from Chet Holmes course, from Russel's stuff, from ... Where'd you learn about it?

Dana Derricks: Yes. So I actually first figured it out through Russell.

I think he had something ... One of his things was like the lost chapter on the Dream 100, and he just kind of described what it was, and then he was talking about Chet and I was like, "Oh man. I have sifted through many stacks of hay looking for this needle, and I finally found it."

And then I grabbed Chet's trainings and it was like game over from there...

Steve Larsen: So what ended up happening. I mean you read this thing, and you go start implementing. Like what did you do first? Because there's a lot of ... I feel like there's just a ton of misconceptions.

Everyone thinks it has to be this package, or it has to be this ... I don't know. I think we all over complicate it a bit. Like what did you end up go doing?

Dana Derricks: Totally. So well, the first that I think everybody thinks when they first learn about the Dream 100 is, "Oh my gosh, I've already kind of been doing that. Right? I didn't realize it."

So for me, the big epiphany immediately was, "Holy crap." So for those that don't know my story, I grew up in a town of, I kid you not, 512 people.

Steve Larsen: Oh no way.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. My graduating class was 30 and we had a big class.

Steve Larsen: Wow. Cool.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So my life growing up, because we didn't have a movie theater, we didn't have a grocery store in town. We had nothing. We had a bunch of cows and not even a goat. Like what the heck? Right?

So football was our life, and I love football so much that I didn't want to stop playing after high school. I wanted to play in college. And nobody from my school, or area for that matter, played in college or did anything after high school. Like it was just, like we're too small.

Nobody knows about it. Like it's not for real. So I'm like, "Screw that." So none of my coaches ever played college football. They don't know how to help with recruiting and all this. So I'm like, "Screw that. I'm going to do it myself then."

And basically what I did is I created these ... Well first I started with ... I printed out a list of 40 schools that I potentially wanted to play football for. And then I made a packet for each school, like literally a box, and in it had like the highlight tape, a letter of recommendation from a coach, a personalized letter addressed to the coach that I was sending it to, all this stuff right. And I mailed all 40. And I was like, "All right, sweet. Let's see what happens." Two weeks goes by nothing. I'm like, "Wow that was a waste of time."

Third week, I get called to the principal's office which for me is not a good thing. Like, "Oh man. What did I do?" I go in there and there's a football coach in there, and I'm like, "Whoa." He's like, "Are you Dana," and I'm like, "Yeah. Who are you?"

He's like, "I'm Coach so and so." And he's like, "I'm here to recruit you." And I'm like, "What? You're here to recruit me? You came all the way to my town?" He's like, "Yeah," and then day or two goes by and then I get called back in and suddenly there's two coaches in there from two different schools at the same time. And I'm like, "Oh my gosh." And I remember like ... Yeah. Like my principal pulled me aside and he's like, "Dana when is this going to stop. It's really disruptive." I'm like, "I'm sorry Mr.C, it's like a broken fire hose. I can't do anything."

So long story short, because of the Dream 100, I didn't even realize what it was at the time, I ended up getting a pretty major football scholarship, and I'm the only person in the history of my school that's ever gotten any sort of athletic scholarship, and it's 100% thanks to the Dream 100. So that's like the first emotion you go through I think when you learn about the Dream 100 is like, "Oh my gosh. Why didn't I know about this sooner? I was already doing it."

You know? And then it turns into, "How do I now leverage the crap out of this in what I'm doing today here and now?" Right? So what I did, just really quick, was I wrote out a list of my Dream 100 right then and there and I remember, I'll never forget, Russell was at the top of my list and I looked at it ... This was not that long ago either. This was only a couple years ago.

I looked at it, I'm like, "There's no way that I could ever get that guy to ever pay attention to me or do anything with me." Right? And I erased it. I literally erased it, and then I was like, "Oh maybe." Right? "YOLO." So I put it back up on the side of the list, like with an asterisk. And I'm like, "Eh. Maybe." Right? And then fast forward like couple years, and then I go up, get to meet you and hang out with Russell, and speak at a Funnel Hacking Live, and all this other crazy stuff, and it's all 100% thanks to the Dream 100.

Steve Larsen: So for everyone else also, before we started this Dana is an amazing copywriter. He's amazing and Dream 100, and between those two topics I asked him, I was like, "Which one do you want to talk about?" And he said, "Which one do you want to talk about?" I said, "Which one gets you the most frustrated and mad?" And he immediately said, "Dream 100."

Why is that? Before we dive into some how you actually put this together, how come the Dream 100 gets you most ticked off compared to copywriting which is also very important?

Dana Derricks: I love this question. So for me it's because I feel like it's sort of a tragedy that most ... Every single business isn't ... Like first of all that everybody just doesn't know about it, number one. And then every single business or entrepreneur isn't using it. Like to me that is such a tragedy.

And for some reason, like I still don't know why. For some reason when people think of traffic and getting people into their funnels or eyeballs on their offers, or whatever, they instantly think, "Oh Facebook ads. I need Facebook ads." And for some reason, like that apparently is the only traffic source in the world. Right? Like, it's just this crazy misconception and the reality is is the Dream 100 is a much ... How do I want to say it?

It's a much more sustainable approach because it will never go away. It worked 50 years ago, it works now, it'll work 50 years from now. And it also ... It's free. I mean it's targeted eyeballs on your stuff for free. And it's all about ... It's really not that difficult. It's just building relationships with people.

So that ... I guess that fires me up is like why everybody thinks they need to have Facebook ads or whatever else when they could be using the Dream 100 instead.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, I feel like maybe that is part of the issue though is like, most internet marketers now are ... We're just spoiled. I mean before Facebook days, I mean how did everyone get the traffic that they needed. It's exactly what you're talking about right now and I feel like that's ... Not that Facebook's a bad thing, but I don't know how to drive ads.

Like I don't want to go learn that stuff. I feel like Dream 100 is so much more long term sustainable, higher leverage sources of eyeballs than going and ... Anyway. And learning that stuff. So you mentioned real fast, you said, "Okay. I went and I ..." It's funny because Russell was number one on mine also, and I was like, "Eh, we'll see. I don't know."

How did you make your list? I feel like that's the ... Do you feel like that's the reason people actually never do this? Like one of the choke points? Or how do you actually put it together?

Dana Derricks: I think that's a big one. And that's probably the most common question I'm asked when I'm talking about it. Yeah. It's like, "Who was my Dream 100? Who was it?" And I'm like, "Well ..." So finally I came up with a very simplistic equation I can give you and your listeners if you want it.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I'd love that.

Dana Derricks: So basically it starts ... It doesn't start with your Dream 100, it starts with you and then your customer avatar. So it's literally this simple. Who is your customer avatar? And that to me is a function of who do you want, as well as who do you not want? So it's who you want, minus who you don't want, equals your customer avatar. Right? And then so I've got my customer avatar, because if you don't have that then the Dream 100 is a very complex, difficult thing because you don't know. Right? So all right. The next question is, where are your customer avatar? Like where do they hang out? Right?

Is it certain Facebook groups? Is it associations they're in? Is it ... Are they buying the same book? Are they all subscribed to the same software? Do they listen to the same podcast?

Like if you can figure out who your avatar is, figuring out where they are is not that hard, and then wherever they are, whoever owns and controls the group that they're in, the groups I should say, or the audiences, that right there is your Dream 100.

Steve Larsen: Interesting. So you go from your customer avatar meaning who you want and don't want, and then you go from where they are, and then who already has them.

Dana Derricks: Exactly. Boom. Done.

Steve Larsen: Who has them. I'm just taking notes.

Dana Derricks: Sure.

Steve Larsen: Who has them. Okay, so then from that point, like ... So I'm just ... From when I've launched a lot of stuff and I've got Dream 100 stuff all over my office right now. What ... Huge believer. Huge believer. So I'm excited I get to -

Dana Derricks: Yeah man...

Steve Larsen: I feel like ... I mean I like to sit down and start creating somewhat of a campaign for each one of these people with a blend of personalization, but also my ability to do it kind of en masse. You know what I mean? To each one of these people. I don't know if that makes sense. But what do you do next to actually get a hold of them?

Are you going one by one for each of them? Are you doing something mass that kind of blankets all 100?

Dana Derricks: Great questions. So I actually, gosh this is just a little bit off topic but it helps to kind of illustrate this. So how build my system around what's working is I do everything the hardest, longest way possible and then that becomes my system. So for example, if I launch a new offer for something, like if I have a ... If I come out with a new $2000 book right?

I will find the person who is absolutely unqualified to buy it, who might want it, but who's totally ... Like for example, maybe they're totally broke. Right?

And I will literally go through and answer every single question for them, and have 1500 back and forths if I have to, to then have basically, after the point of first contact to the point where they actually buy the thing, which is like a humongously long duration of time and effort.

That is my system. Right? So that is now my system because very single objection basically has already been taken care of, and those are now all scripts that I can use for the next person. So I do the basically ... That's how I look at everything. So for my Dream 100, like let's say I have a target. And I'll use more of a short term target. So like a smaller kind of, more accessible one.

Because Russell, that's a long term play. Right? But like a smaller one that you could start the conversation with already is like ... You definitely have the elements of personalization, so figuring out ... And this all comes obviously from ... So for those of you that are Dream 100'ing Stephen, you're in the right place because listening to his podcast is a great way to get his attention and get to know him, and the second secret sauce I'll tell you is, buy all of his stuff. Okay?

So there's a correlation usually between how much access you get to someone, and how much money you've spent with them. So -

Steve Larsen: That is fascinating actually.

Dana Derricks: Right?

Steve Larsen: Man. You say too much good stuff man. You got to slow down. I can't write that fast.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So for me it's like, I'll just pick ... So when you're starting out, it's really critically important to just pick one that isn't years down the road, so don't go after Tony Robbins on your first one. But also don't go after somebody that is already in your network that you could get a yes from without even having to go through all the hoops of all the other stuff right?

And then just figure out what it is that can just showcase to them that you care about what they say, and you listen, and you consume their stuff, and you buy their stuff. Right?

So I've had people ... I learned this myself, they're like, "Well are you ..." I wanted to partner with software companies before and they asked, "Well are you a subscriber of the software?" And I'm like, "Good question." Right? Like, "I should probably get an account and get to know it really well before I should expect them to want to do anything with me." Right? So that's the beginning.

If you're not already doing that, then it's going to be really really difficult. But once you are, then ... Because it's like you're part of the community right? And -

Steve Larsen: It's funny that ... There's a few times I've tried to reach out, or someone reached out to me, and they're like, "How do I learn this?" I'm like, "You serious? I have a course on this."

They're like ... You know there's been times when ... Anyway. I don't know how else to say yes, amen, ahh, little hallelujah, lights coming down. What he's saying right now, please visualize bright shiny objects and things in the sky because that is so gold.

Dana Derricks: That's funny man. But yeah, like if you think about it, makes total sense too. Like, if you're already ... And the other ... To take that a step further, is if you can contribute value to their community, right? So like for me with Russell, I have intentionally ... I don't ... I love helping people, but like I'm not getting paid and I'll go into the ClickFunnels community, the Facebook group or whatever, and I just go help people. I'm not there, I don't have an agenda.

I don't have ... I'm not selling them. I'm just going in there and helping. So if they have a question to something that I know the answer to, I'll spend five, ten minutes helping them.

Steve Larsen: Which you're so good at man. I've seen you pop around all over the place doing that. Like I watch you do that all the time. You're such a ... Ah, it's awesome. Okay cool. Yeah.

Dana Derricks: Thanks man. Well hey, see I'm glad somebody notices.

Steve Larsen: I do man. Yeah I turn back around I'm like, "Man this group doesn't even ... It's not even active anymore. Or this." I'm like, "Man, Dana wrote a long incredible response to that. This is cool. He spent a lot of time on this."

Dana Derricks: So yeah. Because if you think about it, who's the perfect person for a guy like Russell to put on stage at his live event? Somebody that the community already knows, likes, and trusts. Right? Somebody that has invested in him and what he's building. And then, not only like monetarily. Yeah I gave him a lot of money to get into his inner circle, right?

But also like, I spend quite a bit of time, and energy, and effort on helping his people for free. I don't ask for anything in return you know? So it's like ... That's a deadly combination for anybody to ... How can you say no? Right?

Steve Larsen: Right. Oh interesting.

Dana Derricks: So if somebody's saying no to you, ask yourself those three things. Am I already buying their stuff and consuming their stuff, and in the community? Am I contributing to the community?

And have I ... What was the last one? Oh. I think, have I given them a lot of money?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Okay okay. So once ... Let's say ... Let's say ... Right. Because there was some point when Russell's like, "Wow. I'm now aware of Dana," and you realize that he is. How do you move forward? I feel like that's one of the other major questions kind of from the community that happens. They'll be like, "What do I say to him next?"

You know, "When do I drop, 'Hey we need stuff?'" What's the steps forward after you've gotten their attention?

Dana Derricks: This is like the second most frequently asked question is like, "I don't know what to say to him" or "I just feel like ..." Whatever. And I'll share quick like ... So Lady Boss, Brandon and Kaelin Poulin, amazing human beings, I work with them. They're in my intensive I call it. It's kind of like a course mastermind blend. And they build a $10 million company off of paid ads. And I'm just thinking to myself, "Holy crap. If I could make $10 off paid ads I'd be thrilled," right? And they're like, "We should probably try this Dream 100 thing."

And I'm like, "Yeah you probably should. Good idea." So three days before Funnel Hacking Live, Brandon the action taker he is, he enrolled in my course and then he's like, "You know what? I got a guy I think I'm going to put in this spot."
So because they're a big company, they can just by having a full-time affiliate partnership management person. Right? So he ends up being Brandon's brother, and his name's Jeff. He's awesome.

And Jeff asked me three days before the event this exact question right? Because Kaelin was going to be on stage, which is an amazing opportunity for people to know Lady Boss, and I'm sure there are people in the sea of the 3000 plus that they could potentially work with somehow right? Or they know somebody that they could. So Jeff's like, "Dana," he's like, "I'm really new to this. What do I say to people?"

And I'm like, "Jeff, this is the only thing you have to make sure you say. Everything else just be yourself, but this is what you have to say. Before you end any conversation, just ask the question, 'How can we help each other?'" That's it.

If you can just get that question out there, they may not have the answer immediately, but at least it gets their mind going, and number one it like tells them what your agenda is. It's not, "Hey can you do Lady Boss?" No. It's like, "Hey. We want to help each other," and that's kind of how it was for me as well with Russell is I got on his radar, and then you know it's like, "How can I help you with what you're doing? How can I help ClickFunnels?" Right?

And then that's how it came to, "Hey. You could probably help me by coming out here and knocking this copy for the homepage." Right?

So a really long winded way of saying like, if you can just always have that question in your mind, "How can we help each other," then it just takes care of the rest.

Steve Larsen: You know, it's interesting, with that approach, which I absolutely love because it comes from a place of friendship, and adding value, I mean you think about Dream 100 ... I mean, doing that 100 times, I mean it's easy to see how ... You easily could have a full-time position with somebody just doing that alone.

Managing those relationships, working on the next pieces. Is there ever ... What's the point in the relationship after you've been adding value, because I'm sure it's different for everybody. We're all different, but is there a time where ... Because some of them probably come up and go, "Hey. Let me promote your stuff."

But then there's probably other times you have to come back out and say, "Oh my gosh, he's not getting it, or maybe I do have to be a little more forward." Like how do you approach somebody and say that without sounding ... After you've given value, they know you're there, they know you're there to help, you've clearly developed a relationship. What's the way that you approach them and say, "Promote my stuff?"

Dana Derricks: Love it. So I basically relate it to marriage. So me personally I would never get down on a knee if I didn't know the gal was going to say yes. I just don't want to be the next YouTube marriage proposal fail video. Right?

Steve Larsen: Which are great to watch.

Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. As a viewer. Yeah. So I look at it the same way as like ... Like I ask myself, "Have I built up enough goodwill with this person," whether that's buying their stuff, consuming their stuff, being in their community, contributing to their community, or whatever. Contributing directly to them. "Have I done enough of that for them to say yes to what I'm going to ask?"

And if the answer isn't a clear yes, I just keep giving value. And usually for me, it's get to the point where people will ask me, "How can I help you?" Like all the time. That's one of the most common asked questions I have is from people just when I see them at events and stuff, and it's like, "How can we help you?"

And then I'm like, "Hm. Well let me think about that for a second..."

And then it's just the perfect ... So that's the thing is like, can you confidently say yes you've built enough goodwill up for them to say yes. And then number two, if not just continue to give them more value somehow.

Steve Larsen: That makes total sense. Okay okay. So we've gone through ... Okay. Gone through how you make the list, psychology of ... I love your approach by the way. That is just pure gold. Choose the hardest way possible because that becomes a system. That way all the objections popup and you can address those in scripts. Things like that. Just brilliant.

How to actually ... What do you do with the Dream 100 next? How can we help each other? On to promoting. Okay.

You are notoriously known in the inner circle, in pretty much everywhere who's ever come in contact with you, for your incredible packages that you do send.

Dana Derricks: Oh man.

Steve Larsen: Could you talk a little bit about the way that you do that? I know that Dream 100 itself is not packages, but obviously that is a strategy and a method. Could you tell us a little bit about what it is that you're sending out and what you're working through as you go through each person?

Because I've heard some pretty amazing stuff get sent around from you.

Dana Derricks: Oh man. Well do I have your address? I'll have to get it. So yeah. Russell talks about ... Because somebody asked him this once, and he had a great response. He said that he likes to theme things. And I didn't even realize that I was doing it, but he mentioned me as well. But he does superheroes.

You know. So that kind of takes some of the question out of what you should be sending is if you can latch onto a theme. So for me, obviously goats. So I've got ... Let's see if I have one. Oh I must have sent it out. Oh no I have one. Hold on, wait for it.

Steve Larsen: Is that the screaming goat thing?

Dana Derricks: That's the screaming goat.

Steve Larsen: Nice.

Dana Derricks: Oh I got to get you one man. Oh my gosh. That's the best way to crush any awkward silence ever right there.

Steve Larsen: Just play that.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So my stuff is really goat related. And then the other thing that I look at is ... And the other thing, if you're creative you don't have to spend a lot of money. I know that's a concern for people, and at the end of the day though this stuff is so valuable, as soon as you get one, yes everything's paid for.

So I keep that in the back of my mind. That keeps me going. But as far as like making it stand out and be cool, because I get stuff ... People send me stuff and I hope ... I don't care if they're listening or not.

Steve Larsen: It's a lesson. It's a lesson. We're all good.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Like I love you guys. Keep sending me stuff. There is a difference though between something that somebody personally put together in a box, and somebody that just sends me a gift from Amazon with like a gift card, or the typed out thing from Amazon. Like both are cool, and you doing just the Amazon thing is better than 99% of people. But like there's something to be said about that hand touch and stuff.

So for me like, I guess my creativity comes out because one of the things I sent to everybody in the inner circle that kind of got everybody kind of, I don't know, in a frenzy was -

Steve Larsen: Yeah..

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Was a wizard stick. So long story short, my dad lives in Texas, I'm in Wisconsin and I like to send to his Christmas gifts. So a couple years ago I bought this weird like weed puller thing where it's like you don't have to bend over to pull weeds out. It's like ... You know what I'm talking about?

Steve Larsen: Yeah yeah. Totally.

Dana Derricks: And I open it up from Amazon or whatever, and then I forgot. Threw the box away and then I was like, "Oh man. It's like 4:50 PM on a Friday. I need to get this out to my dad." So I went to the post office and I'm like, "Do you have a box that this would maybe fit in?" And they're like, "No not at all." And I'm like, "Oh crap." But he's like, the post master was like, "But we could send it like that." I'm like, "What?" He's like, "Yeah."

Like picture basically like a shovel. Essentially a shovel. He's like, "We could send it just like that." I'm like, "Wait what? You don't have to put in a box?" He's like, "No."

So basically, picture the shovel. They just printed off the label, and then like stuck it to the handle of the shovel, and then the shovel got sent in the mail just like that. Like no box. And so I'm like, "Huh. You don't have to put things in boxes. That's amazing."

So I sent out these wizard staffs or whatever, and I zip tied a wizard hat on top, and didn't put it in a box, and all these sticks essentially showed up at people's mailboxes and it was just this big crazy viral thing. And stuff like that that's just way more memorable and exciting when stuff like that shows up than just a box from Amazon. You know?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Yeah yeah yeah. Let's say ... Okay. So I've identified my Dream 100, I've contributed some things to the community, I really want to do things to grab their attention, what are some of the ... I mean, how much money are you spending on each one of these packages?

You mentioned it could be cheap, and sometimes that's better, but how much money per package do you expect, or ... I guess that's the question. How much money do you expect to be spending on each one of them?

Dana Derricks: If I can keep it under ... So depends on the target too. I segment my Dream 100 with A, B, and C.

Steve Larsen: Oh really?

Dana Derricks: Yeah. A is being like the top, B is being like middle, and then C is being like quick wins. Reason for that is because another things that people ask is like, "Well how high should I shoot?" And if you have all like, Russell, Gary V., Grant Cardone's on your list, like it's not that it won't happen, it's just that's not going to happen any time soon. You know? So I learned an expensive lesson from my football scholarship.

And that was I ended up playing in a division two school, which they still give great football scholarships, and mine was a huge one, but wasn't a D one school because I listened to the doubt in my head that I was never good enough to play D one so I didn't even print off any D one schools. I really regret that to this day.

So I just had B's on the list. And so if I'm looking at ... Typically for a B campaign, or even some C's, if I can keep my packages between $20 and $40 a piece, I'm pretty happy with that. But again, there come ... It comes with like, pretty relentless followup. Because if you just sent the box to somebody, good luck. But you got to do more than that. You know?

Steve Larsen: Right. Right right. Followup process. What does your followup process typically look like?

Dana Derricks: Oh man. So -

Steve Larsen: Because you're a beast at this man. I'm pumped to hear this.

Dana Derricks: It's very extensive. So ... Oh man. Do you want the whole ... Not like the whole thing, but do you want to know the extent I go?

Steve Larsen: Yeah, totally. I do. Because I feel like what people do is, let's say I go put the package together, I go to the mailbox, I drop the thing off. Boom. I've now done Dream 100. You know? That's kind of it, and people kind of like rinse their hands. "Yes, I get my success cookie for the day."

But it's really not over...

Dana Derricks: No. It's just beginning.

Steve Larsen: You're brilliant at this part. I'm so pumped.

Dana Derricks: Thanks man. So that's like ... If you're running a marathon, that's the gun that just started the marathon. But you can go home with your marathon number on, and you've dressed up, and congrats you participated, but you didn't finish. Right? So for me it's like, I'll send them ... For me really the lumpy mail is permission to follow up with them.

That's all it is. Because if I send somebody a gift card, or I don't care, wizard stick in the mail, like I have the right to follow up with you now. Right? I've spent money, invested time and money into you, now you don't have to work with me, or say yes to what I'm asking, but you do have to reply. Like that's the decent thing to do.

So I will then send them an email followup, and it's never like, "Hey did you get my email?" Like have you ever had somebody message you 17 times on 17 platforms saying, "Did you see my email?"

Steve Larsen: Yeah. "I called you. I called you. I called you. I called you." You're like, "Oh my. I know. I saw it, okay?"

Dana Derricks: Dude. Yeah. Like we saw it. Like -

Steve Larsen: It drives me nuts.

Dana Derricks: Right. But if it's like, "Hey did you see the package I sent?" That's a different ball game. That's like, "Whoa you spent money on me, and you took the time and energy to cut through and go to me in the mail." Right? So I'm always like, "Hey did you get the box yet that I sent," or whatever. And I'm not like ... I'm never annoying about it because like, I'll look at the tracking and make sure the thing was delivered before I'm like, "Hey did you get the box?" And they're like, "No, what box?" Right? It's like ... So that ... So it's basically multi-channel followup. It's really ... It's extensive. So it'll go from emails and Facebook messages and whatever they are on, and then if I get no response from them, and I know that they're potentially seeing my messages and I've gone to the extent of like, two, three, four weeks of followups, next is a dodge ball in the mail.

Steve Larsen: Wait you send them an actual dodge ball in the mail?

Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

Steve Larsen: So you're calling them out?

Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. If I have their address, they're so screwed man.

Steve Larsen: I didn't know you do that. That's funny man.

Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. Well that's because you've replied to me.

Steve Larsen: Oh that's funny.

Dana Derricks: So dodge ball. Rubber snakes work really well. It's literally ... And it's always ... Here's a thing. It's always got to be around humor though, and sarcastic, otherwise it's just ... It wouldn't work. So like the dodge ball's like, "Come on man. You're dodging me." And they know I'm not going to stop at this point. And the rubber snake, I think it's just to hilarious to think of the thought of them opening a box to see a snake inside. Like, it's just so funny. So I've never had to go past the snake, but the next one ...

This is kind of naughty, but I will, I am prepared to send a certified with like a W9 inside that basically says, "All right man, have it your way. If you don't want to reply, then I guess you can pay the taxes on all this stuff I sent you." It's all a big joke, but that's the extent.

Like people don't see ... They think you ... Like you said, they just send something and then all these good things happen and it's not. You have to really work.

Steve Larsen: You have to really keep going on them.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. And just be ... But being like ... Not badgering them though either.

Steve Larsen: There's a line.

Dana Derricks: Value. Yeah. For sure.

Steve Larsen: Okay, so someone ... Is the package ... I've heard you say this before, but just for everyone listening. Is the package the first thing you send to them?

Dana Derricks: No. So what I've found is ... I'm not sure the number, like the percentage. I'd say it's close to half. Probably close to half the Dream 100 deals I've made, I've never had to send anything in the mail.

Steve Larsen: Wow.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So that's more of like, it's in the tool belt, it's like a special kind of like drill. Right? You can use it when you need to, but you don't have to use it. So for me it's like more so cutting through the noise, and then giving me permission to continue to followup.

Steve Larsen: Interesting. Okay. You just turn up the heat when you get to packages.

Dana Derricks: For sure. And then also though, it's also about nurturing too. So I send my existing affiliate Dream 100 people, like my number one affiliate last year, I sent him ... I think I probably told you this before, but I sent him a big screen TV and surround sound just out of the blue. Right?

Just to keep him happy and yeah. So that's when it comes back in is really just spoiling people and giving them gifts and all that good stuff.

Steve Larsen: So ... Okay. So I mean you've given a lot of ways to actually pull this off, to get attention. As far as like pulling off a JV with them, and them ... Could you go through some of the practices that you have when someone says yes. Like, "Yeah I'm super super excited to dropout." You know, my people [ Dana. I've heard a lot of people that go by ... I don't know.

They'll pull like a URL up. There's a whole lot of like small little isms and little practices that are out there. Do you mind going through just a few of those?

Dana Derricks: Yeah, sure. So is this ... What's the goal? To get them to promote?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I guess as far as like they've said yes. As far as pulling off the JV with them. What are some of the things that you do to make that go smoothly?

Dana Derricks: Sure. Great question. So the number one hurdle that you'll have to get through first is getting them to actually do it. Because all these people will tell you yes because they don't want to disappoint you or whatever. But few will actually follow through and do the promotion.

Steve Larsen: Interesting.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. And Russell talked about this too. He said ... I don't know if he's faxed me this or where I heard it but, he said for every hundred people you target, you'll probably only end up with maybe about six that actually do the promotion with you. And of those six probably only about three will actually be worth all that time and energy.

Steve Larsen: Totally believe that.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Right? So I break it down like this for ... And my students do it this way. So it's like, first things first. Once we're to the point where we think we can ask, we do. And then when they say yes, we're always selling the thing that sells the thing. So it's not like ... It's getting the calendar. Getting it penciled in on the calendar.

That is like the next win we need. That's what we're trying to sell. If we can get that dang spot locked up, I can remember there were ... I was on the phone with the CEO of very well known company in our space, and he's just like, "Yeah we're booked through whatever."

And I'm just like, "Dude. You know what? That's totally cool. Let's just do October. Right? How's that? Like, October clean for you?"

He's like, "Yeah, yeah okay." And then I'm like, "All right cool. How about the 12th?" And then just getting it on there because if they're going to be like, "Oh I want to look at my schedule, I have to view calendar, I'll have to get back to you," or whatever. But more friction right?

Steve Larsen: Sidestep. Yeah.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So I found too like where it was ... Excuse the sirens this is a big deal for a town of 1000.

Steve Larsen: You're good. No worries.

Dana Derricks: So like, also I've been surprised too where like I had it penciled in, I'm thinking, "Yeah they just told me that so I would keep them happy, or keep me happy." And then they actually did do it on that date and time. So it was like, "Wow, this is awesome." So that's the first big thing. And then making sure that you take everything off their plate.

Because the minute they thing that they're going to have to lift a finger for this, they don't want to do it. Right? So from beginning to end, we do every single thing. We will create all the swipe files for them to send out. We'll create all the affiliate ... I call them co-branded funnels.

So if we're pushing a webinar for example, it'll be a co-branded webinar funnel. We'll offer to host a webinar if they are cool with that.

And then we deliver everything to them about like two weeks in advance just so that everything's done. And then we followup and make sure. That's what's really cool about having an affiliate manager is that they kind of take care of all that, but like we'll make sure that every step of the way is covered so they don't -

Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. Oh man that's super ... Okay wow. That's crazy cool. And what do you when you ... Because I mean, I'm sure it happens right? You go out and you're getting ... I mean I've had those people ...I've had this happen also. Like you go out and someone says yes. You get the few yes's. Six say yes, three actually do it. What do you do with those other three?

Dana Derricks: Good question. So -

Steve Larsen: Is that when you send them the W9?

Dana Derricks: So if they've said yes but you just haven't got it scheduled yet, right? So I would try, just throw it way out in the future, and if you still don't then there's something there they want to do something with you, but apparently the way that it presented was ... That might not be what they're actually going to be comfortable doing. So I would like at trying to down sell it somehow. So if it was originally, "We're going to do a, you know, a joint venture webinar together," maybe starting out with a Facebook live might be better right?

Something that's a little bit easier them to not have to fully commit to, or even just like doing an email to their list or something like that. Because even that's going to be better than nothing, and if you look at ... That's another thing that we ... Is pretty cool.

So if you can do something successful with them, even if it's something small, you can go back to them and do something big. So you know, look at Russell with Grant Cardone. He went to 10X last year, and basically wasn't given ... He got on stage, and he was allowed to pitch kind of, but he wasn't allowed to do half of what he asked to do.

Steve Larsen: Right. The true Russell style.

Dana Derricks: Exactly right. Grant's like, "We're going to do it my way." He's like, "Okay, fine." And Russell did it Grant's way, got some wins out of it, but then look what happened the next year. Russell go to to go there and call the shots. He said, "I want this. I need that." Grant and his team said, "Okay. Whatever. You proved yourself last time."

And then boom. Closes $3 million in an hour and a half. Right? But he would have never been able to do that had it not been the year before doing it Grant's way, doing it smaller, doing it in a way that Grant was more comfortable with.

Steve Larsen: That's cool. That's cool. Okay. I know I'm just pounding you man. I got one more question for you. Scenario is, right, you go off, you've done the successful ones with the three, you're obviously continuing to work and warm up the leads for the other 97 as you go through. With the ones that you have done it with though, what's kind of your play as you move forward? Are you hitting them again for the next promo? Are you ... I guess post successful campaign, what kind of actions do you take with that person?

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So for me, especially like once you've figured out who's good, for me it's like how can we integrate? So I just want to turn and take it to the next level. So for me personally, like let's say that I'm JVing with somebody from my course, and we do a webinar together, kill it. We do five, six figures together, whatever. I want to work with that person. I don't want to just do once a year, once a quarter.

I want like full on, how can we work together. So I always offer ... What I've been doing a lot is I'll create a bonus module for whatever their thing is, if they've got a course. I'll come in there and basically teach a bonus module, or I will throw in my book in their value stack, or whatever just so that I can get not just access to their audience, on the one off promotions, but for every single buyer that comes into their world, they see me and the affiliate doesn't have to do a thing. Right?

And it comes back to value. Like this module I make, it's not like a pitch necessarily. There might be call to action. There is a call to action of course, but this is value, value, value and it's always enhancing the thing that they already sold. That's kind of the secret there. So I look at integration after a successful one.

Steve Larsen: Oh man, that's interesting. That's so cool. Man you have just like, just divulged. I have a full page of notes. Just given so much. I just appreciate that like crazy. I mean right, there's only a few people that ever really even written about this topic. The Chet Holmes. Amazing Chet Holmes, Russell himself, and you. That's it man. Like those are the options.

I know you have a book that has come out and is amazing. You have a lot of people ... I have a lot people who'd come and ... The book's incredible. And I'm very very excited for it. Where can people go get the book? How do they find out more about you and follow you?

Dana Derricks: Yeah. For sure. For anybody that's kind of vibing with this, and you're like, "Oh man, that sounds a lot better than running Facebook ads or running after the next shiny object," Stephen and I are totally Dream 100 junkies, and I'd love for you guys to do the same. So it's called The Dream 100 Book. Actually had the foreword written by Russell. It's pretty cool. I think Stephen's read it.

Steve Larsen: Woo-hoo. Yeah.

Dana Derricks: There is a caveat. Actually listen to Stephen's advice. So one of things you have really made famous Stephen is the concept of sell it before you make it. Right? Which I love by the way. I actually did that. Stephen said to do that -

Steve Larsen: No way.

Dana Derricks: Yeah dude. So I sold a copy of The Dream 100 Book, my first copy, for $2000 before I wrote one page of it.

Steve Larsen: No way. I didn't know that.

Dana Derricks: Yeah dude. Because Russell says writing a book is similar to giving childbirth. Which is...None of us know, but it's probably true. And so there was no better incentive to write a book than to have somebody on the hook for two grand that's waiting for it. Right? So anyway, that's the caveat. It is $2000. However, because Stephen was so gracious to put on a chicken suit and drive around on a motorcycle in Boise, Idaho -

Steve Larsen: I secretly just loved it. I was excited.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. I mean if he didn't like it, he was putting on a good show. So for you guys listening, if you're vibing with this, I'm actually going to let you guys get a copy of it for free.

Steve Larsen: Holy crap.

Dana Derricks: I don't do this really for money that much anymore, so I'm cool with that as long as you guys don't share this with the rest of the world. [inaudible 00:48:48] The mad buyers that paid two grand for it. So the link is going to be ListentoStephen.com. ListentoStephen.com.

Steve Larsen: That's cool man. Appreciate that. It's S-T-E-P-H-E-N. Yeah?

Dana Derricks: Correct. The good spelling.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, the good spelling. The biblical way. No but seriously, just echo what Dana's saying here like I ... Funnel's nothing without traffic. And especially as an entrepreneur and those of you guys who were listening. I know you guys are go getters. This podcast is getting a significant amount of downloads daily now and I thank you all for listening, but what I want you to know ... And that's the way that I think about it too.

Russell thinks about it, Dana thinks about it. Like all these top guys, they're not out looking usually for like this little tiny trick insight of a platform. Right? A Facebook trick. A Twitter trick. They're not looking ... That's not how they do it. Instead, they outsource that piece of it, because we all know it's still important, and they go focus 100% of the time on developing these kinds of relationships.
So anyway, I'm super excited.

That was very very generous of you give that Dana. So it's ListentoStephen.com.

Dana Derricks: Totally. And you all should listen to Stephen. Keep listening to him.

Steve Larsen: I appreciate that. Well thanks for being on the show man, and where can everyone go to follow you as well?

Dana Derricks: So being the farmer I am, I don't think I'm on instant grams. I'm over on Facebook, or DanaDerricks.com, or just keep listening to Stephen, and every once in a while I'll probably pop up.

Steve Larsen: Absolutely. All right. Hey, thanks so much for being on the show. And everyone go to ListentoStephen.com and get the free copy of ... It's literally called Dream 100. Was two grand, for this audience it's free.

Dana Derricks: Go get it.

Steve Larsen: Boom. Just try to tell me you didn't like that. Hey whoever controls content controls the game. Want to interview or get interviewed yourself? Grab a time now at SteveJLarsen.com.

Lessons from my 2-day deep dive (caffeine and dubstep abound)...

What's going on everyone? It's Steve Larsen and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

Hi guys, I'm excited to share this with you. These were ... These are the patterns that I noticed while I was kind of deconstructing some of the most profitable webinars, and especially their sequences. Okay? I was specifically looking at sequences.

The funnel part I didn't look at as much, frankly because on some of these I helped build them, but it's the actual copy itself that I'm trying to go through and show some of these neat patterns that are inside of every one of them.

Anyway, so I'm going to walk through some of these. I've got notes all around me right now. So if there's like a little pause, or little ums, or little ah, just stick with me, bear with me, because I'm going to walk through these. I just sent a lot of these lessons over to several people as well.

Anyway ... Okay. So I'm going to walk through some of the scenarios here, okay? And what's funny is, man just going in and just adding one of these things in. Like it's going to increase my ... It'll increase my show up rate, it'll increase the amount of people who purchase.

There's a lot of pros and benefits to what it'll actually do for actually sequencing itself. And what's funny is while going through and looking at these things, I almost started getting this feeling like, "Man I actually owe it to my prospective customer to do this stuff. To actually make these changes. It actually will increase the experience.

...They'll actually have a better experience during the buying process." I actually feel like it'll serve them more. And so this is like ... These aren't like little tricks like, "Oh these are cool tricks to like do that very thing. Trick them." Okay. I actually think that the level of clarity that this added was very fascinating as well.

Anyway, so I'm going to go through some of these lists as well here, and specifically there's like ... Let's see. One, two, three. There's ten.

Actually ten things that I want to walk you guys through and show you how to vastly, I believe, especially from watching the way each of these webinars are pulling off, increase your cart value, but like I was saying before, I think like followup sales. Right. Dropping refund rates. Does that make sense?

And all the things that come with it. Anyway, so I'm excited for this. Here's the first thing though. So number one here, these are the interesting webinar followup lessons from my hacking expose. Okay.

Anyways, number one here, what I ... Some of these might be like, "Oh kind of cool," and some of them are just like massive super huge bombs. Anyway, so the first one here is on these webinars. The confirmation email ... And almost every one of these scenarios, and every one of these normal webinars, the confirmation email itself has an origin story in it.

Now think about this, okay? Does everybody buy the same way? No. People do not all purchase in the same manner, right? I am not going to sit and read sales copy. I want a video. Right? I do not sit and read a blog. I want to listen to a podcast. Okay. I do not consume content.

All right, but there are other people that exact opposite. And as one of the biggest lessons I think I can give to you, especially one of the themes you'll see throughout as I kind of draw up these lessons, you're actually giving the webinar script in several manners, not just on the webinar. Okay.

There's a group of people that want to see it on the webinar. There's a group of people that do not.

And so you actually threw the scenario. You're actually going hit several different modalities to deliver the sales message, to deliver the offer and the stack. To actually give the scarcity and urgency to close.

To give the time close for them to actually act. To give the bonuses away. It's actually hitting them in several different manners which is really interesting. It's really three heavy ones.

But anyways, think about this right? The first email they're going to be seeing is let's say they're not actually going to go and watch the webinar. But most of them are still going to go check out the confirmation email, right? Or a good portion of them are going to.

That's still an opportunity for you to sell them the origin story. Why you got into this thing, an opportunity for them to fall in love with you, an opportunity for them to actually fall in love as to why they should listen to the rest of the offer.

So just think of that. Okay. So first spot, one of these major touchpoints. Again, when we're talking about the last podcast episode, right? About the hook, story, offer. You're still doing the hook through the email. You're still doing the story.

Your actual origin story is the first, very first thing that's coming over to them regardless of if it's a webinar, regardless of whatever you're selling, you still have an opportunity to ... Right. It's one of the major things too. I remember I was hacking ... I was funnel hacking ... This was again one of the first really profitable funnels I ever built.

Again probably like three, four years ago. I was hacking this guy, and I noticed that he was doing this very thing. He had a soap opera series and the first email after you opted in was the first email of the soap opera series. If you don't know what I'm talking about, go read DotCom Secrets. And he was following that format.

But along with the first email came a second email of just his origin story. And he was like, "Hey, just wanted a chance to introduce myself and blah." He went right into the origin story. So I started doing that as well.

And it was really cool because I got a lot more feedback from people replying to that email saying, "Man I'm totally in this for the exact same reason Steven. Oh my gosh, that's super cool. Thanks for sharing that. I'm actually ... Sounds like you're telling my story."

I got more feedback from me telling my origin story, than I did from that first email with the soap opera series which is fascinating. Anyways, that's kind of cool. So to reinforce the point. Okay, so number one, write ... You're hitting from these different areas.

Here's another one. On webinars that lead to application funnels, the confirmation email has a case studies origin story. Okay this is a pretty powerful thing to notice and recognize. When you think about these, if you're trying to sell something that's high ticket, the way that you present these stories ... Right.

Let's think about some coaching. If you're trying to sell coaching or a high ticket mastermind, or a high ticket event or experience, something like that, a lot of times the ... Like when you think about the way Russell sells his inner circle, or when you think about the way really expensive people sell their stuff, there's really two modalities.

The first one I absolutely hate which is when ... In fact I was ... I can't say his name. You guys would all know him. He's on a very famous TV show that I'm sure many of you guys consume.

I got offered to go help build an application, high ticket application funnel for him, and I said no actually for a lot of reasons. Which kind of made me sad. I wanted to go do it, but just scheduling wise, just logistically too many things going on.

Anyways, it was fascinating because I looked at the current application funnel they had and it was this guy, who's a celebrity, and he ... You could tell he was being told what to say which is fine.

And the first video though was him saying like, "I'm so and so, and I've done this and this and been on these TV shows, and you've seen all this, and you've done this, and you know that I can get you," and I, I, I, I, me, me, me. It has total me syndrome. Okay? It's the me monster.

Okay. Me monster was all over it...
And I was like, "Gosh that's ..." It's very hard to sell super high ticket stuff like that. Right?

Really high ticket funnels are very very client result based stories that you're using as your sales letter. The Liz Benny story. Right? The Drew Cannoli story. Right? Those are the stories.

Do you ever really ... You hardly ever see Russell ever on any of the application funnels that are out there. That's not what's selling it. Results are selling it. The fact that he's been successful with other people is what's selling it.

And it's the same thing when you're selling a webinar funnel into a high ticket application funnel. So I was looking at CF Certified right, and that's a webinar that pushes into an application funnel. And so the actual ... Right, when it's just a webinar funnel for usually like a $1000 to $20000 product, it's the protagonist origin story.

It's the entrepreneur's origin story...

But when it's moving ... This is one of the things I recognize. When it's moving into an application funnel though, it's one of your most successful case studies, it's their origin story. So there's a split that happens right?

There's a very stark, very powerful difference as I was looking at this. Anyway, the indoctrination series, when you think through life you're like, I've had a lot of people reach out and ask like, "Steve you're talking about indoctrination series, what is that? Is that a soap series?"

No. It is specifically for a webinar. It is specifically for ... Think of it as like a ... I make indoctrination series on one of my podcast funnels, and it's actually my other podcast show. I have a really strong podcast funnel there. And it gets like 62% opt in rate, and just it kicks butt. It's really really awesome.

But they get a series from me, I sell it as a course. I'm like, it's free and it's just for the listening. Does that make sense?...

So it's a free course, but really it's an indoctrination series. Anyway, if you study and you look carefully specifically at like the Followup Funnel webinar, the Funnel Hacks webinar, even Software Secrets, the Software Secrets webinar, all of the indoctrination series are actually a product launch funnel. What?

What? I'm like recreating so much stuff because of that. Think about this. Right, some people do not like buying on the webinar. Some people do not like buying from blogs. Some people do not like buying from product launch funnel.

But you can deliver the same message and offer in each one of those modalities. And so that's one of the things I'm doing is I'm looking at my followup sequence. It's not longer just a webinar that's delivering my offer, and the story, and the sales message pieces. Okay.

It's actually ... I have it coming across as text which I'm going to show you in just a second. I have it coming across now ... There's actual hidden product launch funnel inside of my followup sequence.

It's a product launch funnel. This is what I'm building out next which is so exciting. So I have a ... The product launch funnel as well matches and follows up with my close cart sequence. So at the end of video number four, like if you think of Jeff Walker's product style funnels, video number four is where a lot of the call to actions dropping in right?

But it coincides with my close cart timeline. So in the email I'm saying, "Hey the cart's closing. If you want, go ahead and check it out here." They're actually watching video number four though, which is the stack portion. It's me reselling a whole ... Anyway. Super cool.

Super super cool. Hope there's massive aha's with that. Delivering in these multiple ways...

So anyways, it is a product launch funnel the indoctrination series. And I don't know that I've ever heard many people really teach that which is kind of cool. Like if you think through and you're looking at these replay sequences which is ... I'll tell you guys.

Most of my money comes in my replay sequence. Right? I still make sales on the webinar, but I don't know why. Like there's something in my webinar followup sequence that works really really really well. I've not totally identified what that is yet, but most of my money comes in the replay sequence.

If I can turn the sexy up though on that sequence, right, which includes the urgency and scarcity aspect, and I'm putting them through a product launch version of the same webinar, people are going to go check this ... Most people watch ... Most people can't actually join me on the live webinar.

They watch the replay sequence. Everyone's timeline is different. They just login, they sign up so that they know they'll be on the sequence, they can watch it later.
Well, heck. If you can't watch the full hour, hour and a half webinar, might as well drop it out to you in 20, 30 minute little episodes.

And across the top bar on each page, they can progress forward just by clicking if they want to, or it'll drip out to them anyway and match my close cart sequence. Anyway, this is like a far more technical episode and I know that.

Just stick with me. These are like ... Man, these simple little elements guys are going to change the way I do the game a lot.

Anyway, let's see. Post webinar, all emails focused on how to get the offer for free. Yeah. Yep. Anyway, I'm reading what I wrote just so I would remember what to say. Anyway the post ... Yeah. That was right.

All post webinar, pretty much all email focuses on how to get it for free, and if I'm at the part where it's not like the blatant call to action, there's still some piece in every email where they can either number one, go watch the replay, or number two pushes them over to buy.

But it's reinforcing the fact that they can go get it for free. Think of it like this, right? There's some aspect in your stack slide, in your offer, that's the thing that everyone actually wants.

It's not that they don't want the bonuses, it's not that they don't want the other pieces inside what you're actually offering, but there's one thing that you're giving away that's the thing that they actually want.

Let's say I went in and I was on Amazon, and I was creating an offer on Amazon. Actually here's a better example, right? Okay.

Okay. So I've been working out a lot more. I'm super excited. Trying to like ... One of the inner circle member, it's Brian Bowman, what's up buddy? Big shout out to you. You're the man. He was pointing out to me, he's like, "Dude you do literally nothing but funnel stuff." And I said, "Yeah, I know. Isn't cool."

And he's like, "No like, yes that's a good thing, but like you're in a phase now where you should maybe ... You could do something else also. Enjoy other parts of life." I was like, "I'm doing what I love brother." He's like, "Come on dude."

Anyway, so I've been trying to do other stuff as well which is kind of hard. It's funny. I like suck at like this life thing. I'm better at just living in funnels. Anyway I was like, "I got to go lift. I go to go exercise. Get more into that phase more," which has been fun.

Not very sedentary anymore which is awesome. So I've been lifting a lot more and exercising, and one of the workout things I'm following, I'm on two different three month programs which I'm super pumped about and it's going well so far. Trying to get ready for that two comic club cruise. Okay?

It's coming up in January you guys. So excited. But I don't want to be a tubby bubby on that baby...

So anyway, super excited. I was looking and there was a jump rope. This guy was saying, "Hey, whenever you start, one of the cool things to go and do is just jump rope for five minutes, and you're going to burn a lot of calories just like that," which shockingly, oh my gosh, is true.

Anyway. Way harder than I thought. Anyway, so I go on Amazon right? I go on Amazon and I start looking around for a jump rope. A speed rope. And these guys have nailed the offer creation piece on Amazon for ecom stuff, for these jump ropes. When I got the jump rope, it was so funny guys.

Like anyway, part of me felt like a little bit of a pansy for buying a jump rope, and another part of me felt like Rocky. You know. Anyway, and there was ... So the main thing right? I wanted the speed rope. Right? But what came with it? It was so cool guys. They had made an offer in their ecom stuff.

And the offer was, "Hey. You know what? Just because you probably don't know all the cool things ... You think you're literally just going to jump a little piece of rope for a while. A little cord. This little piece of plastic.

But look at this. This is actually going to come with 12 workouts that you can do. By the way, here's a whole bunch of before and after pictures of people who've been doing it. By the way, did you know that this comes with the most awesome cool carrying case?

It's also featured to have extra ends and parts and pieces." Like they made an offer out of it. It was really interesting, and they totally had ... And I was like, "Man I'm buying from you guys just because you did that."

Anyway, it's fascinating right? So if you think through all the different pieces of your offer, there's one thing on there that I really wanted though. It's the reason that I got ... I want the jump rope.

And so all of these followup communication after somebody goes through either a webinar, or a free plus shipping funnel, or I don't care. Whatever it is, all of it is focusing on how you can get the main thing you actually want for free.

So one of the biggest tweaks I would have made to that offer is I would have said, "Hey, actually the jump rope is free."

I would have priced it the same as everybody else, but the copy I would have changed it to would be, "Hey the jump rope is free when you get this other stuff, which happens to be the same price as all the competitors." But does that make sense?

Now the copy made it an offer. Even more of an offer. You still get all these other things, but it makes the thing they actually want free.

And so it's the exact same thing...

Think about that with like funnel hacks. With Click Funnel's offer. Right? "Here's how to get Click Funnels for free for the next six months. You buy Funnel Hacks." Does that make sense? So think through the thing. I'm starting to call it the anchor of the offer.

There's one anchor...

I call it the anchor product, okay? And it's the thing that they actually want in your offer so bad, and when you tell them it's free when they buy those other things, oh man.

Really cool way to turn up the sexy in your offer, and all of the followup sequences, all the emails, all the pieces of copy, post pitch, post webinar, reinforce the point of how to get that thing for free.

Okay. And the fact that there's limited time actually to get it. Anyway. That was really really powerful. So I started looking through that.

This is also a really cool commonality as well. I typically after my webinars, one of the things that I'll go do is I immediately dropout to them the opportunity to go and watch the replay. That almost is never the case in any of these webinars. Isn't it interesting? Almost none of the time is the replay email sent first.

Like post webinar. It's over. Or it could be post ... You know they've gone through your free plus shipping book funnel, or ecom funnel, or high ticket funnel, or I don't care whatever it is. Right? Post call to action. Post offer.

Post you actually going and trying to get them to purchase. Right? The first thing in here, the very first email, was actually another call to action email. It was an email that reinforced the stack. It actually redelivered the stack. Right?

"Thanks so much for joining the web class. I appreciate it. For those of you guys who weren't actually able to get on here, here's what it is," and actually just went straight through the stack slide. First thing you're going to get is X, Y, and Z. In fact which ... There's one of the sequences here.

...Hold on let me look real quick here. I'll include the whiteboard screenshot in the blog just so you guys know. Actually I'll put it on Instagram. It'll be one of my posts. There's my hook right there. Go follow me on Instagram. Okay. At Steve Larsen HQ, and I'm going to make it one of the posts there.

You can see the screenshot of the lessons that I learned from each sequence and then right next to it, I made like this ultimate followup sequence, and I mapped the different webinar emails to each ... Anyways. Super super cool. You can go check it out if you want to on my Instagram which I'm far far more into now which is awesome.

But anyway, so post webinar it was let me followup ... Yeah yeah yeah. Follow funnels. Hold on, let me look at it. Okay, follow funnels. Okay very first ... I've got all the emails I printed out right here. Very first email that goes out post webinar, let me get to it. Okay here. Okay. Yeah. Check this out. Okay.

Okay. So right after the very first email that goes out, right afterwards is this. Okay this is the followup funnel's webinar. Okay cool. Yeah. Check this out. I'm just going to read part of this to you, okay. Reinforcing a stack slide on the very first email post webinar.

Okay. The second email is the one that actually pushes the replay. Okay. But there's another opportunity to purchase right from the get go which is so interesting because I've always just sent immediately a replay email.

Anyway, I don't know if you guys are geeking out about this, and maybe I'm going too deep on this. Hopefully this episode's super valuable. For me, this is going to make ... I feel like the vehicle I've just designed here, because I not only am fixing all the stuff here.

Like I rebuilt an entire funnel that just totally kicked butt. I feel like it's the difference between a $1 million webinar and a three million. And, so excited. Calling the shot on that one by the way. That'll be cool. All right so anyway it says, "So the web class just ended. I hope you had a chance to watch it live.

If so you saw the power of followup funnels. You saw how we were able to literally make $16 for every dollar made on the front end funnels.

You see how this is the way our company's growing.

We talk a lot about the tip of the iceberg, some of you only saw the tip but I showed the rest of the iceberg today.

And that copy is linked over ... Actually it's just underlined I think.
Anyway. "Hopefully you love the presentation. I wanted to send you a quick email because people are blowing up our help desk.

They saw the presentation and weren't sure if they should be all in. What does it mean to go all in? Being all in is something we talked about towards the end of the presentation." And here we go.

He goes into what I'm calling a benefits stack. The benefits stack is one of the things that is included inside of that first email out. So there's an actual stack, but it's not always like, you know, "First you're going to get software secrets. Then you're going get this. Then you're going to get this. You're getting this."

It's like a benefits stack. It's the benefits of actually getting. It's really really interesting. So I don't know what else to call it, so I'm calling it a benefits stack.
And he goes into it. This is the copy part of the email where he goes into benefits of those getting it.

And then he puts a call to action at the end. "It means you're using Click Funnels, backpacks, acitionetics, all the tools inside Click Funnels help dramatically scale your business. When you go all in we've got a huge gift for you.

First off, I'm going to give you 15 followup funnels." So he's still going to go in, and he's selling each part of the stack, but he's diving a little more deeply into the benefits of it because it doesn't ... Like if you didn't see the webinar, right, who cares what the things are in the stack? There's no value behind it.

So he's actually selling the whole ... Anyway, this is interesting...

He goes, "First thing I'm going to give you 15 followup funnels. These are the exact followup funnels I use to one get people to actually show up for the webinar, two get people to purchase after the webinar, three get people to buy high ticket coaching, and much more.

You get all these 15 funnels, total value is 9.97. Second," he's now on the second item in the stack, "We're going to give you a T-shirt that says, 'We're not confusion soft.' If you missed the presentation, you need to watch to get the inside joke, but this shirt is amazing. I'm going to send you it. Third, I'm going to give you," Right. He actually is writing out ... I've never seen this. This is crazy.

"Third I'm going to give you, 'I build funnels,' laptop sticker. Fourth I'm going to give you the, 'All in' temporary tattoo." And then he goes in and he talks about the total value. Anyway, "These are all the insane bonuses you get. Click here to go all in."

He actually literally pushes a stack and immediately back to the call to action is the first email. I have never ... I have always done that like the very dead last thing when my cart's about to close. Not first.

So anyways, huge realization. And later on, right before this email's over, the same email, he goes, "If you didn't get a chance to watch the webinar, don't worry. I'll try to get you guys a replay tomorrow." Is that interesting? So he's baiting the hook for the next.

Totally Seinfeld thing right there. Does that make sense? But he's pushing it.

Anyway. I might have gone too deep on that. But that is like crazy cool stuff. That is so lucrative to know that. This is pretty interesting too. He did this in a lot of webinars. Not all of them. And several of the followup sequences, he actually has two different replay pages.

Okay. The first replay he pushes out. So let's say it's the next day, he pushes a replay out. All right. It's kind of the normal, "Hey you can go check out the replay here. By the way this is only open for the next 36 hours," or whatever. And then a few hours later he'll be like the hook. Right? The hook of the email.

The reason. The curiosity...

The reason why he's emailing again is he says, "Look, a lot of you guys are emailing saying, 'I actually saw most of it Russell. I just don't want to actually watch all the things I've already seen before. I want to fast forward to the point where I left off.'" And he says, "I get it. I totally get it. So we did something special for you guys. Here's a replay with scroll bars."

So he unlocks ... He just makes another page and he just, on the video element, he makes it so that they can fast forward. That's it. But it's another reason to email. It's another hook to go email and get it out into their hands. What? Crazy.

So I now have two replay pages in my personal webinar, and one of them is ... I want another reason to email them. Another logical reason to email them after they've ... "Check it out. There's scroll bars in this." Okay.

Anyway that's a big one. One of the things too is as part of the first replay email that goes out, he drops in ... You can see this specifically in Funnel Hacks if you go check this out. Actually I think there's few others as well. High Ticket Secrets have this.

There's a few other webinars that had it. But this was brilliant. Oh this was brilliant. I was just saying how not everyone buys the same way...

Okay. If you go to Funnel Hacks. You know, go opt into Funnel Hacks, buy it again if you want, but if you go opt in to Funnel Hacks, and just watch the replay sequence that's coming out, there's something very interesting that comes in. Let me grab it here real quick.

Something very interesting that pops in in this sequence as well where he dives deeply into ... He actually gives ... He calls it, "Hey for those of you guys who didn't get a chance to, or you'd rather skip around, I'm going to toss in for you cliff notes to the webinar."

Oh man. Funnel Hacks has an awesome product launch funnel in it. Let me find it here. Anyways, whatever. I'll just tell you guys what it is. What he did is he took all of his slides and printed them all out, and transcribed the webinar so that you could see the slide, and you could look at the slide and you could read the webinar.

This is brilliant. Guys, he has somebody go through and they actually printed out all the slides, and transcribed everything that he said in the webinar underneath each one of the slides so that you can see the slide, and then read. See slide and then read it. See slide, read it. It's huge.

Okay. I don't even know how many pages ... It's absolutely gigantic. Right. But when somebody goes through, somebody who's a reader, they want to read stuff, they want the little nitty gritty details. They want, right. Especially those who are like the engineer mindsets. They really like that kind of thing, right?

They want to go through, and they want to read the webinar.

And so he gives them the option to do so inside Funnel Hacks.

And they go through and they read it. What happens when somebody spends like an eternity reading the webinar?

They buy. You know what I mean?...

Oh there it is. All right. This is a day three post webinar. "24 hour warning. Want the cliff notes? Okay in less than 24 hours they're pulling that Funnel Hacks web class and the special offer we made.

We can get Click Funnels for free for the next six months," he's reinforcing the ability to get free for the anchor product of the offer, "Because you're almost out of time, I had one of my team members type up the cliff notes of the web class just in case you missed it to recap.

So here's what you need to do now." Straight on to call to action. "First download the cliff notes. Second watch the replay here. Third get a huge Funnel Hacks discount, six months for free by clicking here." So number one, want to see the cliff notes. Number two, just watch the replay here. Or number three, you want to go buy.

So towards the end it's more ... And that's the whole email. It's a super short email. But towards the end of the replay sequence, I've noticed that the emails actually get far shorter as well. Almost across the board.

The email's towards the beginning of the replay sequence are much longer. They're telling the whole origin story. They're telling the secrets. They're telling the reasons you should get in there. And usually the copy, copy wise is actually getting smaller and shorter, and shorter, and shorter as the replay sequence goes.

Anyway, I'm almost done here...

Okay. There's something called ... I don't remember if I go this from Russell or ... Anyway, I've seen this from several people, but I'm calling it ... It's a hidden cart close.

So they'll close the cart down, scarcity, urgency is the only reasons why anyone does anything. So it's important to close the cart I believe. So close the cart down, and legitimately take the bonuses away.

They can still go get the main thing I'm sure on your main page, they can still go buy Click Funnels for example somewhere else. But the actual main thing they want, they can't get that for free. They can't get all the bonuses.

There's some aspect of it that you take away for the scarcity aspect. But there's a hidden ... What was it? It was like 72 hours later ... Yeah. Something like that. There's a case study that people can go in and they can read. I think I saw Dan Henry do this too once.

They can go in and read a case study of another successful person. The cart closed, they clearly did not purchase. And you don't really ... You're like, that's fine. Instead a little while later, you drop this amazing case study after the cart's closed, with a link to a limited secret replay that they could go watch it again just to scoop off the top.

So the hidden cart close thing. Cart close, and then hidden cart close. That was kind of cool. One of the things that I'm doing is I'm going to put Facebook, the actual Facebook comments element. I'm going to put it below the broadcast page. Below the replay page.

Below my indoctrination, which is going to be a product launch funnel page. And it's going to be the same link though, so any comment on any one of them is going to populate to all those pages. Massive social proof. Super excited about that.

If somebody ... So on the actual order page, and on the broadcast page and replay, an exit pop that I'm dropping on, I'm going to drop in like the Facebook live chat element. So if they're leaving ... It's kind of like...and one of the reasons why he would make so much cash as well on his ... And if you don't know, like he made ... I can't say the exact number.

He made tens of millions of dollars in only a few months. Like a couple months. Right. Made a lot of money, tons of revenue dropping in. And one of the reasons why is because he understood his buyer, and understood that everyone does not buy the same way.

So some people wanted to buy on the website, but then ... Or on the funnel. But when they tried to leave the funnel, there was an exit pop that said, "Hey got a final question? Why don't you just call us?" Right? And there was a phone number.

Well I'm going to do the exact same thing with a Facebook live chat. So when they're leaving, and I'll just change the copy to whatever it needs to be. If they're on the order page ... Like, I'm noticing for every four people who actually check out the order page after the webinar, about one purchases which is pretty standard.

I mean that's pretty normal. What if I just doubled that? I mean, does that make sense? People are clearly going to the order page. They're checking it on out. They want to see it. So they got some last burning dying question. Well I'm going to go in, I'm going to drop in the ability for them to ask a question live.

So on the order page, when they exit, it will be a Facebook live element, or a Facebook live chat element. Probably through mini chat or something like that. That way they can chat immediately with somebody on my team and get the final questions answered. Or let's say they're on the broadcast page and they try to leave. Right?

"Oh you got a final question? We got a live moderator right now. Go ahead and drop it in." And there's probably going to be some ... Like a page profile or something like that. Probably for the main product that someone's just moderating at all times and trying to get back to almost instantly. Right.

So we can keep on there. Keep the last few questions going. Because most of the questions I get now are ... They're not, "Hey, I don't believe this product works." The questions I get now from my webinar are primarily, "Hey, will this work for my scenario?"

And if I could just have someone answer that question, we'll double our sales right off the bat. And so I'm going to do that on the replay pages, I'm going to do it on the broadcast pages, on the order page, and just to get the last few ... Anyway.

So I'm super stoked about it. It's going to be awesome, and all right. That's a lot of stuff. Anyway, that was deep. That was heavy. If you need to listen to that again, go for it. I would love to do like a full blown out course just walking through all the cool stuff I'm dropping in. There's so many ways.

Now that my ... Because I recreated my whole offer, and it's so much more sexy.

It already was sexy, but it is like ... I got the correct response this time guys. People were emailing me, they were Facebooking me, they were all saying, "Dude are you sure you want to give all that value away for that price?"

But I was like, "Yes. Yes. That means I hit it. That means I did it right. That means ... Okay. That is the correct response that I want," and I got a lot of them.

And I'm like, "Yes. Okay, sweet." Right? And I'm finishing the last few pieces that I want to go get for the stack slides, and stack section itself. I'm getting the webinar funnel where I want to be now. And I'm obsessing over the little things now that'll add just another two percent conversion here.

Extra half percent conversion there. Now I can obsess over that tiny stuff because for a while it's just making sure that freaking offer is amazing. Anyway. So I'm excited about that. And I'm going to go put these different pieces together, and anyways it's going to be epic.

All right guys, hey go crush it. And please for the love, if you have not left a review, I get so excited. Thank you guys for dropping those reviews in there. I just spent two days studying and learning the stuff that I just dropped you guys in 30 minutes to an hour here. Over these last few episodes.

I would love a review if you wouldn't mind...

If you could drop it on over. That drastically helps. I'm certainly always trying to increase the reach of this. We are pushing stuff all over on Instagram. I'm getting my content machine all put together. But I would love that, and anyway.

In fact, I think I got a cool little special bonus coming up for those of you guys who do coming up soon. So anyways ... Because I can see your name on it which is awesome. Anyways guys, thanks so much, appreciate it. There's my ask. All right guys. Talk to you later. Bye.

Hey thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Want today's best opt in funnels for free? Get your free opt in funnel pack by going to SalesFunnelBroker.com/Free Funnels to kickstart your opt ins today.

In this episode let's look at the Hook, Story, and Offer of 5 of the most profitable webinars...

What's going on everyone? It's Steve Larsen, and you're listening to sales funnel radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today, and now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million-dollar business.

The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?...

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio...

What's up everyone? Hey, I am excited for today. I'm excited to share some things with you. I actually have been preparing for this episode alone for, I think, at least a month.

And I know that's kind of crazy, but honestly I've been trying to figure out and distill down how to actually share with you these lessons over an audio without actually visually seeing it.

So, I'm excited to go through this. What I want to do is, I want to walk through, if you guys haven't noticed in the last little bit here, I'm going to talk about Russell Brunson again here, right? And if you noticed, especially those of you guys at the last FunnelHacking Live, Russell sold a 2 Comma Club coaching The X Program.

It's amazing. It's incredible. We have tons of people in there. We took the program that we created about a year ago, and we made it this full-out, blown-out thing. We brought all the coaches in. And it's just been a bunch of fun.

So, I have the incredible honor to continue to teach, offer creation and sales message development to all the new students. It's just been a lot of fun. The more I get into it, just like anything, I continue to learn.

We don't teach the same thing every single time...

I constantly look for new patterns, new ways not just to teach it, but to understand it and make it more and more simple and more and more applicable, and more and more ...

The biggest thing I fight is, I treat every individual who bought the coaching program like they're my customer.

Therefore, what are your false beliefs? What are the ways I can get you to learn the most?...

So, anyways. If you notice, one of the first videos in there for those of you guys that were able to go in and grab it, you guys have probably seen this. It's an absolutely amazing video. For those of you guys who have not, I don't know when Russell will open up 2 Comma Club coaching X again, but seriously look into it, okay?

I'm blown away...

I've never seen him create an offer like this and it's just been amazing...

So, anyways, one of the first videos you see when you log into these ... It's part of the core training, before you come over to my course which is Secrets Master class, is this training that Russell does about the hook, the story, and the offer.

He actually did a podcast episode about this recently as well. In all things, all we're trying to do is make things more and more and more simple. In a world where sometimes we confuse complexity with prestige, which is stupid. That's not true at all, okay?

Needing to sound smart, that's not serving anybody except your own self, which ultimately doesn't serve you ever.

We try and make it more and more and more and more simple. It's actually harder to make things more simple, to bring things down to a place where it's like, "Look, you need this, this, and that." For my little 15 minute speech I gave at FunnelHacking Live, I prepared for nine hours.

Seriously, nine hours for 15 minutes. I remember I voxed Russell and I was like, "Dude, 15 minutes, man. It took me nine hours," and he was laughing and he was like, "Yeah, that's the price of simplicity."

And it's so true...

So, anyways, what I wanted to do is, I want to show you that framework all over the place. If you look at some of the most profitable webinar follow-up sequences ever, I want you to know the hook, story, and offer pattern is everywhere. It's not just hook for sales message as a whole.

It's not just story for the entire thing as a whole. It's not just offer for the entire thing you're trying to sell. It's in every little aspect, every little piece.

So, what I did a little while ago is, you guys know January I left Click Funnels, and I was like, "Hey, I'm going to call my shot here." This is pretty nervous. I left Click Funnels with no offer, no message, I had no funnel, nothing. Two kids and a pregnant wife.

That's part of my hook, me telling you that right now. It's like, "Holy crap, what did you do?" House payment, payments all over the place, that's pretty ballsy, right? That's why I was doing it.

I was trying to call my own shot with it, and say where I was going to go and make my story for it...

Which is exactly right, hook, story, and then I put together an offer. What I did is, when I first launched my webinar, I launched it, I did just this basic version. I knew it was broken. Guys, my funnel is still limping on one foot.

I know it is...

There's so much that's wrong with it, so much that's wrong with it. I've been going through and re-writing the entire script and just re-did it again, and did it in front of a live audience again, and it was awesome. We did really well.

But I'm constantly refining these things down. After about two months, so about the beginning of March, I was like, "I need to go re-write the entire webinar." I want to re-build the entire funnel, but I want to make it like, super awesome.

To the tenth degree, go all the way, which is kind of my mentality on everything. But I want to make it go all the way, just make it awesome. And so I started thinking, webinar is what I teach all the time and I'm good at them, and I like writing offers and scripts and sales message and message to market match.

I love that stuff. It's super fun. It's my obsession, even more than funnel building, which might shock you. I obsess over this topic greatly, offer creation and sales messages. But I was like, "I want to go do it on a deep, deep funnel hack of the top webinars that are out there."

Biggest webinars, most successful webinars that I could go find, that are easy for me to go grab data on real quick. I have a list of some of the top webinar gurus on my whiteboard. Lots of them. Anyone from Russell, of course, to Sam Ovens, and tons of these different webinar junkies, on guys that make big cash primarily through that method.

And what I did is I started logging into all their stuff, I started grabbing everything they've got and I started going through and grabbing all the email sequences.

Anyways, I specifically wanted to go through Russell's follow-up sequences for some of the most profitable webinars I've ever seen him do, ever.

And so what I've got here next to me, and what I started going and doing was I was, of course I'm opted in everywhere, for everything that that man puts out, but I went through and I printed off all of the webinar sequences.

Specifically the email copy for the FunnelHacks webinar. That thing's done like, 50 million, 60 million, something like that. Which is crazy. In like, three years? The CF certified webinar, man, that thing made a ton of money. I don't know the exact number on that one but it's millions and millions and millions and millions, right?

Lots of money...

High ticket secrets, that was one of the most profitable webinars that Russell ever had as well. High ticket secrets. I grabbed that one and the follow-up sequence for that. You know what I mean? I just opted in. I printed out the emails that came. Does that make sense?

So I opted in, waited a while, printed it out, and then I laid them all out. Software secrets, that one was a huge one. Follow-up funnels, oh baby. Anyway. So I have five sequences of these webinars in front of me. This is actually going to be a two-part episode. There's no way I'm going to get through all this right now.

But what I wanted to do is, I did like, for like two straight days my blood was surging with caffeine, dub-step blasting, but I laid out all of the sequences across my floor. Some of you guys saw my Facebook live as I went through that at a pretty high level.

I pretty much for two straight days, I read the sequences and I studied them very, very, very in-depthly. What I went through afterwards is writing on my whiteboard the ultimate sequence. When you are reading that much copy...

It was a lot of paper. It was like 50 pages at least. I don't even know. This is fat, I mean, I'm holding them all together. It's a pretty fat stack.

When you go through that depth, you start to see patterns. Especially when you're studying from the same person. That's one of the reasons why I dive so deeply on everything Russell has done, is because I want to see where his head is.

Not just what he's writing. Not just what he's putting out. Not just this hook, story, and offer. I want to see what progression is going on in his noggin. Right? And, by doing so, I can see where he's actually looking and what he's trying to accomplish.

It's been cool to do that. When you have that kind of ... Proximity's power, right? It's huge. It's why I always encourage everyone to get a coach, be a coach, anyway...

So, what I did is, I laid them all out and I started doing this deep dive and I realized that there were these intense patterns throughout the sequences that I don't know that I've ever heard him teach, and I don't know that I've ever taught them that way either.

Next episode, what I want to do is dive into a lot of the actual commonalities and lessons between them on a pretty in-depth level. For this episode, what I wanted to do is I wanted to walk through and show you guys hook, story, and offer in each one of these sequences.

And show you and let you know that they're actually in every single one of them. It's not just like this overarching thing. I want to sell X product. I'm going to create this offer, but first I'm going to go test it with this sales message. Oh, awesome, the sales message is making cash now.

Sweet, I should go finish making the offer and make the funnel amazing. It's the reason I haven't made my funnel amazing yet, is because I've been waiting to make sure I've got all the pieces together. I'm so glad I did because of all the stuff that I found while doing this.

Anyway. I'm holding right now the sequence for the follow-up funnels webinar, and it's pretty ridiculous. And if you don't know what this one is, this is one FunnelHacking Live 2017 Russell wanted to go backwards and look and see how much money is actually being made after the initial cash is taken from somebody.

How much money does each dollar turn into? And he found out, this is the hook, yes, $16.49 for every one dollar. Crazy. The subject line is the hook. The subject line is the hook. You're not selling anything inside the email. The only thing the subject line's selling is they want you to open the email.

The subject line of an email is selling you opening it. That's it. They just want you to open the email. But it's this hook, massive curiosity, and for a long time we've been trying to figure out how to better describe what a hook is.

If you think about it, a hook is really just a piece of curiosity that pulls you along. That's why we call it a hook. It hooks you. Hooks you like, "Wait a second, what?" It's what grabs your attention, both eyeballs, and makes it go, "Wait, what?"

That's another way to think of a hook...

So it's usually some element of a story. It can be part of a headline. It could be before a headline. It's a little bit fluid and for a while, we've had a hard time to explain it because they're a little bit, I don't know, almost ... They're so fluid and evasive it's like, how do you ... Anyway.

So, think of it that why. The hook is the crazy piece of the story that makes people want to listen to the rest of it. It's the thing that makes people say, "Oh my gosh, I have to stop what I'm doing immediately and watch what the rest of this is."

So what I want to go do is, I'm going to dive through hook, story, and offer through each one of these sequences because it's extremely powerful when you start looking through all of it. Think about this real quick, right?

We got a webinar registration page. On the webinar registration page, or free plus shipping page, or high ticket application page, or if you're selling retail or SAS it doesn't matter. Any page where it's the first interaction with somebody.

Or it could be even on the ad. The first touch point with a perspective or a current customer, that is the place you're tossing your hook in.

So the registration page in this scenario has a hook, a story, and an offer on just that page. Each email has a hook, story, an offer. On each email, the hook is the subject line. The story is the first part of the email.

Usually there's some kind of offer or call to action at the end of the email. On most cases. Every once in a while, there's ... Anyway. Definitely for emails that are selling stuff this is always the pattern.

I was looking through and I was studying this and I saw Russell dropped that out there and I was like, "Yeah, that's true. Look how this fits in. Boom, boom, boom, all over here." By the way, it's on the thank you page, it's a reinforcement of that hook. It's a reinforcement of the story.

It's a reinforcement of why the offer's amazing, why you should show up and cancel everything during that webinar time and show up. All the indoctrination sequences, all they're doing, it's another shot at a hook that makes you again want to go clear your schedule.

You're literally telling the story for secret number one. The offer is get on the freaking webinar and it will tell you the rest of this.

Does that make sense? It literally ... Think of that. If you're like, "Steven, I like building in Click Funnels, I like building webinar pages, I like building pages in general, all this stuff is fun to me but I don't know what to always put on the pages." At a very top high level, just think through hook, story, offer.

Hook, story, offer...

Per page. Per email sequence. Per touchpoint. Per engagement. Per content. Guess what I did, literally, on my legal pad right next to me before I started recording this episode? I wrote H, S, O. Hook, story, offer.

The hook: I'm going to talk to you guys about the most profitable webinar follow-up series on the internet, or series-es. The story: I'm starting with the story so you guys have backstory on why this stuff matters, because I'll tell you more about that in just a second.

And then I have somewhat of an offer and call to action at the end of this. And me delivering this chunk of content is the offer. When you think of it that way, it's not always a stack, slide. Stack, slide is a framework to create an offer.

Anyway, so I want to walk through this here real quick. Because I'm just going to be honest with you guys. When I first started going through and into this stuff, what am I doing? I'm writing a story. Here's the story, okay? When I first started doing this stuff, and I got interested in it, I started following ...

It was actually Pat Flynn from Smart Passive Income. He really got me going on internet stuff. Listening to his podcast, I had not heard of Russell Brunson at the time. I was listening to a lot of a guy named Sean Terry and was doing a lot of house flipping stuff. He had a great podcast.

He got me going as well on some other things...

This was like, six years ago. Those guys have been awesome and really were the catalysts to get me along and then finally I was like, "Oh my gosh, who's this Russell guy?" And I started diving deep into his stuff.

But honestly, when I first started learning these things, I started going through and I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is so cool but, how do I do this without writing?" I hated English. I hated writing papers. I hated ...

I got good at them because I wanted to get through the pain as fast as I could. But I didn't actually want to get good at the writing aspect. All this internet stuff, I was like, "Yeah, it's all about the copy." I kind of wanted that to not be true. I wanted it to not matter.

So I dove deep, you guys, I was huge into design stuff. I got two state ... I'm sorry, I got three. Three Colorado State awards for my layout and designs in high school. I was the head editor of yearbook. For layout, not writing. For layout, not photography.

For layouts...

So I've been studying page layout and design for like, probably, a lot of my life. The majority of it now, which is awesome. I wanted the design to be the thing that sold. I wanted the design ... And the farther I got into this, you guys, you have to know I started realizing that wasn't true.

For example, insert testimonial, here it comes. When I was driving traffic for Paul Mitchell, I was in college, and a buddy and I ... It's funny, a lot of the Paul Mitchell schools in the area started coming over and they were like, "Hey, how do we get more of the social media crap going?"

And all of our professors were like, "We don't know what these two kids are doing, but hire them." So they did. And from our marketing classes, we got hired out to go actually do the stuff, not just learn it, which was really funny.

And we started driving lots of traffic for Paul Mitchell schools, so that they would have more walk-ins into their stores...

And it was interesting. And still, to that time, and this was four years ago, still to this day, I was still to that time, I was not ... I was still kind of hoping that design was the thing that would do it. That the layout ... and there's certain element that totally matters of that.

But what actually does the actual selling is the copy. We spent, I think, three hours on the headline for one of the campaigns we were running for Paul Mitchell. And it was working. And it was at that time that I started realizing like, "Gosh," because it was an active thought of mine like, I was trying to avoid the whole topic of writing. I did not want that to be true.

I did terrible most of the time in English...

I did terrible. When it was about stories, I actually did really well in English. When it was about research papers, I did terrible. I hated them. Just completely awful at them. Anyway. So it was around that ... I started realizing, "Oh my gosh, I gotta learn more about this thing, this copy writing thing."

And I started diving more deeply and that's when I ran into the Dotcom Secrets X. A lot of you guys know that story...

This stuff matters like crazy. If you look at some of those profitable funnels now that are out there, you wouldn't say that they visually are actually that attractive. Some of them are. And I'm not saying it doesn't matter.

I'm not saying you can't make it aesthetically pleasing. I do everything that I can to do that, but the ultimate bar that actually turns the dollar, the actual crank is obviously the words on the page. So obsess over that. The ability to write and the ability to put out ideas...

If there's anything else I would have done, if I could look back and like classes I wish I would have taken, I would've take debate. I would've taken a lot more creative writing. I would've taken a lot more stage presenting styled stuff. Which I actually did do a lot of that.

But, anyway. So I want you to know, I'm going to walk through real quick, as the one that Click Funnels hires to go teach this stuff to other people, with my lens.

Not to beat my chest, but meaning I want you to know that what I'm looking at here and what I'm looking for has taken not just a lot of time personally studying this stuff, but the lens that I'm looking at it through, this stuff's popping off the page at me.

Anyways, I want to walk through some of the most profitable ... This is part one of two. First of all, I'm going to go through hook, story, offer on each one of these funnels. There's five webinar funnels. Very, very, very lucrative funnels and dive deep.

In fact, I encourage you to do that very thing and I would go print out the top selling stuff. Go get it. Print it out. Study it like crazy. There's no other higher leverage activity I can think of, you spending your time on, than studying the copy of previously vastly successful sales letters.

Anyway. So one of the first things I want to point out is, before I dive into this as well is that each one of these email sequences, what's fascinating is, when I printed them out and I put them all across the floor, I already knew it would do this but it's just cool how it reinforced it was.

You can read them like a story...

The whole webinar follow-up sequence is a story, all of it. All of it goes and it wraps in together. It did not feel like there was anything random sert in. Random little inserts put in. It's almost like a ... Very similar to a Seinfeld episode, right?

Where when one episode ends, I'm begging for the next one to start because it was awesome...

Each one of these reads like a story. There's a logical progression throughout them. They're connected. It's not like these little tiny pop-shot emails all over the place. "Three hours left." "Two hours left."

Three hours left, but like, what's the story?...

Two hours left okay, but what's the story? How did it tie into the last one? What's the logical progression? So these are like works of art when I look at them...

I'm sorry it's taken me 19 minutes already to get to this, but I'm excited to. Let me just go through each one of these real quick here and walk you through some of the hook, story, offer of each one of these sequences.

So first I'm looking at the follow-up funnels webinar and it's the one where Russell did a really awesome up-sale to get a lot of people to upgrade to Actionetics at FunnelHacking Live 2017.

So what's the hook? The hook, the piece of curiosity. What? 16 dollars on the back end for every dollar on the front end? Whoa. There's the hook. It's also part story there.

The story there is Russell saying, he goes, "First off, I want to thank you so much for registering for the webclass. I wanted to make sure that you have a chance to watch it in the next 24 hours because as I mentioned, you get a special bonus that you don't get if you wait until tomorrow to watch it."

Whoa. Now let's dive a little bit here into the origin story. Which is what he did. This is the first email they're getting after they register. Great time for an origin story. Here it goes. He's starting right into it.

"During this webinar I am hoping to save you, hoping you'll have the same epiphany I did." He's actually pulling it on out. Here it goes. Here it goes, the origin story. "As the owner of Click Funnels, I obviously create a lot of funnels. Sometimes I'm not aware where all of our sales and profit is coming from.

...So last December I pulled all of our numbers, and I wanted to see which funnels made us a lot of money and they work together." There's some curiosity there. It's kind of like a second hook. This is the barb on the hook.

"What we found, which is crazy, is that for every dollar we made on the front end, we made 16 dollars through our back end follow-up funnels. What are follow-up funnels? That's what this presentation is all about.

In fact, I'm going to show you how a page-by-page, step-by-step, every single thing we do inside our follow-up funnels." Now I have desire to show up for this. There's a reason for me to clear my schedule.

And sometimes if you're like, "I don't know what the hook is," sometimes it's just the title for the story you're about to tell. Does that make sense? It's one of the easiest ways to think of a hook. These headlines.

The headline for secret number one...

The headline for your webinar. The headline for the webinar is literally the title for the origin story you're about to tell. A lot of times it is. It doesn't have to be, but a lot of times it is. It's one way to think of it.

"Secret number one: how to blank without blank." That's literally the title for the story that you're about to tell in secret number one.

If you're feeling this mismatch between your sales letters, it doesn't matter if you're making a webinar or not, any of your sales, if there's this mismatch in your titles and the stories you're telling, that's why...

The headline is the promise that ... It's the reason you should listen to the story. "How I blank without blank." "How to blank without blank." And that's kind of like the base format we use and more from another formats after that.

Software secrets. Next one. Software secrets goes through and hook, story, offer. Hook is, let's read through here real quick. Subject line for the very first email you get. "Your webclass is starting. Thanks for registering.

...Upcoming class, your training is about to start. Here's the access link to the webclass about to begin. Click on the link now and join all three of us inside this free training." So this is like a confirmation email. There hasn't been so much of it yet, but look, it'll keep going.

"If you've been wanting to create your own software, do not miss this webclass." Did he tell me how to? No. That's it. Just that one sentence right there, he salted curiosity throughout. "If you've been wanting to create your own software, do not miss this."

He goes on. "Did you catch the free webclass that you signed up for?" Little bit of a hook there. This is like the main hook of the second email you get after the webinar. "How much money will it cost to actually build my software program?

Hands down, that's the number one question we get from the webclass. Fun fact: did I ever tell you the first time ..." Now we're going into the story.
"The first time I made my first software for a whopping 20 dollars. True story."

He literally calls it a story. There we go: there's hook, there's story, and then he goes into the offer. "In fact I made a quick and fun video."

As we move on here he goes, "Here's what you need to do next if you want to learn this. Step number one, watch the Q and A video to find out how much you can expect your software to cost. Step number two: access the webinar replay here." That is the offer. There's a reason to take the call to action.

That's the offer right there, to grab that...

Anyway, in each one of these sequences there is one of those things. Let's go with High Ticket Secrets right now. Just grabbing the next one here. High Ticket Secrets right now. High Ticket Secrets, the title is the hook on this case. "Starting now, High Ticket secrets."

And he says, "I'm going to show you how to instantly add high ticket sales to any funnel without you personally talking to anyone on the phone ever." That is the hook. I don't want to talk to anybody on the phone for high ticket sales.

You don't have to do that. Are you kidding me? You give me the reason. In this case, the title of the webinar is the hook coming in here...

And he dives into the story and he starts talking about how he's done that. "How to plug in a new business. How to sell high ticket stuff without feeling like a used car salesperson." Two pages that you can add to any ...

If you think about it, think about it this way too. If I'm looking at just the headline of my webinar, and I'm looking at like the three secrets or whatever it is you're going to share inside there, whether it's a free plus shipping funnel or a high ticket funnel, the headline is the hook.

The headline, the title for the entire thing, that's the hook...

The three secrets? A lot of times, just the titles, the actual headlines themselves, is the story. I hope there's some a-has there. Does that make sense? Wait for, pause for effect. You think through it that way.

Anyway, I'm just moving quickly here. So I can dive into the next one as well...

CF certified. This one's pretty interesting too. Hook here is extremely strong and obvious as well. "The highest-paying part-time job in the world." This is for CF certified. "Funnel consulting: the highest-paying part-time job in the world."

That's pretty strong hook. That's pretty strong hook. That webinar sold really, really, really, just fantastically well. And as we look through here, just to prove the point, secret one, two, and three, that is the story in this case.

So we know what the hook is, let's look at the story. Here's the story: "How Amanda went from reluctant click-funnels rookie to selling 12 funnels her first 47 days." What?...

"The results first, cookie-cutter method that will give you unlimited clients. And how to easily shift from six figures a year to six figures per client per year, and a whole bunch more." What? Those are all titles of stories but he salted the oats in a way there's so much curiosity inside there I have got to go check that out.

It also happens to be the offer on that ... Anyway. What's funny is that each one of these emails is a hook, story, offer as well. Sometimes there's some elements that are stronger than others, but as kind of like a rough outline, that's another way to think about each one of these emails.

Each content piece...

When I write my podcast headlines, the title of each podcast, I'm trying to create a hook. I'm trying to salt an amassive promise in there, without you actually knowing what it is. That's the hook. Also happens to be the headline.

Not always has to be the case, but in this case it is...

All right, for FunnelHacks. This is amazing. "Anatomy of a 500,000 dollar per month sales funnel." Okay, that's a pretty strong hook. The right audience sees that and they're like, "What?"

The other kind of audience sees that and they're like, "Yeah, right." Isn't that interesting? The right person needs to see that...

In fact, when I saw his title of his webinar, "Weird niche funnel currently making me 17,000 dollars per day and how to ethically knock it off in less than ten minutes," I think that's what the hook was, but it had such a profound effect on me, I was like, "I'm in."

I didn't even have to see the webinar. I was pumped to see it. It made me even more excited. But I was the right person to see it...

That's why when you think about and when you're writing these hooks, and the stories and headlines and offers and all that stuff, who you're talking to matters so much. If I go talk to some ... Do you think it's ...

Imagine I walk up to Russell and I'm like, "Dude, I got this amazing idea. Imagine a website, but like instead of a website, it's like when they say yes to one thing, we send them to something else, like another page automatically, and we ask for more money. Again. And then we do it again. And if they say no to that, it's okay, we'll like, give them like a payment plan on something."

Is that a new opportunity of Russell? No. You have to think through when you're writing these hooks and you're writing these stories, you're putting these offers, the very first step to go through is figuring out who you're actually speaking to and to that person, is it a new opportunity? Is it a blue ocean?

It's one of the reasons my webinar does so well. I'm taking things that are already well known in another industry, I'm just changing who's hearing it. Does that make sense? Big a-has?

Reason why I wasn't a psycho for leaving and being able to with all the expenses I had and a family to pay for? Does that make sense?

Anyway. All right, so, hook. "Anatomy of a 500,000 dollar per month sales funnel." And he actually says it in the email. One of the very first things says, "While you're waiting I've got a fun story to show you. To share with you so you can be prepared.

Video one: we'll show you the anatomy of a 500,000 dollar per month sales funnel. Want to see it? Also in this video, you can see one of the most trusted website designers battle a tiny blond female in a cage fight." What? Isn't that interesting?

So every single email, every single piece of copy, every single page, every touch point with the customer. A lot of times why people don't have enough engagement is because they have the story and they've got the offer.

They got the sales message and they got the offer but every sales message has a reason why you should be listening to the story. Which is the hook. We brainstorm many times hours on that.

It is one of the easiest ways to give yourself a raise...

Just come up with a better hook.

These guys that have these offers that've been out there and they've been making tons of money with the exact same offer for years, the reason they can do it, they don't change the offer, they hardly change the story ever.

What they're doing is coming up with new hooks. And they're just dropping new hooks and they're trying to drop new hooks to the same audience, and try to expand the audience.

Anyway, I hope that that is making sense to you. And if you go through, start looking at it from that lens.

Look at the way that people go through and they come up with this hook and that hook. That's the reason why we have swipe files and swipe files and swipe files just loaded with different cool ads...

Because if we knew it was profitable, what was the hook inside that ad? And also the story inside that ad? Usually there's both inside an ad. And some kind of offer inside the ad as well.

And then they go to the next page, there's another little mini-hook, story, and offer. And they go inside, and then finally you get to the main offer of the whole thing. Then you get to the main story. Does that make sense?

Anyway, start looking at it that way and I'm going to ruin you because you're going to look at all ads, all commercials. That's the reason why we'll geek out about infomercials. If I'm late for a movie at a movie theater, I don't want to go to the movie. I don't.

I actually want to turn around, and just go to the next time because I want to see the previews. Because I'm looking for hook, story, and offer inside each one of them. If you go and you ... In fact I did a very funny thing. Go Google ... I did this probably like a year and a half ago.

I went through and I started looking ... I Googled "top phrases". "Most common phrases in movie previews." And what's funny is, guys, even though there's different movies, it's technically a different story, it's the exact same story most of the time. And you can go through and you can start looking.

They're using the same pieces of copy in almost every single movie preview. The hook might be a little bit different, it's the same story though. Some dude's freaking out, "Oh, my gosh, unexpected event." We like him because of some affinity that the commercial made us have for him or the preview.

We go through and the little tiny hero's too journey going on. Little epiphany bridge, epiphany bridge, epiphany bridge, unexpected, unexpected. It's this exact same ... It'll ruin you a little bit. But you also become a really good copy writer.

Anyway, so take it from a guy who hated actually the copy side of this whole game for a long time. It is incredibly important to go through and just if anything else, just start looking for those patterns and how you're being sold.

And how you're selling. And if it's not intentional, my guess is you can give yourself a very fast raise by making it intentional...

All right guys. Hey, thanks so much. Hopefully this is helpful to you. I'm excited for the next episode as well. I'm going to dive more into the strategies I saw in a very deep level in each one of these email sequences and the patterns and commonalities between all of them, and how it actually drastically has effected my funnel.

There's like, this whole other series and thing that I'm going and creating because of what I studied and learned, which I don't think we've really talked about. I know I haven't. I don't think I've ever heard Russell talk about it either, so.

Anyways guys, hey, thanks so much and I will talk to you and see you, well, you'll hear me on the next show. Hey, thanks for listening.

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