My focus is shifting from, "what should I have customers do post-purchase" to "what should they do pre-purchase?"

Cue drum roll, cue lights; it's time to grab that tux and dig out that little black dress because - TODAY, your product is about to get the Hollywood Treatment.

I'm about to drop some gold here - so settle down and take notes ;-)

WHEN OVER-DELIVERING IS A BAD MOVE

Recently I've been focusing on the small tweaks that you can make in your customer onboarding that create BIG effects.

There this time that I built  86 funnels (x2) for a promotion that Russell was doing for one of Stu McLaren’s products called Tribe.

When somebody purchases Tribe, they are given a step by step path to help them go through the program without overwhelm.

Let’s think about that for a moment…

Have you ever bought an online course and been so overwhelmed by the amount of content that you didn’t know where to start... or even worse, decided to ask for a refund?

Providing a massive amount of content often makes us feel great because we feel like we're over-delivering. However, bombarding a customer with too much information can actually freak them out - causing them to utter the dreaded “refund” word. (*gasp*)

Your customer is not looking to be overwhelmed; they're looking for a solution.

Since I launched my product, I've been thinking a lot about the concept of onboarding and success paths. I've been trying to figure out the most effective ways to hand-hold your customers into being successful.

There was a membership area that I built. It was by far the best members area I've ever created in my entire life. The problem was that it contained 200 hours of content.  It was packed with value, but it was just too much for most people to handle.

People were coming up to me saying: “I gotta quit my job to watch this! I'll never get through it." It was way too much stuff.

People felt so stressed that they started asking for refunds. If they didn't have time to consume all the content - they wouldn't get the result - so they asked for their money back. Not good, right?

So I started to create success paths that show customers exactly where they should start and what they should do if they want to achieve a certain result.

Your kind of giving your customer permission to focus on just one thing and holding their hand along the journey.

Creating a Success Path is a super effective way to increase customer satisfaction and reduce refund requests

We’ve just talked about the importance of a post-purchase success path for your customers… but what about before they purchase? What happens there?

Is it possible to create a pre-purchase success path to help you increase sales? The answer is a definite YES!

PRE-PURCHASE THE HOLLYWOOD WAY

Think about how Hollywood releases previews way before the movie gets released.

Can imagine what would happen if Hollywood didn't release previews? I mean, think about that. Our brains wouldn’t be pre-framed and loaded with anticipation. We wouldn’t look forward to the release dates and arrange to go to the movies with friends. A movie release would just slip out without much of an event.

It's like being really excited to go to a party or vacation. Sometimes, the most exciting bit is the anticipation and planning beforehand.

THE BEST PART OF YOUR VACATION ISN’T WHAT YOU THINK

A 2010 study published in the journal Applied Research in Quality of Life, found that planning or anticipating your holiday often makes you happier than actually taking it.

The happiest part of your vacation actually happens before you even begin your holiday

How does this work?

I have a favorite story that explains what’s going on in our brains when this happens, so let me share it with you quickly…

THE WARM/ COLD EXPERIMENT

There was a college class who were told that they would have a substitute teacher for the day.

Right before the substitute teacher came in to teach, the students were handed a biography of the teacher. However, there were two versions of the biography.

Both versions were completely identical except for one word.

One version said that, most students found the new teacher to be a very “warm” person,” The second version said that, most people him to be a very “cold” person.

The biographies where split equally between the students - Half the students were pre-framed to expect the teacher to be warm and friendly, while the other half expected him to be cold and aloof.

What happened next was fascinating...

At the end of  the class, they surveyed the students to see if the professor should continue teaching.

The students who were pre-framed with the “warm” biography said that he was incredible and that they enjoyed the class.

Conversely, the students who were given the “cold” biography  answered that they didn’t enjoy the class and didn’t want the professor to continue to teach.

It was exactly the same person teaching exactly the same lecture - but students the responses were wildly different depending on how they’d been pre-framed!

That’s nuts, right? It was exactly the same person teaching exactly the same lecture. On the surface, the students were in the same room having the exact same experience, but how positively they responded depended on the pre-frame that existed in their head.

Isn’t that fascinating?

As a marketer, I started to ask the question:

What can I put in place to pre-frame and  build positive anticipation for the purchase of my product?

I started to look for a way to boost levels of anticipation and to create “an event” around the purchase of my product?

So here’s what I’ve been doing…

CREATING A PRE-PURCHASE EVENT

• Before people attend my webinar, I have a product that they can purchase which helps me to recoup my ad cost.

As soon as somebody buys that mini product - I have a system set up that sends a message to my phone telling me who it is and I send them a quick personalized message.

Bloop. It sends straight back over to their email, and they get a personal message from me inviting them to come and watch the webinar. It's super effective.

2. We have a program on my funnel called “Deadline Funnel” and when somebody doesn't purchase within a certain window of time, it removes their ability to buy

Next we ask them if, “they want to join the waiting list?”

The people who join the waiting list are super pre-framed to buy the next time the purchase window opens because they don’t know when they’ll get another opportunity. BAM! It’s sooo effective.

What I'm trying to illustrate is that the way a customer is pre-sold your product drastically affects the likelihood of them buying the program - and their success once they purchase.

So start focusing on the question:

How can I pre-frame my customers brain to create a purchase, and to make the purchasing experience better?

TAKING THE EASY PATH

There are a group of people who purchased one of my main products who did not go through a success path. It's the same product, and yet they are having a different experience.

Nothing has changed in the product. However, the way they were pre-framed and what happened after they purchased was different.

You guys know how to create  value, but if the lead up to the purchase doesn’t create enough anticipation and the post-purchase success path doesn’t do the right amount of hand-holding afterwards; then you are making your life (and the experience of your customers) harder than it needs to be.

With some great pre-framing and an effective success path - the same product can produce a vastly different experience for your customer.

Start thinking about, how you can create a positive pre-purchase experience and an supportive success path post-purchase.

For a long time, I was only thinking about post-purchase, but once I started thinking about pre-purchase too my results went wild.

Getting people excited to buy, then finding ways to reduce overwhelm post purchase is one of the keys things that you can do .

Most people spend too much time running around asking, “Is my product good enough?” The answer is “Yeah, it usually is.”

There’s just not enough of a pre-frame. You’re literally sending your potential customers straight to an order page or a sales message.

You need to put something in place that will actually get them in the mood to buy. Start thinking of how you can create an event for someone who is thinking of buying your product - think of it as a Hollywood preview that builds anticipation for your product.

Ask  yourself:

How can I create a Red Carpet experience for my customers?

Answering that question will pay you back tenfold.

Until next time - Keep Crushing It!

Got a question you want answered live on the show? Head over to salesfunnelradio.com and ask your question now.

A common funnel error is targeting the wrong persona in the red ocean…

Do you have a great product that you know could change someone's life, but you’re not getting the sales you want?  Well, stick with me, because you might just be selling to the wrong people.

In this blog, it's my mission to help you discover the customers who are ready, willing and able to buy your product. In fact, these people are so eager to buy - that you can even be a C-level copywriter - and still make loads of cash. Intrigued? You should be ;-)

MY PERFECT PITCH

A few years ago, I got a job as a door to door salesman. I'd walk around knocking doors, "What's up, pest control!"

As the summer went on, I developed a bit of a theory.

I started to notice that when I went to areas that were less affluent - smaller houses, not as much cash - I could get a ton of sales fast.  

I was killing it!   

Two to three sales a day was good in the pest control business, but I was regularly making six. I'd collect the cash, and we'd spray the houses... I thought everything was amazing. I felt like “The Man."

Every so often, we’d rotate our areas and visit different cities with more affluent neighborhoods where people had bigger houses and more money.

When I'd knocked doors in these wealthier neighborhoods and gave them my pitch, I was shocked to find that I got a lot of rejections.

It was rejection after rejection; I couldn't figure out what was going on. So I decided to go back to those old neighborhoods where the people didn't have as much money - 'cause I knew I could sell them.

Well, at the end of the summer, at least half of my accounts failed. Lots of my contracts refunded or didn’t renew because the people I’d pitched were not able to keep up the payment - even though they “wanted” the product.

I realized that I’d perfected my pitch to sell to people with less cash.

In the meantime, all my buddies who had spent time learning how to pitch to rich people made a lot of cash.

They had fewer cancellations and sold higher value contracts - so by the time the summer was over they were still getting paid on their accounts.

Not only were their customers not leaving, but they were also putting more money in their pockets.

I realized that even though I’d been making lots of sales, in reality, I’d been selling to people who didn't have the money for continuity -  which made them far more likely to refund or cancel; leaving me broke and fed up.

Sure, I'd get a lot of accounts, but none of them would stick very long.

I was like, “Crap! How can I NOT ever do that again?” It was  a huge lesson for me.

WHO ARE YOU SELLING TO?

Now it probably won't surprise you to you to learn that since my pest control days, one question I’ve obsessed over is “How do I sell expensive things to people who have cash?”

Most of the time when I consult with businesses they have a great product, it’s simply that they're  selling it to the wrong “type” of person.

We know that it's best go sell in places that are competitive (i.e, the red ocean) - because there's security there.

Personally, I combine elements of the red ocean with elements of the prolific and the blue ocean to create a purple ocean offer that’s extremely attractive to your customers.

If you want to learn how I create purple ocean offers, you can find out here.

However, If you want to avoid making the same mistakes that I made when I sold pest control, it’s vital that you understand the 3 personas inside of the red ocean…

So let me grab my whiteboard and show you what I’ve figured out!

 
YOUR “NO DUH” PROMISE

The first thing I look at on any funnel that I work on is its promise.

There are 3 “no duh” areas that people spend money in, and these are HEALTH, WEALTH & RELATIONSHIPS.

So the question that you need to answer is: “Does my product promise results in either Health, Wealth, or Relationships?”

These are the “no duh” places for people to spend money in. They are the basic that everyone wants - they’re like milk or eggs (or maybe tofu if you’re vegan).

There's no salesperson next to eggs, right? It's a “no duh” buying experience.

I'm not saying, “go get in the eggs business.” But it's best to choose industries where there’s a “no duh” purchasing experience because this will make selling your product so much easier.

People will spend money on:

• Improving Relationships

• Improving Health

• Growing businesses, investments, and wealth

THE 3 PERSONAS OF THE RED OCEAN

In every red ocean and every single industry, not all buyers are created equal - that probably goes without saying, right?

So let’s look at why I made such a big mistake as a door to door salesman.

Let’s look at the 3 types of buyer who exist in the red ocean (i.e.,the proven market) and what motivates the to buy.

THE “DIE-HARDS”

The “die-hards’ are deeply seated inside of their red ocean product.

If you come to a die-hard person and say, “Hey, I got this cool thing for you.”  There not going to be interested. They’ve had success with the product that they use - they’re a fan.

I'm wearing my funnel hacker shirt right now. I'm a die-hard. For me to move away from ClickFunnels - well, it isn’t going to happen.

For me to shift from using ClickFunnels, I would need an identity shift. I would literally need change how I see myself. It’s about so much more than price and value for a die-hard.

If someone starts bad-mouthing ClickFunnels, I get a little hot and bothered about it. I'm like, “Are you kidding me? ClickFunnels changed my life! I'm a product of that product! No. I will never change.”

If you ask a die-hard to switch products - it's a personal insult.

THE “BREAK-EVENS”

Let’s use a relationship example here:

Let's say someone goes to Tony Robbins kind of event and that person is someone who's considering suicide or divorce and then Tony flips them around - those people are the die-hards. They’re never not going to love Tony Robbins. They’re never not going to buy his next program coming out. For them to change to someone else would mean an identity shift. It is not likely.

However, a person who goes to a Tony Robbins type event, and as a result, they feel better about themselves - but they don’t experience a massive transformation - they’re a “break-even.”

They’ve not had a massive transformation like the die-hard. They’ve  had a little bit of a, “Oh my gosh, this is super super cool.’ They're probably gonna keep purchasing the products. They won’t be looking for anyone else for relationship advice.

They've had a taste of success, but they don't necessarily “love, love, love” the product like a die-hard would.

For the break-evens, it’s the pain of disconnect that they want to avoid.  They don’t want to go through the struggle of switching services or finding something new.  

However, for the break-evens, price and value do have a role to play. If they become aware of a better product that offers more value, if the incentive is enough they will be willing to shift their allegiance.

THE “NO OTHER OPTIONS”

Now, let's get to the number ones - the “no other options.”

I’m going to use a health example here:

Have you guys ever had pea protein powder? It’s like whey protein powder, but made from peas. It tastes terrible and the texture is horrible... oh my gosh! But I know it's the best one.

I was read loads of reviews and found out that pea protein is awesome for protein synthesis. I was excited to get some. When it arrived in the mail, I took a scoop, put it in water.

I have a strong stomach. I'm not the kind of guy who throws up or anything, but honestly, “That’s some nasty crap!” I’ve spent 6 months trying to find ways to mask the texture of that crap.

I’m a number one pea protein drinker. I drink that stuff simply because I know it's the best, but I HATE it. I hate that it's the vehicle. I have no customer loyalty that brand at all.

If you can offer me “a super sweet protein powder - that works as well as mine but tastes waaay better - How easy do you think it would be to sell me on that? Super easy, right?

On the other hand, if someone has a protein powder that they love and it’s helped them lose 50 lbs -  How likely is it that they are going to switch? They’re a die-hard - so your chance of getting them to switch is practically zero.

The break-even person who's had some success with that protein, but doesn’t “love it” - well, they may be willing to try it.

For number twos, it's all about price and value; it's not an identity shift.

IDENTIFYING YOUR TARGET MARKET

Now let’s go back to my pest control fiasco!

When I was selling pest control, who was I selling to? I was selling to a lot of “break- even” and “no other option” people. There weren't that many die-hards.

I was selling to the people inside the red ocean who wanted to get rid of the bugs. I was selling to a lot of ones and twos, but it was the wrong kind of ones and twos because they didn’t have the resources.

So within the three different personas, you also have then you have levels of different resources. You need to identify “Who has money?” and as who, as Russell Brunson says, …“is willing and able?”

The reason why I want to talk about this issue is that 80% of the time, when I’m looking at somebody's headlines, or doing some consulting - I see that the people creating their messaging to try and convince with facts, figures, and features, and maybe with some benefits…

BUT they're trying to convince the die-hards to come and buy their product.

That's the wrong person to write your copy for... It's the wrong person to write your headlines for... It’s the wrong person to build your product for...

You are not trying to sell to the die-hards!

Your target market should be the people who are willing to hear your message… the people who have no customer loyalty to the brand that they already use.

You need to design your message to sell to the break-evens and the no other options; the guys that are just using a product 'cause they don't know of anything better.

These people just need to hear a new story. They need to hear a new sales message.

That’s the thing I didn't figure out when I was doing pest control until it was too late.

When I started building my first info product, I did the same thing again. I spent eight months building it, and when I tossed it out there, I was selling it to the die-hards.

The people who were like, “Don't you dare make fun of my products and the things I use.” It was an insult to their identity - I was offending them by merely suggesting an alternative.

Once I changed my messaging to hit the people who “hated the vehicle” and “hated the products they were using,” things changed. I made my messages for those people. I helped them throw rocks their old products and showed them a better way.

All they needed was an excuse to switch, and they bought my product.

So if your product is not selling the way you want it to, or you’re designing your sales message, remember to run it through the 3 personas I’ve talked about and check it for fit.

I'm trying to help you guys identify the people “no other option” people because it's not hard to sell to these people.

If they also have the resources, you can be a C- level copywriter, and still sell to these people easily.

They're just looking for something that’s that's different and better to save them from their current vehicle - which mean more money in your pocket.

Anyway. Hopefully, this has been helpful. You can check out the episode on  iTunes, please rate and review. If not, subscribe to my YouTube channel as well, that'd be very very helpful.

If you’d like to see some live funnel building, (a lot of times I'll build whatever project I'm doing, live), go to the science of selling.online, and it'll forward to my Facebook group, it's free.

You guys can join me there and watch as I document what I'm building and why I'm doing what I'm doing.

Until next time - Keep Crushing It!

Hey, want me to speak at your next event or mastermind? Let me know what I can share that would be most valuable by going to stevejlarsen.com and book my time now.

I have a FaceBook group called The Science of Selling Online -  I hang out there daily (it’s a FREE group).  I do live funnel builds - and walkthroughs of my latest projects where sharing the reasons for what I'm doing. You can ask me questions, and I’ll answer them live.

One of my latest projects is a program called Affiliate Outrage. It's an amazing course. The cherry on the top is that I’ve managed to pull together some outstanding experts to share their skills in each module.

Last week, during one of my live funnel builds in The Science of Selling Online, someone asked me, "Steve, how did you build a product and get so many experts to contribute to it...  How do you crowd-create a product?”

So in this blog, I'm going to answer that question and reveal a skill that I see many Entrepreneurs utilize - that you may not be aware of.

I'm also going to share some of the secret self-improvement skills that have influenced me profoundly over the last few years. Stay with me; this is going to be juicy!

DODGEBALL - AND BEING AN ENTREPRENEUR

There was this one time in my life, where every Monday for months; a group of us would show up turn tables over in a gym and hurl tennis balls at each other as hard as we could.

There was about 30 of us, all in our late teens and early twenties - playing dodgeball and using tables as barriers.

People got hurt -  this was hardcore.

I remember one particular time - I was super excited to play that week. I tried to get everyone to start.  Man, I wanted to play so bad. I kept trying to get people ready, but nobody was taking any notice of me.

After about 10 - 15 minutes, I got frustrated and went over to this other guy.  He goes, "Oh, you're trying to start?" Then he lifts his head, and says, "Hey, guys, we're getting ready to start."

With that one sentence, everyone turned their heads, stopped their conversations, and started listening.

I watched the room in dismay. I couldn’t believe it, "Are you kidding me? - I've been trying ‘forever’ to get these people to do what I want!"

I remember right there, at that moment, I realized that I didn't need to be good at everything - in fact, it was better if I wasn’t.  

I realized that it was better for me to be an orchestrator rather than try to learn how to play every instrument...

That an entrepreneur is someone who has a vision and brings is to life.  An entrepreneur is a maestro.

MY LITTLE BLACK BOOK

For years, I kept a little black book in my pocket. Every time I had a business idea or an insight, I would write it down in that black book. It was chock full ideas - some great, and some dumb - but I carried it around with me at all times.

When I realized that I didn’t need to be “good at everything” to be an entrepreneur, I wrote it down in that book.

Even though I was in my early 20’s when I wrote that thought down - it was one of the hardest lessons for me to learn as an entrepreneur.

When I was at ClickFunnels, Russell drilled this lesson into me for eight solid months before it finally sunk in

Multiple times, I'd be, "Dude, I'm gonna go learn more CSS." Russell would look at me and say "Why? We have someone for that." He'd be dead serious.

I’d say, “Well, my major before marketing was CIT. I know I could understand it.” Again, Russell would look at me and say, "Oh, yeah, but who cares? We’ve got someone for that. Don't  learn that."

I struggled to take it on board because I’m curious and I like to know how thing work. However, when it finally sunk in, it was one of the best lessons EVER!

If you’re like me, it may not be an easy lesson to learn, but please learn it. Here it is:

Just because you know how to do something doesn't mean you should do it

Sure, I can pop open Photoshop, use Illustrator, do my video editing, write copy, film videos, build funnels. However, to scale and get the highest leverage for my business - I need to concentrate on doing the things that only I can do. It's hard, I get it - but it’s soooo worth it

DON’T BE A RENAISSANCE (WO)MAN

The reason I started affiliate marketing was to get the cash so that I could hire people to do all the things that I shouldn't be doing. I also learned to develop another skill that I see many successful entrepreneurs use get stuff done.

About 3 months ago, I had a brilliant person tell me,"Figure out how to hire people you can't afford." It's changed everything in my business!

If you’re reading this, then you’re an A-player - a weird breed of person with both vision and ability

 You can bring your vision to life. However, the worst mistake you can make is to be a renaissance man or woman and do “all the things” yourself. It’ll slow you down and burn you out.

So what do you do instead?

SHARING YOUR VISION

There’s one skill that I alluded to at the start of this article. A skill that I see so many successful entrepreneurs use to their advantage. A skill that can help you stay focused on your highest value tasks and get results at the same time. That skill is Influence.

If you have a vision and the ability to share that vision in a way that connects with people on an emotional level, then people will follow you and support you - even when the path is rocky or unchartered.

Let’s face it, as an entrepreneur; it’s likely that you’ll be laying a path rather than following one. So it’s vital that you can communicate your vision and tell your story effectively so that people will follow you.

USING INFLUENCE

Influence is what I’ve used to help bring my incredible content machine together. The caliber of people on my team would normally cost me 40 or 50 grand a month, but because they believe in the vision of where I'm taking the ship, it's way less than that. It's only 30 grand a month!

Granted, it's still 30 grand a month - but in hindsight, I'm getting a huge discount because everyone involved believes in what I'm doing.

Yes, I know, 30 grand a month is still a shed load of money, but if you don't have the cash, don’t panic…

You still have a story.

A great story is one of your most valuable assets.

If you get good at telling stories, your vision will help you hire the people that you can't afford.

It’ll stop you from getting stuck trying to learn everything. It’ll help you bring in the experts you need to grow your business. I see way to many entrepreneurs stunting their growth because they try to do EVERYTHING.

The highest leverage thing you can ever to learn is marketing, and how to change belief

If you want to change someone's belief - tell them a great story. Get REAL good at telling stories that connect emotionally with people. If you can tell amazing stories, it will negate 99% of your need to learn scripts. Just tell a story and then make an offer.

When I started approaching all these experts - calling them in to help me, that's exactly what I was practicing - communicating my vision with a story.

Show people how coming along with your mission will benefit their business too, and you’re on to a winner.

I used this strategy to create my content machine - and to get all the amazing experts to contribute to Affiliate Outrage - which is where this blog post started…

However, before I round up this blog, I want to say a few words about “Vision and Purpose.” Along with trying to “learn all the things,” - the other place I see people getting stuck is on trying to find their “vision and purpose.”

THE PURPOSE QUESTION

Recently, I was hanging out at an Inner Circle member's house with Russell. We were chatting away when he asks me, "How's it going, man? What are you struggling with? Gimme the deets, brutha."

I thought for a minute, and then I replied, "Dude, I'm trying "to figure out what my purpose is."  Immediately Russell starts laughing. Myron Golden was standing next to us, and laughing, Russell interrupts Myron:

Dude, Stephen just asked the purpose question. He's trying to figure out what his purpose is."

Myron laughed, "Man, are you kiddin' me? I just found out my purpose 3 months ago."

Russell grinned and said, "Dude, I only found my purpose 3 years ago when I started ClickFunnels, and this whole thing blew up."

Right there I decided, "Alright, I'm not gonna freak out my purpose anymore."  Russell said, "Yeah, don't worry about it… Just  help people make money, it'll be great." So, that's my purpose for now.

You don’t need to have a grand vision or purpose for things to workout - Just make some money, solve problems for people and your purpose will develop in its own time

My vision right now is to develop something that's freakin' cool. I want to help a whole bunch of people who probably haven’t made their first dollar online yet. I want to teach people how to do what I've done.

TAKE ACTION

• If you want a following, publish. Get over the fear of it! I was scared to death. It took me 30 episodes before I was comfortable publishing

• You want people to come and follow you? Make a product. If you don't want to make a product (or don't know how to), sell someone else's. Join Affiliate Outrage, and I’ll show you how to do it

• Launching. Don't worry about the details. Just figure out all the things that you’ve got to do to get off the ground. Don’t wait… you’ll turn around and 3 months will have passed - and you’ll have no cash or results to show for your time.

• Figure out your BIG purpose as you go along. I've talked about my revenue outpacing my business, and that's true. However, the secondary thing that was going on was the psychological game I was playing with myself; “What's my purpose, what should I be doing? What do people want from me?”

THE OBSTACLE IS THE WAY

I have this coin on my desk. It reminds me to lean into any challenge I have. I'm sending these coins out with a lot of my new products because I freakin' love this concept.

On one side it says: “The Obstacle is the Way.” On the other side it has the message:

The impediment to action advances action. What stands in the way becomes the way"

At the last Funnel Hacking Live, the countdown clock for the Two Comma Club coaching program is dropping down. There are 4 minutes to go, and someone comes to me and says: Hey, we're gonna go get in the program, but we figured if we split the program, it'll be half the cost -  and we'll take turns going to the events."

My answer was, “ Well, you could do that… but I believe that if you seek a discount, you will find a discount. If you ask how can I afford this program, and you really believe you can do it, you will answer that question instead.”

Questions invite revelation - so it crucial to pick your questions carefully.

Don't worry if you don't have a solid vision yet. Be fine with the fact that you have unanswered questions. Just be careful of what your questions are.

For example:

When I asked the question, “How do I become a Russell Brunson?” One of the answers I got was,  “Publish your journey along the way.”

That's why I publish like an animal. It's because I'm NOT a Russell Brunson yet. Most people use their lack of status as an excuse not to publish.

Don't worry that you don't have any followers yet. No one's listening for a while.

As you start publishing, you’ll begin to create an attractive character, and you start gaining expertise. You’ll become a figure.

If you wait to begin publishing until you're “a figure,” no one's gonna believe you. People only believe you when they see the trail you’ve left - when they can see your history.

I asked a much more useful question than asking “How to get a discount.” That question has brought me to a much cooler place than finding out how to get a discount ever could.

ADVICE TO MY PAST SELF

If there's any advice I could give myself looking back, it would be to ask different questions

For a long time, until I became cognizant of the principle that “questions invite revelation,”  I asked some stupid questions, and it slowed me down - A LOT.

So if you take anything away from the blog, I hope it’s a commitment to ask better questions.

So let’s round up, and finish of with the steps I took to “crowd create” my products. They are so powerful, that you can use them to move forward with any project you’re working on… Here we go:

HOW TO CROWD CREATE A PRODUCT

These are the step I’d follow:

1. Have a Vision - it doesn’t have to be your grand life purpose

1. Don’t try and be a Renaissance man/ woman - don’t try do it all yourself - Find experts

1. Share your vision - master storytelling to help bring in experts from different fields to support you

1. Don’t be put off by challenges - remember, “the obstacle is the way.”

1. Ask better questions and get better solutions - questions invite revelation

Until next time - Go CRUSH IT -  and, Keep Upgrading Those Questions!

Hey, wish you could geek out with other real funnel builders and even ask questions while I build funnels live? Wish granted!

Watch and learn funnel building as I document my process in my funnel strategy group. It's free! Just go to my FaceBook Group, The Science of Selling Online and join now.

What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larson, and this is Sales Funnel Radio.

Today we are gonna talk about how to create your own affiliate army.

I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my 9 to 5 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch.

This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business, using only today's best internet sales funnels.

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio. What's up guys?

Hey, so one thing I wanna get out of the way real quick is in the last few episodes I know I've talked a lot about things that I was doing at Clickfunnels when I first started working there. And the reason why is because what you'll notice that I'm doing, is I'm actually modeling the very things that I was doing over there, in my own business. Why? Because they work.

I had a hand in creating a lot of those things, and I've done it before so, why not just do it again for my own company, right? And so to tell the story, real quick:

I was just starting at ClickFunnels; I'd been working there like three months, and I noticed Russell started doing this weird thing...

He grabbed an iPad, and he sat figuring out how to mirror his iPad to his computer. I was like that's kind of weird. He would record his computer. And he was sitting there, he was writing out the script…

I think I was working on Biohacking Secrets at the time, or something like that. Feels like about the right timeline I think.

Anyway, so he was writing those things out, and I would kinda notice him, you know just over my shoulder, just watching what he was doing. And I was building stuff, putting things together

He did this really cool presentation where he showed how to be an affiliate, and the power of being an affiliate. Right, and if you guys know what I'm talking about, I'm talking about when we created affiliatebootcamp.com.

And then something magical happened. This was one of the things that was a catalyst for me - that gave me confidence to actually teach the things that I was doing.

He turned around and he said “Hey, do you wanna make the videos for this?”  I was like, “Are you serious? Yeah!”

On the outside I was like, “Yeah,” but on the inside, I was like, “Oh my gosh, this is crazy, right? Holy crap. Oh it's Russell Brunson.” I was pretty sure lightning would strike me if I didn't do a good job.

Right, that's what was going through my head...  but I didn't want him to know that. So I sat there and we started going through the different topics, coming up with different topics and different ideas for what Affiliate Bootcamp training was going to be.

Now I knew affiliatebootcamp.com, he had used that in previous businesses, but the current version of it right now, at the recording of this video, I created.

I remember I stayed up super late multiple nights filming and re-filming. I don't know if he knows that I did that, but I did that so many time because I was so scared that it wasn't gonna be amazing.

And so I'd film, and I'd re-film, back and forth, back and forth…

They were only 15 minute videos teaching a single really cool strategy that was very powerful, but I wanted to deliver it well. So I stayed up super late.

I remember Russell went out of town once and the project was due soon. I was probably over obsessing, but just 'cause I wanted to do a really good job.

So I was there really, really late. This was well over two years ago now - I was there super late, telling my wife, “Babe I gotta finish this thing... I'm doing the videos.” And she's like, “Whoa, that's crazy!”  So anyway, I was super excited about it.

I filmed a bunch of these strategies and taught a lot of cool stuff. And then I showed some of my own stuff that I had be doing to get affiliates at that time too.

And that's what a... You know then Jon Parks came in with this amazing amazing job, right, teaching incredible Facebook strategies. Right, and it was really fascinating the way it all came about, and a lot of people joined Clickfunnels because of that.

So yesterday what I did... I was going through and I have a Facebook group, if you guys don't know…. It's where I dump a lot of my strategy sessions. It's where I bring up a lot of things that I'm thinking of throughout the day. These podcast episodes are a little bit more... I think through them heavily, and I make sure that they all are like... It feels a little bit more permanent, right?

The Facebook group though, that's what I'm doing on a daily basis. It's called The Science of Selling Online, go check it out - it's free.

Anyway, yesterday, I did a deep dive with my group about creating an affiliate army. It was funny because half the people on the Facebook live told me that they were in Clickfunnels because of those original videos I did for Russell…

They're were like, “It was after seeing that strategy, that I decided to come and join ClickFunnels.” I was like, “No way,” it was a ton of people. Lots of 'em on the Facebook live that said that.  It was crazy.

So, I wanna show you how to get your own affiliate army. I also wanna show you more of the strategy of why you should want your own affiliate army. It's a little bit like where to start…

My brain's all over the place on this one. I'm excited to go through this:

Number one, we need to talk about the Dream 100. And funny enough, I feel like there's this, almost like a... It's almost like when I mention the Dream 100, people are like, Oh yeah... the Dream 100....” There’s this attitude around  it... “Freakin' do it - it works!”

We shipped out a whole bunch of packages yesterday to our Dream 100 - AGAIN. It's gone really, really well. It's super fun... really neat stuff.

You have to know that I treat Dream 100 and affiliates different... While I might do a joint venture, I’m not necessarily looking to do a joint venture with an affiliate. However, I am seeking to do a joint venture with a Dream 100. Does that make sense? It's one of the major differences between the two.

People can go out and they can promote my product, but they might not have a much of a following yet. It's not worth me doing a specific webinar with that person,right?  

A Dream 100 person is an influencer. They're a ‘river owner,’ right? They own traffic. They own eyeballs. I can do a joint venture with them, but that's different to most affiliates. Does that make sense?

For example; when we were getting the Expert Secrets book out of the door, we spent a significant amount of time... Dave Woodward did an amazing job putting together this cool campaign inviting people to promote the Expert Secrets book.

Who made that list? Influencers. A and B list influencers, maybe even some C list. People who owned traffic, people who already had a list. That's Dream 100s style strategy.

All I wanna do with influencers is get them on a joint venture. Maybe a webinar we can do together, or something like that. Affiliates, though, are different…

What I do with affiliates is, I go and I create assets for the affiliates. I want to make it as painless as possible for them to promote my product. What do I mean?

If you guys log into your ClickFunnels account... If you don't have one, you're crazy…. You can get your free trial accounts at salesfunnelbroker.com - you get free funnels too. Yes, it's an affiliate link, okay? - go get it though. It’s awesome.

If you go inside the back area in your ClickFunnels account (when you get a Clickfunnels account, you're automatically an affiliate for Clickfunnels) … Let's say you want to promote the “Expert Secrets’ book; if you go into your CF account, there's a bunch of assets in there.

You’ll find a unique link that you can send people to - so you get an affiliate commission. Scroll down and you’ll see pre-written emails, image assets and pre-done videos that you can use. There’s lots and lots and lots of pre-done assets just to promote Expert Secrets.

That way, all the affiliate has to do is grab an asset, and put their affiliate link under it, and press go - or turn on the ad. It's super, super painless.

I don't wanna offend anybody when I say this, but stereotypically, affiliates are very lazy people... meaning they have their own projects going on, right?

For me to get them to actually promote my thing, I have to do a lot of work to remove the pain that they'll feel when they start to promote my product. Does that make sense?

So, just understand that I'm talking about how to create your own affiliate army - I'm not talking about the Dream 100. That's a different strategy. I'm gonna go different things with them. I'm gonna treat them differently, I'm gonna massage court and date them very differently than an affiliate.

For affiliates, it's a great way for them to make a whole bunch of cash quickly without a whole lotta fulfillment time. So just know that that there's the difference.

Now that we've established the difference - there's a huge difference in the way you treat them.

One has a following, one doesn't. One has an existing success that's happened, one usually doesn't, and that's fine.

Some people just wanna be full time affiliates, and that's great.

A little while ago, I was standing in front of Russell in his office there with him and I was talking about some cool things I wanna go toss together.

I was talking about campaigns, and I said one of the campaigns I wanna run is my own Affiliate Bootcamp. And he was smiling and he said, “yeah that's a super cool thing to do,”  because you train people how to sell for you.

Right, think with me real quick on this….

In Affiliate Bootcamp, when I'm going through and teaching how to promote and actually get cash as an affiliate, (which a lot of you have - which is amazing. Super cool)...  Every example that I'm giving is actually a ClickFunnels product. So it's free training showing you how to promote ClickFunnels.

Mine will be completely free as well. It will be what I drive ads to. I will definitely get money back and those ads are definitely gonna be profitable ads.

Every example that I give will be my own product. I'm pseudo teaching how to promote me, alright? And that's cool, it’s totally fine.

So I started thinking through, like okay right, Affiliate Bootcamp goes through things like YouTube, it goes through things like podcasts. It goes through things like how to use other people's content and blogs. And while I'll still go through some of those strategies, I wanna add in some of those new things as well.

So here's my plan, here's my strategy. This is me being completely open, completely vulnerable. I'm excited to invite you you guys - it's gonna be totally sick. It's amazing, oh my gosh.

In my affiliate training, I wanna to show you how to use Chatbots for affiliate commissions... 'Cause there's a way and there's a FREE way. How to use things like offerwalls. How do you use things like the strategy Todd Brown was talking about, along with Instagram and Facebook groups.

I want to show you how to use strategies that have come into play more heavily in the last two years. I mean obviously Facebook groups were there. But how do you use the most up to date strategies as well?

I have a habit of going really deep with stuff... sometimes it's kind of a negative... But this is gonna be amazing. I was thinking to myself, “Self, why don't I have other people who are already experts teach those things?”  

A lot of the people who are doing my YouTube, my Instagram, my Facebook groups, my blogs, my podcast stuff… The people I'm spending a lot of money for on a monthly basis to have around... What if I asked them to be the ones who do the training?

They'll just spend 10 -15 minutes teaching the strategy, how to promote, and how to actually be an affiliate. You could use it for any product, but we'll use our product strategically as the examples in there. It's teaching people how to be affiliates for me. Right, does that make sense?

Russell was really excited about it. It's gonna drip out to you over 30 days. You can obviously speed up and go a lot faster if you want... but we're putting together now. It's planned for the end of June. So I'm really, really, really, really excited about it.

There's a beta list and you can jump on the training and do it kind of live with us. That's the plan so far anyways. Go to affiliateoutrage.com and get on the waiting list.

There's a cool monkey there, it's like a gorilla, and he's got glasses on, and they're the Clickfunnels colors.

What I wanna do is, train my own affiliate army. Create my own affiliate strategy and teach people how to promote my stuff, 'cause it's freakin' awesome.

Right, and one of the campaigns I'm putting together is I wanna show people… I have watched multiple people become wealthy with just one campaign. One! When I say campaign, I don't mean Facebook ads. Facebook ads, YouTube ads, Google ads, those platforms are destroying the term campaign. They're destroying it. That term is being lost.

Campaigns are not ads. A campaign might include ads, but it's not a campaign. Does that make sense? I know it doesn't make sense yet, follow me…

Doing something like a seven day launch. That's a campaign. Ads are included as part of that. But an ad is not a campaign.

So what I started doing a little while ago, is I started thinking through all the strategies that I've either been a part of, or I've seen people pull off - where just the one campaign has made their product a lot of sales and cash.

So I thought well, what if I got a whole bunch of campaigns, and did all of them? Right? If one's not amazing - six are, right!

So what I did is I went through, and I started putting together six different very unique campaigns… (Watch what I'm doing closely from about June through the end of October.)

This has been in the works for quite a while... But it is campaign strategies, not just ads. We're gonna scale ads, ads are gonna go crazy. But there's six different campaign strategies that I'm using - that I've seen, been a part of, or done in other areas where it's made a lot of cash.

This 2 Comma Club award right there - that's the result of one campaign. That's one campaign!  So I wanna go through and show you guys how I've pulled all this stuff off. How I've actually done it.

Watch what I'm doing. I'm gonna make my own affiliate army, and then I'm gonna do an affiliate contest…

Then the top ten affiliates, I want you guys to fly out for a day or two. We'll just do whatever you want. We'll work on funnels together. I'll help build your businesses, I'll help you do whatever. That's part of the gift I'm gonna give.

But where I did I learn that? Ah, the Expert Secrets book, right? That was part of the campaign of that launch. There was a Dream 100 campaign, but there was also an affiliate campaign.

Campaigns are events, they're not ads. It drives me nuts, I'm starting to get all itchy about it.... Campaigns are not ads! Campaigns are EVENTS.

They're succinct events that are happening inside of a period of time. They're things that you're doing to create pressure, and then release pressure towards your sales page, or towards your order page, right?

Anyway, I am excited for all this stuff. So watch what I'm doing here…

I'm creating an affiliate army by teaching them how to be affiliates for anybody. I don't care if they don't promote my stuff. They're on my list, right, and I'm gonna show them why promoting my stuff is really freakin' profitable.

I give amazing affiliate commissions, and at the same time, I'm not gonna be the one to put it all together, I'm gonna crowd create it…

I'm gonna grab some of my most trusted people on my team, and have them go in these incredible skill sets that have taken them a long time to go master...  I'm gonna have them do little pieces of the training. What does that do? That scratches their back and mine at the same time, I'm totally cool with that... why would I not be?

I'm not a genius at YouTube. I love it, but I'm not a genius at it. Why would I teach that? Let's go have the person who is a genius teach that.

Right, why don't I teach Instagram? I love Instagram... Instagram's blowing up. And it's really, really cool. (We're at 11 and a half thousand followers now, which is really, really fun. And... Anyway, gosh, super cool.) But I'm not gonna teach Instagram because I’m not an expert.

There was a principle that I learned when I was 20. Actually I was 21... I remember where I was standing when I realized that successful people are not necessarily renaissance men. They don't act like a renaissance men. They act like an orchestrator.

They stand up  and they put the pieces together. That's it!  They're contractors basically. Just be better at it than most contractors are.

Anyway, I hope that that's helpful to you.

Remember to watch the campaigns that I'm going to start launching and putting out... use them, follow them, right.

We're gonna do a seven day launch. We're gonna do all sorts of stuff. We've got a really cool summit that we're gonna do that's coming up as well. It's to promote the same product, but from different angles - because some people are like’ “I don't wanna be an affiliate... but man, I'll check out that summit…”

“I don't wanna do this... but man, I'll come to a two day event.” You know, a little masterminding...

Does that make sense? I've laced these all together, so watch very closely what's gonna happen. It's one of the reasons why I know it's gonna do really well.... And 'cause the product is selling well, the offer's amazing, the story's incredible, the funnel's fantastic. So now it's just time to promote.

Let's scale those ads - we're doing right now. And it's working. Our SLO is selling, and it's liquidating ads costs. It's exciting guys.

Anyway, thanks for following the journey, and where I'm taking the ship. Again go to affiliateoutrage.com if you wanna be on that list, and watch that training - it's free. Watch how I'm unrolling it, it's very methodical.

Anyway, we're gonna talk about a lotta cool stuff with that, but if you have anything that you wish was in that training, man let me know, okay, let me know…

Comment on the YouTube version of this video. Put on there what you would love to have inside that training.

We're gonna go through Facebook ads, we're gonna go through different groups. We're gonna talk about Instagram. We'll talk about all tons of different traffic platforms and how to use that to gain affiliate commissions for whatever you're promoting.

My hope is that you choose to promote my stuff, 'cause it's really good. It's not all the plan, but it's a snapshot, okay. I’ll document even more along the way and you guys can follow it as we move forward.

So anyways, hope that's been helpful to you, as you start to think through  which campaigns you’re using to promote yourself?

If it's just ads...man, do a campaign. Do something big, right? Do something real big, make an event out of it. A seven day launch, that's another great version of it. I don't wanna give all the secrets away. Okay, I'm not going to…

Anyway, I'm excited about it though. I'm excited for what's gonna happen here with this. Watch what I'm doing, and feel free to follow along @ affiliateoutrage.com

I'm having a lot of really incredible experts come on - who are frankly really expensive to get - to teach some cool stuff to you guys.

So anyways, thanks so much and I'll talk to you guys later. Bye.

Many of you don't know that I actually made my first money online as an affiliate marketer. If you wanna know how I funded my entire company without using any of my own money ever, you can learn to do the same for free @ affiliateoutrage.com

- What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larson, and this is Sales Funnel Radio.

Today I'm going to talk to you about why I chose the info business over the others.

I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my 9-5 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is, how will I do it, without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch. This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business. Using only today's best internet sales funnels.

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

I wanna deep dive into some of the reasons that I sell info now. I started and walked through several other models and markets over the years, but I've planted in Info for a few specific reasons. Here's why...

What's up guys, hey, first off please know that I know there are far more types of business than just the ones I have on the board right here. But generically I find that a lot of them fit kind of in this category as far as the way that we market them.

The four categories that I’m using are: Ecomm/ Agency/ Affiliate/ Info

Service is kind of the same way as Agency. We might market Ecomm in similar way to retail.

Anyway, so I went through and I started looking through different ways.

I did this a while ago and I was very methodical about the way that I entered the business space and which market I actually went into.

I'm not saying that one is not better than the other, and I'm not saying that these are all of them...  please know that I’m going to talk in massive stereotypes.

There are lots of different businesses out there. The kind of people that are solopreneurs, I typically see them going into one of these categorizes - until they get to a certain level, then they'll scale and blow it up and get to other places as well.

I might put supplements under Ecomm. They’re very similar - the funnels are different -  but there are some similar aspects to them.

Services and Agency are kind of the same.

Affiliate/ Salesman/ MLMers/ are all very similar

Then there’s Info products…

Anyway, what I want to do is I just want to show you guys real quick why I chose what I do and first of all I want you to know that this is, I actually sell info products now, right? I did not start that way at all though.

Info products is kind of interesting the way that it plays out because to sell info products, it helps to have a little bit of authority in the space that you're selling it to. Obviously, it helps, it's true for anything. But especially with info.

I didn't start with info. If you want to you can tackle it right away. Awesome, go for it.

I actually was just trying to prove that this whole internet game worked. I remember the first time I was sitting in college in a class and for this particular class, it was Quantitative Marketing Research. That was the name of the course. And we went through and we had a live client, and it was actually Paul Mitchell.

It was a Paul Mitchell school that was nearby. And what they were having us do was we would go collect a whole bunch of survey data and we were going to try and consult Paul Mitchell on what they should do with this actual real life scenario in business. And it was really really interesting.

Well the assignment was for us to go talk to 10 people each as a class, then collectively we have a whole bunch of, we have a lot of data to work from. Well, sitting there with one of my buddies, we were like, "I do not want to go ask people, even ten, "I don't wanna ask ten people how to do the survey."

And so what we did, we were like "What if we go, "and let's just actually put the survey on a Google form "and we will drive ads to it." Something very simple, but we did Facebook ads and we drove to it.

And what was interesting is we actually went and we had we collected more surveys than the rest of the class combined. And it went really really well.

Well that's how I started working for Paul Mitchell. Because Paul Mitchell came back like, "Hey, we don't have to do any of this internet stuff, "professors, like college teachers, do you guys "know how to do this stuff?" And they were like, "No, but these two psychos over here "seem to be doing something crazy, talk to them."

And we got a handoff from the professors and we started building funnels, we didn't know they were funnels.We were building sites, in WordPress, we were driving traffic, and it was really really interesting how that happened.

Well, right before all of that happened, I was like "Does this internet game even work? "Is it all a scam?" And so what I did was I started studying a lot of, if you guys know, High Traffic Academy from Vick Strizheus, I'm sorry I'm probably butchering your name man, Vick.

Anyway, I started studying that and I started learning, "What if I was to just put a squeeze page in front "of a clickbank product and drive traffic to it? "Oh my gosh, let's try that." It seemed so simple.

And I looked at my internet marketing teacher, and I said, "I don't want to come back." It was like the first or second day of that class. And I said, "I don't want to come back." And I drew a funnel, I didn't know that's what I was drawing, but I drew a funnel. I drew a funnel, and I drew an email follow up sequence, and I drew, and I said, "I want to go build this." And shockingly he looked at me and he goes, "Okay." And he left, he said, "You don't need to come back "the rest of the semester, but just give me some "kind of cool deliverable at the end of the semester." So I was like, "Cool."

So me, and this other guy, we went and we started, we started, trying to make and literally we held class everyday just trying to make as much money online as possible. That's what our task was. Today, let's make as much money as we physically can on the internet.

And so one of the very first products we did, was what I was just saying. We went and grabbed the squeeze page, it was a template software, we didn't know what we were doing. And we grabbed the template and we just changed the headlines and we grabbed a video from YouTube of someone else talking about that product, and then we put our affiliate link at the bottom.

When they clicked submit, the page collected their email and it redirected over to the Clickbank page, and I remember that night we put, it was a ton of money at that time, we put $50 in in ads, and we woke up the next morning, and I was anxious... this was like the 100th business I had tried. You know what I mean.

I opened up my computer and I was like, "Crap, "there's cash in here, what?" And I called my buddy real fast and we put $50 in, we got $50 back out, and we got 17 people on our list.

And one person was the buyer and bought the up sale and we liquidated. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is crazy. "That sucks we only made 50 bucks."

And at the time, I didn't understand how cool a deal that was. On our very, that's the very very first real funnel that I ever built. And we liquidated because 17 people on the list, and I thought it was a failure because we didn't make any money. How stupid is that. I should have kept it going, would of got a massive list quickly with that. Anyway, lessons learned. And we kept doing stuff like that.

I started in the affiliate area, as far as the internet business goes, I started here. This is actually where I started. Like, I'm not joking, a few weeks later that's when we start doing these cool things and we start getting involved with Paul Mitchell. And I start building these, we start building these things, and at that time, my buddy graduated, and I was like, "There's something to, what's this funnel thing. "There's something about this funnel game. "What's with this funnel game thing?"

And I went and I decided that I would start studying the funnel game more. I was like, "Who is this Russell Brunson guy, he looks like he's 13." Alright, what? And I was like, "Who is this guy?"

And I started deep diving guys, I mean I obsessed, I still do, right hardcore on what he was teaching, I was like, "Yeah, that's totally how it works. "Yeah, he's right, it doesn't work that way. "Whoa, look at that." And I started learning all these lessons.

I took “Dot Com Secrets X”, and I filled an entire notebook, page by page, you know those Steno notebooks with the lines, the graph notebooks. I filled it from front to back from notes just from that one course.

I mean, it took me three months to go through that one course. because I played it for 15 seconds, and then I stopped and I thought about it and I wrote down what I had just learned. And then I would press play, and guys I did that for a year.

And when I say I hid in the box office seats in campus, I did. And that's what I was doing for a year and a half, was studying and learning, and I started applying and doing all those little things

And I got to a place here where I was like, "I'm gonna start proving that I know this stuff." And I started going out and I wrote down, I started building all these funnels, and I did it with a lot of startup companies for a while.

And the problem with startups was there business wasn't proven out and if the funnel didn't work they thought it was my fault, and I was like "No, you don't have like a product yet. "You don't have a business. "I have to train you on all this stuff before you even accept me."

Anyway, startups were really really hard to work with for many reasons. Then I was like, "Ah man, I should "change who I'm actually pitching." I was like, "Oh sweet, I'm gonna go for successful people "who already have a list, who already have a successful "product, who have testimonials, with a mid-range product."

And I shotgun blasted out this invite to tons of people and I said, "Hey, I know you don't know what a funnel is, I will build one for free "just to show you that it works. "If it works, let's talk about me getting paid. "If it doesn't work, no harm no foul, I'll walk."

And I had several people bite, like alright, bring it on. And I went and I kind of, I started building funnels for several different people. I kind of went Agency, it was service style. And this is really where I started making actual real money, on my own, in college, ever.

First was, I started doing a whole bunch of affiliate stuff. But number two though, I went over, I actually, oh you can barely see that , okay cool. Anyway, number two though I started doing a whole bunch of service stuff and just putting my name out there, being like, "Look, I understand how this works now. "Am I perfect? "No, I'm not. "But let me just learn under your business wing, right, "let me go build this funnel and I'll keep getting better "and if it's working then let's talk about me getting paid "Don't pay me before hand though." And that's what I did and started getting these huge success stories.

Well, around that time is when Funnel Hacking Live was coming up, and I was like, "I wanna go. I'm getting "successes for a lot of these guys yet, but still "didn't feel like enough cash to spend money "on a Funnel Hacking Life ticket." And I started trading even, building even more funnels for plane tickets, and hotel nights, and things like that.

And I was like, "Oh, what's up Russell. "Then I got hired by Russell, right?" And that's really where I started building a lot of Ecomm funnels. Right, some of the biggest projects we were doing together were like, Fiber Fix, and a lot of products for Marcus Lemonis, for that TV show, The Profit, on CNBC. It was a lot of Ecomm style funnels that was going on there.

And it went really really well, it was awesome. I mean, we were blowing these guys up, sometimes too fast and they'd be like, "Turn it off, you're going "to bankrupt us." And I was like, "Oh my gosh," that's the model for Ecomm does really really well.

Whenever Russell's like "Dude, we need an Ecomm funnel, kinda like this funnel this funnel, this backend versus that back." I was like, "Sweet, I got it," and I'd go build it real fast. So I got really good at that model.

However, I've always known that this is kind of one of the Holy Grails. Info products are, I wanna go through this real fast, and then I want to show you something and this is the only reason why, but info products, it's one of, it's one of the hard categories to get into, but it's also one of the Holy Grails.

If you look at what Dan Henry did, well, it's episode, it's one of the earlier episodes of Sales Funnel Radio, but I interviewed when he had only made 200 grand with his current offer, that he'd blow up with.

His Facebook ads for entrepreneurs He'd only done like barely $200,000 at that time. And he was talking about it and if you have listened to that episode, what he was saying, was for his info product, he spent a solid like five, six months taking a beta group through and seeing what they were doing and how they were reacting to what he was teaching.

Okay, I told you to build the Facebook ad this way, but turns out you all thought I meant this. Okay, let's clarify. Then okay, now do this step. Oh man, you're all screwed up here, let's do it right. And he was spot checking and he was making a system.

And he spent a lot of time proving out his info product before he ever sold it. I've done the exact same thing with mine.

Alex and Leila Hormozi, at Funnel Hacking Live, this last one, they were talking about for a full year, before they ever, they just got, they just made 10 million dollars since last April. But they didn't just start doing that.

For a full year before they ever started really scaling and selling hard, for a full year, they were living in crazy areas, doing crazy things, just so they could prove the process that they were going to bring people though.

That is really one of the gateways, it's one of the key gates of getting really good and awesome at Info. Your crap's gotta be amazing. It's gotta get results for people. And the best way to do it is to just spend a lot of time with your prospective customers. With people who represent your prospective customers. And make them successful, make them successful, and get, and when you do, it's in my mind, it's one of the Holy Grails.

I love selling info products, okay. I love it. And here's why, let's walk through this now real quick.

Here's a good reason why, just so you know, that's been kind of my journey I've gone through it, I kind of did a little more Ecomm stuff then I jumped over here to the Info side where I will reside as long as I can. I absolutely love it, and it's super cool. It takes a little finesse to get into a lot of times.

I'm not saying you can't go interview a bunch of people and toss out that interview series as an info product. You could totally do that. Now, I'm not saying you can't, there's a lot of ways to create an info product really quickly. But I'm saying, like you as a brand, you as an educator, you as an idea and a vehicle that has potential for two commas, like info wise, it's gotta be really good. It's gotta be really good, okay. So let's walk through this real quick here.

With Ecomm, let's say over here on this side, we're going to go through Ecomm and for each one of these we're going to look at the profit margin potential.

Again, massive stereotypes... I understand that there are people out there who have figured out how to game the system, but they are not typical.

I'm talking typical, stereotypical, kind of result in each one of these categories. How much profit, how much margin potential is there? How much money for you after all the expenses are done? How much earning potential is there for you, typically, in that category and how much time does it take to actually do the business, actually fulfill on the thing that you're selling? I'm gonna walkthrough really fast.

This is why I've chosen what I have and I've been methodical about it. I'm going to say that #1 equals a little, #2 equals kind of medium, and then #3 equals a lot.

Let's go with Ecomm. And I know that some of you guys want to reach out to me, and kind of fight me on these things. I understand. I'm talking just straight atypical general person that goes through this think, okay.

What is the earning, at the very end of the day, the profit potential of the Ecomm category? What is it? It's not, it's not actually that high.

A lot of people get in two comma clubs in Ecomm, but they don't actually keep that much money, they actually don't have that much cash to their name themselves.

I understand the coolness of the award, and you certainly can scream to it real fast by doing something like Ecomm really quickly. But there's not typically that much profit margin inside of Ecomm. Especially when people don't do my freaking offer creation strategy in this.

If they do, they can make a lot of cash. It's like, I don't know why, a lot of Ecomm people don't believe me. Like even though that's what we do, and it works. Anyway, but the actual earning potential, actual profit margin on the actual business itself, is a little bit tiny. I'm gonna say, we'll say a two here. A one to a two. It's kind of a little, especially if you're doing something like drop shipping, that's obviously a one.

If you own the product, you're going to get more of a 2. But let's talk about time to fulfill. Even if you got a shipping fulfillment house doing your work for you, or if it's in house, you're typically sourcing products like crazy. You're spending a lot of time finding the next product, testing the next thing. I'm not saying you gotta sell the Ecomm product for a couple bucks like a lot of Ecomm people do. You can sell really really expensive, but you're usually in a game of trying to figure out the next thing to go sell really really quickly.

Info, the way I write info, is a little bit different, ok? I'm gonna say a 2, because you can spend a butt load of time actually on the phone. Right, that's one of the things that Trey Lewellen was having a hard time with, with his, which you can't blame him, with his credit card knife. The dude's the man, absolutely amazing. Spent a lot of time though fulfilling, and it's easy to run into troubles that way.

Ecomm, I was like Ecomm's cool but like, ah man, I'm about that ROI. How can I get the highest leverage, ok? Which in Ecomm comes in later.

Remember this, ok? I'm going to come back to this and show you how I use this now. But you sell info. Wait, do I?

Agency's freaking awesome too, there's a lot of cash that usually comes in the business. The thing that I don't like about Agency is when you get paid, is when the work starts. I don't like that. It's where I proved that I knew what I was doing. It's services, services/Agency. It's where I, it's a really fast way as well. I love the path that I personally took. I learned how to sell other people's products, which is awesome, we'll get there in a second.

But then I went over to the service and Agency side and it was really cool because you get paid a lot of cash but you're also, even if you have an amazing team Agency wise, you're still managing the team, you're still closing deals typically. I'm not saying you're, anyway, there are exceptions to the rule, but usually, there's a lot of time to fulfill on Agency model.

After the sale is made, is usually, that's when it starts; I'm going to say a three and then a two here.

Let's talk here about affiliate. Now typically with affiliates, the profit margin, usually small, right? You got the crazies out there like Russell Brunson giving 40% every single month of his check to you for getting an affiliate person it. That's amazing, that's incredible. Usually not the case though. So I'm going to say a one. But what's interesting, but actually 1.5, let's say 1.5. Depending on the product, depending on the affiliate, there's a lot of variables with every one of these categories and I totally get that. But just generally, usually 1, 1.5.

How much time does it take for you to fulfill after the sales made. No time, no time at all. Oh my gosh, great place to go. And this is actually how I built my entire company and business without ever spending a dollar of my own. I've never spent a dollar of my own, I don't think so, in my own business. And it's because I started with affiliates.

That generated cash so I could do cool things like hire VAs in service/Agency and that brought in even more cash, and I was like, "Well this is awesome, but I want to free "up my time a little bit." Let's jump over to info, and that's what I went in to next.

Let's talk about info. What's the earning/profit margin potential on an info product? Guys, my margins right now on my main product is like 94%. Obviously there's a business margin, but I'm saying the actual product margin is like 94%, it's ridiculous. It's like no cost to fulfill on it at all. I think it's actually like 98.8. It's really, it's ridiculous. Three, definitely a three.

Time to fulfill, like virtually nothing. The cost of an email with access to a members area or something like that. Now, there's a caveat to this. If I go through and there's an info product, people know, there's this inherent understanding that the info product is already made. It's like the subconscious know, the little thing that they know that it's not going to take you anything to fulfill on that. Because of that, the perceived value, the perceived value, so it's a lot of value to me, but the perceived value of info, is usually kind of low. It is, right.

Let's take Ecomm for example, though. Ecomm something physical, something I'm gonna get in the mail. I got these stupid crows that are flying all over the place around the office and they just, they're messing with me, they'll like, so anyways, I've got a BB gun coming, you can guess what's happening, right, but the perceived value, perceived value of an Ecomm product is really high.

Perfect example, go think about Amazon. There's not sales copy on Amazon, there's like bullet point descriptions, this is what it is. Bam, here's the button, put it in your order and just go get it. The perceived value, perceived value, of Ecomm is high, but the value to the entrepreneur is typically a little lower. So what I do is I combine them.

In my offers with info, the reason why info does so well for me now, is yes, you get the info thing, but I also ship a lot of amazing, incredible things to the person when they purchase. I combine info with Ecomm and it's one of the reasons why my stuff does so well and one of the reasons why the perceived value of my offers is so high, cause the value is high.

They're getting something in the mail, they're getting, it's not just like something, they're crazy cool things, they're getting those and they're getting access to all this crazy stuff: funnel builds, incredible things. Things that people pay a lot of money for me to go do normally. They're getting those things in there and that's the reason why I chose and landed on info, and I will stay there, stay there, stay there.

The category that I want to move into eventually though is software. I think I don't know what it's going to be, but it's because it's almost like the benefits of Ecomm, high perceived value, software, right, software is high perceived value. With really high margins on the product itself, the business margin on software is a little bit hard, because you have a lot of support usually, that's a higher.

But the time to fulfill is like virtually nothing which means the entrepreneurs can spend, as long as they get great support, usually in software the entrepreneurs can spend little time doing any kind of fulfillment, instead they do a lot of time selling.

Russell stays in the act of selling like, 24/7. He can do that because of the software game, because he's in the info game, because he combines a lot of Ecomm inside of it. Does that make sense?

So he tosses off a lot of the benefits to his affiliates by giving them the ability, "Hey look, you don't have to fulfill anything, "I ain't going to pay you for it." Sweet. And he teaches a lot of people, look, if you need cash and a lot of it pretty quick, go service/Agency style.

You'll get a lot of cash quickly but eventually that's why I landed in what I do, and that's why I stay in info, and I will always stay info. I love it. The time to fulfill is tiny, which lets me stay in the zone, where I get to create more things for the same product. Toss in more cool things. Make the value of the offer even bigger. Create amazing things for people, and the profit margins are big enough that it allows me to do that.

I'm not having to sell thousands of little knick knacks. And take away a thousand dollars to go put that in something else from the source of knick knacks, that's really really rough in Ecomm.

But a thousand dollars, coming from the source of an info product? It's really really easy, it's not that crazy hard, at all. SO this is why I do what I do. This is the reason that I've structured it the way I have. So I hope that helps.

If you guys are thinking through how to actually sell the stuff that you are, and what you're trying to get into. I started as an affiliate and it's a great way to go.

And frankly, when I started Sales Funnel Radio, I kept this thing going by giving away share funnels. And now I've got a bunch of people on ClickFunnels accounts.

At the beginning when I was working at ClickFunnels, at a 9-5 job, I had this extra cash that was coming in, and because of that, while I was doing my 9-5, which was way more than that but while I was working over there, during the same day, there would be doing VAs in different places that were getting projects and cool things done for me. Not from my own pocket, because I was doing affiliate stuff like crazy. Really easy to fulfill, got some cash from it.

Still to this day, it's significant. I think we've passed, we're well passed thirty grand in affiliate commissions in the last like year-and-a-half, I mean that's good. It's been the cash that I've needed to do all the stuff on the side and prep the groundwork so I could launch into the info space.

So anyway, I just hope that that helps. It helps you guys work through and think through where you're heading.

If you're like "I'm trying to do info." Okay, does anyone know who you are? Have you proved out the process yet? Can you, if someone actually follows the process, can you virtually guarantee that people are going to be successful at it. If you can't, it can be to sell that at scale.

If someone follows my process, they get results, I know they do. I have the best product in the category I'm selling in in the entire market, and I know I do, and I'm fine with that, and I'm fine saying that because I know it's true.

Because that's what happens, when people do it, they get results. It's happening life, like right now. It took me like two years, honestly, to really get to a spot where my info product could do that for people, so if you're knowing that, if you're like, "I want to do info," Awesome. Or if you're like, "I want to stick in Ecomm." That's great, that's great. Just figure out the little tricks to make the margins huge and make that two into a three. That's super super cool.

Just be cognizant of what that industry is typically like and the cost associated with that. Like supplements, supplements takes a lot of cash to sell someone into the supplements.

Continuity, and software, take a lot of cash to sell. Continuity is expensive to sell. So don't sell continuity outright. Attach it to other things. Funnel Hacks, like Russel does. Isn't it amazing. When you do it that way, oh my gosh, so much easier.

Same thing with supplements over here, supplements cost a lot of cash to drop in, but if you have an info product that you're coupling it with, they buy the info product, that's what's self-liquidating, your ad cross and now in the backend go toss them to your supplements.

Awesome, or your Ecomm, or whatever. Does that make sense? This is one of the reasons I've structured the way I have - I'm very methodical about it. It's turned out really really well.

So I hope that it's helpful to you?

If you're stuck or you're like, "Oh gosh, I don't know "how this is going to work? I don't know if this is going "to be successful here or there?" Man, just go figure out how you can get cash now. And some of the easiest places to do it, Affiliate. Probably next, probably the Agency. I know a lot of Ecomm people will probably fight me on that and that's fine, that's totally fine. We all have our own opinions and that's perfect.

The model I'm following and I just wanted to walk you guys through why I do what I do. And what my logic has been behind each one of them is... profit margin potential out of the gate, not tricks, not little tips. Profit margin potential out of the gate - what is it?

I'll do the little tips and tricks and stuff like that, and I do and it goes even higher, but I don't want to bank on those. That's why I didn't run into Ecomm. I almost ran into Ecomm... I just about did Ecomm, but that's the reason I didn't right out the gate.

Again, not telling you not to, but that's the reason I didn't was ‘time to fulfill.’ I was like, "Man I just want to "do revenue generating activities, but what I'm constantly managing a product for someone else. I’d collected the cash already but I can't "actually do anything with it cause my hands "are tied, my time is tied because I can't actually "go do, I have to fulfill.

I don't know if I want to marry the Agency/service model. It was a great place for me to go for quite a while honestly, to vet out and prove who I was and what I was doing and that I could do it, which the market obviously needed to see, why would they not?

I got my testimonials from there, I got, that's what launched me in to being able to work next to Russell. In fact, that's one of the first things he asked when I sat down face to face with him.

Actually before I even got there, he's like, "Have you "been building funnels?" I said, "Yeah." He's like, "What are the URLs?" Boom, blasted over like 20 URLs over to him. Look at all these funnels I've done, look at all the stats here we go, boom, and when I sat down, he was like sick, okay, cool. He didn't say sick. He was like, "Okay, cool, awesome." You've actually done this. I didn't start from ground 0. But it's because I actively was trying to prove that I could do it. So anyway, that's the path I took, hopefully it helps?

Sit back, figure out where you're trying to go and those are some of the, when you're just talking about generating cash flow, I'm not talking about change the world products, I'm talking about you making money, for you. Change your own life before you go trying to change the world. It’s way easier, do it that way.

I want to change the world and I plan to. I don't know how yet. But first I'm changing my world so that I have the ability and power to change the world afterwards.

So this is the path I took with that intent in mind and it's been working really well. And we haven't had a negative month yet and I don't think we will. Anyway, things have been going great. I really appreciate it .

Thanks for listening, please rate and review the podcast. Please share it, we'd love to have more people on. For those of you guys who are on iTunes, I do film these now, if you want to see the graph I just drew, go to my YouTube channel if you want to see - it’s just ‘Steven Larson’, that's the name of my YouTube channel.

If you're on You Tube and you're like, "Hey, I would rather just listen to these," go to iTunes. A lot of you guys on Instagram, I know these get pushed to you as well.

Bloggers, what's up. You guys can come out to any of these platforms as well. We push out now to, it's over, it's like 25 different platforms. Just know that the others exist and excited to have you guys. Thanks so much, talk to you later. Bye!

Boom, what's goin' on everyone? This is Steve Larsen and this Sales Funnel Radio.

Today we are gonna talk about how to pay for expensive things with your business.

I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels.

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

All right, guys, hey, I'm excited for this episode. This has been kind of a long time in the making. This is gonna be one of those episodes that have kinda been on my mind for a long time as something that I wanna  share with you guys and teach you something really interesting.

I wanna tell you a story, okay? We were planning Funnel Hacking Live 2017. I remember being on cloud nine, I could not even believe that I was in the planning sessions for Funnel Hacking. I was freakin' out about it, I was super excited. I was with Melanie, Dave, and Brent. It was just fun to be in the room. Russell's like, “Dude, what if we ask Tony Robbins to come?”  We're like, “Oh my gosh, that's crazy.” So they started doing some research and reaching out to his team.

Tony's team reached back out and said, it's gonna cost about this much. I am not privy to say the amount... I'm not even gonna allude to it... but I will tell you that it was a lot of cash. It was a butt ton of money. It was so cool to watch how Russell handled it…There is a lesson that I picked up... I was watching him like a hawk. I always do.

First of all he goes, “Oh my gosh”, with this face. “Huh, oh my gosh, huh, oh god, I feel sick, huh.” What was interesting was what he did next...

There was a moment where he freaked out, and that's appropriate and everyone can feel free to do that when you wanna buy something expensive. But then, he just said “Yes.”

Then he was very careful to structure the FHL event in a way that would pay for Tony. Isn't that interesting? The event literally liquidated the cost of Tony Robbins.

If you go look at any time he's ever had someone really big on - that's how he structures it. That's really fascinating.

We started doin' some pretty interesting things that were very expensive. Things like the Harmon Brothers.The Harmon Brothers, they're the ones who did the viral video...

Hopefully you guys are cool with me telling all these stories? I wanna link it back to what I'm doin' right now and hopefully you'll take something cool from this.

The Harmon Brothers, it's public knowledge, so I'm just gonna say it... they charge half a million dollars to do a video. One video! A three, four, five minute video. Half a million bucks. They're expensive, but they get results. They're really cool, so they can charge that money.

Instead of Russell going, “Gah, are you kidding? Half a million dollars?” Which was appropriate (and we all did that at first)... what he did was start figuring out a way to liquidate the cost with some kind of campaign, event, or product.

So that at the end, he is left with both the asset and with his own cash in hand. Meaning he doesn't let his own cash out, he created something else to pay for the expense. Does that make sense? This is the smarter VC funding way.

You guys know I'm pretty against things like VC funding, but it's because of this very principle right here.

Think about a free plus shipping book funnel. A free plus shipping book funnel or even a webinar funnel... A lot of times in a webinar funnel there’s a self-liquidating offer before somebody even gets to the webinar.

There’s a product to purchase even before someone gets to the webinar - that way, an average of 10%  - 15% purchase the product, then it liquidates most of the ad cost. So everyone who comes and buys during the main product during webinar is actually pure profit. Does that make sense?

That's how it works in a funnel, and the same principle can apply your business and the way you run it. This is the principle that I’ve been  applying to my business.

I told you guys about the story at this last Funnel Hacking Live, someone was like, “oh man, maybe I can get a discount on the 2 Comma Club X Program. Maybe I can split it with a few other people!” and I was like, “No, wrong question!’  Questions invite revelation...  So you need to change the question.

Instead of asking “How do I get a discount?” ask the question: “How can I afford the most expensive things in life?”

Solve that problem, not the question: “How can I get a discount?” You'll solve either question... but most people don't ask questions with intent.

So what I said to him was: “Look, go figure out how to pay for the most impressive, most expensive things in life, and at the end of it, you'll be left with the thing that you wanted that's very expensive, and you'll be left with a paying asset.”

If  you just go out and say: “Oh man, I guess maybe we'll have to get someone cheaper” or “I guess we have to take this cheaper option over here.” What ends up happening is you get a much cheaper experience and there's no asset!

Usually you end up paying out of pocket. Does that make sense?

So start thinking about how to liquidate costs... this is something most entrepreneurs end up getting pretty good at as they go down the road.

I would watch Russell, and it's  an active theme. He goes and figures out what he wants to do and then figures out what he can create to pay for it.

And so I started applying this strategy too.

About two years ago I launched a funnel explicitly to do this. What eventually started happening was I started making more money off that funnel than I was getting paid at my job.

In essence, I replaced my income with this funnel that was running on the side while I was working at Clickfunnels. Isn't that interesting? I'm always looking for some kind of asset to do that.

When I finally left ClickFunnels, I didn't take a paycheck from my business for almost three months. We were living on savings through March. It wasn't until April that I got paid. It was fine - we had cash, it was just I wanted to make sure the funnel was awesome. I wanted to make sure the business had enough cash flow. So I was like, well, “How do I remove the cost of me?”

I launched my funnel, I got it off the ground. Things are doin' awesome. It did a lot of money.

Grant Cardone says “Cash is King.” But in reality CASH FLOW is king. Cash flow is king. Cash is NOT king, Cash Flow is King.

If you think through your business and you think about how much do you pay yourself right now?  Or do you have a business you're actually paying yourself from? I make it a consistent amount so I can count on it. And then I ask the question, “How can I replace that cost?”

I pay myself eight grand a month before taxes, before costs - and I have people that work for me, I have a team, then I need to liquidate those costs.

At the beginning I asked: “How do I remove eight grand a month?” Boom, I'm gonna start a coaching program. I went and launched the coaching program and that removed the cost of me taking money from my main product. Does that make sense?

All I want  is for my main product to scream it to a million bucks. Structurally, the way that I'm doing this is that instead of me getting paid out of the profits from my main product, I take money from this entirely separate thing over here - from coaching or something else.

Then the product can just roll on itself. We can spend a crap ton of money on ads and get a lot of people in there fast. Is this making sense so far? This is how I've structured it from a money standpoint. From a cash flow standpoint I can pay for expensive things like my content team this way.

In the last episode I talked about my content team which is 26 grand a month in hard costs before I even think about ad spend. “26 grand, oh my gosh,”  right?  

Back in the day, I made 18 grand during my first year of marriage... only $18,000.  And it was loans - so I wasn't even making it! We were living on students loans, guys.  

So I’ve gone from $18,000 my first year of marriage to 26 grand a month on hard costs that are not direct cash flowing things! It blows me up... that's a lot of money!  $26,000 a month on the team as an ongoing cost.

So I was like: “Okay, okay, how do I remove that cost from my main product?” My main product could pay that cost... but I don't want it to. So what I did is I upped my coaching. I increased my coaching availability. I increased my consulting.

A lot of people have reached out lately and asked: “Will you fly out for a day? Just come in and work through our offers with us, work through our funnels with us. We're not asking you to build 'em. We just want you to come double-check, look over the top of it...  How much is that?”

I'm like, “Sweet, well, 10 grand a day... Fly me out and we'll do that... I'll dive deeply through your stuff with you. I'll teach you. I'll show you what to do and how to put it together. I’ll critique and tweak, or build it straight from the ground up and design your marketing with you.”

So that's what I've been doing. I’ve been going through and figuring out different opportunities to remove the cost of the team, my salary, the hard costs that I have. I want to completely remove them and liquidate them from my main product.

With my main product, we've kept the ads tiny because I've been testing stuff.  As of yesterday... I'm actually really excited, it’s the first full day that our self-liquidating offer was up on the webinar. It's doin' well.

It has an 8% purchase rate right now, which is okay... I'll keep tweakin' it and making it better and better. But it's a good starting place, right? It tells me at least that there's need for it. That it’s actually working…

I'm liquidating my ad costs, so now everything in that webinar purchasing process is pure profit.

The whole principle of this entire episode, what I'm trying to say (and I know I've said a lot of things, and hopefully you've followed it), is that you need to find a way to liquidate ‘your costs’ from your main product so that you can keep enough cash flow to scale your product fast.

I was talkin' to somebody and they're like, “I'm gonna go get off the ground here, I'm just gonna quit my job immediately.” And I was like, “Duh, don't do that.”

I had active cash flowing funnels... I had active cash coming in from another source before I ever did that. We had savings and security - you know what I mean? The waters were well tested.

I'm a risk taker, but I'm a calculated risk taker. It took a lot of time to actually put that stuff together and get things rockin' off the ground.

I’ve got an SLO in my funnel. It’s liquidating the ad costs. Awesome! If it's not always break even at least it's always like nothin' now. So when it's all said and done, the cost is really, really tiny to acquire a paying customer.

Then the business side, I'm like, “Sweet, how do I remove myself from the books of that product specifically?” I don't wanna get paid from the profits of that product. So I remove myself from the books with coaching consulting and speaking.

I'm speaking in loads of different places recently. It's been a ton of fun and I’m liquidating all the costs of the business which means I can get a sweet content team together and publish way more.

I’ve liquidated the cost of my content team, my salary, the people workin' for me without taking any money out of my business.

Don’t ask, “Uh, how do I get a discount on stuff?” It's a bad question! You'll answer it… You just don't want to answer that question. It's the wrong question.

So the next thing I want is a super ninja support team.  If you guys didn't listen to my deep dive on webinars... it's in two parts…  it's a few episodes ago. It's probably 10 episodes ago... It's worth listening to.

One of the things that I've been seeing other guys do on webinars is have live support. So now I want to toss in support on my automated webinars too...  This represents a new cost coming in.

Watch how I'm gonna handle it. We already have awesome support, but I want 24/7 support. I want three people in eight hour shifts. Sheesh. A good support person, you can typically get good ones, maybe I won't say numbers, but it's not gonna be cheap. So how do I replace that cost?

So I thought, okay, what if I do this? If my webinar is what the main revenue generator is right now, it's like the big product that I'm pushin' out the door… how do I make it so that it further replaces the support person cost?

I wanna beef up support and I wanna get a full-time assistant. Those are the two positions that I'm looking at right now. So how do I remove that cost and not bankrupt the company, which we're not close to at all, but like, right? How do I make it so that I don't have a negative month?

I don't wanna have my first negative month - I wanna keep goin' up. How do I do that? So this is what I'm thinkin'... Follow me on this…

On the broadcast page for my webinars, the replay pages, right underneath, I have a cool chat box, but now I wanna have live support on the page while they’re watching.

If someone's has a question, who's gonna fulfill those support tickets? Support. Who's gonna fulfill that live chat when they're on the webinar? Support.

A lot of people just have a last question or two before they actually purchase something from you. If they don't get it answered they won't buy it. It's that important to them, even if, in hindsight, it's a really small question…

This is what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna add in a live chat box element - so  that when they click it opens up Facebook Messenger right there. Then they can chat with one of my three support people tight there on their profile.

If a support person closes that person, number one, it brings in more cash... Number two, I'll give that support person some affiliate commission. That way they’re motivated to close people when they do write in. Isn't this interesting?

If support answer a few extra questions and bring in the cash, it will probably liquidate the cost of my support team. Will it actually make extra cash? Probably not, but it will probably remove the cost of the support person. Does that make sense?

Anyways, that's what I'm doin'. Maybe this is a little bit too crazy for me to go into on a actual podcast episode... but that's what I've been doin' lately, which is kinda interesting.

What if the question is not: “How do I do this?”... but: “Who knows how to do this?” Go listen to that podcast episode from Russell if you haven't…

Maybe the question is not, for example:“How do I build a funnel?” … but “Who knows how to build a funnel?”

If you don't know how to build funnels, you could go learn... or you could find someone who already knows how to do it. Go find the right “who” with the know how and your speed increases. And that's I've been focusing on lately.

Going from six to seven figures is not a matter of more hours in the day spent in the office, it is a matter of leverage. And so that's what I've been figuring out.

I've been getting this team, and I've been putting people together. I'm getting these support people, and it's been awesome, you guys. All of its been awesome. I've been able to liquidate the cost of my team through the coaching and other stuff.

Next episode, stay tuned, I wanna show you the other way that I'm gonna replace them again with more revenue. I'm very, very excited to go through and share that thing with you.

Anyways, I'm excited. Hopefully this episode made sense to you? It's just a recap. I know I kind of went deep with all this stuff…

Just the same as I would create an SLO or some kind of self-liquidating offer that pays for ads in a funnel… I’m doing the exact same thing in my business now.

I've removed “me” completely from the cost of my main funnel profits. I've removed my team completely from my main funnel profits. The more people I put in, instead of figuring out: “Can the business handle it?” (The answer's yes, but I don't wanna ever go negative on my revenue or my cash flow)... Instead, I ask: “How can I remove that cost from my business?”

I'm getting a few more support people and I'm just plugging them into the closing process. So I'm getting support people, a little bit more aggressive support people... People who know how to close a little bit.

Support people who know just even the smallest amount of closing techniques, so they can come in and answer and close people. People who can answer support questions and support tickets when they come in, but who can answer any kind of closing questions too.

That's kinda the thing I wanna go build team-wise. I wanna to put that together. I'm really, really pumped about it. I hope it makes sense.

What's funny is that when you start asking and answering these sort of  question, your speed's gonna increase like crazy.

I've never met anyone who made a ton of money just on their own. It always takes a team. Everyone benefits as the entrepreneur and the business move together.

So just start answering these questions: “How do I attract the right ‘who’?” - “How do I liquidate the cost of the right ‘who’?”

Russell was a  room with a lot of brilliant people... I think it was at the Genius Network, but I'm not sure. Anyway, someone said:

“Don't figure out how do I do this, how do I do that.. That route takes you forever... Yes, you'll become a renaissance man - which means you're really gettin' good at nothing.”

Instead of asking, “How do I do this?, ask, Who knows how to do this?”

I was on a coaching call, I'll end it with this…

I was on a coaching call with another amazing mentor of mine and he was telling me, the one question that I should start learning how to answer is: “How do I hire people that I can't afford?” And if I can answer that question, everything blows up.

He asked me to start thinking about that probably about six weeks, eight weeks ago, and I've been answering that question. It's the reason why my team and my business is accelerating is because I have learned how to hire people and bring people in that I can't afford.

How do I do it? I do it by creating a liquidating asset that covers that cost.

I still have one funnel. I still have one thing that I'm doing, that's it. My focus is there, is absolute. However, on the cost of the actual business itself, to start really leveraging the speed of the team, I need to go create something else that pulls in and liquidates the cost of that person.

That's the question I wanna pose to you: “How can you hire people that you can't afford?” And when you start doing that, oh my gosh, it's crazy. There's so much expertise that will get brought into your company and your business, it's ridiculous.

I don't even know all the stuff that my team do for me - it’s insane. It's really cool. Problems get solved that I didn't even know existed. And they get solved in an expert way rather than a just good enough way.

All right guys, hopefully this was helpful to you, and I will see you on the next episode.

Please get a chance to rate and subscribe and review this podcast. And please share it.

I would love to be able to share my message with people who are kinda just starting out and haven't quite made it yet. Or people who have made cash, and they're trying to figure out how to scale. That's where my expertise is - in offer creation and the storytelling.

Anyways guys, thanks so much. Have a good one, and I'll see you in the next episode. Bye-bye.

Hey, thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Got a question you want answered live on the show? Head over to salesfunnelradio.com and ask your question now.

- Boom, what's going on everyone. This is Steve Larsen, and this is Sales Funnel Radio.

Today, we’re gonna talk about my content machine and how I'm pulling it off.

I've spent the last four years learning form the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business, using only today's best internet sales funnels.

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio. What's up guys?

Hey, I am excited to share this with you. You know when I first started listening to gurus on the internet, when I first started consuming their content, when I first started going through and reading it - I was grateful for the content. But... I don't know if you're like me?... I didn’t ever want to do any kind of publishing ever, ever.

I remember when I first went to my first Funnel Hacking Live. It was 2016. I remember this very clearly... I think I might have shared this with you before....

I was biking around the bay at San Diego because what cash we had, I didn't want to spend on a cab. So I was biking around on a hired bike and I remember thinking to myself, “I will do whatever Russell tells me to do, except I will not publish.” That was my actual thought.

Fast forward a week, and I'm working next to Russell Brunson, and this is what I see him doing. He's sitting there and he's on camera going, “What's up guys, this is Russell Brunson!” Then he's over on his podcast, “What's up guys, this is Russell Brunson!”  And then he's over on his blog... “What's up guys, this is Russell Brunson.” And I was like, there's something to this. This is really interesting.

Funnily enough, on the very first day at Funnel Hacking Live, he said, “Everyone needs to start publishing.” And I was like, “there's no way I'm not gonna do it. I will build the funnels. I'll do whatever you want me to do Russell. My life's already changed. Thank you so much. I appreciate that. But I will never, ever, Mr. Russell Brunson, ever be one of those podcasters.” And that was my thought.

Well, “What's up, how you doing?” I'm podcasting!

We've crossed over 160,000 downloads between the two shows that I have - which is awesome. It's gone really, really well.

I remember after watching Russell publish…. We didn't do anything unless there was a camera around a lot of times, right. We’d go grab a camera...

One day it was like 4:00 a.m. and he voxed me; he goes, “Dude, I got this sick idea man - swing down to the office as soon as you can. I'm really, really pumped about this. I'm gonna make you famous.” I was like, what does that mean? And then he goes, “Dude, we're gonna start a reality TV show man!” And that's when we started Funnel Hacker TV.

So we had a visual show... and then a podcast so people could listen... then there were blogs so people could read. Dominating everywhere! I mean, to be completely honest with you, can you consume all of the content that ClickFunnels puts out? No, nobody can. But that's not the point. He's trying to dominate the conversation.

I remember about six weeks into working at CF,  I decided to get a handle on this whole content creation thing. There was no way to do this without actually publishing.

I know I'm gonna suck at first. Like I'm gonna be terrible. I'm gonna be awful. And I was awful. I was super bad. I really was not good. If you guys go listen to the first few episodes of Sales Funnel Radio - the content is good. What I'm talking about is great. But the delivery is terrible. I knew that. And I came to grips with the fact. I just needed to gut it out a little bit -  just start moving forward.

When I first started publishing, I was the only person in my content team.

I was watching a lot of  major entrepreneurs, and they were never the only one doing the content. They had a content team.

I was like, “Oh my gosh, I'm not gonna be able to afford something like that… and how do you even put a team like that together.”

The whole point of this episode is to show with you guys the journey through my content team - because even though I have a team now - it didn’t start that way.

When I started, I was just using Libsyn. That's Liberated Syndication dot com. Libsyn.com. It's L-I-B-S-Y-N dot com. It's amazing, okay. It was like five bucks a month for me to start.

And what it allowed me to do was... I wanted to be able to push out on iTunes obviously.... But I knew that a lot of people want to read, but I didn't want to write a blog.

I like writing about this kind of stuff. But I'm not gonna take the time to write a blog for every podcast episode.

So what I did was rip the audio and get it transcribed at Rev.com. Then I took that transcription, and it became the blog post. So now I have an blog for every episode. That's all I did. I just took the transcription, I put it on WordPress, and pressed go.

I believe in using tools for the intent they were created. ClickFunnels is not meant to be a blogging platform. So I don't blog on it.

I use WordPress because WordPress was built to be a blogging platform.

Some people do some weird things with WordPress and turn it into a sales platform. But it's not a sales funnel. So I don't use WordPress to sell things. I use WordPress to publish things. Does that make sense?

You could make a lot of things turn into a lot of other things with weird connections and stuff. I just don't.

It's kind of like going to a sushi place and  ordering a hamburger. I'm sure they could make it for you, but that's not their thing. You know what I mean?

I look at software the same way. Whatever the software was intended to do, that's what I use it for. And that's why I still use several different platforms and I'll tie them together.

ClickFunnels is built to sell crap. So I use it to sell my crap.

When I first started out, it was just me; it  took me about two hours per episode to get it out of the door. I would wake up at about 5:00 a.m -  I'd be at ClickFunnel's HQ at about 6:00 a.m - and I would take Russell's microphone 'cause I didn't have money to go get a microphone at that  time… I would unplug the microphone from his computer and I'd go over and plug it into mine. Then I'd record the episode 'cause I knew his mic was good.

And I was like, well crap. I gotta figure out how to use Adobe Audition, or some kind of software for editing, or something like that. I went through and I created my intros. And I make all my intros and outros by the way. I really like doing it.

I've been a sound junky and editor since I was like 12. And I would make a lot of music on a lot of different platforms. I spent a lot of Saturdays just making music. It was a bunch of fun. So I did my own sound editing. I would go to Fiverr and have somebody do a voiceover.

The way I wrote my intro, just so you guys know, is I went and I actually listened to all the top rated podcasts in the business category on iTunes.

I listened to all their intros, and transcribed them. I found all the similarities and grabbed some of those - and then I threw a few other things in as well.

Then I went to premiumbeat.com and downloaded a cool song I liked. Had a voiceover guy from Fiverr just say it. And then I just put 'em together. That's how I made the original Sales Funnel Radio intro and outro.  Guys I freakin' bootstrapped, okay. That's the whole point.

Before I was at ClickFunnels, I started putting together videos - I didn't have video editing software. So I thought, who does? I was like, ahh libraries. So I did all my video editing in libraries for like a year before working at ClickFunnels. I didn’t have a camera. So I went back to libraries and I would rent their cameras.

Entrepreneurs would hire me to get on planes film their events, and film them doing sales videos. Then I'd go back and edit them in libraries, and give the camera back that I didn't own.

I’d take those videos and put them up on the funnels that I was building, which I was just hacking from what Russell and other successful people were doing. The whole way is bootstrapping. All of it's been bootstrapping.  And it's been super fun.

My content has been no different. I bootstrapped it.  I didn't have a mic, so I just borrowed Russell’s really early in the morning. That's like how I did the first 50 episodes of Sales Funnel Radio. I got to CF HQ way before everyone else - so I was completely alone in the office - and grab Russell's mic.  My job required that I had the Adobe Suite - so I’d use Adobe Audition (because it came with it) to do all my sound editing on.

I didn't know which settings to use. So I went to YouTube and I googled, podcast sound editing. I didn't know what they meant. I have no idea what all those letters mean on the sound editing stuff. I just took them and pasted them in... and it's one of the reasons that my podcast sounds so good today. So many of you have complimented me on that. I don't know what the settings mean,  I just know it does really awesome stuff when I push the button and apply those settings.

I have literally bootstrapped the entire way. The obstacle is the way. Just follow  your questions - and the answer's on the other side usually.

So for a while, I was the producer, and the recorder, the attractive character, and the content creator. For  the first 40 episodes, it took me about two hours per episode to take the transcription, put it into WordPress, and make it look amazing.

Then I'd go in Libsyn and press the publish button - and blast out to 16 different platforms. Boosh!

I hate Twitter. I don't know why it's there. But I publish there 'cause people like it, right. I did it for a lot of different platforms. Pushed to YouTube, pushed to Facebook, pushed to the blog, pushed to iTunes, iHeartRadio, Spotify. Boosh, all over the place. Libsyn did all that. It really helped my time.

Around episode 40, I went and I hired my first VA. And it was my sister. A lot of you guys know who she is. She was in a position where she was interested in this kind of stuff.

I said look, “I'll train you how to do it all.”  I showed her exactly what I was doing, right. I would get the episode transcribed, and then I would just hand off the transcription and the episode, and she would do everything else. She put it in WordPress. She did SEO optimization on it with some cool plugins we had...

And that's what I did for quite a while from like episode 40 up until like episode 140. For the last few episodes, I’ve been doing something different. I'm just going through this so you guys see the content journey.

Those of you who went to Funnel Hacking Live and saw Peng Joon’s presentation on how he does his content might  think that you need to start with a gigantic content machine, right?

I never started with that. Number one, because of the cost, right. I'm spending $26,000 in hard costs a month right now on my content generation process. My content machine costs me that much. But I would never have started that way.  There's no way. That's dumb. But I knew content was important.

If I could get my voice more out there and share  what I was learning as I was watching these gurus...  If I could document my journey (which I'm still doing)... You guys are watching me do it all the time… If I could just do that...

I know that whoever controls content in an industry controls the industry. If no one hears you speak, then no one knows you exist in your industry, okay.

That's why this whole content thing is so important and so powerful. If no one knows you're talking, you don't exist, okay.

One of my first mentors was the CMO of Denny's and also Pizza Hut. I spent a lot of one on one time with him. He was actually a professor of mine. And he and I got a friendship. I would ask him a lot of questions and I talked a lot with him. He invented stuffed crust pizza. Whoa, right. He's the man…

I remember I was sitting in his office with him once and I was talking with him. At the time we were in this semester of college where we don't do anything but run a business. That's it…

You start a business from scratch. They give you virtually no help. You start it....

Well I was voted the first CEO of this company.  We ended up making two to three grand a week during that semester, which was awesome. With no help, we built it up, and it was awesome.

I remember though, I was talking about marketing with him. It was at a time in my life where I had not yet totally decided to go into just marketing alone. I was like man, should I go do supply chain? Should I go do finance? Should I go do this, should I go do that?

Anyway, he and I were chatting. And I was like, “I feel like I'm yelling at people about our company... like hey, we're here, we're here. Come buy our thing.”  And he said, “You know what's funny about marketing? The moment that you feel like you are being annoying is the moment that people are just starting to realize you even exist.”

You're gonna get tired of your message. You're gonna get tired of your stories way before the market will - Far before. You are not yelling as loud as you might think you are. You're not, okay.

Now I'm pushing content around all over the place, and that's what I want to talk about real quick.  I want to show you how I've evolved. It's interesting to see the journey that it's taken…

Whoever controls content controls beliefs and ideas.

If you're barely talking, or if you're not even talking,  people just don't know you exist for the longest time.They really don't.

You're gonna have the core people who follow you, who love you, who do the crazy things, who are the fanatics over what your business does. But most people don't really know you that well. They know of maybe your podcast. They know maybe of your business. They don't know what it is. It just feels like you're yelling at them because to you, it feels like you're yelling. You're not, okay.

So get used to speaking or at least communicating in some way. If you don't want to do a podcast, don't, okay. If you want to do video, sweet. If you want to just blog, awesome. Neil Patel blew up that way, right.

Whatever medium you're comfortable doing most frequently, just marry it. Okay, marry it, right.

We just did the episode a little bit ago about the attractive character. It is the vehicle for your attractive character to explode on. Okay, that's why it's so important for you to do this stuff.

I remember at Funnel Hacking Live feeling that my content machine was good - even though it was just me handing it off to one person. However, I realized that I could do a lot more.

I was like, you know what, I've worked my butt off. I'm gonna go try and blow up some of these platforms a little bit better.

I love YouTube, okay. Facebook and I still have a love hate relationship - but I use it. Instagram, loving it...

At  Funnel Hacking Live, Russell stood up and he said... It was like his first presentation. He stood up and he goes, “Where's Stephen?” And I was like “Woo!”... 'cause that's what I do, I yell. And he's like there he is. “Stephen's one of my favorite people on the planet. But he does not know what's on Instagram. He does not ever get on it.” Then he proceeded to pseudo make fun of me. Huh, I know you're watching man. Okay, proceeded to pseudo make fun of me for not using Instagram. I felt the stance of shame. Here's the stance of shame. That's the stance of shame.

The very next day during a lunch break in Funnel Hacking Live, Colton and I went over to an Apple store and we grabbed myself an iPhone, a new one, and I have been Instagramming my face off. I started putting these different pieces together.

When I saw Peng Joon talk about how he does his content machine - I was like, you know what, with a few tweaks, I'm actually close to what he's doing.

So that's what I've been focusing on. It’s part of the reason why some of my other business has slowed down just a little bit - because my focus has been on this content machine. Setting up systems, setting up the business, getting my processes in place.

We've kept the ads small on my main product - but we're still very profitable. And I’ve been building up this content machine and the business. Like we have this crazy accelerant now guys. We got this insane power. And it's been really, really cool.

So here is my new content machine. I'm not gonna name names because they are my people, and it took me a while to find them, and I'm spending a lot of money to get them. So I'm  just gonna let you know what the roles are, okay. These are the roles that I filled and I really wanted to go hit, okay.

If you read Dotcom Secrets. These books are never really that far from me. Here they are. If you read Dotcom Secrets, one of the things that Dotcom Secrets talks about very early on is it talks about this whole concept of old media versus new media.

Old media, if you think about old media….That's things like newspapers, right, a lot of direct mail, the radio. It's still consumed, it's just that there's all these new media that you also need to be cognizant of and speak on.

If you look at the new media versus the old media you can see that podcasts are the new radio. What is the new TV? Kind of YouTube, right. YouTube and Facebook Lives, things like that. What's the new newspaper? Blogs, right.

If you go study guys like Ryan Holiday who's obsessed with the ideas of content creation... He's very good at placing ideas in places. Right, if you go look at what he's doing, he's just using different media sources against itself, right. Anyway, really, really fascinating okay.

So what I did is I said: I want to be on YouTube. I want to be on blogs. I want to be on Instagram. I want to be on Facebook groups. I want to be on…  And I started thinking through all these different platforms that I wanted to be seen on, even though that's not the format I was gonna publish on, okay.

I was like, well that causes a really interesting scenario because you need to match the content to the platform, right. Each platform has a context. You don't go on podcasts and listen to these podcasts typically while just standing in a room. You know, usually you're doing something else.

So on podcasters, I know I'm usually talking to like active individuals who are running around. They're getting something else done, typically.

If I want to get on Facebook... what's the intent of Facebook? People go on Facebook to get distracted usually, right. So I’ve gotta make sure that it's somewhat entertaining when my same content piece hits that platform.

People get on YouTube to either get distracted, entertained, or it's like a how to video … generally, it’s more instructional than Facebook's intent - I'm talking stereotypes here.

Why do people read blogs? There's not tons of story usually in blogs. I know it depends. Like in the space that I'm in, there's usually not tons of stories. It's usually a lot of how to stuff, right.

So that became the challenge; how do I just do a podcast and then repurpose the content for the different platform's context?

I believe that questions invite revelation. So that's been the question on my mind... How do I solve that problem? And cool enough, I solved it.

That's what happens when you ask the right questions. Questions aren't threatening. You'll answer the question, no matter what you're asking.

If  you ask, “Oh, why am I broke?” You'll get the answer. Instead ask, “How can I make more money?’ and you'll start finding that answer. Isn't that funny. Total side note and rabbit hole.

So…

Here's my content machine:

The first thing I do is I have a video podcast now, right. I primarily do this on a video camera. This is the same camera type that we use for Funnel Hacker TV that Russell uses. And I like it. It's big though…. meaning the camera file is big. The camera itself is small. It's a 4K camera.

I film, and by the time this episode's over, it's gonna probably be like 10 gigs, no joke.

Then I go rip the audio from it and send it to my audio guy -he's the man. He adds whatever intro and outro I said I want to the episode (he already has those). He then adds on the settings that I like. He puts all those settings in there. And then he goes through and matches the volume loudness.

Have you guys ever wondered why my intro and my outro all sound the same volume as the actual episode?  It's because of some cool things he does in the background with post editing.

Up until this point, I’d  been adding the settings myself - but I had to remove myself from this process.

So he goes through and he does a whole bunch of cool sound editing, and he re-uploads it to our Google Drive folder that we use as a team.

Then the Trello card, yes we're using Trello to track this, gets assigned to the next person, right. And that person goes out and does crazy, amazing things on YouTube with it.

She takes the video that's been recorded - she's amazing - and she figures out really cool ways that I should be competing with different keywords on SEO to rank me in YouTube. Then she creates these cool, 15 second clips of neat things that I said and takes them out. And that's what gets passed into our assets folder again for future use for Instagram, right.

Next, she creates a thumbnail video... She does a whole bunch of other stuff. She's absolutely amazing.

The card then gets passed off to my incredible blog writer. She grabs the actual transcription from Rev when it comes in and writes a blog post.

So it's no longer just a transcription. She actually takes this, (which you guys reading right now) and turns it into a blog.

So now, you guys know what I'm doing with this after I stop recording... It's going through his machine that we've created with these amazing, brilliant, specialized people.

They're not cheap. They're incredible, okay. I wanted good people. And I found out a lot of them have their own agencies behind them too, which is another reason why they're so good.

It's taken me a long time to get to this stage - so don't feel like you have to do this when you start out. You don’t need to. This is something you will graduate to eventually.

And it'll keep blowing up from here I'm sure and we'll keep adding processes and cool things to it, but this is the core of what it is.

So anyway, after the writer uploads the blog post back to our individual episode asset in Google Drive, then the next person goes in and takes it.

She goes in and puts the blog post into WordPress, and makes it awesome....

We're gonna do a massive overhaul of the blog that's actually associated with this. It’s gonna be a massive overhaul of the look, the feel, the layout, everything! I want it to be cleaner, neater... everything...

Anyway, she goes in and she makes the blog look visually amazing inside of WordPress.

This is the sixth episode that we've launched doing this process. Really cool.

Then the next person goes in and  launches everything on Libsyn. He does all the cool checks so that it can blast out to tons of platforms at one time.

Then the next person comes in... He goes in and puts it up on Instagram, on Facebook groups. I think he does a Twitter blast . He does a Chatbot blast. It's nuts guys… that whole team, that whole process.

What's cool about it is the deadline for the episode at the exact same for every platform. So everyone publishes at the exact same time. So at the exact same time (give or take maybe a few seconds), all this content is hitting the internet at the same time. Boom, from different platforms.

The same content, repurposed to suit the intent and context of each individual platform.

So because of this, there's over a week lag time in the preparation. So after I record, there's usually about a week and a half, or two weeks, while everyone's doing their role.

Anyways, it's freakin' awesome. It's super cool. That's my content machine.

I call it a machine, because I wanted to find a way to hit those all platforms in a systematized way.

I had to find people and pay them what they want to get paid, and what they're worth. They're worth a lot of money, okay.

If you go out and you start putting those people together. It's pretty interesting what happens... But for the love; if you're just starting out, do not try to build that from the get-go.

Like, good, great… eventually!  But be gentle with yourself until you can put 26 grand out on a team just for content's sake. It certainly, certainly pays me back more than that - but you can build up gradually, like I did.

So that's the content machine that I've got going on. I just wanted to give you guys an update.

Episode 60 and 61 of this podcast go through in depth on how I put my actual content together for the podcast. It dives more deeply through some of my tech setup, and the systems that I use as well. They're great ones to listen to if you are trying to build your own content machine, whether it's blog, or podcast, or video, whatever.

But with this episode, I wanted show the updated of what I've been doing here.

So anyways, you guys are awesome. You're rock stars, appreciate it. Keep at it.

I’d love if you could please, please, I know I keep asking... but what I'm putting out here, a lot of people charge a lot of money for. And I do it for free a lot of times. I really, really, really would love if you wouldn't mind, please go rate this podcast, review it on iTunes. It proves to iTunes that I'm not a schmuck and that this is all really good stuff.

It's been fun for me document my journey along the way. I am still telling you guys what I'm doing along the way so you can avoid pitfalls.

So, if that is worth anything to you and you've gotten any value from this, please go to iTunes.

Someone reached out once and they said, “I don't know how to leave a review on iTunes.”  Just go to iTunes, open it up, type in “Sales Funnel Radio”. I will show up. When you click on the show, right at the top there, it says ratings and reviews. Click there and it'll say write a review. Click write a review. I’d appreciate that. Thank you so much. It does mean a lot to me.

I want to keep showing funnel builders and entrepreneurs who are starting out and crushing it, the pitfalls to avoid, and some cool tactics along the way too.

All right guys, thanks so much, and I'll talk to you later, bye. Boom, thanks for listening.

Hey, please remember to rate and and subscribe. Hey, you want me to speak at your next event or Mastermind? Let me know what I can share that would be most valuable by going to stevejlarsen.com and book my time now.

What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larsen and this is Sales Funnel Radio. Today we are going to talk about what to do when your revenue outgrows your business.

I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine-to-five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch. This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business, using only today's best internet sales funnels.

My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

What's up guys, hey, I am very excited for this episode. So, when I officially left my job, just like the intro to this podcast says, January first, it's been five months. Five solid months now, five and a half-ish by the time this episode goes out, and five and half.. it's been fascinating to watch what's happened. So follow me here, this is what happened.

Okay, so I left, right, and I had this awesome idea, I vetted it, I knew it'd be successful and what I did is I went and I started launching, launching, launching, launching, launching and what started happening was over on this side was the sales. Sales, sales, sales, sales, revenue, revenue, revenue, revenue. Lots of money started coming in.

I was like "Whoa! This is crazy, "I've never had this much cash coming. "Whoa, my gosh, whoa!" And all this cash started dumping on in. And we did about 100 grand the first month and then it just continued.

Now it's 50 grand a month and that's where it's been for a while because I slowed it down ..

You guys might be like, "Hey, that's kinda funny, why would you slow it down?" I actually slowed it down because here's what happened; January, February, March was like sell, sell, sell, sell, sell, sell, and I'm selling, and we're making cash, and it's coming in, and we're at a 100 grand. You know, 100 grand, right... Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, we're making... A lot of cash coming in...

What I started realizing was the actual, my actual business wasn't able to handle what was going on. I was like, "Crap, I never ever thought this would ever happen to me." And I say that because when I started building funnels for companies while I was in college and it always happened the same way…

The funnels that we build, they sell things very, very, very well. I don't think people understand how well the funnels work, and that actually creates a business problem NOT a funnel problem.

Here's what I mean:

I was building all these funnels for people in college and there's this guy I was building a funnel for…  I did the research, I ran ASK campaigns, and I figured out exactly what his customers needed. Then I went put those things together, and created funnels. When we launched them, boom! He made a lot of cash real fast.

He made 50 grand really quick. 50 grand in the first month, it something like that. I can't remember exactly, it was a long time ago now. But there was a lot of cash coming in and then it kept going, and going, and going.

It’s funny because Day #1 after launching the funnel, the business owner always comes and they're like, "Oh my gosh, look at all this cash coming in! "That's amazing, these funnels are so cool!"

Then Day #2, they reach back out and they're like, "Wow, this is really awesome. "Holy crap, that's still a lot of sales."

Then Day #3, they're always like, "Turn it off! Turn it off! "You're gonna bankrupt us, turn it off!"

I remember I was kind of laughing when they said that, I thought they were joking. I was like, "Why would I ever turn off this... " Why would I turn off this funnel? Who wants less sales? I've never heard anyone say that in my life ever and at the time, I was making fun of it... I just didn't know any better. I was like, "Aw, that's stupid, why would you ever want less sales?"

However, he’d run into a situation where the revenue was outpacing his business!

Funnels are not businesses, they're not. A funnel is a revenue arm. A funnel is a very effective way to sell stuff. A business, though, that's completely different.

A business is a series of systems - that's really all it is. It's a series of systems that fulfills on the funnel, that's really it. Okay, that's the way I define it anyway, okay?

If you don't have enough systems in place, it means that every person who purchases from you is being fulfilled on differently.

It means that every person who's coming in, right, and has a support question, you're treating it differently every single time.

It means for every single, you know, package that needs to get shipped out there's not a process in place.

It's literally different every time, and what's hard about that is that it makes it very challenging to scale.  Especially if you’re just starting out and you’re kind of a solo guy for a while. If you're a solo, individual person for a while and you're kind of running on your own, that's great. That's a great place to be, but eventually you're gonna get to a place where your revenue starts to outpace your ability to fulfill well, and that's what happened to me.

Funnily enough, right after, I graduated college and started working at ClickFunnels, we did the exact same thing to so many other people:

Day #1, we launch an amazing funnel. They're like, "Oh, my gosh, look at all the sales!"

Day #2,  they're like, "Wow, that is "still a lot of sales, oh my gosh."

Day #3, they're like, "Turn it off, turn it off, turn it off, there's no way... "Oh, my gosh, we're gonna die, you're literally gonna bankrupt us, we're not gonna be able to fulfill on all this stuff"

I remember the second time it happened it was for a funnel we’d built for... I don't know if I should say the name, but anyway…

Russell and I built this sweet e-comm funnel. It was amazing, they had tons of revenue coming in, and they spent the next two or three months simply upgrading, building, solidifying and putting in place systems inside of their company so that it actually could handle the revenue coming in. Isn't that funny?

For some reason I had never, ever considered that for such a long time, and so I ran into the same thing.

Part of my first role as ClickFunnels was to build funnels for Russell's personal clients. I built a lot of funnels for ClickFunnels itself, but (especially when I first got there there) I built funnels for his personal clients - building them, putting them together…

I have a marketing degree. In the business marketing degree that I got they do a lot on teaching ‘the business.’ The actual systems and the structure. They do hardly anything on teaching sales, right? Which is so funny.

It makes sense of why everyone goes and gets VC funding... because they build the team and there's no cash to freaking support it. You're like, "That seems backwards."

Anyway, so I started going through this very same thing. I started recognizing it coming up... I launched all my stuff and I was like... It was like, "Money, Money, Money, Money," and I was like, "Holy crap."  I was still the sole operator of my business. I was like, "Huh, this is interesting."

I knew what happened next; pretty soon it becomes so high, the tower gets so tall that eventually there's not enough foundation and it starts to crumble and you start getting refunds and people start saying bad things about you.

And I was like, "Crap, I don't want to hit that," and so I purposefully had my amazing ads person, (I will interview her one day and put her on here because she's incredible), but I had my amazing ads individual go and turn the ads down. We kept the ads tiny because I didn’t have the power to fulfill at the rate I was able to sell at.

Most businesses are the exact opposite. They’ve  got the sweet structure and they don't know how to get new cash in. “Well, I'm a funnel builder, baby. The cash part's not the hard part…” It's this other way around.

So, I guess I've been feeling the need to... You know, it's June now, to account,  to let you guys know what's been happening, and so for the first, like, three months there's been a lot of cash that came in. I was like, "Oh, my gosh, that's nuts. "Crap, I'm like the only guy!" I was pulling my hair out - stressed 24/7.  

I remember I was talking to... This wasn't an Inner Circle meeting, but I was talking to a lot of the members. We were hanging out at someone's house and they were asking, “What's going on?” and I was telling them, and someone said, “You know, you're probably gonna have to put the brake on just a little bit to go build this stuff up and then you'll be able to handle more cash coming in.”

I didn’t want that to be the answer. I really didn’t want him to say that. I was like, "sell, "sell, sell, sell, sell," but...

This year, I've been doing a lot of stuff. I'm one of the coaches for Two Comma Club Coaching X, the new 2CCX program, and it's going freaking incredible. I've gotten my own processes down and in place there now. I’m helping them fulfill; helping them do amazing stuff, helping everyone make money and put their funnels together. So, I've been doing that as well as actually my webinar  So, I've been selling, selling, selling, selling.

It's been tons of fun. Now I’ve backed off on the selling a little bit. I’ve put together a lot of systems - a lot of them.  I always thought that it was kind of like a drag, but I know now why.

Because without huge cash coming in why on earth am I building the system, right? That's what my mentality is like. I'm like, "What's the ROI of me building a system when there's not buttloads of cash to match it with?”

So, that's all I would encourage you guys to do.  If you’re selling and you've got cash coming in and you're like, "Hey, this is going really, "really well, it's going incredible,"  but you're having a hard time blowing up, I want to tell you one thing that Russell told me...

Actually, I was sitting next to him, I’d only been working there for a little bit and I was keeping notes. I mean, I was sitting next to the dude, right? Would you not take notes? So I did.

I had a Trello board called "Brunsonisms" and "Russell Lessons" and I would write down things that I heard him say - things that were really profound. I was already fanatic about his content, but like, really profound things, and this is what he said... He was talking to one of his Inner Circle people and he goes, "Scaling from six to seven figures... " I'm gonna botch the quote, but this is the lesson. He said, "Scaling from six to seven figures is NOT a matter of MORE hours in the office.... Scaling from six to seven figures is about leverage."

So if you've got a product, right...  that’s done, like, 300 grand, something like that… What I've noticed is that you probably have a leverage problem.

You need to  put systems in place that let you expand, that lets you fulfill, that lets you, right, go grab another funnel out there, put something out there that brings more cash in, so things like that.

But specifically, right, it's a leverage problem. It's not typically a cash problem.

You guys will all notice and you'll all see, if you haven't already, which I know a lot of you guys are already rockstars and you're selling. You're making a boatload of cash already, right, but for those of you guys who are, like, just starting out, you'll see really quickly, right, it's typically...

When you go and you start, right, you're building, you're building, you're getting the revenue coming in. Awesome, and you should do that. Prove to the market that it's awesome. You’ll find that when you have an amazing product, right... Like, my product right now is so freaking awesome. (I keep adding some amazing... Oh, my gosh. I just added this really cool thing to it.) Another time, another episode, but oh, my gosh. And the success rate is just, like, skyrocketing because of it.

Anyway, when you actually figure out something really awesome, the path to a million bucks is not actually that hard.

I remember I was walking out, I think it was my last day at ClickFunnels, and Russell was like, "So, what's the goal, man?" And I was like, "A million bucks," and he goes, "You're gonna find out real fast that's not that hard," and I was like, "Oh, hahaha."

It's not that hard, let me just tell you right now. It's not that hard, oh, my gosh.  The funnel that I tossed out it was really, really quick, and revenue came in real fast. I was like, "Crap, I need systems to handle it," I don't want to become so systemized that the systems start outpacing the revenue…

I can feel it. I have an organization now. There's eight people on my team now. I have a full-time employee. I'm getting full-time support, full-time assistant. I'm setting up the structure so that I can go back to the funnel and be like, "Blow it up, baby, yeah, go, we're going to three." Does that make sense?

If you watch all these other Two Comma Club winners, they've gone through a very similar pattern. While we often study the funnel, which is great…  we study their marketing, which is great. Remember, though, to actually study their business and the structure of it.

When you're funnel hacking- you're not just hacking funnels, you're also funnel hacking the way they fulfilled on what the funnel was selling.

That's been part of what I've been doing heavily this last little bit. I mean, I've been studying my face off. I’ve got notes and papers all over the place, all over my desk right now. Because now I’ve got the revenue coming in,  I can build the actual systems and the processes to support even more revenue.

My structure as of two months ago couldn’t have handled much more. My structure now, though, it's getting a lot cleaner. I know that soon I'm gonna be able to just, like, scale, scale, scale, scale, scale.

What I've learned and what I've seen a lot of people do, is... If you look at the pattern of a lot of Two Comma Club winners, you'll notice that usually with a team of three to five people they'll run to a three million real quick.  

It’s different for every business, every industry, but the actual structure, the business structure allows them to get to that kind of place, usually pretty quickly with not many people on the team.

It doesn't take a huge team to do these things. Brandon and Kaelin Poulin, they just crossed 10 million dollars. They just had their first three million dollar month - crazy!  They've got 40 people on their team. However, it doesn't take these gigantic teams to make a significant amount of cash for your pocket.

So, real quick I'll tell you the roles and then my camera's gonna die…

Okay, so what I'm going for is, right, I am the main marketer, funnel builder, CEO, right. That's the position that I'm in.

I also have an affiliate manager. Right, that's my first full-time employee. Not support, right, not assistant. I want other cash generating people, right. That's all I want, right, where there's still structure. He's going out and he's my affiliate manager.

He's going out and he's creating relationships. We're doing another huge Dream 100 package drop. That's actually where he is right now. That's why he's not sitting there right now. He's at the post office, we're doing another big Dream 100 drop, and we got a lot of people excited to promote. He’s bringing in new blood. New blood as far as relationships goes.

Okay, so it's me as the funnel builder and marketer and attractive character. Right, that's the roles I'm trying to take on.

The next one, though, right, affiliate manager, and that actually was told to me by Russell. He said, "The next employee I would get, 100 percent man, go grab an affiliate manager and then grab an assistant, and then a support person."  Really that's it.  

If you're, like, shipping stuff out you might need a fulfillment person too. I'll probably maybe grab two support people so that they're almost around the clock.. That’s all I really need, right, as far as full-time people go.

've got six content people and I do have a bookkeeper, but those are like VA positions, they're not full-time on my books. They're on my books every month, but they're not W-2 employees. They’re 1099s.

As far as full-time W-2 employees that are actually like here with me I’ve got the affiliate manager and I’m  definitely gonna have a full-time assistant, and definitely gonna have full-time support. Because right now we're doing the support piece. He mostly is doing support and affiliate stuff, and that's kind of it. Those are the roles, it's really four roles that I'm going for for the business model that I love and am modeling. It's going great and everything's running how it should.

So, anyways guys, hopefully that was helpful to you? I just wanted to do a little bit of accounting so that you see where you are.

If you're feeling stuck, start  asking: "Is my funnel revenue outpacing my business?" - because they're not the same, right?

Or if you're like, "Hey, I've got this "sweet business and these cool systems "and structures and processes, but not enough revenue." Then go build a funnel.

There’s kind of this balance between one and the other. They're gonna have a hard time outpacing each other.

After a while the structure will get too weighty, you're not gonna have the cash to hold the system so the system will need to get leaner.

I don't like to build the business past the revenue. That's called debt and I personally am not a huge fan. I own my stuff. I don't want anyone else to own it. All right, hopefully this was helpful?

Just so you guys know what's going on with my team and how I'm actually building it out and actually putting it together....

My content team, they're freaking rockstars. I'm definitely gonna interview them so you guys all know who they are. Then over here on the W-2 side where I'm actually building out a full-time team, I backwards plan my structure.  I figure out how much money is that person gonna want a month? My hard costs right now are like 25 grand a month for my salary and my team’s salary. So hard costs right now, for the content team, for everything else, 25 grand a month.That's not bad at all. All right, sweet, done-zo.

So I've backed way off, built up the structures, got the systems in place- we're just vetting them right now. That's really all we're doing. Yesterday I talked to my amazing ads person and we're gonna go scale these ads like crazy and get them off the ground.

So, anyways, I just thought it would be kind of cool to show a little of the accounting so that you guys know what I've been doing, because my structure could not handle much more.

So, anyway, awesome stuff. The next road mark I fully expect we'll probably do the... This is me calling my shot, okay. Probably I think we're gonna hit the million by October at the latest.  I think we'll go to maybe 1.4, 1.5 by the end of the year.

That's me looking at where we are combined with the campaigns that we're putting in place, where I've seen them go before, where I've put them before. Anyway, we'll see what happens, but that's where I am right now.

It's kind of a different episode. I never realized that I would be in the role that I am as far as a systems builder, you know what I mean? I'm a funnel builder, but  now by necessity I'm also a systems builder - which has been great.

I'll talk to you guys later, please rate this podcast and review it, that helps me like crazy. I think that my podcast is one of the foremost podcasts on funnels, which is why I'm trying to push it hard and prove to iTunes that it matters.

So, please, please leave a review and share. That means the world to me, and I'll talk to you all in the next episode, bye.

Hey, thanks for listening, please remember to rate and subscribe. Want today's best opt-in funnels for free? Get your free opt-in funnel pack by going to SalesFunnelBroker.com/FreeFunnels to kick start your opt-ins today.

What's going on, everyone? It's Steve Larsen, and today, we’re gonna talk about how to compete with your Attractive Character.

I just spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now, I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million-dollar business. The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business, using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

Guys, I'm pumped for today. This could be a bunch of fun.

A lot of guys know, I was really shy for a long time, right? And I've mentioned that many times, and some of you guys have said, that's not true, Stephen. No way that's true, right?

But I was. I was really shy for a long time. I would say I even had a near-clinical fear of adults. You know, I would see an adult, and I would physically move in a different direction - I did that for a time.

Even into my early 20s, I was pretty shy. It's not that I was like cowering, or  that I wouldn't speak to anybody else...

It's just that I was doing everything that I could to not engage with human beings. I don't know why I was that way. It’s not that I was really reclusive… or that I was sitting back all the time, going, “ugh, it's a person.” That's not how I was at all. But there was no way I would be getting on stage now. There was no way I would ever do something like a podcast. Just the thought of that would freak me out. To have a camera on my face right now, there's no way.

When I finally became cognizant that I was this way, I started noticing all these business people who were amazing leaders. I’d be, “oh my gosh, check out those guys... Look at him, he's so impressive. He speaks and things sway. I wanted to develop that skill.

I started doing things like door-to-door sales for the explicit reason of learning how to sell in scary environments. I started doing telemarketing, for the explicit reason of going in and learning how to sell hard in environments where you're constantly getting rejected.

I don't know that everyone has to go through this kind of thing, but for me, I chose to start molding who I was... and who I was trying to become. It was a really challenging thing to go through.  As I started getting more into it, I noticed that my ability to speak and to give sales messages started improving.

Several years before I started working for Russell, I realized that I needed to get even better at this whole stand and deliver concept. I wanted to work out how to become… I don't wanna say, ‘a leader’… How to become... a ‘follow-able person’. It's kind of like saying leader.

Anyway, but I was trying to figure out how to do that. Because from my background, and where I was coming from - that was an insanely hard thing to do!

I would take my computer and find videos of people on stage. I did this specifically with Russell Brunson's stuff. This was way before we ever knew each other personally. I would take his videos - videos of him on stage, and I would go in front of a mirror, mute the video of him, so I could see him, but not hear him. And he'd be making all these gestures and I would mirror him. I would mimic him.  

I’d be moving around all over the place, mirroring and mimicking everything he was doing. It was so weird. It was awkward. I know that it’s weird, but it was what I needed to start breaking out of the shell I was in.. It’s how ‘Steve Larsen’ was born.

Fast forward, I was working for Russell, sitting next to him; I was about 40-ish episodes into Sales Funnel Radio...  We were running this thing called the FHAT event - the Funnel Hackathon Event. People would pay 15 grand for three days, and I would teach for hours. I mean, man, it was a long freaking time!

Well, the very first FHAT event, we were vetting out the content, we were making sure that everything was awesome and solid. Then, right before Russell goes on stage, he turns around at me, and he goes, "Hey dude. Do you wanna introduce me?"

I always make it a habit to say “YES’ - especially when someone with a lot of influence asks me to do something…  My knee-jerk reaction is to say “YES!” and then figure out how to do it later. This attitude has brought me to some cool places in life.

At the FHAT event, the room's filled with loads of people - very successful people.There's like 60 people in there, and many millions - tens of millions - hundreds of millions of dollars, collectively inside of that room.

There's a lot of Russells inner circle - and they know what the heck they're talking about, right? I was like, crap, I gotta get on and introduce…

The whole role of somebody who introduces somebody else is merely to raise the state of the room so that when the speaker comes on, they don't have to raise the state of the room. They can just walk on and start presenting.

Otherwise, the speaker spends a whole bunch of time to do that. Russell told me, “that's your role.”  I was like, crap! How can I do that? It's not like Russell's low energy. How do I introduce Russell Brunson in a way that suits who he is? That suits his audience?

It was very challenging for me. I remember sitting there. I mean, he asked me three minutes ahead of time, to go on and do this. Immediately I was like, okay, is there a script? Is there like a format that good introducers use to bring on other prominent people? There's gotta be something. What can I do?

Russell walked over, and he said, "Hey, just make sure you raise the state of the room- that way, I don't have to."

I was like, oh crap. Okay, another huge task. Okay, sweet. Inside, I was like, oh, crap! He could tell I was stressing out. He knew that I had done all that stuff, like stand in front of a mirror with his videos muted,  just moving around and mimicking what he's doing.

He knew I’d done door-to-door. He knew I’d done telemarketing. He knew I’d done a lot of stuff and become good at them so that I could break out of my shell.

Instead of fight the fact that I was in a shell, I accepted the fact, and just did things to come out of it.

Knowing this, Russell turned to me, and this is what he said, and this is the reason why I wanna share this with you... Because it really, really, really matters:

He turned to me, and he said, he said, "Dude, "You model me. It's quite impressive how you model me. You model me to the ‘T.’ You do everything that I do. You model me so well, but you’ve got to have your own voice eventually. Just do it how you’d introduce me."

It's funny because I knew that answer, but for Russell to say it ‘in that way’, I really took notice.

At that time, I'd already been publishing. I'd already been doing a whole bunch of stuff. I would already say that I had, quote, unquote, found my voice.  However, when he said, dude, you gotta have your own ‘isms’, you gotta have your own character, you gotta have your own thing, I started thinking through, what makes ‘me’ me?

These were all quick thoughts that were hitting me as I'm about to walk on stage. I don't remember what I said, but it went great. The energy in the room got really high. It's half the reason I yell like crazy, guys. Those are all little things that I do on stage before bringing somebody big on, and, and it's a bunch of fun.

What does this have to do with anything? It has to do with everything....

Your business competes in the marketplace based on how much value it provides, right? You're very valuable if you answer a lot of questions, if you solve things for people, if you give things that people want, if you give things that people need (I suggest you go for the wants, not the needs - You’ll make more money). However, let’s start thinking through what value your business gives to the ecosystem - to the market? Because that's where you compete on the business side - with your strengths.

How can you be the best? How can you deliver more? How can you be more than the other guy? How can you do things in an entirely brand new, unique way? That's  what the business side competes on. Strengths.

Your Attractive Character, however, doesn’t compete on strengths. Isn’t that interesting? Let me explain…

In the first office that I was a part of with ClickFunnels, Russell and I would sit back to back. His computer and my computer screens were facing each other, so I could see his reflection in my screen...

I'd be building these funnels - In the first two months, I was totally mute. I didn't wanna say anything. I was like, this is freaking Russell Brunson, like, oh my gosh, look, Y'all, oh my gosh. He's gonna melt me with his marketing zeroes and ones, huh! I’d see his reflection in my screen 24/7 right there, I was like, don't say anything or you'll die. That was my mentality.

I remember my desk was a picnic table that was slightly too high, and my chair was slightly too low - so I get a lot of back pain 'cause I have kind of long arms. These details are burned into my head... I remember the way that room smelled, I remember the way it looked, I remember everything about that room. Over to my right, there was a book. I never read it, but it was called: ‘How The World Sees You.’ And on the back, it said two things. One of them was, “Don't compete on your strengths. Compete on your differences.” I thought that was really interesting.

The other one was, “You don't learn interesting, you unlearn boring.”

Now, I wanna look at those two phrases real quick. You have to understand that this is HOW your Attractive Character competes.

On the business side, you compete on strengths. Your business, the systems, the offer, the marketing.

But with your attractive character (which marketing bleeds into for sure) - You don't compete on strengths! Somebody will always be better, faster, stronger, right or  better-looking, right? Does that make sense?

Someone's always gonna be more talented. Someone's always gonna be boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. So on that measure, your attractive character will die.

It’s the fastest way to entrepreneurial suicide; to start competing with your attractive character on strengths because it’s never gonna be enough.

You start comparing yourselves to ideals. The problem with an ideal is that it’s fluffy, it's fictitious, it's out there. There's no way for you to know if you'll ever hit it... And because of that, it's not measurable - so it's not attainable.

As an entrepreneur you start spinning your wheels and comparing yourself to an ideal. To strengths. Don't do that. Don't do that.  I did that for a long time. I'm speaking from experience with this stuff. I did that for quite some time. It sucked. It was hard because you start saying things like, “man, I don't know if I'm ever gonna make this. Am I ever actually gonna be successful with this?” Right?

Every one of us has said that. Come on, I know we all have, right? Am I ever gonna, is something wrong with me? Oh my gosh, another two people made a million, you know, made the two comma club today. Crap. Gosh, dang it. Are you kidding me? Right? What's wrong with me?

Something must be wrong with me, because it’s not the funnel, it's not this, it's not that. It has to be me, right? And the entrepreneur starts to blame themselves because they're comparing themselves to where the other people are. They're comparing themselves to another person's business. That's a stupid comparison. Don't do it.

The way to move forward on the Attractive Character is to compare YOU to YOUR history. That's it. That is what keeps you from, from self-sabotaging, from literally burying yourself. It's like your brain eventually turns submarine mode, and it doesn't know how to go back up.

You start sinking-and going further, and further down. Oh crap, I can't get this, something must be wrong with me, because all these other people are getting it done.

You're comparing themselves with somebody's business. Stupid, dumb comparison. Because while a business competes on strengths, an attractive character competes on DIFFERENCES - YOU compete on your differences.  It is so much easier. My gosh, guys, you’ll save your sanity.

If you guys haven't been following me on Instagram, (I think you'll like it)... Monday morning, I always yell, and it's exactly what it sounds like. I yell. I get up, and I yell, whoo, yeah.

What I've been doing lately is having a whole bunch of you guys yelling back.  In the the highlights - Russell's in there yelling, Peng Joon's in there yelling - it's really fun.

Go check it out if you want to; you'll see what I'm talking about. But why do I do that? It's because it's what I would do anyway. I'm just me, but louder… That's the real trick with becoming an attractive character.

This internet business, does not exist for you to have to change into someone you’re not... Meaning there's this facade, right? There's this facade about what it means to be successful. I don't want any expensive fancy cars. Heh. Right? I'm not living in a mansion, urgh. Right? And there's this facade that's complete garbage when it comes to what it means to be successful on the internet. There's this persona that you have to go live. It's crap. It's complete garbage. Don't believe it. It doesn't make sense.

For those people who are doing it because that's who they truly are, great, I'm not poo-pooing on that. Like, that's great, okay, stay that course. That's awesome.

What I'm saying is those of you guys who are not naturally that way - you don’t have to pretend. If you want those things, that's awesome, but you don't have to pretend to be someone different to be successful.

I'm saying this because I've heard a lot of people say things to the equivalent of, I don't even own a briefcase, how can I be successful, urgh. Right? It's like, what? That's not what the game's about, right? Your business competes on strengths, but your Attractive Character competes on differences.

What makes me ‘me’ is how I compete; so I listen to music more openly, 'cause I'm always listening to music - my kind of music. I don't care if people don't like it because it’s one of the things that makes me different.  

On the business side, I can't say that though. When it comes to products, I need to have slight reactions to what the market wants me to build for them…

However, for the Attractive Character, that's not how it works. I can do all the quirky things I love to do. The little character traits that I have that make me a bit weird... those things that I don't necessarily want other people to see... Man, those are your freakin' superpowers. That's the stuff to go publish about.

Right now, I'm yelling into a camera in an office by myself. It would be weird for other people to come to see this. I don't care. Right? For a long time, I would've cared though, 'cause I had that same perception.

I was like, this is what it means to be successful in this business; I have to go have X, Y and Z over here. I need to have this kind of suit, and I must look this way, I must act this way. I must be slightly recluse from all of these other people and set myself apart…

(I still have to be a little bit reclusive sometimes, when I'm around other people,  just to recharge, but it's not for the same reason. Mentally, I have to recharge, 'cause there's a lot of questions 24/7 at events, you know. Whoo, and I'm like, whoa, I gotta separate and isolate for a second)

When I hear somebody say, “I don't know that I can be successful because I have a stutter” or I have this limitation or that limitation, or I'm dyslexic, or I have ADHD. Man, that’s just wrong!  

I had this counselor once tell me that I have a lot of tendencies of ADHD. And for a long time, I used to think that this was a hindrance. That's garbage. It's bullcrap.

Did you know that most billionaires are dyslexic? Seriously, go look it up. Richard Branson - the guy's dyslexic - it didn’t stop him.

Whatever it is about you - I'm not just talking about dyslexia, and you know, ADHD and stuff, whatever - I don't care what it is. Whatever it is about you that makes you feel incompetent- is actually a superpower. Stop acting like it’s a hindrance.

The beauty of the internet is that you can become who you are, even more, louder. You don't have to change you -  just be a louder you. That's what the attractive character is.

Instagram's kinda fun, 'cause I can do a lot of the little snapshots of what I'm doing throughout the day. I have a little dummy down there that I beat the crap out of. I'm gonna name it ‘Poverty’, so I can beat the crap out of ‘poverty’ every morning. It's really fun. But no one's telling me to do that. That's my own creativity and my own little weirdness kicking in. That's great for my Attractive Character.

What's funny is that if you try to go and you compete on strengths, if you try to be something that you’re not - IT WILL SINK YOU. You’ll have a tough time connecting with your audience. Your audience won't feel your authenticity if you're not being true to yourself. People can smell it. They can.

When you start having thoughts like, I don't know that I can do this because I have, blank. I have a limitation because of, blank. I have a limitation because of, blank. Those things are the things that you should be publishing about!

Not that it's a pity fest. Not that you're walking around all the time, saying like, oh well, follow me, I'm terrible at this. I'm awful at that. That's not what I'm saying at all. The reason I can push so freaking hard, is because I do have some ADHD tendencies. I’ve got a lot of friends who can't do that. It is a superpower.

When I talk about this, all of you guys who feel the same way - you reach out to me and you say, I getcha. I feel ya. I'm with ya. I understand what you're saying. If I wasn’t willing to expose my vulnerabilities - the things that I feel I'm limited on - I wouldn’t be able to connect with you in the same way.  Does that make sense?

That is why I tell everyone to publish so much. Don't take on a persona that doesn’t feel like you. Just be you - louder.

While  businesses competes on strengths and the ability to give results, your attractive character competes on differences. You don’t need to compare yourself to somebody else. If you're comparing your business to somebody else’s, I don't see a massive problem with that, as long as you feel like you’re not your business. You know what I mean?

Sometimes in an agency setting you are the business. Well, that can be dangerous. You'd be like, well, I suck at this, I suck at this. No, no, no, no, no, no. No, no. Bad.

The reality is that you don't have the ‘systems’ in place to get those things done. That's not YOU!  It’s your business. Right? So get in the habit of running your critiques through a filter.

You need to ask’ “Is this a business-oriented adjustment, or is this just, who I am?”

On the business side; judge, and critique away. It’s your baby and it's always broken. Don't fall in love with it. But when you head over to the attractive character side; don't judge yourself on how you’re different.

Your difference is your superpower - it’s what lets you be you. It's what calls out your tribe and provides the blanket of security for the people who follow you. What makes you attractive, what makes you followable, is your ability to be open with the things that you're not amazing at, your little quirks, the things that you ‘like’ or ‘don't like’ -  the polarity that you have…

When I say, “I hate this” or “I love this” - It's very polarizing. When I say “I freakin' hate VC funding, I can think of 99% of businesses that probably didn't need it.” I understand that some people are not gonna like that, and that's okay because it's me. I'm totally fine with that.

So as you think about your attractive character, don't judge yourself. Don't come over here and be like, oh, I should change, I should be this, I should...

I'm always for self-improvement, but don’t tie your self-worth to the worth of your actual business. Don’t tie your self-worth to the value of your offer, or how many people you’ve helped - You are NOT the business.

If you’re in this scenario, you need to start separating your business from your attractive character. You can be an attractive character of the business. Every business should have one. However, you are NOT the New Opportunity. You are NOT the Offer. You are NOT the Cause. You ARE the Attractive Character.

Every mass movement needs an Attractive Character, a Cause, and an Opportunity. However, the attractive character is in its own category. The Cause and the Opportunity are separate too. They are not judged on the same report card as the Attractive Character.

Anyway, I think I've beaten this one down like crazy. I just wanna help entrepreneurs to stop beating ourselves up. If you’re not like everyone else, then good, great, awesome. Be louder about it! You'll find it’s actually an accelerant. It's a catalyst, an enzyme. *Other synonyms*. So that you can go forward faster. Boosh!

But only, if you're willing to be open about your differences - that's the key- and the caveat. Again, it’s not a pity fest. That's not what I'm saying at all. Those little quirks are the things that make you amazing and unique.

Anyway, I think I've said the same thing like 12 times now, but it's because I'm trying to hit it home! Now, I challenge you to sit down and start thinking about what makes you different. Either write it down - or just start being cognizant of it.

I like guns - there's a sniper rifle behind the camera right there. It's an Airsoft sniper rifle. I don't care about being politically correct - because it's me. So start writing down these things. Start being cognizant of who you are - and then be willing to share those differences.

It may require you to drop a wall that you’ve been building because you're afraid of people seeing the true you. “I'm not clean all the time… Sometimes I'm a slob, heh.” Whatever. I don't care, okay?

My garage downstairs, it's not painted. Urgh, it shouldn’t be on Instagram because it's not painted, right? I hate that kinda garbage. On stage the other day we were talking about the stack slide. We were talking about using certain scripts, and I was talking a little bit about this…

There's one great therapy known to help people get past the fear of doing these kinds of things. It's really interesting. So if you guys raise your arm out at a 45-degree angle in front of you. Next bend, right, at the elbow. So your arm's out 45 degrees, starting bending at the elbow, and then get your hand, kind of like right by your face. Kind of like right by your cheek right here.

While you have been watching this, while you have been listening to/ reading this, without you knowing, I have ‘ninja-ly’ (that's a new word)... Like a ninja, I’ve placed the most deadly spider on your face from South Africa, and it's gonna bite your face.

Okay, get that thing off. Just slap that face. Yeah, right, get it done. Get it out there, right?

I couldn't tell if it was offensive when I did it on stage, or if it was actually  really cool. But you got the point, though?

Just buck up a little bit, and you guys are gonna be awesome. I care about you so much, okay, so much. I think about you guys like, 24/7, and that's 'cause when I look back and see where I've gone, both from a revenue and a business standpoint - it's humbling, right? But I was not expecting all of this other stuff ‘mentally’ to have to happen.

Am I an attractive character? My attractive character has now come to a point and a spot, where it is... My business doesn't move past the level of my attractive character anymore. I now have to develop individually, personally, mentally because my business will not move past the level of my attractive character. It's fascinating.

Anyways, guys, I hope that that was helpful. It's a long episode. Thank you for tuning in. I appreciate it. Hopefully, this episode has made you cognizant of the power that you have inside of you. The power that’s already there.

All right, I'll talk to you later. Bye.

Please remember to rate and subscribe. Got a question you want answering live on the show? Head over to salesfunnelradio.com and ask your question now.

Just over two years ago, fresh out of college - having unexpectedly landed my dream job as 'Lead Funnel Builder' at ClickFunnels - I found myself sitting just feet away from my marketing hero, Russell Brunson.

For the first few months, I was practically mute. Looking back, I think I was in shock. Inside, my head was whirring and going crazy: 'Oh, my gosh, I'm sitting next to Russell Brunson. RUSSELL BRUNSON! Look it's Russell Brunson. I'm in the same room as RUSSELL BRUNSON...'

After a few cool moves to start a conversation: 'Hey, Russell, I nearly put a poster of you on my wall.'- *AWKWARD*- I decided that the best approach was to stay quiet and learn everything I could by watching the Master Marketer doing his thing.

It was fascinating to watch Russell's brain work; the incredible way that he’d create offers, recall marketing campaigns, get into the zone to brainstorm and solve problems. Each day I learned far more than I ever had in my whole Marketing Degree.

The main reason I started my Sales Funnel Radio podcast was to record all the nuggets that I was learning and pass them on.

Day after day, I'd sit there mesmerised, listening to Russell coach and talk with his inner circle. I'd listen to him advising all these massive gurus and influential people - as well as entrepreneurs who were just starting out. So much golden advice- I was a like a sponge soaking it all up.

After about three to four months, a funny thing happened - I started to notice patterns in the conversations that Russell was having. So one day, as he finished on a coaching call, I turned around to him and said: 'Hey, Dude, you're kinda  saying the same things over and over again.' And, he goes, 'Yeah!'

Now, if you're an expert in your field, you've probably noticed a similar pattern? You like to dive deep into your subject; you're obsessed with it.  

You have sooo much knowledge to pass on, but the problem is that a lot of the people you're serving don't need to go that deep with you.

They don't want to freak out and geek out the same way that you do - they just want to take the next step- or get to the next level.

So we had this idea to create a way to guide people from the ground up, on a step by step path, to create a million dollar company. From that point, Russell could take them EVEN HIGHER. It was a win/win solution.  

The entrepreneur got access to everything they needed to help them on the first part of their journey, and Russell got to spend less time on the basics, and more time in his zone of genius.

I spent six months going through twelve years of Russell's videos, and all of his content. I backward planned and organized the material into the exact steps needed for a million dollar business. We created a 200-hour membership area -  it was freaking huge and packed with VALUE... And that's how 'Secrets Masterclass' was born.

On its launch, Secrets Masterclass made a million in three weeks!  What was even more fun was that people who joined the program made a  million dollars too. A lot of people became hundred-thousandaires, while many others made money on the internet for the first time in their entrepreneurial life.  

It was such a success that we decided to take the material from the Secrets Masterclass and condense it into a three-day live event -'The Funnel Hack-A-Thon' (aka, The FHAT Event.) The FHAT event was loads of fun and got excellent results for the participants.

Then right before the 2018 Funnel Hacking Live in Orlando, Florida, Russell asked me if I wanted to go on stage to do a presentation (Hell, Yeah!)... The challenge was to take the material from the three-day FHAT Event and present it in ten minutes. Holy Smoke!

At first, I didn't think I could do it. It was soooo challenging. Luckily, my head is kinda geared towards sorting this stuff out - I love to take a complex subject and simplify it down to the essentials.

So I put on some music and got my brain into gear. I started at 4pm and didn't finish until 5am the following day. That's eleven solid hours spent creating a ten-minute presentation. CRAZY!

Hands up, guys - at the event I ran over time by seven-minutes (sorry, Russell). But you get the picture? Twelve years of teaching - turned into a two hundred hour membership site, then condensed to create a three-day live FHAT event, finally turned into a ten-minute (ok, *cough* seventeen minutes) presentation.

Well, all this condensing got me thinking…

Sometimes you have a fantastic product that you've been selling it face to face, but it's not selling online the way you want it to.

Here’s the problem (and most entrepreneurs have been through this at some time):

You decide that you're going to sell a something - so you go out and find a product that is selling well. That's smart. That makes sense.

However, once you find your product, then you just kind of toss it out there and kind of hope that people start buying it. And that's the extent of your plan. I've definitely done that before… and then been shocked that no one's buying. Duh!

The truth is if you want to take less risk and make your product launches more successful - you need a better way.

A bit more work up front is the best way to ensure a launch that goes well, makes money while serving both you and your customer…

Often when things don’t go well, we think it’s a problem with the funnel. However, it's usually NOT a funnel problem. It's usually a marketing problem! If you can sell your product face to face, but you’re not making online sales, then you're just not doing the necessary ‘marketing’ to qualify your customers in a way that makes the sale easy.  

So, I started to wonder what would be the quickest way to help entrepreneurs create an effective Marketing Plan that would take away the guesswork and risk to bring in a constant stream of qualified leads.

I started distilling the material down again...

My goal was to find a way to design a marketing plan without having to go through two hundred hours of content.

Once again, it took me a whole night of obsessing, but by the time the sun came up, I’d created a two-page document that solved the problem. By filling in a two-page sheet, you can design your offer and the marketing that sells it.

It doesn't matter if you're selling face to face, or on the internet;                   this is the core stuff that anyone would want ever.

About three weeks ago, I taught this method at my own event. It took about six hours. I think that’s the fastest I can teach this while still being effective.

As I was watched people fill out the sheet I could feel the energy in the room change. Suddenly, I’d sense that someone in the front had got it - then another person and another - until the energy of the room was buzzing with people having breakthroughs.

It didn’t matter what kind of funnel they were building - whether it was free plus shipping book funnel, low ticket, high ticket, coaching, agency - it was the same process. It's still the act of selling and putting things together.

‘You need to start creating the marketing and designing the marketing before you freaking launch the product.

I know you might be thinking, ‘Yeah, Steve, that’s obvious!’... But let me ask you, ‘Do you actually do it?’

Before you even go into ClickFunnels and consider building a funnel - you need to take these steps:

Essential Steps Before You Build A Funnel

1. Do not open your ClickFunnel Account ;-)

1. Figure out what's selling and where? Identify the red ocean - what's the current offer that people are paying for?

1. Discover the Story that’s selling those existing products, i.e., What's the sales message/ story that gets your potential customers to open their wallets?

1. Design your New Opportunity. Your aim is to get the sales message to the point where somebody is so excited, that they’ll take their wallet, and whoosh, hurl it at you - then you know you’ve got a winner!

1. Next, go obsess over the fulfillment of your offer.

Once you know that your sales message is good and the fulfillment of the offer is great, then you can freak out over all the bells and whistles of the funnel.

Obviously, you create a rough draft of the funnel to sell your product, but don't obsess over it.

Right now, my funnel is limping on one leg. It’s broken, I know it is. There's lots of stuff that's wrong with it, but I don't want to shift my focus away from what I’m working on yet.

Every time I say that people are shocked, ‘What? Why is your funnel broken, man? You were the lead funnel builder at ClickFunnels. Are you kidding? Why is your one funnel limping along?’

BUT that stuff doesn't matter. The funnel won’t make the sale. What makes the sale is THE SALES MESSAGE.

The success of your product has so much less to do with pages or what color the button is. On a page level that's great, but on a market level you need to figure out:

1. What’s the current offer that people are paying for?

1. What's the sales message that’s working to sell that offer?

That's all Funnel Hacking is. If you know those two things, you’ll have pretty much everything you need to create an opportunity. Then you go and design your New Opportunity before your actual funnel.

You need to be able to stand up and deliver the sales message so that people want to give you cash. It has nothing to do with being online or offline and EVERYTHING to do with your sales message.

The act of putting a product on the internet is just a method to market your sales message.

I love how Joe Polish talks about the difference between Sales and Marketing:

‘Marketing systematizes and automates selling. Marketing is selling in advance.’ - Joe Polish

Sales is an activity that happens face to face.

It's a whole bunch of logical closes as to reasons why people should act now:

• It's 50% OFF

• Buy one, get one free

• You’ll get ‘this’ bonus

• Act Now!

Marketing is how you get somebody to your face so you can sell to them

Marketing delivers people to your offer who are (to quote Joe Polish again):

• ‘Pre- Interested’

• ‘Pre- Motivated’

• ‘Pre- Qualified’

• ‘Pre- Disposed’

The great news is that the better you are at marketing, the less hardcore sales tactics you’ll have to use. Just think about that:

Marketing delivers people who are ready to do business with you. It’s the act of attracting pre-qualified people in an automated way

so that you don’t have to knock doors or cold call to find them.

In my opinion, selling is the most prestigious career out there, but marketing will take you to the next level.

When I buiIt my first ever  funnel in ClickFunnels, we didn't have  the $97 a month. So we put everything together before we even pushed ‘go’ on the two-week trial.

We designed the funnel. We designed the offer. We designed the videos. We wrote the copy. We had to build the funnel and get customers before ClickFunnels started to bill us. And that’s how we did it.

If I think back through on every successful funnel I've ever had, I’ve taken the time to design the marketing before I ever build the freaking funnel - Every Single Time!

If you've got products that are not doing as well as you want, then take a step back and look at your marketing.

You've got to get into the psyche of the person who's leaving the red ocean. You've got to know the psyche of your prospective customers.

Anyways, I'm excited. I want to do an event where you’ll be able to work through this two-page document with me. You’ll design your sales message, your story and your offer in a way that attracts customers easily from the red ocean.

It doesn't matter what funnel you apply it to; this is the first step that you need to take before you even open ClickFunnels...

My wife is due to have our third kid any day now. She keeps having contractions, and I'm going to sleep with an eye open so that I can be ready. I don’t exactly know when the event will be, but I’m thinking sometime in August - so stay tuned, and I’ll let you know.

Until next time- Go Crush It!

Want me to speak at your next event or mastermind? Let me know what I can share that would be most valuable by going to stevejlarsen.com and book my time now.

The Purple Ocean

A few days ago I was in San Diego preparing to go on stage. If you’d seen me, (and I’m kinda glad you didn’t), you might have thought I was a bit strange.

There I was with my headphones on, eyes closed, intently focused on getting into the zone. Pacing around the room to music like a crazy person.

I love speaking because there's a sort pressure cooker effect that happens before I talk on stage.

Somehow my neurons start firing extra fast, and all these ideas begin to percolate in my head.

I become obsessed with how to get my message across clearly and in the most beneficial way for my audience.

If you’d been a fly on the wall... (shhh) you might even have seen me dancing.

I do whatever it takes to get those connections firing in my brain. I’m fixated with making hard to chew concepts as SIMPLE and exciting as possible...

‘Cause ‘ain't nobody loves a yawn fest.’

So, picture me, shaking my moves and freaking out about the Red Ocean versus Blue Ocean idea that Russell talks about in Expert Secrets. It’s such a great concept!

The Red Ocean is a PROVEN Market.

The Red Ocean is safe because you already know that people want the product. However, it's risky because tough competition means that you'll have to compete on price.

So the chances of you making a whole lot of money are slim - #urrrgh!

The Blue Ocean is a NEW OPPORTUNITY for your market!

The Blue Ocean is where you'll find yourself if you create an offer that's prolific - Something different to what’s already out there.

Sure, there's a lot less competition... BUT, you’re still taking a RISK - because your offer isn't proven. How do you know if anyone actually wants it... or what they’re willing to pay you for it??? *Fatal Flaw Alert*

Then, it hit me:

Here’s the Equation:

Red Ocean = Product Security + Intense Competition = RISK

Versus

Blue Ocean = No Competition + Less Market Security = RISK

‘Holy Batman... It’s Catch 22!’

So, what do you do…

How do you combine the Security of the Red Ocean with the Opportunity of the Blue Ocean? Can you minimise risk, serve more people and MAKE MORE MONEY?

Is it even possible?

Relax!

This is where my pacing, dancing, and obsession pays off ;-)

‘Welcome to the Purple Ocean of Opportunity’

The Purple Ocean is a mixture of the Red & Blue Ocean…

Think about it...

You mix the best aspects of the Red and the Blue Ocean together, and you create the Purple Ocean!

‘The Purple Ocean provides the Security of the Red Ocean with the Opportunity of the Blue’

So, you might be thinking, ‘Yeah, this sounds great Stephen, but how does it work?

Let me explain:

Recently, when I’ve been putting together my offers, I’ve been using the Purple Ocean Concept to great effect.

My students have been feeling it’s impact too. It’s sooo incredibly powerful!

How to Create a Purple Ocean Offer

When you create an offer, make sure that you take elements from the Red Ocean and combine them with elements from the Blue Ocean that you want to guide your customers towards.

The mixture of the elements from the Red and Blue Ocean creates a Purple Ocean Offer. This provides the SECURITY and SAFETY of the Red Ocean while gently guiding your customer over to the prolific NEW OPPORTUNITY of the Blue Ocean - where you have more control and less competition.

Your customers will often guide you and let you know which elements from the Red Ocean are needed to help make them feel safe and secure.

Entrepreneur’s Dilemma

‘If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.’ - Henry Ford

It’s fascinating to look at the significant industry shifting products, like the iPhone, because they often follow the same Purple Ocean method.

Steve Jobs had a vision of what was possible. He produced an entirely revolutionary product. However, he made sure that his product fulfilled the needs of Red Ocean customers as well as the those of the more innovative early adopters.

‘You can't just ask customers what they want and then try to give that to them. By the time you get it built, they'll want something new.’ -Steve Jobs

Jobs, recognised the same issue as Ford.

As an entrepreneur, you need to do the same.

It’s your job to hold a vision of what’s possible for your customers - while adding the safety and familiarity of Red Ocean elements to your offer.

That way you help your customers to transition to your New Offer in a stress-free way.

For Example:

If your customers are convinced that the only way to make phone calls is with a mobile service provider, then you have to make sure that your offer includes the SECURITY of that service.

You can then throw wifi calls and facetime into the mix - and gradually win them over to the NEW and the prolific.

Freaked out, scared customers who are unsure of your product are the least likely to part with their cash. They’ll refuse to buy into your vision - however amazing it is.

They’ll keep their money in their wallets until they find a solution that fits their preconceived ideas.

Think about how many people resisted getting an iPhone (or even a Smart Phone) when they first came out! It was just too much for them to take on board: ‘Why would I want to facetime anyone- my phone is enough for me.’

Looking back on my MLM product, this is exactly the approach I took:

A customer would reach out and say, ‘Steve, this looks great… but does it do ‘this’?’

Very quickly I began to notice the elements I needed to add to convince my customers to buy. It was always elements from the Red Ocean, so I’d pull them in and add them to my stack …

And without knowing it, I created a Purple Ocean where they could feel both safe and excited. BOOM!

Even with a small ad budget, my product made $100,000 in its first month, and $25,000 - $50,000 each subsequent month.

It’s doing really well... Even with a ‘broken funnel’ (more about that in my next post)...

One of the main reasons for this success is the Purple Ocean that my product is swimming in!

So before you create an offer stack…

Ask yourself these questions:

Are your customers looking at your offer in a suspicious way because it is too prolific/ new/ revolutionary?

What is the ‘current’ Red Ocean norm and is your offer too far away from it?

What elements from the Red Ocean can you add to your stack to help your customers feel safe - to help them make the transition to your Blue Ocean more easily?

Honestly, try it - I think you’ll be amazed at the structure and clarity it will give your offer creation.

And, most importantly, the effect that creating a Purple Ocean of Opportunity will have on your wallet!

I know this is going to help you CRUSH IT with your offer creation. Until next time… Go Kill It!

If you want me to speak at your next event or mastermind? Let me know what I can share that would be most valuable by going to SteveJLarsen.com and book my time now.

This is quite an emotional post for me.

I’m sitting in a hotel room in San Diego. It’s the hotel where we've been doing an event for the ClickFunnels ‘Two Comma Club’ Coaching Program. It’s been an intense few days - loads of fun, but extremely busy.

On Thursday and Friday, I had my own event.  On Sunday, I took a flight to San Diego and finished some big projects. Then on Monday night, I stayed up until 2am to complete the slides for my ‘Two Comma Club’ presentation on Tuesday.  It’s been event after event after event. Kinda crazy, but I really enjoy it.

Today, I’m sitting in my hotel room feeling tired. Tired, but incredibly grateful. I’m looking out over San Diego Bay and thinking about how much my life has changed. If you've been to San Diego you’ll know that the bay is beautiful - it’s absolutely amazing.  When I walked into my hotel room, I saw it had these windows all over the place and a fantastic view of the whole bay. I actually started crying - because only two years ago, I'd bootstrapped my way to San Diego to attend Funnel Hacking Live. And… it was THAT event that changed my life.

In the grand scheme of my lifetime - two years is no time at all. Seriously, I can hardly believe that two years ago my family struggled to afford anything more than the basics of life. Financially, things couldn't be more different now. However, more than the financial changes, I can't believe how much I've changed as a person. I can't believe all the things that have happened to me- and the lessons that I've learned.

From my room, with the amazing windows, I can see the hotel where the 2016 Funnel Hacking Live Event was held. It's right there between two of the buildings in front of me - that's why I cried. So many memories came flooding back.

You probably know the story of how I broke I was in 2016; I had a young family to support and seventeen failed businesses to my name. All of which doesn’t make you feel great. I had people depending on me, but I just couldn't get things to work out the way I wanted them to. I think most entrepreneurs have a similar story. It's not like you get taught this stuff in school. Most of us just kinda 'try it’ until we find out what works and what doesn't work. What sells and what doesn't sell. We go through a process of elimination. Man, but sometimes, it’s tough.

In March 2016, I was determined to get to Funnel Hacking Live. I didn't have enough money, so I’d decided that I’d adopt the entrepreneur's attitude that Robert Kiyosaki talks about. I decided to get resourceful, and get myself to Funnel Hacking Live anyway I could.'

“Never say you cannot afford something. That is a poor man’s attitude. Ask HOW to afford it.” -Robert Kiyosaki

I knew that if I could just find a way to get to FHL, that my life would change. Looking back, I had no idea how much - but somehow, I knew that it was imperative for me to go. So I got resourceful and bartered funnel builds for a ticket, followed by flights and hotel rooms.

I was so pumped when I made it to FHL.  But even when I got there, things weren’t exactly easy. I didn't eat much - because I couldn't afford to. I cycled to the event on one of those city bikes. You know, those little street bikes. I literally took my luggage, put it over my shoulder, and while I was balancing it over my shoulder, I pedaled all the way around the bay to the event.  I didn't have much cash, and what little I did have, I wasn't gonna spend on a freakin' taxi.

Imagine how I feel today-

From my gorgeous hotel room with all the windows and the view of the bay, I can even see the hotel where I stayed in 2016.

The hotel that I didn’t barter enough for a bed in for my final night. The hotel where I spent a night sat in the lobby going over my FLH notes like they were gold dust because I didn’t have a room. Those notes meant everything to me- I didn’t want to forget anything I learned. I didn’t have a bed, but I felt rich and excited in so many other ways.

Last night, I stood at my hotel window watching the ships going out on the bay, and I got a bit introspective. I stood there for a long time thinking. Then suddenly, the thought came into my head, 'Man, how did this all happen? How did I go from a broke college student struggling to support his family to the Lead Funnel Builder at Clickfunnels, then to running a successful business with so many opportunities around me all the time?'

I felt a bit shell shocked- so I went for a walk around the pier, right out there, eating Haagen-Daz and talking to my wife about how it all happened. It's just fascinating for me to think through all the pieces that brought us here. And the more I started to think about it, the more I realized that:

'I don't think I'd actually be here if I'd had money to get to Funnel Hacking Live 2016.  I don't know that I would have treated everything that Russell said with so much conviction at that event - if I'd had the cash to get a taxi.'

Interesting, isn't it? That the pursuit of my dream to get to FHL is what actually opened the gateway for all these other cool things to happen.  That the pursuit of hard stuff is what got me to where I am now. It’s why it's all worked out. Let me explain...

THE OBSTACLE IS THE WAY

In my office, I have a wall full of quotes that I use to inspire me and keep me on track. One of then is from Ryan Holiday (I totally recommend his books btw). Anyway, this particular quote has come to mean a lot to me. It kinda symbolizes my journey in so many ways. And when I talk to other successful entrepreneurs, they always have the same story.

'The obstacle is the way' - Ryan Holiday.

This is such a useful mantra to have in your life. For instance, every time I don't know what to do, I make an effort to think about where the blockage is- and it's always in the pursuit of solving the problem that I move forward. Everything else that I try to do is just an easy distraction. Each time I overcome an obstacles, not only does my business grow, but it also adds to my attractive character- which helps people to relate to me even more. In short, the path of the obstacle ALWAYS ends up being ‘the thing’ that I needed all along.

I don't know that I'd have been hired at ClickFunnels if I’d had the money to get to FHL. I wouldn't have ferociously built funnels for other companies in exchange for tickets, flights and hotel rooms. I learned ClickFunnels so freakin' well by not having the cash. I had no other option. Before I got my fourteen-day free Clickfunnels trial, I planned out an entire funnel to make sure that I could start building straight away. Then I kissed my wife goodbye and hid in a room for two weeks. I worked solidly because I needed paying customers before my trial was up. I learned at a ferocious, desperate pace because of this limitation.

When I saw an advert for Funnel Hacking Live, I knew that we didn't have the cash to get me there. I could have got all despondent, but instead, I decide to lean into the obstacle and get resourceful. I remember thinking: 'How can I make this work? I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna make it work.' It was this resourcefulness that gave me all the background, all the experience and all the stories that sold Russell on why I should be his guy.

So if you have some limitation right now,  if you have something that's standing in your way - whether it comes in the form of self-doubt or financial constraints - I want you to lean into it, get resourceful and find a way. Give yourself that gift.

PICKING YOUR OBSTACLE

Obviously, you need to be careful that you don’t just select obstacles randomly. You need to consider the following points:

1. First of all figure out where you're trying to get to, and even if you don't have like a clear picture, just kind of a general idea what it is you're trying to go for is enough.

1. Secondly, make sure any obstacle you pick is ‘on purpose’ and will help you to achieve your goal - don’t get distracted by things that only give you an excuse to avoid the actual thing that you don’t want to do, i.e, ‘I think I’ll design a logo’- when what you really need to do is get visible and publish.

1. Thirdly, ask: Will overcoming this obstacle add to your attractive character/ story/ or hook?

1. Fourth, remember that attractive characters compete on differences. You're competing on you evolving your own self.

LIVING YOUR HOOK

I remember biking to the first day of FHL with this distinct thought in my head:

'I’ve given so much to be here that’ll do whatever Russell tells me to do- except I will never publish.’

And funny enough, lo and behold, I go, I go to that very first day bright eyed, bushy tailed. I get to the event, and I'm like, 'Hey I'm here to learn, I'm here to execute and take action.’ Then literally, on the very first day, Russell stands up and tells everyone, ‘You’ve gotta start publishing like crazy!’ And I was like 'Crap! I don't wanna do that. Are you kidding me? That's the exact thing I said I didn't wanna do. I don't wanna do that. There's no way I'm gonna do this.'

I was so freakin' shy. Seriously, I got the 'nicest guy' in school award purely based on the fact that I hardly said anything. Inside I was a teenage rage machine, but nobody knew that because I didn't tell them. I just stayed quiet in my own little world. Not exactly premium podcasting material, you might be thinking?  Now with my podcasts combined, they're crossing 160 thousand downloads. It blows my mind. It's only been a year and a half.  Eighteen months of me practicing becoming the attractive character in front of you- rather than waiting to be perfect. I'd never have learned half the lessons I have if I'd waited until I was READY (ahem- maybe never) to start publishing. And that's one of the reasons I love and appreciate every one of you guys- because you've been with me on the journey. I have such a huge following, and it's because I didn't wait to be the expert or the guru to start publishing and you can relate to me with all my challenges and limitations. Even though I didn’t want to Idid it exactly as Russell said. Even though it didn't come naturally to me and it was the LAST THING I wanted to do at the time. It took me until around episode 85 to finally find my flow. Just imagine what would have happened if I'd given up before then!

What I'm trying to help you understand is that whatever your limitation is right now, whatever you've got to go through, just do it. Lean into it, not away from it. Don't pull back. These are the things that will create the crazy hooks that you can use as stories later on in your life and business.

'Completely broke college student goes to work at Russell Brunson’s side. He then leaves his secure nine to five in the best company ever to follow his dreams and make his own million dollar funnel.'

It's a good story, right? Or what about:

'Pathologically shy person, who hardly ever spoke, overcomes his fears of speaking in public and hits 160 thousand podcast downloads in only eighteen months.'

Sounds good, right?

I had to live both of those stories for them to actually become real hooks and mean anything.

When I coach, I notice that a lot of people aren't willing to live the crazy hook. It's not that they have a lack of things that could be amazing hooks, it's that they're not willing to live the path that makes the hook real. So I just want you to understand how key this concept is.

It's kinda like the 'Fit to Fat to Fit' guy. He was super fit, and nobody believed that his methods could help them lose weight. He just wasn’t believable. They thought: ‘Yeah, you’ve always been slim and healthy - it’s easy for you- but it won’t work for me.’  So to prove them wrong, he spent a lot of time overeating. He got really really overweight. He did it on purpose. Then he invested a whole bunch of time to get fit again-  just to prove that it was possible for anyone to lose weight using his methods. He was willing to live his hook.

Are you willing to live your hook? If you're selling yourself- or your expertise - and people are buying into YOU, then you've got to be willing to Live Your Hook. Those places in your life where you feel stuck, use them as a challenge. Come up with some crazy ridiculous way to get around it. That's your hook. Live that. Then be willing to document your journey along the way. Don’t worry about being perfect or getting everything right… Perfection doesn’t create an attractive character who people find it easy to love, follow, believe in… AND, eventually buy from.

Leaning into my limitations meant that when I went to FHL, I was already an expert funnel builder. Two days later I'm sitting across from Russell Brunson being interviewed. Twenty minutes after that I got the job offer. Two days after that I graduate from college. Two days after that I was sitting next to Russell as his Funnel Building Assistant. The truth is that you can't always see the opportunities that are just around the corner...  Or what opportunities may come your way because you've faced an obstacle and pushed your limits...

During my interview with Russell, he asked me about my history with ClickFunnels.  I know that they checked out my ClickFunnels account hardcore to make sure that I was already a good builder. If my limitations hadn’t meant that I had to get good at building funnels fast, I wouldn’t have had an impressive portfolio to show him - and I probably wouldn’t have got the job.

The whole point of  writing this is that I want to challenge you to look at your limitations in a different light. Start seeing them as they way forward instead of something to be avoided. Use them as fuel to move forward, instead of a weight to hold you back. Remember: ‘The Obstacle is the WAY.

Thanks for reading. I have to go now as my wife is literally due to give birth any day soon. The event just ended and Dave was like “Hey man, do you just wanna fly home tonight?" And I was like "Yes. Absolutely in case she goes into labor.” So I am heading home right now. I'm packing up my bags, and I'm gone in just a few minutes. I’m actually gonna miss the flight unless I leave right now! Alright guys, talk to you later. Bye. Go kill it.

Got a question you’d like me to answer live on my podcast? Head over to salesfunnelradio.com and ask your question now.

If you wanna know how I've launched all my content, I ripped the audio from my presentation at Russell Brunson's Inner Circle...

Hey, what's going on, everyone? It's Steve Larsen. You're listening to Sales Funnel Radio and I'm excited for this episode. What I did for this episode is I wanted to rip the audio from the presentation that I gave at the Inner Circle.

We just barely had the Inner Circle, and it was packed. It was one of the bigger groups. It was a bunch of fun, just absolutely loved it.

I thought I'd rip from you guys the presentation. If you don't know the way that those presentations are handled, everybody gets up and everybody speaks, but the way it is ... One of the reasons I like this Mastermind so much ... I've seen others, I've watched ...

What I like is everybody's very giving, and so what we do is we stand up and everybody gives something incredible to the group; either something that's working, some cool hacks, something that's cutting edge, something that's just jaw-dropping, "Oh, my gosh! That's incredible."

You know what I mean?

Then, at the end of it there's an ask and you ask, "Hey, these are the things I'm struggling with. Could you guys help me with X, Y, and Z?" That combination between the two where you've given before you ask is amazing. We obviously see that in selling to our customers and selling to everybody.

The more you can give, obviously, create this feeling of reciprocity, well, it's no different inside of the Inner Circle.

What I did is I ripped the audio from my presentation. We only have 22 minutes, it's really, really fast, so I would love to dive more deeply into this at some point, as this is a topic that I've been obsessing over recently. Anyways, this is cool stuff, and this is how I launched my podcast.

A lot of you guys continue to ask me those questions...

If you have never heard the episode 60 and 61 of Sales Funnel Radio, it will walk you through my content strategy, how I handle it all, but I think you'll like from the standpoint of, as far as how I stack together my episodes when I launch my shows. This is super powerful.

I've had a lot of students now who are actually in top-rankings of iTunes with their podcasts, because of the same strategy that I teach with these, so this is powerful stuff.

Know that there is a lot of data behind it, there's a lot of success stories behind it. I know the strategy works, this is how I launched my own stuff.

Anyway, take notes if you were thinking ... Especially, if you're going to do a blog, or a podcast or whatever, it doesn't matter if you're going to do a podcast or not. This is any type of content strategy, as far as what do you say? What are you doing? How do you call your shot?

How do you become the guru on the mountain without being perceived as an idiot or a jerk or self-centered?

This is how you do it, and I'm excited for this episode. Anyways, we'll cut over to the show here and this is the audio again of my presentation to the Inner Circle. Thanks for listening.

I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today, and now I've left my 9:00 to 5:00 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels.

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

Hey, I'm excited for this, though. I have waited so freaking long to be a part of this group. It's cool. I'm like a combo of really introspective moment, look back, and like, "Yeah," at the same time. That's what I feel like, anyway.

It's been a long road, though. When I first saw that email come in from Russell I was walking through the basketball gym, and I started reading the email. I'm like, my face as I'm reading it goes like, "Oh, it's from Russell," and that's when my face starts going, I was like, "No!"

I stopped and I responded to him that the Inner Circle is closing. I was like, "Don't close, I'm on my way! I don't have $25,000."

I showed him the email like six months ago. He was like, "You know it was an autoresponder, right?" I was like, "Yeah, I know. I just needed to ..." because I didn't see that. Anyway, so it's a good email, though. [inaudible 00:04:01] I could show you some day.

I want to show you my support team for how I got here. This is my support team.

That's Maya. I call her Thigh master, because her thighs are like the two-year-old 12-ounce steaks. Do you know what I mean? Chewy thigh. Anyway, she's the Thigh master. That's Brnley. I call her Pack and Play, because she will randomly dive at me off of couches with no warning.

Anyway, she's awesome, playful. Here's my wife. I call her Princess Babe. That's been the name in my phone since we dated, because ... well, duh.

The whole thing started though when I was ... I really wanted to go to Funnel Hacking Live in 2016. I had no cash for it. I started bootstrapping my way there and I started trading funnels for plane tickets. Funnels for hotel nights. Funnels for event nights. Things like that.

I remember I was riding my ... I was riding ... Do you know those city bikes in San Diego? You can rent them or whatever, slide a card in. What money I had, I did not want to go and actually spend money on a cab. We were living off loans. I had been building funnels for companies and making them successful. I just hadn't charged for stuff yet,

I was just trying to make my story...

I was staying on the other side of San Diego, and I had my luggage over my shoulder riding my bike over to Funnel Hacking Live through the city, around the bay. That's how I did it.

As I was riding the bike over there, I was like, "I'm going to do whatever this man tells me to do, but I will never publish." That was the sentence that came out of my noggin. I was like, "I'm never, ever, ever going to do this publishing game. I do not want to be one of those publishing people. I will not become a character on Facebook Live. I'm not doing any of that. I'm not doing it." The first-

Character in a comic book.

Right? The first day ... Right? I know! Then the first day, and part of it was because I was voted the nicest kid in high school in my graduating class, but it was because I was shy. I had this near clinical fear of adults and massive anxiety; huge insecurities, I've dealt with a lot. Even into my early 20s. It's true. That's why I was like, "I'm never going to do that."

The first thing he says is, "Everyone should start publishing a lot." I was, "Crap! It's the thing I don't want to do!" I gave a lot to get there. We take the picture.

Two day later I was interviewing here, and two days after that graduated, two days after that I was sitting next to The Man.

I'm seeing Russell going on the camera, "What's up everybody?" Then, he's over on podcast, "What's up everybody?" Then on blog typing, "What's up everybody?" I'm like, "There's something to this publishing thing. I've got to do this." Since then, I want to ... I didn't ... I spent three hours trying to figure out the question to ask you guys on Wednesday.

I realized, sitting here, you guys already answered it. I was like, "Dang it," but I couldn't believe how many of you are not publishing, because I started with, not just with no email list, there was no list.

No one knew who I was. I want to show you how I launched these two podcasts, because today we should cross 160,000 downloads. It's freaking nuts. It's the content strategy behind it.

I'm going to show you guys real quick the strategy behind it. I just want you to know that it works. Here is, as of six weeks ago, six people I brought through, they're in the top, if not 100, then 25 for the MLM category in iTunes now. I'm going between number one and number two on Stitcher. Darn you, [Simon Chan 00:07:24]. I will beat him. I'm number six in that category. Then, if you look at the Sales Funnel side. I want to show you how I did it as a seriously shy person.

Everyone of you have to do this. If you guys have massive businesses with these cool audiences, you are sitting on a goldmine. I want to show you real quick how I did it. With Sales Funnel Radio, the way I started it, that was when I started about a year and a half ago. There's been no ad spend on any of these. Can't spend it profitably yet, so I'm not.

Anyways, if you think about this is the concept I came up with as I was launching this. I was so scared I didn't know what to talk about. I chose not to talk. What I did is I thought, I'm going to reach two levels up at all time. If I go through and I say, "If this I me and my level of influence as a brand new person, and there's someone who's a little bit above me, someone who's a little bit above me," and it's like C-list influencers; people who have sway.

People with lists...

You think through, "Oh, my gosh. There's someone above them. Someone above them. Then there's Russell Brunson. Wow!" Let's say it's Tony Robbins, which in my mind I've switched now. "The Pope!" We got at the very top ... Who's at the top?

Batman. Okay? All right. You think through that. I thought, "What if I get other people to do the talking for me and I just provide the platform?" I'm just the platform. It is ridiculous what it has done for me. The Dream 100 comes to you when you are able to boost their status.

I started getting a whole bunch of people to just get on my show. This is the pattern that I used to launch that first show.

My very first episode wasn't even me talking. I was so scared. I was like, "Who's two levels above?" Then when I felt like I had reached up, I reached another two. I reached another two. I didn't want to be ... and it's no hit against John Lee Dumas, but that's all he does; interview, interview, interview.

I don't want to get asked just interview questions. I also want to be seen and positioned as an expert when I do, so I lace in podcasts with myself and what I'm learning.

I was sitting with a student in Dallas a little bit ago, a month ago, and we were chatting. He goes, "What are you going to do on episode 157?" I don't know, I'll figure that out when I end 156. He was like, "Well, aren't you going to run out of things to say?" I had this realization.

You think I already know what I'm going to talk about. The huge secret is that you're learning with me. I can't batch four months of content, because I don't know if I'm going to be able to scrunch four months of learning into that amount of time. That's not my style. When I saw ... Anyway.

When I saw [Peng Joon 00:09:53] do his thing, I was like, "Oh, we're super close to that already." I got six people. We have the sweet concept machine that's been moving and just a few tweaks and we're super close to what he's been doing. This is how I launched the first one.

The second one I did, this was amazing, was, I thought through ... If you think through what the perfect webinar script is, it's not just for webinars. It is the basis of persuasion. What I started thinking through is, oh my gosh, what if I just took the first part of the perfect webinar script and I write an ordinance story for the audience I want to be buying from me later.

The audience that I believe will listen to me. This is in an MLM space, and I took some concepts that everyone believes you need to be successful in that space. "Talk to friends and family. Lose all your relationships." I go through and I just  rocks at them as hard as I can.

I literally wrote a webinar script and I wrote an ordinance story, the three more stories for the secrets and I turned them sideways; so episode number one was the ordinance story, episode number two was this story only for secret number one. The next episode's only the story for secret number two, only secret number three.

Then, that let me go through ... By then, they're so freaking sold, so sold. I haven't even sold them anything, but I have tons of people who reach out to me consistently. Many of you have already. You're in here. They're like, "I listen to your podcast. It's amazing. When are you going to ask for my money somewhere?" I'm like, "Well, you just wait."

Anyways, this is what I thought, is what if I combined them? That's what I've been teaching to my students lately and it is killing it. They're all over on iTunes and because what they've essentially done is sold their audience on why they should continue subscribing and listening.

I combine them. Instead what I do, is I say, okay the first five episodes is going to be literally a sideways webinar. The next after that, I go through and I call my shot publicly and I say, "I have not done the thing that I'm here to show you that I've done yet. Instead, I want to show you that I'm just a few steps ahead and I will document my entire journey, both the successes and the failures.

You won't want to miss this. If you don't want to go through the same pain yourself, follow me and sidestep it." It is crazy what happens.

We're not at 3,000 or 4,000 downloads a day, but we're about 800-ish now. It's been awesome what that does. It's ridiculous. People feel like they know you so well when you get vulnerable with them. I talk about all this stuff. I talk about how shy I was as a kid. I talk about Russell was going, "What's happening you guys? What's happening guys? What's happening guys?"

I learned this and that. It's really cool to see if you take the standpoint of a reporter and become the expert in front of them, crazy what that does.

Here's the funnel that I kind of made up, but it works super well. I went through and I figured out, on all the end of my podcasts as well ... I'm going to hurry because there's something I want to ask you guys. I create this ridiculous bait. Something that is so insatiable and I say, go to blah-blah-blah.com and check it out. It's a free course, and when they go opt in, what they're actually doing, on the very first thing is my ordinance story again, that's the first video.

Then I tell them, if you opt in, I'll give you this cool free course. Thank you so much. It's like a 72% off  on the thing, still, it's crazy, crazy. I haven't sold anything to them yet. I pre-frame the crap out of them, though.

Over the next six days, it's essentially a product launch funnel. They don't know it. "It's a free course," but it's a product launch funnel. Underneath every video is the option for them to go learn and experience more from me. It just goes through my webinar registration page and I sell. My best sales, my best customers, my best advocates, Dream 100 people, future affiliates, all come from my podcast, not my ads. My hardest customers come from my ads. Anyway.

That's super cool. I have a four-and-a-half-hour course I created on this.  Which as a gift to all of you guys, I will give it to all of you.

It's super cool, if I may say so myself. It's pretty epic. It blows me away. I'm like, "Holy crap! A lot of you guys aren't publishing." I didn't even know how to get as big as you have been without doing this stuff. I'm excited for you to plug that in. If you have any questions, ask campaign.

Can I ask really quick, you just ...them, like, "Ha!" Your hardest customers come from your ads. Your easiest customers come from your content ... Anyway, it just makes you think the frame they go through. It makes me want to take all my crappy hard ad customers and shove them to something like a podcast so that they become good customers and then we sell that at that point.

Anyway. That's-

Well, what I realized ... I studied Ryan Holiday like a beast. When you think about it, what controls public opinion? Publications do. Right? All of our ideas, our cultural ideas, come from the news.

Whoever controls content, controls ideas. What I'm doing is creating ... I have the funnel going, which is awesome and it's doing really well, but I'm creating a content machine that can go through and it is repurposing the crap out of everything that I do to the nth degree.

I've figured out I spend about $20,000 a month in hard cost in just my content machine only, because it spreads the ideas.

I'm trying to change the MLM industry. I will not do that on my own, so instead I create mini-me's, teach them how to do it as well. When we are the only ones talking, the highest ranked on iTunes across blogs and everywhere, we affect ideas and belief. That's what I'm doing.

Real quick, I want to ... I got to go. The reason this works is because story amplifies value. When you think about your offers, your offer has generic value inside of it. This American flag, what's the material cost for this flag? $20? Meaning retail value, probably about $20, maybe a dollar to actually manufacture. Watch.

This certificate is from a senator ordering that this flag be flown on the White House for me specifically. Now, how much value just got added to this? It's worth way more than $20. I'll not trade it for that either. Isn't it interesting? Most the reason why you can't sell your thing for what you want to when you start doing things on a..., "Oh, my gosh. They just don't believe me."

It's because your story suck. They don't understand yet. There's already inherent value in the flag, but what amplifies and explodes on multiples and exponential curve is story, because story gives context.

Just one more thing before I ... I got to show you what I'm stuck on, because ... Dark example, a man walks down an alley. He shoots another man, and he dies. Context, it's a war zone.

Shifted everything. Story creates context. Context amplifies value...

Anyway. Is that helpful?

Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

Freaking, geek out on this stuff like crazy. It's the fastest 22 minutes of my life. Oh, my gosh. I already talk fast, I'm winded. Okay.

Wow. Thanks for listening. Yeah, please remember to write and subscribe.

Hey, you want me to speak at your next event or Mastermind? Let me know what I can share that would be most valuable by going to SteveJLarsen.com and book my time now.

I'm STOKED that Peng got on my show. Come learn how he transformed both his audience and himself in his crazy story...

What's going on everyone, it's Steve Larsen and you are listening to Sales Funnel Radio. This episode is a little bit different. I had the incredible honor of having Peng Joon on the show with me.

And if you don't know who he is I've heard him described many times as the Tony Robbins of Asia, actually by a lot of other big people.

Anyways, he's very, very impressive...

Millions and millions of followers. This was a huge honor to have him on.

What I was trying to do is I was trying to do a Zoom interview so that I could record him, and I together, so you could see our faces and have the first video episode of Sales Funnel Radio.

The issue is that he is in Malaysia, and I am here in Boise Idaho. We both have fast internets. I think literally the fact that we were on the other side of the world from each other, the internet was not agreeing with that. So anyways, I had ripped the audio from it instead and just do audio only.

This interview is incredible you guys. How should I say this? The quality of my life, but also the direct thickness of my wall has been impacted directly from Peng Joon, and especially what he taught at Funnel Hacking live, and the things that he's doing.

I watched him for quite some time and he is very, very, impressive. I was incredibly honored to have him on.

So anyways, excited for the interview. Please definitely take notes, and if there's little glitches or whatever here and there with the sound, or the interview I apologize with that. Again, a lot of it had to do with just I was being on the other side of the world.

We eventually had to turn off our video, and just do an audio interview. So if it's a little glitchy here and there I apologize, but this is worth your time to learn and listen of what he's doing.

In fact, much of the inner circle now is calling their own content strategy they coined it the Peng Joon method. It is because of how powerful this stuff has been in their own content curation and generation, and spreading it all over the world.

Guys, I'm just very thankful for you guys being here and listening to Sales Funnel Radio. Please go take notes and welcome to this episode with Peng Joon.

I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. Now I left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt completely from scratch?...

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business. Using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

Alright guys, hey I'm excited for this. This is gonna be so much fun. I've had this individual on my list of people that would be a dream to interview for actually a long time. There's an actual list, and I'm blown away right now.

I'm gonna try not to blush too much. This is gonna be a bunch of fun. I actually have on here, Peng Joon.

He has such a gigantic following, and the way that he's done is actually amazing to me, totally astounding. And has had a direct impact on literally the way that I do my personal business, as well as I know a lot of you guys as well, so this is gonna be a bunch of fun to dive on in.

Anyways, without further ado I welcome you to the show. How's it going Peng?

Peng Joon: Hey, I'm good.

Steve Larsen: Thanks for taking the time over there I know it's a historical day like you said.

Peng Joon: That's right. I'm just so excited. It's one in the morning right now, but I don't think I'm gonna be sleeping any time soon, because I'm just so excited. History made here in Malaysia.

Steve Larsen: So cool. You just went and voted, and waiting for results is that what it is right now, everyone's waiting?

Peng Joon: Yes, that's right.

Steve Larsen: That's so cool. Thanks for taking the time to do this especially during such a big day over there as well. For everyone else, first of all if you're not following Peng, he's one of the go to people. I watch everything he does, okay.

Go follow him. Go do everything he says to...

How did you get started with this whole thing? You kind of talked a little bit about it at Funnel Hacking live, and you were showing a video of how you first started out on stage. It was amazing.

I think it broke everyone's beliefs on the ability to be successful like this. Can you just for everyone else you mind just talking a little bit about that what you were doing?

Peng Joon: So here's the quick back story. For my entire life I've always been this really shy, introverted kid. When I start off with my online journey I just wanted to be anonymous and make money online without speaking to anyone ever.

So what I did was back then I was really struggling. And here in Malaysia things are really different. My first pay slip, I actually got my first job for was about 300 U.S. dollars and it was my monthly pay cheque.

I worked on that job for nearly two years before I realized I need to do something different.

So what I did was I didn't realize I had a strength back then, but I was really passionate about computer games.

I created my first ever digital product which is really like a 32 page World of Warcraft ebook, that was it.

It did well. It enabled me to, and I started scaling to all these other gaming websites and guides, and because I didn't want to be branded as Peng Joon, because I had this limiting believed that I thought to myself nobody would ever buy a product from someone called Peng Joon.

So a lot of these sites I branded under my pen name Tony Sanders which really, true story was Tony Robinson, Colonel Sanders. It was Tony Sanders.

Basically, the turning point was when I had all these different niche websites, and I owned several dating websites in the dating niche as well.

So I was also branded Tony Sanders, and one day without me realizing it I actually set a huge broadcast for a dating offer to my entire gaming list. So I got 400,000 gamers receiving a dating offer, and the spam complaints was really high, and I was using AWeber back then, and they literally shut me down.

And I couldn't believe it because I was paying I think $2500 a month On my bill, and I would never thought they would shut me down, but they did. And used to give me a copy of my email list, and we went back and forth for probably over 10 days.

This is the terms of service it stated here that if you shut me down we are not obligated to give you an email list.

So I really lost my entire business overnight. Because of that, I realized you know what this is an opportunity for me to do something different, and I want to be able to share with other people what I did in my gaming, and all these different niche websites that I did.

So I thought why not teach other people how they too can market what they know based on their life experience, their passion, and learn, monetize what they knew.

So that was the first time ever I actually stepped out of my comfort zone, and decided to ... But I was really shy and introverted, and I still am, but what I did I wanted to improve myself, so I started going all these different speaker trainer events.

I started practicing in front of a camera, in front of the mirror...

It was a journey. That has allowed me to, so it was a lot of journey of self-discovery getting a lot of past my fears, limiting beliefs, and all that kind of stuff. That has enabled me to now speak in many different countries, and more than 20 countries now.

Doing events, doing workshops, retreats all that kind of stuff...

Steve Larsen: There had to have been this moment then, because I actually was very similar. I was so shy. I got the nicest kid award, because no one heard me speak. You know what I mean? I actually really, really it was one of the reasons I wanted to talk to you about this, and ask you about it.

It's actually one of the biggest questions my audience wanted me to ask you as well. When you had this ... I was so afraid to talk to people. If you had the same kind of thing I remember there was this moment for me where I just realized of this self-awareness. “Oh my gosh, I'm shy."

And I didn't know that for a while...

Holy crap. I had to actually start actually doing things kind of like what you did. Was there a moment when you realized, oh my gosh I need to become, I had to become something. I want to shape and shift the way I am. Is there a moment you can think about-

Peng Joon: Oh yeah I remember the moment so vividly. It's basically when I did my first ever event. So back then, after I did all of those different events. For a long time this event organizer, Success Resources, they've always wanted me to speak on their stages. But I always said no, because speaking is not for me...

Eventually, I took a leap of faith and I did my first event...

So back then after going to all these different speaker things and stuff that was when I realized they talked about the stack. Back then it was pretty old school. You would use a flip chart, and you right down the offer and the price, and then you would kind of cross things out.

You give out the bonus, and you say things like, “For first 17 people go to the back room and sign up you get all these different things.” So I did that in my first event, and it was in this huge, it was at the Singapore Expo Hall it was this huge room.

There was about 900 people there. Right after I did my stack and offer my bonus and I said, “For first 17 people go to the back of the room, and sign up.” It was all quiet they were all you know.

My mind was racing, because when I was attending all these different speaker trainer events what would happen is people, all the other participants, do a similarly a table rush, they all stand up go to back room, and give you confidence.

But when I did it for real nothing happened. It was weird, it was awkward. So back then those things were very different to all those, no music, and when I had to walk to the back room.

Just imagine this...

Room of 900 people, huge expo hall, I had to walk back and awkwardly smile to everybody as I walked. It was like the walk of shame. I walked back.

I remember this one of the staff who was working there she asked me, “So Peng Joon do you know how you did?”

And I said, “No so how many people signed up?” I noticed she was avoiding eye contact, and that's when she said, “Yeah well nobody signed up.”

I went back stage and I was sitting down there, and I realized, first of all I was very disappointed. Disappointed in myself, because at that point in time I truly believed that I did my best. I didn't wing it. I spent tens and thousands of dollars attending all these different events and seminars.

I practiced in front of camera, in front of mirror, but doing my best just wasn't good enough. And at the same time I disappointed the audience the value of what I had to offer. The irony was so many people coming up to me Peng Joon it was an amazing presentation.

But nobody bought anything...

That was when I told myself I think speaking is probably not for me.

So I was about to leave the event. The CEO of Success Resources, Richard Tan, he was there. I went up to him I said, “Thank you for inviting me to your event, but as you can see speaking is probably not for me. I might come back to be a conference speaker, but maybe not a sales speaker. What do you want me to do?”

So I was about to leave the event, here is what he told me. He said, “You know Peng Joon we been around for more than 20 years. We worked with the best of the best. We work with people like Tony Robbins, Richard Branson, Robert Kiyosaki, and all these guys.

Worked with best, best and worked with many average speakers that we have seen come and go. And I can tell you right now this is when an average speaker will quit. So you decide if you are average.”

And those words were so powerful...

I really realized that my entire life speaking really was one of those fears that was just one of those things that I could never do, because all of these things I tell myself like I'm not a people person, I'm introverted, I'm shy, and all these different reasons.

I realized, and I asked myself, “What if I could conquer this one fear that I thought I could never do. Then I will be unstoppable.” It was just one moment of decision where I told myself I'm never gonna quit until I really become world class at this.

And that I just continued practicing. I attended more events. I continued just practicing, and eventually I sucked less and less, and eventually I became good. That was the journey...

Steve Larsen: Was there a moment where you were able to sit back and go, “Oh my gosh I actually think this possible.” He said I'm going to be I don't want you to be average go off and do it. You said, “Oh my gosh okay we'll go do it.” And you started moving forward.

When was the moment though where you felt this period of self confidence? It seems to me most entrepreneurs actually know what to do next. They just don't have any confidence to do it.

It's much of a personal development thing as it like hey here's how you make a dollar. Here's how you make money. So is there a moment where you had, you know what I mean, like that first real success where you're like, "I could actually do this"?

Peng Joon: Yes. And I think back then so this was like I think the first time I had it was a few shifts. Number one, the importance of telling your story, which is your struggles as well as your successes.

For me back then all I wanted to do is, my mindset was as long as I went on stage on a platform, and as long as I gave them great value. I will go stream the content give them as much as they can so that they can understand the value that I'll be able to give them on the backend in my offer.

I passed the stories and the struggles of the back story. It was so crucial.

On top of that, and you know this, is that it came from the angle of just teaching. Without really coming from the angle of answering objections, objections about the opportunity. Objections about the limiting beliefs.

Objections about the external. So that was the difference.

Steve Larsen: That's interesting. So a focus itself on when you understood now how to actually go for the objections, and rather than just teach itself. Actually get into the mind of the person. That's interesting. I never heard anyone say that would be one of the things that ...

Peng Joon: 100%. The difference between a world-class speaker/closer, and average one is that a closer understand that the entire presentation is a close. Right from the start, the open, the content, the stack, the close. The entire thing is a close.

To really be able to serve an audience at the highest level it's not about the steps. Even though it might be intuitive to think that it's about the steps it's about the content.

If you really think about it you might be able to give them all the steps, but if you are not covering the objections, their self-limiting beliefs, their attitude, the environment that they're in.

Let's say we're in fitness. I'm teaching people how to get sick, tight abs. So if I taught them the steps, and we all know the steps are. The steps is just eat right, exercise daily. So everybody knows what the steps are.

Everybody wants to get healthy. Everybody wants to look good naked. But reason why people don't do the steps is because of the other 80% which is the why, the desire, their attitude towards it. All that kind of stuff.

The objections that they might have, and therefore in order to really serve the audience at the highest level it's not about just teaching the steps, but rather the other 80%, the mindset and attitude behind it that will make all the difference.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. I appreciate you saying that. So those are the things you identified in your own head started doing to yourself what you do to customers.

That's what pushed you forward...

I want to ask real quick about the way that you do your content, because the content that you create is incredible. I know you batch a lot, you put a lot of it together.

To go from someone who's shy, and introverted to somebody who you are now. You have books that you written, you're an author. You have millions of followers.

Dude, you are so ... and you are in front of massive audiences that you're teaching. You write books about the things that freaked you out at one point. That's amazing.

Could you talk a little bit about how you realized you needed to go heavy into the content creation side of this?

Peng Joon: Yeah. We all know that the algorithm on all these different social media platforms are constantly changing. It's harder, and harder to get rich, especially if it's organic.

For the longest time marketers have always said that the first step you need to be doing in order to get people into your funnel is to collect their name and email address. That's like the golden rule of marketers for the longest time.

But here's the problem. The problem with that is, first of all, that could have been effective maybe fives years ago, but to me a person is going to be a lot more reluctant to give you their name and email address in the first encounter.

And also it's gonna be a lot more expensive...

So to go about that the new way of doing things is really to lead that entire relationship with the value first. To be able to put out content out there where people don't have to ... where there isn't a catch.

Where they don't have to give you a name and email first in order to get value.

So you are able to lead with that, which again putting out content on social media, reaching people who don't know who you are, so you give them value first, and then we target them later for the main email address it becomes a whole lot cheaper.

That relationship is gonna be totally different because it started off with you giving value. That's different.

The rules of the game has changed. It's basically the first thing you need to be doing now is rather than starting off a relationship by getting a person's name and email address, it should be starting that entire process by getting people pixeled in, or into a custom audience where they have engaged their page like, commented, or shared anything on your page, or watched specific videos of more than say 50%.

And then we target them for the opt-in. I know it's a little bit technical here depending on, yeah but that's how it should be done.

Steve Larsen: Makes total sense. Makes total sense. They are already pre-framed what you're gonna talk about. They already pre-framed who you are. False beliefs have already shattered that you didn't even know you're solving. That's amazing.

Peng Joon: And you think about it, it's kind of like going into a club. Getting somebody's name, and email first is really like going into a club, and try to get somebody's name, and phone number in the first five minutes of your conversation.

Maybe some pick-up artists can do it, but it's gonna be tough. However, if after the conversation... with value first that's kind of like perhaps going to a club, and ...who has interest, who's looking at you, and then talking to them. And then building value, building relationship, and then asking them for their...it's going to be easier.

Steve Larsen: So Peng Joon is coming out with a dating tips book very soon with that very strategy right? Sorry for the lag in the internet a little bit everybody.

Peng Joon: ...

Steve Larsen: You are right there? Okay got you.

Peng Joon: ...

Steve Larsen: Awesome. So I wanted to ask you also real quick. Let's say you're a new entrepreneur just starting out. Let's say you redoing this you are starting over again. How much emphasis would you focus on just amassing, because I get this question all the time.

How much focus would you give on amassing a huge following versus making a product that's selling? Would you put one before the other, would you do them in tandem?

Peng Joon: [inaudible 00:21:06] So I mentioned this strategy. One of the thing I always want to make it really clear. The priority for somebody that's starting out should always be building their funnel first.

Be clear about what they are selling, what their offer is, building the funnel before they start messing around with traffic, or social media, or podcasting, or anything like that.

People get caught up with all these distractions they think they need to put up content in bulk they need to do...Facebook when in fact for new entrepreneurs one of the things that they get distracted by is people telling them that they need to do all these different latest tactics and strategies which is like Facebook, or Instagram, or podcasting, and doing a blog post.

When in fact, if you are first starting out the only focus you should have is your funnel. It's getting clear what you're selling, what your offer is, and building up that funnel for that offer.

The best way to tell if you have a funnel is to ask yourself this morning when you woke up, whether you made any sales while you were asleep. And you if you didn't make any sales where you sleep last night means that you don't have a funnel. That should be your core focus before you start dabbling into all these other traffic generating strategies.

Steve Larsen: That's so powerful that you say that, absolutely. Someone has reached out, and they are like, “Well I'm gonna grow this huge following I'm brand new.” I'm like what are they gonna follow you for though?

So at what end what's the end goal there, so when did you know your business was ready for this brilliant content machine that you have?

Peng Joon: I think it was just the progression. There wasn't really a moment in time when ... And I don't think it really happens for anybody where we just wake up and say today is the day we're ready. It's just through little progress every single day, and the little victories along the way. So yeah I don't think there was a moment, and time specifically.

Steve Larsen: Sure. I know that you gave an entire presentation on this on Funnel Hacking Live. Not trying to ask you to do that as well. Can you talk through your process just a little bit at a high level what you do to actually generate all this content?

Peng Joon: So it all begins with the pillar content, which is a video. Shooting a video where you begin with the end in mind, which means you are gonna use highly engaging content as titles, where you will look at, and there are many tools for this [Bust a Move 00:23:44] is one of them, while you look at what content in your market industries already proven to convert by looking at the conversations people already having.

Creating videos based on that topic, and you want to be creating topics that has some sort of polarity, rather than using safe neutral topics.

So what I mean by that is so if you are in a topic of, say wealth. So rather than a safe topic which is how to make more money, a much more powerful video would be here is the reason why you are broke.

That's gonna offend some people, but the people that's gonna be into it is gonna be a lot more engaged. We need to understand that there's no money in neutrality. It's either they love you, or hate you, but there's no money in neutral. Start off with that, and by saying that I'm not talking about intentionally creating videos that offend people.

I'm not a polarizing person, but I'm talking about taking a stand for something, and not being safe about it. If you take a look at all the books, you take books like 'Rich Dad, Poor Dad', when it was created that goes against every single safe principle when it comes to wealth, and investment when it was written. That's why it did well.

So that's the first step. Creating videos, based on topics as high engagements, and then after that I got a nine step process, but it's basically about repurposing it so that it goes into your blog posts, it goes into youtube, it goes to Facebook, and Instagram.

I call this strategy the Content Multiplier Formula, which is basically having all your content put into all these different platforms where the content matches the context of the platform.

Steve Larsen: Which I think is so interesting, because it's not like you go on ... most people get on Facebook to get distracted. They are not getting on there to ... a very different intent than I go on youtube for, which is to usually some kind of how to thing, or maybe some other piece of entertainment or whatever. That's very fascinating, so you match content to the context of the platform that's fast.

Peng Joon: And that's so crucial, because what I see some marketers do is they post the same piece of content onto all platforms failing to understand that people go onto these different platforms for different reasons.

So it can still stem from the same pillar content, but you want to repurpose it in a way that matches the context of the platform.

Steve Larsen: Amazing. You obviously have this down it's a science now for you. Every time I see you on Instagram, or wherever you don't seem like a lot of the classic A type personalities, or entrepreneurs out there where it's like they are usually stressed out of their brain.

You got this down so well for how you done it, and the way you multiply content and match it. How do you go actually out, and start actually multiplying all that content that way? You must have a massive team.

Peng Joon: Out of 12 people that works for me in my team in-house not including the people that we outsource to, but in the grand scheme of things we are really lean, and it's not a really big team.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome.

Peng Joon: So no, you don't have to have a lot of people doing all of that. In fact, chances are if you give them the right system, and the strategy, and the steps to follow you probably just need three people if you are really pumping out with current content. And that's like a lot. The video guy, the graphics, and one content writer.

Steve Larsen: Wow, interesting okay. Video graphics, and a content writer themselves. They'll go out, and repurpose all the stuff. For you I know when you spend three days with 90 videos that you create.

Peng Joon: 120, yeah.

Steve Larsen: You got 120, oh I thought it was 90.

Peng Joon: Yeah 40 videos a day.

Steve Larsen: What? That's so crazy that's amazing, and these are three, five minute videos something like that?

Peng Joon: Yes. Three to five minutes works best. Sometimes it can be shorter, but three minutes would be the average.

Steve Larsen: Wow, okay. Three, five minute videos. That's actually what triggers from that pillar content, the rest of the machine that you created. Fascinating.

Peng Joon: Yes.

Steve Larsen: Fascinating. Thanks for your time today. Again everyone, sorry for the little bit of lag in the internet there. We are talking on the other side of the world right now, so which is pretty awesome.

I know that you have this ... you are such an expert at it now, you wrote a book. I love the actual sales video I've watched it many times that you have for it. Very, very fascinating. I encourage everyone to go get it, but do you mind talking a little bit about why you wrote the book, 'Platform Closing'?

Peng Joon: So I realized there were a lot of people like me that struggled, like they have a nice message to share, but because of all these different limitations, or maybe they just didn't know how when it comes to speaking, and presenting.

It doesn't need to be live events it could be through sales videos, or webinars. I wanted to show people how to do it, because there wasn't one book that really specifically showed people how to speak, inspire, sell on all these different platforms.

I wanted to be able to show people as well that it's not about talent, because that's what many people think. They think that oh because I'm not like that therefore I can't do it. People might look, say Peng Joon ... speak and sell, but I'm not like you.

I'm not extroverted, and therefore I... So I wanted people to see that look that I know that's like a lot of people out there.

They are not doing it, because just like me they're either too afraid, they have that fear, they are introverted, and therefore they never even begin. So that's why I wrote that book.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. That's amazing. And it's only been out for a little while right, it's very recent.

Peng Joon: It's about six weeks in since I published it.

Steve Larsen: Awesome, that's awesome. I guess is that the best place for people to come follow you, and learn more about you? That book right there?

Peng Joon: So if you always wanted to learn how to sell, inspire, and present you can go platformclosing.com. It's a free book you just need to cover shipping.

Steve Larsen: Man, thank you so much for your time on this I appreciate it so much. You really are an inspiration, not just to me, but a lot of people in my audience as well I know they are just gonna love this. Thanks so much. Anything else you'd like to share with us?

Peng Joon: I think at the end of it all, you just need to get started. I think I want to leave with this. I think that one of the major things that really separates successful people is this one main thing.

So when it comes to one thing to do a task. We all have these dreams and aspirations. The difference between a successful person, unsuccessful person is this. We might want to do something, but we only tell ourselves these three things.

It's the road blocks that we have is just these three things...

It's either number one, we don't have the time or money. Just the lack of the resource. Now here's the difference. An unsuccessful person, that's where they stop. They let that reason why they can't do it.

While a successful person would say, “So how can I raise this money? How can I put it on Kickstarter? How can I pitch it to an investor who might be believing in my dream as well so I can start this project?”

Or it could be if you don't have the time it's, “How can I find an extra hour? How can I be more productive with my time? How can I shut off social medial?” Perhaps it could be stop watching Game of Thrones or something.

But to be more resourceful, know how to get the resources. That's the first one.

Number two, it's basically where they say, “I want to be able to do this, but I don't know how.” And this is where again, a not successful person this is where they stop.

While a successful person would say, “Okay I want to be able to do this, but I don't know how.” Same starting point, but now they say, “What I add it in my agenda now so that I can find out how. I'll watch the youtube videos, I'll read the books, I'll attend the seminars so that I can learn how."

Number three, I want to be able to do this, but I'm not like that. They might look at me and say, "You know Peng Joon won't be able to do [inaudible 00:32:55]." You don't get it. I'm not like that. I'm not an outgoing person, I'm not extroverted.

Again this is when unsuccessful person will stop. They let that to be the reason to why they can't do it. While a successful person would say, “I understand that in order to scale my business I need to learn how to speak, and present.” But I'm not like that. So how can I become more like that? How can I add it in my agenda, and catch myself out of my comfort zone so that I can become more like that.

I think that in anything we do whether it's building funnels, whether it's speaking, whether it's selling, all of that. The difference is in just the way we think about it. And that's really the differentiator between successful people, and non-successful people.

Steve Larsen: That is incredible. So number one, I don't have the resources or time versus how can I get the resources and time. Number two, I don't know how versus I'm gonna find out how. Number three, I'm not like that versus I'm gonna become that. That is just amazing.

Thank you so much for your time today, Peng Joon, especially there in a historic day in Malaysia. Thanks for the viable interview here, and what you shared.

Peng Joon: I enjoyed being here. Thank you for having me.

Steve Larsen: Boom. Just try to tell me you didn't like that. Hey, whoever controls content, controls the game. Want to interview me, or get interviewed yourself? Grab a time now at stevejlarsen.com.

Social Media is constantly evolving. Listen and learn about what it takes to make it as an Entrepreneur in today's content saturated world...

What's going on everyone? This is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to a special episode of Sales Funnel Radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today, and now I've left my 9 to 5 to take the plunge and build my million-dollar business. The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

What's up guys? I'm super excited for you to be here. This is going to be a massive treat for you. I've got to tell you, the topic we're going to go through today and frankly the person that I've brought on today, at first this topic I discredited just a little bit. I'm not going to lie, which is shame on me, poopoo on me, right, but I'm very excited for you guys to learn more about this. The longer I've been doing this game, the longer I've been part of this, the more I've looked at what this person's doing, it's just with sheer awe.

I cannot believe everything that he gets done, and I'm very excited. I'm super honored, actually, to have him on the show. It's going to be great. Anyway, I want to welcome to the show, though, Mr. Josh Forti. How are you doing man?

Josh Forti: Hey Steven. Good to be on here. Thanks so much for having me on. I appreciate it.

Steve Larsen: I'm super excited. I was thinking right before you got on here, I was thinking through kind of the different times we've brushed shoulders.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: But not really actually spoke. You know, I know you came to the Viral Video launch. You had an invite for that for sure. I saw you over there taking pictures with Gary V., and I was exhausted by the time that event came up.

I barely remember anything. Everything was hazy...

Josh Forti: I got roasted by Gary V. at the Viral Video event.

Steve Larsen: I remember that. He was standing right there.

Josh Forti: Remember that?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. He roasted you hard, man.

Josh Forti: That's right. That's right. I think you handed me the microphone for that, too.

Steve Larsen: Yep. Yeah. I had no idea we'd work this much together and have you on the show.

Josh Forti: Who knew, who knew?

Steve Larsen: Who knew? Yeah. And then it was really, right, we did that Mastermind together.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: And I heard you speak and I swear gold was just spraying everybody in the audience, just all over the place. I could not believe what you were saying. It was amazing. It was incredible. This whole other side of the funnel where the person is the funnel and really diving into personal branding.

You're clearly, in my mind, I actually believe that you're like the foremost expert on personal brand creation. I'm just so honored to have you here...

Josh Forti: Oh man, well I really appreciate, really appreciate that, and I don't know if I'm the number one, but I certainly try to be. Yeah, we've had a lot of fun with it.

Steve Larsen: I'll say it for you.

Josh Forti: Okay. You can say it for me. I like that. I like that. Yeah. We've had a lot of fun with it.

Steve Larsen: Honestly, it was when we were standing outside right after that Mastermind and I saw not just that you were like, I mean, dude, you're very smart. You get a lot of stuff done. You're a go-getter and a hustler, but then also you're intent on helping the world. That's when I was like, man, I've got to get close to this guy. That wasn't long ago. That was like a month ago.

Josh Forti: It feels like it. It was a little longer than that. I think it was, back in January. That was in Vegas.

Steve Larsen: Oh, that's true.

Josh Forti: Right? That's when that was. We spoke there. That's when we first officially met. We had brushed into each other like you said, but we officially met. We spoke on the same stage. I remember at the event someone was like, Steven Larsen's going to be speaking. I was like, well, if it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. So, I'm super happy that we got to meet up there and, yeah, form a friendship that eventually led to us speaking together again down at the Mastermind before Funnel Hacking Live.

Steve Larsen: Oh, yeah, that's right. That's awesome. That's awesome. Yeah. You know, so for those in the audience who may not know who you are, how did you actually get into this, this area of personal branding? I think the area, like I've had such an issue with it just because I've not ever known really what it is. It seems a little bit fluffy and you're so clear on how to do it. How did you get into this?

Josh Forti: That's a great question. So, actually I grew up through high school, I was home schooled and I grew up on a farm. I had no online presence at all. In fact, I wasn't even allowed to have texting on my phone until I was 18, so like really knew nothing.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: I got into insurance. Long story short, dropped out of college, got into insurance sales and realized that the internet marketing space was this huge trend that a lot of these businesses that we were working with were totally missing out on.

And so I went from there and I was like, man I've got to start studying this, so I started studying e-com and started studying all the different things and blue like several thousand dollars with no success, no results whatsoever. I was like, man, it can't be this hard. I mean, like I've got to figure out a way for me. How I started into it was I was just trying to figure out a way to grow an audience so that I could test like landing pages.

Even if I was giving it away for free, I just wanted to be able to test it without having to pay for it...

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: And get the audience's response. Tell me what I was doing right, tell me what I was doing wrong so that I could service them better without having to pay thousands of dollars up front for not getting any results. So, I actually started on the Instagram platform. I thought that was, for me, the fastest way to like grow an audience.

I didn't really understand Facebook at the time. We hear all the time, organic range on Facebook is dead...

Not entirely true, but I started on the Instagram platform and played around with just some different accounts. I bought a course on it. I loved the Instagram game and I loved everything that was there. It is. It's a game.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: Just finding the little trends and pieces there. I launched a company with a business partner of mine, and together we grew and managed several million followers on the Instagram platform. aCtually, it was just the beginning of last year we decided we had kind of different visions for the company. He wanted to go kind of more the agency route and specifically just servicing that, and I really wanted to help like people launch like Instagram accounts.

I wanted to like give back the information that we had and like really help that and you know, different strokes for different folks. So he went one way and I ended up selling the agency that we had built to him. That allowed me a whole new world of opportunity. I was out on my own. I had contacts and I'd just sold a company. I went out and invested in a couple different coaches and some programs and really just dove into all things branding and social media.

I read Expert Secrets and Dotcom Secrets and everything that Russell talks about and came up, and I'm only 24 years old right now, and so just studied and studied and worked and applied and worked and launched a Facebook group shortly before I sold my company, about, I don't know, six months or so before I sold the company out and have not run a single dime of paid traffic to it. It's about 18 months old.

Steve Larsen: Wow.

Josh Forti: We just hit 30,000 members in it.

Steve Larsen: Holy crap.

Josh Forti: Being able to use a lot of the tactics that Russell talks about in marketing with the attractive character and really being authentic with your audience and really going out there and showing them the behind the scenes, a lot of people are like, man, you know, you are authentic or you're showing them the good, the bad and the ugly, like they're never going to buy from you, right?

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Josh Forti: And the thing is, we live in the world of experts, but we also live in the world of influencers, right?

Like, you do need to be an expert at what you do, but you have to understand that if you have a single follower, you're more credible than the person without one, right?

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: And so if you're one step ahead of whatever it is that you're doing and you show them the good, the bad and the ugly, what that does is it builds trust, so people can go out. We live in an overwhelming world of information.

I can go onto YouTube and figure out absolutely anything, so if you're full of crap, I'm eventually going to figure it out, so if you're lying to me, you know, I'm eventually going to see that, where if you just show, hey, this works, this doesn't, here's what we're doing over here, here's what we're doing over here, people love that and people eat it up because then they know that you're going to be honest with them. We've had so much success with that.

In fact, I've done, this is a funny fact, two six-figure businesses now and I've never spent a single penny on paid advertising for either one of those.

Steve Larsen: That's so cool. I mean, seriously man, congrats! That's incredible.

Josh Forti: I appreciate that, man. Does that kind of give you a background there of everything?

Steve Larsen: Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. I guess, when did you realize that you were getting it, you know what I mean? When did it start clicking?

Josh Forti: Well, I must say, my parents always taught me to work hard. I grew up on a farm. I was homeschooled, and I have seven siblings, so you kind of partner all those things together and you realize you just kind of have to work hard in life.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: I wouldn't say I felt ... I still don't know if I get it, Steven.

Steve Larsen: Sure. I know we're all still getting it.

Josh Forti: Yeah, yeah. I think that the point in my life where I understood that I got it was when I realized that I was willing to go learn and do above and beyond what everyone else was willing to go learn and do.

When everybody else was out at the movies, and I have nothing against going out to the movies or taking a night off, but I spent two years of my life studying and going to conferences, seminars and things like that and when I came back and when I realized that just simply being around those type of people and just simply being immersed in that versus being immersed in say pop culture of like movies or music or whatever that thing was, you know more about that.

For me, that was a really like a first step in the right direction for me because, I mean, we as an entrepreneurs, I really believe that we all, at some point or another, struggle with a lot of self-doubt.

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Josh Forti: While I'm a very confident person in myself and what I can do, being around those type of people and realizing that, hey, I'm at least making actions and decisions that drive me in the direction that I want to get close to was an encouraging reminder to me.

So that was kind of the first step in the right direction and then as far as like making it, what do you mean, like having it figured it out? Like, specifically when I thought I knew Instagram or when I thought I could do this or like what specifically?

Steve Larsen: Sure, sure. I just like to ask that because we all kind of go a different route with it, which is kind of cool, but, yeah, really with Instagram, when you realized that like, oh my gosh, this personal branding thing like it's suddenly is clicking, you know. I see the path at least far enough where I can have results for the people and make money with it.

Josh Forti: Yeah. I'm going to take us back to Funnel Hacking Live.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: Remember when Russell was on stage and for those of you that weren't able to attend, uh, you missed out, but he was on stage, and on Friday he was talking about, and really, the whole theme of the conference was if you just follow a proven formula for success, you will be successful with it. Remember when he was talking about that?

Steve Larsen: Oh, yeah.

Josh Forti: Yeah. So, I think I realized that I had figured it out when I was first able to duplicate my results and so on Instagram I grew my first account to, I think it was 30,000 or 35,000 followers, and I got the idea that I was like, well, I did it once. I wonder if I could do it again.

So, I do everything kind of over the top, so I went and opened like eight other accounts...

Steve Larsen: Love it.

Josh Forti: And tried to do it on eight different accounts and figured out the niches. I think five of them stuck, and so I had five or six accounts at this time and all of the sudden all of them were at 10,000 and then 15,000 and then 20,000 and then 30,000, and then I realized this is just a system.

Like, it's a formula and when I realized that there was just a formula for growing accounts and a formula for growing social media, people often complicate it and they're like, oh, you know every platform's different, every platform's this. They are, and the content that you post on those platforms may be different types of content, but the concepts of social media, of the goals that you're trying to accomplish are all the same.

Once I figured out that formula I knew I was set. I was like, there's nothing I can't do on social media now if I have either A) The time or B) The budget. If I have one of those two things, I can do anything. I think that's when I figured out that there was a proven formula that I could just duplicate over and over and it looks different for each account, looks different for each niche that you're in, but the formula of what you're trying to accomplish is the same.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. That's super powerful. It's powerful insight for sure. I just want to ask too, so, okay, you obviously are like me and you're constantly diving deep into the thing you're trying to be like the best at. You're constantly learning.

I'm sure you're constantly moving as forward as fast as you can. Out of your own curiosity too. It's like no one's forcing you. I'm sure you're the same...

When you were diving deep into this stuff and you start getting into social media, you get into personal branding, how did you choose what to learn and what not to learn?

Josh Forti: Oh man. That is such a tough question.

Steve Larsen: I know. Sorry.

Josh Forti: No, no, no. This is really good. You know what's interesting is the reason that I got into personal branding I think is because of this question right here.

Steve Larsen: Interesting.

Josh Forti: Because you think about it and you go, who do we learn from? I look at the people that I modeled after. The only people that I followed were people that I wanted to become like because in my opinion and especially in the way of the world that we're going right now, if you're taking advice from people that are not doing what it is that you're trying to learn and you can't relate with what they're trying to do, why would you take advice from them.

That's like the mentality that's going through my head at the time that I'm starting...

Steve Larsen: I believe that.

Josh Forti: And so as I looked back, like who did I model? I modeled after Russell Brunson. I modeled after Tai Lopez. I modeled after Gary Vaynerchuk. I modeled after Grant Cardone.

Those are my four big top influencers in all of marketing right now. If you were to say, Josh, who are the top four? Those are them. What do they all have? They all have a personal brand. They've all gone out there and established what it is that they've done, and so, I think for me, I look at the person as who they are. Now, do I agree with everything Tai Lopez does?

Absolutely not...

Or Russell or Grant or whoever, but because they have elements in their business that I want to model after and I like who they are as a person in that area, I'm going to go and I'm going to learn from them.

So, for me, I decide what I'm going to learn or not learn by actually studying what the person stands for and looking at the life that they have. I hardly ever buy, even like a lead magnet or download anything for free until I go out and actually study who that person is. And so I just got a book in the mail, Millionaire Success Habits by Dean I can't pronounce his last name.

Steve Larsen: Graziosi.

Josh Forti: Yeah. But I saw his ad probably 100 times before I bought his book. I finally sat down and was like, okay, who is this guy. I went and I looked at his brand and I looked at what he was and I looked at what he stood for and that's the power of personal branding. Everything that I do and everything, like if I choose to study someone or something or learn or not learn, I look at who they are as a person because I think that's really important to me.

So, I got into personal branding for that matter because I was like, if someone's going to look at my content, whether it's a physical product, a digital product, free paid whatever, I want them to be able to come look back at me and know exactly what I stand for and if that aligns with what they are going to be doing then they are going to come learn from me and be up front about it.

Having that personal brand, I mean, I can't tell you how many people I've asked and say, why do you use click funnels? The click funnel platform is awesome and I love it and it's so much fun, but a large majority of the people were like, I wasn't that interested in click funnels at the beginning. I was interested in Russell Brunson and then he showed me click funnels and it was like, oh my gosh!

This is awesome...

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: But it was Russell that brought them in and that's the power of a personal brand, and I think that we really need to realize in the online space if you don't have a personal brand you're either on your way out or already dead. You're just becoming irrelevant after awhile.

Steve Larsen: I completely believe what you just said right there. That's so true. As far as from a top level, I just want to ask a few questions here because you think of like, I mean, you service a lot of like these funnel builders of that community as well. You've helped a whole bunch of people like that.

You've helped some massive individuals...

Josh Forti: There's definitely been some Instagram touchpoints with some big, yeah, big influencers in that area as well as a lot of people in my inner circle and a lot of people in really all areas and all industries, yeah.

Steve Larsen: You've been all over the place. You're very much, and what's interesting too, I mean, when I think about, like, what I do, right, I go through and I help people get their phone off the ground, their message, their offer and get that out the door and, yes, totally, I mean, you obviously don't need a personal brand to go get that off the ground, but the personal brand becomes this vehicle that just explodes and accelerates in this ridiculous way.

I want to ask a little more how someone actually does that, but how do you define a personal brand? You know what I mean? Like, what do you even say that actually is?

Josh Forti: Yeah. Yeah. So, summed up in a very short phrase I say, your business is what you do, your brand is what you stand for.

Steve Larsen: Cool.

Josh Forti: If you think about that, in the message of personal branding, we're shifting as a society and I think we really need to understand that while we still definitely have big corporations and big things like that, we're going very much to a freelance society, to an online marketing society and things like that and really you have to go make a name for yourself, and it's expected because it's so simple. I say that hesitantly, simple to do.

Not easy, but the concepts there are simple. It's almost like required, like as a prerequisite...

What I tell people is you want someone to be able to look at you and your profile and content online and know exactly what you do, what you stand for and how you're going to go about doing that because if I can't look at your profile and know not only what you do, but really like the vibe that you stand for and who you are as a human, I'm not near as likely trust you as if I know who you are and what you stand for, right.

If you don't give me that information, like, yeah, you might be great at eCommerce, but if I don't know your personality, if I don't know if you get my agenda, there's so much information.

People look for what they can relate to. And so if they don't understand what it is that you stand for or if you're relatable or not, then you don't have a very good chance of them buying from you. That personal brand is your message and your statement of what it is that you stand for and your statement of the type of person that you're trying to attract and sell to.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. It's not really enough to just be, I mean, you can get by for a while just being amazing, but, I mean, after a while people want to know who you are as a person. It makes total sense. Okay. I've never heard it explained that way. How does somebody go about doing this?

Obviously, they hire you...

They give you a whole lot of money, which everyone should, but like what are the most important parts of this? I know we can take it to the enth degree, but I mean, is there like a base level someone should at least have?

Josh Forti: Well, I think the first thing that everyone needs to do is they need to define themselves and understand their why. Before you go into anything else, I think the most important thing is understanding your why and if you don't start with your why I think everything else really gets kind of pushed off track.

So a lot of people are like, oh, man, my why is I want to go out there and use entrepreneurship skills to change the world. That's not your why. When I sit down with people to find out what that why is I tell them, you should be able to tell me your why and I have no clue what you do.

Steve Larsen: Cool.

Josh Forti: Because if I can go and hear just like your vision and your purpose and passion in life, there's a lot of different ways to make something happen, right.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: And, so I can change the world in eCommerce. I can change the world in sports. I can change the world in the oil fields, but if I don't know what my why is, if you can't clearly identify what that why is then I think that you're really off track, because everything needs to lead back up to that.

I think step number one is identify what your why is and then step number two after that is very clearly defined, and I cannot stress the importance of that enough, very clearly defined.

Then, step number two from there is you need to pick the avenue or the industry that you're going to get into to make that why happen. And so your what is kind of what you believe in and who you're going to go about implementing that vision to the world.

I'm not talking about the product necessarily. I'm talking about the avenue or the vehicle that you're going to use to get that why message out there. Once you kind of determine what that is going to be, then you can go out and start crafting your brand from there.

So, start with why and then from there go to the how and then go to the what from there. Start with why, how and then what.

From there, you have to understand you need to publish a lot of content.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Everyone hear that. I know I shove it down your throat, but say it again, baby, whew!

Josh Forti: Yeah, like publish your face off. I've heard you say it before and I know that's your saying, but it cannot be more true because in a world of unlimited information you have to be able to stand out from all your competitors and from everybody else that's out there that's putting out similar information.

If you expect to be seen, if you expect people to build trust, then what do they say, 8 to 12 times before someone is willing to buy from you?

Most of you guys and most of the people out there who are putting out content, it's like, I'm going to put out one video a week. I'm going to post one status a day. Those are not even rookie numbers, you know what I'm saying.

Like, you've got to step it up to where you need to be omnipresent. I need to be able to see you, and I'm just going to take it back again to the Gary Vaynerchuk, the Russell Brunson, the Greg Cardone, Tai Lopez.

Go look at their YouTube channels, their Instagram page, everything that they're doing. Those people put out way more content than you do, and way more content than almost every other person out there.

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Josh Forti: And so you don't even have to be that good, and I say that hesitantly. Be good. Be an expert.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: But if you can produce more content to the next guy, you don't even have to be an expert, you know. Your message is out there in front of everybody else and so if you start with why and you craft all of your content around making that why come true and showing people your vision with that why and whatever avenue or venue it is, whether it's entrepreneurship or fitness or music or what have you and publish a lot of content to move that forward, you're going to have an audience.

Steve Larsen: That's huge. Completely believe that. Just there's power in just being present, just being out there when people are ready to look and ready to see you, fresh stuff that's available.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: Um, okay ...

Josh Forti: Oh, sorry. Go ahead.

Steve Larsen: No. Go for it.

Josh Forti: I was going to say, the one other thing that I would mention in there that I think is really important for entrepreneurs, especially for entrepreneurs in the business space and for people that are trying to grow a personal brand and trying to grow an audience, you've got to pick something and be all about it because I see so many people.

In fact, I just got off a phone call earlier today with a lady who she's really smart. She's really talented and she's got seven different projects that she's been working on, and she's been working on seven different projects for the last 20 years, and they're still not, you know, nothing's still happening.

Steve Larsen: That's because there's seven of them.

Josh Forti: I asked her, I said ... Right, and I'm like, so which one are you going to pick. She's like, well, I love them all. I'm like, and for the last 20 years you've gone nowhere. I mean, she's dumped money into them and she's dumped time, and her videos are good. Her content is good, things like that, but people don't know what she's about. It's 22 different things.

Well, in her case, seven different things. Pick what it is that you're going to do and be about that and then once you have an audience and once you've grown you can kind of push your audience from one to the next or kind of incorporate different brands and things like that, but if people don't know the one thing that you are about, then they're not going to follow you.

You know, what's Russell Brunson known for? Funnels...

Steve Larsen: Funnels.

Josh Forti: Funnels. Right. Think about that when you're building your brand as well.

Steve Larsen: I totally love that. Oh, man. So huge. Gain the clarity and then move on. When you take somebody who's, I don't know, I'm trying to figure out how to ask this.

When you take somebody who's just starting out, right, what are some of the basic things somebody could go do once they have the why, how and what?

They figure those things out, they're publishing frequently. I guess what's the routine look like for them?

Josh Forti: Yeah. For sure. I'm not going to pick a specific platform here.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: I mean, I'm going to kind of give you an overview basis of what we'll look for. Russell Brunson talks about this in his book, Dotcom Secrets, but when you're publishing content you want to make sure that you're getting your content in front of the right audience.

Different social media platforms do this differently. You know, on Instagram it's more hashtags and on, you know, Facebook it's more groups and things like that, but that's very important because if you can go and get your message in front of the right audience and always push them back to a centralized location, that's really, really important and you're going to start growing an audience that way.

The first thing I would say is make sure that you're getting your message in front of the right people and then second, kind of like what we talked about when we went over your stuff is have a centralized hub of where you're pushing everyone to, so for me and a lot of my clients that I work with, that's a Facebook group because that's the most interactive way for us to be able to communicate to our clients.

Maybe for some people that's an Instagram page or whatnot, but once you have them in that centralized hub where everything is pushing, also push them back out to other platforms as well.

All of your content, all of your most valuable information is going to be at your centralized hub, but then you want to be able to cross-promote, because if someone comes in from YouTube, it's like, okay, they're coming in from YouTube and have an Instagram channel and a Facebook page and a Facebook group and a Snapchat and a Twitter, like where do I push them.

I always push them back to wherever my centralized location is. All right, for me that's the Facebook group.

And then from the Facebook group I then diversify to different platforms and push them from there, but I want to make sure that they're all in my Facebook group because that is where my most valuable content is.

That's where I know my warmest leads are going to be and that's where I'm going to get a majority of my traffic from. Does that make sense?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Totally. Okay. That makes sense. You've got centralized hub.

Josh Forti: Yeah. To have that centralized hub to where people know because it's like, okay, Instagram is great, but would I go to Instagram to be able to get in contact with Steven Larsen?

Probably not...

Would I go to Instagram to watch a full-time tutorial about that?

Would I go to Instagram for this?

No, but I would go to Instagram for valuable tips, for motivational tips and to stay in touch with that side of your life. Whereas YouTube I would go for more how-to's, but there's probably no information for me to get a hold of you or interact with you. I can't message you or anything.

What I have found is a Facebook group is the most valuable place because it encompasses everything, posts, videos, text and video and image. It allows people to interact with you, you to interact with them and them to interact with each other and there's multiple places where you can put information, contact information and push them to different lead magnets.

So, I take all of my traffic, I send them there and then I take my traffic from there and I go, hey, if you want to learn more about blah, blah, blah, make sure you subscribe to my YouTube channel and that way all of my Instagram traffic that I've just gotten off of Instagram and into my group, now I have it on Instagram and in my group and now I'm pushing them out to a third platform so I can now have them in three different places as well.

Steve Larsen: You have like the main communication hub, but as needed you can shove them to the rest of the things you're doing in your marketing or campaigns or whatever else you're doing.

Josh Forti: Yes, and it's very important to diversify on social media, but I do like to have my one main hub where everything goes because it's just so much easier than, especially when you're starting out.

Now, as you continue to scale and you've got $10,000, $20,000, $50,000 a month behind you, then you can talk about different things, but in the beginning when you're starting out and you're just trying to grow an organic audience. We have a course coming out called Six-Figure Audiences.

Steve Larsen: Sweet.

Josh Forti: It's going to be so cool. I'm so excited about that, but it really talks about having that main hub and then diversifying from there. That's how people know where you're at most and for people like us, people like you, we don't have time to be posting and going live on four different platforms.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: Go live on one and push everyone to that one and then diversify the content out from there.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. Okay, so say somebody who's maybe brand new or has an existing business and they're starting to set these things up. Got the centralized place. Got the message.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: When can you tell? Like, what are the things that need to be in place in order for the person to, I guess, blow up for lack of a better term? Like, when can you tell that someone's about to just go nuts?

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: Most likely.

Josh Forti: Yeah. When their branding is consistent across all their platforms, that's really important. If I can click on your Facebook profile and see that that is optimized and clean and clear, has a clear call of action in the timeline photo, things like that, you have a Facebook that's growing and is there as well. Your Instagram, no matter how big it is, I don't care how big your pages are, right, I don't care how many followers they have.

I care about the quality of the content that you're putting upon those pages. When they're all set up right and well and I actually, I really look a lot at the engagement and the copy and the type of content that you put out, whether that be written or video, my favorite is video.

I overwhelmingly do more video than anything else because it is the most engaging, especially live video, but if their content is engaging, even at a small amount and they have clear branding across all platforms, that says to me, okay, this person knows enough to at least understand that this is important and that maybe they're just missing the traffic piece right now, but they can figure that out and I would encourage everyone to optimize all your profiles no matter if you have followers or not.

I mean, Twitter is like I never am on Twitter, and I only have like 2,000 followers on there, but it's still optimized to if anybody were to click on my Twitter they could come back and find my other social media profiles and things like that.

So, when everyone's optimized across that platform, when they're putting out good consistent content every single day and it's branded there, I think that says to me, okay, this person is doing the right things from that standpoint, but then on a more like psychological side standpoint, things that are maybe a little bit harder to teach, if I can see that your brand has a very clear message and it is speaking directly to your target audience, that's probably the most, like the number one telltale sign of being able to say, okay, this person really has dialed in their audience.

When you go, like we've worked with all sorts of people, the people that have the clearest message to their audience are the ones that grow the fastest, hands down, almost without question unless you're running massive amounts of pay traffic. From an organic-grow standpoint, from an audience creation standpoint and a brand standpoint, the more precise that you can get with your message across all platforms with that branded, says to me okay, you're ready to blow up.

And, going back to your original question, a great way to do that is through interviews. Once you have everything set up, podcast interviews like this, livestream interviews in other groups. I cannot stress enough the importance of cross promotion within the marketplace with other influencers.

Steve Larsen: That's huge. Oh man. That's a gold mine everybody. We should be charging for this. This is awesome. Please be writing notes.

Super awesome...

Hey, so this is me with the direct-response marketer in me, when's the best scenario for me to be grabbing contact information, you know, opt-ins, email addresses, stuff like that so I can continue to remarket to them or is the fact that they're on my page, is that my opt-in?

Josh Forti: Yeah. That's a great question. Common misconception there says, oh, if they're in my Facebook group, I don't need them on my email list. You're wrong.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: I don't ever think you can have people in enough places.

Steve Larsen: Sure. Sure.

Josh Forti: If I have them on YouTube and Facebook and Instagram and my email list I can still get on a chat bot, you know. I think that from a timing standpoint, right away.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: You need to have, and that's part of putting out content. As soon as I hit your page, like if I want more information, it's not for everyone. We know that, but if I want more information and it's not there, you just lost money. That's pretty much the only way there is to look at it. Being able to provide information in exchange for contact information as soon as they hit your page.

That's why I tell people, and I know we've talked about this as well, cover photos on timelines for people's profile pictures or in people's Facebook groups. Have call-to-actions. You look at a lot of the big influencers. You to in there and you hit their cover photo or you hit the cover of their timeline photo and it's get my free book, get my free this.

That's amazing advertising and it's free advertising space. Take advantage of that. Any place that you can go and provide awesome amounts of value, get their contact information.

I don't think there's such thing as having them in too many places...

Steve Larsen: Sure. Completely makes sense to me. Yeah. Absolutely. You like to do a lot of eBooks and stuff that's easy to fulfill on.

You're still giving value, but that's what's actually getting them on the list that way and remarket afterwards?

Josh Forti: Yeah. Anything from eBooks, webinars. I actually really like to be doing a lot of like free training stuff.

Steve Larsen: Oh, cool.

Josh Forti: Where I'll just go live on my Facebook group and so, you know, when I go live now we'll have 1,000 viewers, right or 1,000 people, 1,200 people that will watch that, and so you know, throughout there I'll just be like if you want more information on this specific training, you know, drop a comment below and we'll send it over to you or click this link below and go to that.

It could be anything from the recording of that training. It could be an eBook. Any form of free magnet. I know you talk a lot about that.

The other thing that I think is a misconception from a lot of people is they think that providing value is only free information and that like you shouldn't pitch right away with your audience. I actually used to believe that and when I first started my audience..

I didn't pitch at all and it was like 30 days on my email sequence before I would pitch anything or at least two to three weeks, and the problem that we'd run into with that, and we made a shift as soon as we realized, I mean, certainly we don't do that anymore...

I mean, you train your audience and your audience is either a buying audience or it's a not-buying audience. If you can establish right away that you are there to provide massive amounts of value, that you're there for the right reasons, you clearly identified your why, you know, all those things with your branding and with your message, charging right away upfront, like having an eBook with an upsell, you know, $37, $97 or a pitch to a webinar.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: That's fine. People don't always expect to get things for free, and the people that do aren't usually your ideal customer. I think that's really important to remember that provide a lot of free information.

Give them opportunity to only take advantage of free information, but having paid content, paid products and things like that, that is not a bad thing and, in fact, if anything it probably will increase the value of your audience when done right.

Steve Larsen: Sure. Completely makes sense. Yeah, absolutely. That's somewhat of a locked gate, you know, between the good people and those who are there to just freeload a little bit.

Josh Forti: Right.

Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. Okay, cool. Cool, cool. Let's say, okay, someone's gone through and they've set the stuff up because they've got like consistency in the message, putting all the platforms together, they've got a hub. What would you say? I know I'm just kind of grilling you, man, but this is awesome stuff.

Josh Forti: Yeah, yeah.

Steve Larsen: Easiest free ways to grow your following?

Josh Forti: Facebook group and Instagram page.

Steve Larsen: Okay.

Josh Forti: Those are going to be your two fastest-growing organic-growth platforms for free. With very rare exception, if you're like a ridiculously awesome video editor and you can produce a YouTube video absolutely every single day, then maybe that's an exception, but for most of us it's the Instagram platform and a Facebook group.

Two reasons for this. One, Instagram is still the fastest-growing platform on social media right now. It's the hottest and it's getting the most users per day over any other platform. They're almost at a billion users there, so half the size of Facebook already.

There is no way to pay the Instagram platform itself for followers like it is on Facebook. Right. I can run ads with like swipe up ads, like swipe up here. Go to this link and have that link back to my page and things like that, but there's no ad that I can run that's like, hey, Instagram, I want more followers and I want to target these people, I want these people to follow my page.

Because of that, the Instagram algorithm still allows us to majorly capitalize on viral content, on Instagram networks, on engagement groups and things like that. So, posting good content, using hashtags. If you're in my group, Social Media for Entrepreneurs, you can go and we give a lot of free trainings on Instagram and social media like this a lot.

Hashtags are important...

The captions are important...

Getting into different engagement groups or plugging into different networks with shout-for-shouts and things like that. You can still majorly take advantage of a lot of those things and grow 10,000 followers in even a month. I mean, that's not impossible.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing.

Josh Forti: It's totally doable, even for the beginner. A Facebook group, on the other hand, typically speaking, it's going to grow a little bit slower. You're not going to get 10,000 members in there in a month organically; however, the quality of your lead is a lot higher because it's important to remember on Instagram, and this is kind of a gold nugget here for those of you who are taking notes and listening, especially in the marketing space.

Instagram followers are not buyers. Now, you might be like, Josh, okay, what the heck?

Why would you preach Instagram then? You get a ridiculous amount of free traffic from Instagram and you need to push them off the platform. Instagram is amazing for free offers, free webinars, free eBooks, things like that, but very rarely do people buy on the Instagram platform. In fact, the same person on Instagram and Facebook I think is like eight times or something like that more likely to buy on the Facebook platform to a paid offer than they are on Instagram.

Steve Larsen: Holy crap.

Josh Forti: I don't remember what the exact thing is. However, it is probably eight times cheaper to get them on the Instagram platform and then just push them off to another platform, either on your email list or into your Facebook group. That's why on every single lead magnet that I ever create the last page of that lead magnet is a call-to-action to my Facebook group.

That's true for both pay traffic and organic traffic, but particularly on Instagram you want to get them and get them off as fast as you can. We're seeing a little bit less of that. Instagram is starting to make some changes, but as of now that is still very much the case.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: Whereas Facebook, the quality of your follower is going to be much higher, a little bit harder to acquire one, but once you have that member in your group or that follower on your page, they are much higher and Facebook is making a really big push for Facebook groups right now. It's never been easier to grow a Facebook group. Everyone's like, ah, the trend is over.

I'm like, oh, no, no. The trend is just starting. To be able to capitalize upon that and really take advantage, yes, obviously, we're already partly up the wave and so it's not as easy as it was six months ago, but I mean we're still launching Facebook groups and getting 1,000 members in a month, all organically and 2,000 members in three or four months.

I tell people the more active you are in a Facebook group the more Facebook will promote you and so if you can be active and you can get your members to be active then Facebook is going to recommend your group to so many other people. Do that and being very, very active in your group, having a clearcut message to that, constantly going live and posting statuses and getting people to engage, answering questions, and then having what we call lots of hoses to fill up the pool. Think of it as a swimming pool, and I got this from my buddy Arnie Getsky, you know, think of your Facebook group as a swimming pool.

If you have one hose in it and if leads are only coming in from one source, it's probably going to fill pretty slow, but if on the end of every lead magnet, whether it's an eBook or a webinar training or even paid courses, and in your email lists your constantly pushing and promoting to your group from all your other social media platforms, now you have six or seven hoses in there.

It's going to grow six or seven times faster...

Steve Larsen: That's a great way to think of it. That's going to make me go rethink what I'm doing at the end of every one of my thank you pages now. I've got to refix some of those things. That's interesting.

So, let's say, lots of free ways, lots of cool ways, and, again, like you said, you pull them from one platform, you can push them to another...

Josh Forti: Right.

Steve Larsen: That's huge about Instagram by the way. That's so cool. Gaining them there but pushing them to Facebook through actual purchasing. Those are free methods, right. What are some of your favorite paid methods for growing it? Let's say you've got some cash you're able to dump behind it. Hire you.

Josh Forti: Facebook ads for sure. Yeah. That's an option for sure. You know, it's really interesting because paid strategies are often not always the best strategies for growing an audience.

Like, in many cases they are, but don't just think because there's money behind it, it can't be done organically...

Interviews, especially with bigger pages, is my favorite way to grow an audience, honestly, getting on podcasts and things like this is honestly my favorite way, but from a paid perspective my two favorite ways are going to be paid Facebook ads and influencer shout-outs on Instagram.

Steve Larsen: Okay.

Josh Forti: Instagram traffic is cheap. It is probably some of the cheapest traffic that you're ever going to get, so a lot of people think paid traffic, they think paying the platform itself. Find an influencer in your industry and in your niche that has similar products or services to whatever it is that you're promoting.

On Instagram it's really easy to find big pages with a lot of followers, a million, half-million, two-million followers in the motivational niche or the quote niche or an entrepreneur space and purchase shout-outs from them for really pennies of what you'd pay elsewhere for the amount of exposure that you're going to be getting. If you have a good offer, usually we do something like a giveaway of some sort, usually a physical product tied in with cash, not just cash only...

We've found that cash doesn't convert as well as if you do have a physical product with it. Pushing them to either your page or to an offer or to your Instagram account or to your Facebook group, that works really well. And so partnering up with influencers to get exposure is huge.

I know we talked about this a little bit both in Vegas and down in Orlando, but make sure that every one of your pages is pixeled with a Facebook pixel and I hardly ever run a Facebook ad before running that offer first on Instagram...

Steve Larsen: Really?

Josh Forti: What I mean by that is if I'm shooting out of the dark, right, and I'm going out there and I am like trying to figure out what's going to work. I don't know who my target audience is, now this is for beginners, all right. I have no pixels. I have no audience creation. I'm just starting out. What I'm going to do is I'm going to go and I'm going to take my offer. Usually it's a free offer because I'm going to Instagram with it and I pixeled all the pages and I'll go and for the people that hit my offer I'm going to get lots and lots of traffic on that page. So for $500 on you know Facebook, I might get opt-ins for like $5 and I might get 100 opt-ins. For $500 on you know Instagram I can get opt-ins for $2 or $1, depending on the audience.

So, all those people are going to hit the page plus all the people that hit the page that didn't opt-in, now I have an audience created and I have an audience created of people that just hit the page and are interested and then another audience created of people that actually opted in, right, because I have that page pixeled too.

Now, I can actually create lookalike audiences on Facebook or re-target those specific people on Facebook for those that didn't buy or that I want to target them with a similar product and I'm going to get higher conversions right off the bat and I'm going to be able to play around right at the beginning. If you are just getting started in paid traffic and you have under a $3,000-4,000 budget total, to play around with this, I'd highly recommend throwing $500 or $1,000 at an Instagram, a couple of Instagram shout-outs.

Typically, story shout-outs work best, story with a swipe-up feature...

Steve Larsen: Oh, cool.

Josh Forti: That usually works better than a post...

Doing things like that, getting a lot of data, pixeling up those pixels, getting them firing off so that you have an audience and then going over there and retargeting on Facebook for Facebook ads for different offers like that.

Steve Larsen: That's an amazing strategy. That's so cool. Pulling from that.

Josh Forti: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: Oh, man. Then you're retargeting them and okay. Cool. Cool.

Josh Forti: You can create lookalike audiences from there and whatnot. And then as far as growing a Facebook group, so important thing to note is it against Facebook's terms of service to run a Facebook ad directly to a Facebook group. Just FYI.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Josh Forti: We had an account shut down. We learned the hard way. Avoid that. However, if you did want to grow a Facebook group and you do want to, man, I really want to focus on a Facebook group, one of the strategies, like I said, that we have found is just get your highest converting free offer.

Like, something that's going to opt-in at like 60-70% that everybody's opting in at, and then maybe your thank you page, basically a sales page to join a free group.

Steve Larsen: Clever.

Josh Forti: That's going to be the fastest way to be able to, so instead of an upsell, if you're like, man, I've got $3,000 to dump at advertising for my group, how am I going to do that best?

If you want to run paid traffic just find your highest converting landing page, put the thank you page as basically a sales page for that group and then as long as that group is on the second page and not on the first page that they click on, you should be fine and then you can promote people to that group that way.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. It's a little gray hat action. Zuckerberg, you hear that? Just kidding.

Josh Forti: A little bit. I'm sure he's listening, so, you know.

Steve Larsen: He's everywhere. We've got Zucker in the air.

Josh Forti: That's right. That's right.

Steve Larsen: Hey. That's super cool. Just a final question here. I guess is there some kind of platform that helps people be able to pull this off and do this? I don't know, something that you like or are you literally kind of manually going through and doing all this stuff, pushing all these different platforms and stuff? Is there a tool that you're using?

Josh Forti: As far as like the content, like pushing out the content or creating the content or getting the data or like what specifically?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I guess not so much curating, pushing it around though.

Josh Forti: Oh, gosh. We have a team, different BA's or whatnot.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: I think that's probably going to be the best way for most people is just diversifying content from there, different transcripts and things like that. As far as like pushing it out, like there are different schedulers, like you can schedule content on Instagram, Onlypult and Groom both are like, if you want to schedule content to be automatically posted. Those ones both work for Instagram.

Typically speaking, the reach is a little bit lower because Instagram knows, but they have said, yeah, you can do that. For Facebook we use like Buffer or Hootsuite. Once again, in my experience, reach is lower, so I always like to just post things. For me, I really value the exposure.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Josh Forti: I really value reaching the maximum amount of people that I can reach. I post everything manually. My BA's don't use schedulers. I don't use schedulers. Everything that you see is done from a real person. As far as analytics and like data is concerned, the Instagram platform, social info is actually mine, so you know, slightly partial, but we have crafted and we coded.

We've been working on this for the last eight months...

We've been tweaking and tweaking and tweaking it. Social info basically gives you, for the Instagram platform, every piece of data you need from what content is working or not working for influencers to hashtag research to being able to download other people's content to like everything that you need on there to checking if your account is shadow banned, things like that. From an Instagram perspective, if you're trying to grow your Instagram organically, social info, it's my favorite platform for that.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Appreciate that. Thank you so much. Hey, I appreciate it. Where can actually people reach out to you and be following you and be seeing what you're doing?

Josh Forti: Yeah. The best way to stay in touch is just going to be the Facebook group. Use my strategies that I just told you guys.

Post it all to one place. Social Media for Entrepreneurs.

If you got to socialmediaforentrepreneurs.co it will take you right to the group and you'll be able to check that out. And then if you want something for free there is an eBook that I wrote and it's all about how to create a profitable personal brand and actually start generating leads for free with the audience that you have on Facebook and optimizing your Facebook profile and things like that. If you go to joshforti.com/ebook.

My last name is spelled F-O-R-T-I, but joshforti.com/ebook. You can get something for free there. That's a pretty cool book and there's some contact information as well as the thank you pages, a call-to-action to join the Facebook group.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, and what better to go check out a live example of everything we've been talking about then just to go check out the group anyway.

Josh Forti: That's right.

Steve Larsen: Social Media for Entrepreneurs. Awesome stuff. Well, I appreciate it. Thanks so much Josh and thanks for taking the time to do this.

Josh Forti: Absolutely, man. I appreciate you having me on, and I look forward to working with you and making the world a better place.

Steve Larsen: Boom. Just try to tell me you didn't like that. Hey, whoever controls content controls the game. Want to interview me or get interviewed yourself? Grab a time now at stevejlarsen.com.

Click above to listen in iTunes...

I've come to know and be increasingly amazed by Dana. His knowledge and skillset never ending and very impressive. Dive into this episode with notes to learn how he's using the Dream 100...

What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

How's it going everyone, I am super excited for today.

I have a very special guest on. Please go stop whatever else you're doing. Again this is another one. Take a piece of paper out, write down notes, write down inspiring things that come to you. This is the kind of episode that not just has the ability to teach you a lot, but have a direct impact on the thickness of your wallet. I'm very excited for our guest today. I have known him for quite some time.

I'm always extremely impressed with everything that he does. I want to welcome to the show, Dana Derricks. How you doing man?

Dana Derricks: What's up man? Hey, thanks for having me. And for anybody that's listening, if you're in your car, pull over, put your hazards on. Just stop what you're doing. Tell your dog to go away. Your about to get hit with some gold here.

Steve Larsen: This is awesome stuff. Thanks for being on. Anyway, I've been just been super impressed with you. I think honestly the first time we met though was we were redoing the homepage of ClickFunnels and Russel's like ... I remember I came in one day and Russel was like ... He was like, "Hey man. Dude I got Dana Derricks man.

He's going to come on over and he's going to help us rewrite the entire, all the copy for ClickFunnels' homepage." And I was like, "Cool. Wait, who's this?" "He's the goat farmer." I was like, "Wait there's a guy ... There's a goat farmer who's an internet marketer?"

He's like, "Yeah yeah yeah yeah." And then you came out and you showed up, and you had overalls and like, sweet straw farmer hats. And I was like, "This guys is the man." And like ever since then I've just been diving into your stuff. I'm super impressed with what you do.

Dana Derricks: Dude, thanks man. I'm glad I have one fan.

Steve Larsen: Whatever.

Dana Derricks: No, that was so much fun and don't forget what ... By the end of that trip, what did you end up wearing home?

Steve Larsen: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. So he came in one day, just so everyone on the show ... He came in one day, it was one of the last days, and he had a full chicken suit costume for me. What was ... You gave Dave a massive bear. Russell had ... He was the gorilla right?

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Russell was a gorilla, Dave was a bear, you were the chicken.

Steve Larsen: That's right. And I thought that it'd be funny to ride that on my motorcycle home. So I did. And we'll put that -

Dana Derricks: And...

Steve Larsen: In the show notes.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Please. And can we put the picture? Can we dig up the picture too?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I'll go find the picture. I'm just writing that down.

Dana Derricks: Oh man. So good.

Steve Larsen: Chicken.

Dana Derricks: Such a good sport everybody. Steve Larsen, everybody.

Steve Larsen: Oh thanks man. Appreciate it. Well hey, just so ... If you guys don't know, if you're not aware, Dana Derricks is one of the, I would say foremost experts on this whole concept that I feel like is extremely kind of gray, cloudy. A lot of people don't understand it, but it's this whole thing around the Dream 100 and how to actually implement it.

And I mean you literally wrote a book on it right? And when did that come out?

Dana Derricks: When did the book come out?

Steve Larsen: Yeah yeah.

Dana Derricks: I think it's been out for about eight months. So probably about towards the end of last, of 2017.

Steve Larsen: Okay cool. Now before, before you were doing Dream 100 ... So I mean, first of all, how did you become an advocate of Dream 100? How did you start doing it yourself?

Was it ... I mean, I know the story, but for everyone else who's listening, like how does a goat farmer who's also a copywriter, who's also an internet marketer overall product creator, go directly into Dream 100 stuff as well? Could you give us a little backstory there?

Dana Derricks: I know. Everybody at this point is probably thinking, "Stephen, what is wrong with you? Where did you find this guy?"

Steve Larsen: "Who is this guy?"

Dana Derricks: Yeah. "What's happening?" So yeah. So I guess a little bit of a backstory that got me into the Dream 100 was I'm the type of guy that's going to try everything, and then figure out what works and what doesn't. And when I figure out something doesn't work, I just keep moving. Like, so I always say like honestly, there's two things about me that work well.

Like, number one I'm too dumb to overthink things so I don't get paralyzed by that. And then number two, for every ten things I try, one of them works and I'm thrilled. Like I'm so grateful for the other nine that didn't work so that I could get those out of the way to find the one that did. Right? So like for me, like I look at like major league baseball right?

The best in the world, on the planet, go up to the plate and they end up getting a base hit or you know a single, double, triple home run only three out of ten times. Right? Like nobody goes over four out of ten. So what's happening the other seven out of ten times?

They're striking out. They're hitting the ball and getting it caught.

Like bad stuff's happening almost over two thirds of the time. Yet like, us in business we go and try one thing, we step up to the plate and we expect to hit a home run, and then when we don't we're like devastated and never want to step up to the plate again.

So for me, I was not ... I wish I could share this amazing story of how I fell in love with the Dream 100, and it was this love story. But reality is dude, I tried everything. So back in the days of Google SEO, like, Google AdWords, and then YouTube, and then Facebook, and then like all these things I tried and tried and tried, and it just like, it sucked and I failed.

I kept failing, and failing, and then I realized, "Wait a minute." I was already doing the Dream 100 before I even knew what it was, and that was the only thing that ever worked for me. So that's why I got obsessed, doubled down, wrote a book about it, and all that other good stuff.

Steve Larsen: I mean, how did you first find out about it though? Was it straight from Chet Holmes course, from Russel's stuff, from ... Where'd you learn about it?

Dana Derricks: Yes. So I actually first figured it out through Russell.

I think he had something ... One of his things was like the lost chapter on the Dream 100, and he just kind of described what it was, and then he was talking about Chet and I was like, "Oh man. I have sifted through many stacks of hay looking for this needle, and I finally found it."

And then I grabbed Chet's trainings and it was like game over from there...

Steve Larsen: So what ended up happening. I mean you read this thing, and you go start implementing. Like what did you do first? Because there's a lot of ... I feel like there's just a ton of misconceptions.

Everyone thinks it has to be this package, or it has to be this ... I don't know. I think we all over complicate it a bit. Like what did you end up go doing?

Dana Derricks: Totally. So well, the first that I think everybody thinks when they first learn about the Dream 100 is, "Oh my gosh, I've already kind of been doing that. Right? I didn't realize it."

So for me, the big epiphany immediately was, "Holy crap." So for those that don't know my story, I grew up in a town of, I kid you not, 512 people.

Steve Larsen: Oh no way.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. My graduating class was 30 and we had a big class.

Steve Larsen: Wow. Cool.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So my life growing up, because we didn't have a movie theater, we didn't have a grocery store in town. We had nothing. We had a bunch of cows and not even a goat. Like what the heck? Right?

So football was our life, and I love football so much that I didn't want to stop playing after high school. I wanted to play in college. And nobody from my school, or area for that matter, played in college or did anything after high school. Like it was just, like we're too small.

Nobody knows about it. Like it's not for real. So I'm like, "Screw that." So none of my coaches ever played college football. They don't know how to help with recruiting and all this. So I'm like, "Screw that. I'm going to do it myself then."

And basically what I did is I created these ... Well first I started with ... I printed out a list of 40 schools that I potentially wanted to play football for. And then I made a packet for each school, like literally a box, and in it had like the highlight tape, a letter of recommendation from a coach, a personalized letter addressed to the coach that I was sending it to, all this stuff right. And I mailed all 40. And I was like, "All right, sweet. Let's see what happens." Two weeks goes by nothing. I'm like, "Wow that was a waste of time."

Third week, I get called to the principal's office which for me is not a good thing. Like, "Oh man. What did I do?" I go in there and there's a football coach in there, and I'm like, "Whoa." He's like, "Are you Dana," and I'm like, "Yeah. Who are you?"

He's like, "I'm Coach so and so." And he's like, "I'm here to recruit you." And I'm like, "What? You're here to recruit me? You came all the way to my town?" He's like, "Yeah," and then day or two goes by and then I get called back in and suddenly there's two coaches in there from two different schools at the same time. And I'm like, "Oh my gosh." And I remember like ... Yeah. Like my principal pulled me aside and he's like, "Dana when is this going to stop. It's really disruptive." I'm like, "I'm sorry Mr.C, it's like a broken fire hose. I can't do anything."

So long story short, because of the Dream 100, I didn't even realize what it was at the time, I ended up getting a pretty major football scholarship, and I'm the only person in the history of my school that's ever gotten any sort of athletic scholarship, and it's 100% thanks to the Dream 100. So that's like the first emotion you go through I think when you learn about the Dream 100 is like, "Oh my gosh. Why didn't I know about this sooner? I was already doing it."

You know? And then it turns into, "How do I now leverage the crap out of this in what I'm doing today here and now?" Right? So what I did, just really quick, was I wrote out a list of my Dream 100 right then and there and I remember, I'll never forget, Russell was at the top of my list and I looked at it ... This was not that long ago either. This was only a couple years ago.

I looked at it, I'm like, "There's no way that I could ever get that guy to ever pay attention to me or do anything with me." Right? And I erased it. I literally erased it, and then I was like, "Oh maybe." Right? "YOLO." So I put it back up on the side of the list, like with an asterisk. And I'm like, "Eh. Maybe." Right? And then fast forward like couple years, and then I go up, get to meet you and hang out with Russell, and speak at a Funnel Hacking Live, and all this other crazy stuff, and it's all 100% thanks to the Dream 100.

Steve Larsen: So for everyone else also, before we started this Dana is an amazing copywriter. He's amazing and Dream 100, and between those two topics I asked him, I was like, "Which one do you want to talk about?" And he said, "Which one do you want to talk about?" I said, "Which one gets you the most frustrated and mad?" And he immediately said, "Dream 100."

Why is that? Before we dive into some how you actually put this together, how come the Dream 100 gets you most ticked off compared to copywriting which is also very important?

Dana Derricks: I love this question. So for me it's because I feel like it's sort of a tragedy that most ... Every single business isn't ... Like first of all that everybody just doesn't know about it, number one. And then every single business or entrepreneur isn't using it. Like to me that is such a tragedy.

And for some reason, like I still don't know why. For some reason when people think of traffic and getting people into their funnels or eyeballs on their offers, or whatever, they instantly think, "Oh Facebook ads. I need Facebook ads." And for some reason, like that apparently is the only traffic source in the world. Right? Like, it's just this crazy misconception and the reality is is the Dream 100 is a much ... How do I want to say it?

It's a much more sustainable approach because it will never go away. It worked 50 years ago, it works now, it'll work 50 years from now. And it also ... It's free. I mean it's targeted eyeballs on your stuff for free. And it's all about ... It's really not that difficult. It's just building relationships with people.

So that ... I guess that fires me up is like why everybody thinks they need to have Facebook ads or whatever else when they could be using the Dream 100 instead.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, I feel like maybe that is part of the issue though is like, most internet marketers now are ... We're just spoiled. I mean before Facebook days, I mean how did everyone get the traffic that they needed. It's exactly what you're talking about right now and I feel like that's ... Not that Facebook's a bad thing, but I don't know how to drive ads.

Like I don't want to go learn that stuff. I feel like Dream 100 is so much more long term sustainable, higher leverage sources of eyeballs than going and ... Anyway. And learning that stuff. So you mentioned real fast, you said, "Okay. I went and I ..." It's funny because Russell was number one on mine also, and I was like, "Eh, we'll see. I don't know."

How did you make your list? I feel like that's the ... Do you feel like that's the reason people actually never do this? Like one of the choke points? Or how do you actually put it together?

Dana Derricks: I think that's a big one. And that's probably the most common question I'm asked when I'm talking about it. Yeah. It's like, "Who was my Dream 100? Who was it?" And I'm like, "Well ..." So finally I came up with a very simplistic equation I can give you and your listeners if you want it.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I'd love that.

Dana Derricks: So basically it starts ... It doesn't start with your Dream 100, it starts with you and then your customer avatar. So it's literally this simple. Who is your customer avatar? And that to me is a function of who do you want, as well as who do you not want? So it's who you want, minus who you don't want, equals your customer avatar. Right? And then so I've got my customer avatar, because if you don't have that then the Dream 100 is a very complex, difficult thing because you don't know. Right? So all right. The next question is, where are your customer avatar? Like where do they hang out? Right?

Is it certain Facebook groups? Is it associations they're in? Is it ... Are they buying the same book? Are they all subscribed to the same software? Do they listen to the same podcast?

Like if you can figure out who your avatar is, figuring out where they are is not that hard, and then wherever they are, whoever owns and controls the group that they're in, the groups I should say, or the audiences, that right there is your Dream 100.

Steve Larsen: Interesting. So you go from your customer avatar meaning who you want and don't want, and then you go from where they are, and then who already has them.

Dana Derricks: Exactly. Boom. Done.

Steve Larsen: Who has them. I'm just taking notes.

Dana Derricks: Sure.

Steve Larsen: Who has them. Okay, so then from that point, like ... So I'm just ... From when I've launched a lot of stuff and I've got Dream 100 stuff all over my office right now. What ... Huge believer. Huge believer. So I'm excited I get to -

Dana Derricks: Yeah man...

Steve Larsen: I feel like ... I mean I like to sit down and start creating somewhat of a campaign for each one of these people with a blend of personalization, but also my ability to do it kind of en masse. You know what I mean? To each one of these people. I don't know if that makes sense. But what do you do next to actually get a hold of them?

Are you going one by one for each of them? Are you doing something mass that kind of blankets all 100?

Dana Derricks: Great questions. So I actually, gosh this is just a little bit off topic but it helps to kind of illustrate this. So how build my system around what's working is I do everything the hardest, longest way possible and then that becomes my system. So for example, if I launch a new offer for something, like if I have a ... If I come out with a new $2000 book right?

I will find the person who is absolutely unqualified to buy it, who might want it, but who's totally ... Like for example, maybe they're totally broke. Right?

And I will literally go through and answer every single question for them, and have 1500 back and forths if I have to, to then have basically, after the point of first contact to the point where they actually buy the thing, which is like a humongously long duration of time and effort.

That is my system. Right? So that is now my system because very single objection basically has already been taken care of, and those are now all scripts that I can use for the next person. So I do the basically ... That's how I look at everything. So for my Dream 100, like let's say I have a target. And I'll use more of a short term target. So like a smaller kind of, more accessible one.

Because Russell, that's a long term play. Right? But like a smaller one that you could start the conversation with already is like ... You definitely have the elements of personalization, so figuring out ... And this all comes obviously from ... So for those of you that are Dream 100'ing Stephen, you're in the right place because listening to his podcast is a great way to get his attention and get to know him, and the second secret sauce I'll tell you is, buy all of his stuff. Okay?

So there's a correlation usually between how much access you get to someone, and how much money you've spent with them. So -

Steve Larsen: That is fascinating actually.

Dana Derricks: Right?

Steve Larsen: Man. You say too much good stuff man. You got to slow down. I can't write that fast.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So for me it's like, I'll just pick ... So when you're starting out, it's really critically important to just pick one that isn't years down the road, so don't go after Tony Robbins on your first one. But also don't go after somebody that is already in your network that you could get a yes from without even having to go through all the hoops of all the other stuff right?

And then just figure out what it is that can just showcase to them that you care about what they say, and you listen, and you consume their stuff, and you buy their stuff. Right?

So I've had people ... I learned this myself, they're like, "Well are you ..." I wanted to partner with software companies before and they asked, "Well are you a subscriber of the software?" And I'm like, "Good question." Right? Like, "I should probably get an account and get to know it really well before I should expect them to want to do anything with me." Right? So that's the beginning.

If you're not already doing that, then it's going to be really really difficult. But once you are, then ... Because it's like you're part of the community right? And -

Steve Larsen: It's funny that ... There's a few times I've tried to reach out, or someone reached out to me, and they're like, "How do I learn this?" I'm like, "You serious? I have a course on this."

They're like ... You know there's been times when ... Anyway. I don't know how else to say yes, amen, ahh, little hallelujah, lights coming down. What he's saying right now, please visualize bright shiny objects and things in the sky because that is so gold.

Dana Derricks: That's funny man. But yeah, like if you think about it, makes total sense too. Like, if you're already ... And the other ... To take that a step further, is if you can contribute value to their community, right? So like for me with Russell, I have intentionally ... I don't ... I love helping people, but like I'm not getting paid and I'll go into the ClickFunnels community, the Facebook group or whatever, and I just go help people. I'm not there, I don't have an agenda.

I don't have ... I'm not selling them. I'm just going in there and helping. So if they have a question to something that I know the answer to, I'll spend five, ten minutes helping them.

Steve Larsen: Which you're so good at man. I've seen you pop around all over the place doing that. Like I watch you do that all the time. You're such a ... Ah, it's awesome. Okay cool. Yeah.

Dana Derricks: Thanks man. Well hey, see I'm glad somebody notices.

Steve Larsen: I do man. Yeah I turn back around I'm like, "Man this group doesn't even ... It's not even active anymore. Or this." I'm like, "Man, Dana wrote a long incredible response to that. This is cool. He spent a lot of time on this."

Dana Derricks: So yeah. Because if you think about it, who's the perfect person for a guy like Russell to put on stage at his live event? Somebody that the community already knows, likes, and trusts. Right? Somebody that has invested in him and what he's building. And then, not only like monetarily. Yeah I gave him a lot of money to get into his inner circle, right?

But also like, I spend quite a bit of time, and energy, and effort on helping his people for free. I don't ask for anything in return you know? So it's like ... That's a deadly combination for anybody to ... How can you say no? Right?

Steve Larsen: Right. Oh interesting.

Dana Derricks: So if somebody's saying no to you, ask yourself those three things. Am I already buying their stuff and consuming their stuff, and in the community? Am I contributing to the community?

And have I ... What was the last one? Oh. I think, have I given them a lot of money?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Okay okay. So once ... Let's say ... Let's say ... Right. Because there was some point when Russell's like, "Wow. I'm now aware of Dana," and you realize that he is. How do you move forward? I feel like that's one of the other major questions kind of from the community that happens. They'll be like, "What do I say to him next?"

You know, "When do I drop, 'Hey we need stuff?'" What's the steps forward after you've gotten their attention?

Dana Derricks: This is like the second most frequently asked question is like, "I don't know what to say to him" or "I just feel like ..." Whatever. And I'll share quick like ... So Lady Boss, Brandon and Kaelin Poulin, amazing human beings, I work with them. They're in my intensive I call it. It's kind of like a course mastermind blend. And they build a $10 million company off of paid ads. And I'm just thinking to myself, "Holy crap. If I could make $10 off paid ads I'd be thrilled," right? And they're like, "We should probably try this Dream 100 thing."

And I'm like, "Yeah you probably should. Good idea." So three days before Funnel Hacking Live, Brandon the action taker he is, he enrolled in my course and then he's like, "You know what? I got a guy I think I'm going to put in this spot."
So because they're a big company, they can just by having a full-time affiliate partnership management person. Right? So he ends up being Brandon's brother, and his name's Jeff. He's awesome.

And Jeff asked me three days before the event this exact question right? Because Kaelin was going to be on stage, which is an amazing opportunity for people to know Lady Boss, and I'm sure there are people in the sea of the 3000 plus that they could potentially work with somehow right? Or they know somebody that they could. So Jeff's like, "Dana," he's like, "I'm really new to this. What do I say to people?"

And I'm like, "Jeff, this is the only thing you have to make sure you say. Everything else just be yourself, but this is what you have to say. Before you end any conversation, just ask the question, 'How can we help each other?'" That's it.

If you can just get that question out there, they may not have the answer immediately, but at least it gets their mind going, and number one it like tells them what your agenda is. It's not, "Hey can you do Lady Boss?" No. It's like, "Hey. We want to help each other," and that's kind of how it was for me as well with Russell is I got on his radar, and then you know it's like, "How can I help you with what you're doing? How can I help ClickFunnels?" Right?

And then that's how it came to, "Hey. You could probably help me by coming out here and knocking this copy for the homepage." Right?

So a really long winded way of saying like, if you can just always have that question in your mind, "How can we help each other," then it just takes care of the rest.

Steve Larsen: You know, it's interesting, with that approach, which I absolutely love because it comes from a place of friendship, and adding value, I mean you think about Dream 100 ... I mean, doing that 100 times, I mean it's easy to see how ... You easily could have a full-time position with somebody just doing that alone.

Managing those relationships, working on the next pieces. Is there ever ... What's the point in the relationship after you've been adding value, because I'm sure it's different for everybody. We're all different, but is there a time where ... Because some of them probably come up and go, "Hey. Let me promote your stuff."

But then there's probably other times you have to come back out and say, "Oh my gosh, he's not getting it, or maybe I do have to be a little more forward." Like how do you approach somebody and say that without sounding ... After you've given value, they know you're there, they know you're there to help, you've clearly developed a relationship. What's the way that you approach them and say, "Promote my stuff?"

Dana Derricks: Love it. So I basically relate it to marriage. So me personally I would never get down on a knee if I didn't know the gal was going to say yes. I just don't want to be the next YouTube marriage proposal fail video. Right?

Steve Larsen: Which are great to watch.

Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. As a viewer. Yeah. So I look at it the same way as like ... Like I ask myself, "Have I built up enough goodwill with this person," whether that's buying their stuff, consuming their stuff, being in their community, contributing to their community, or whatever. Contributing directly to them. "Have I done enough of that for them to say yes to what I'm going to ask?"

And if the answer isn't a clear yes, I just keep giving value. And usually for me, it's get to the point where people will ask me, "How can I help you?" Like all the time. That's one of the most common asked questions I have is from people just when I see them at events and stuff, and it's like, "How can we help you?"

And then I'm like, "Hm. Well let me think about that for a second..."

And then it's just the perfect ... So that's the thing is like, can you confidently say yes you've built enough goodwill up for them to say yes. And then number two, if not just continue to give them more value somehow.

Steve Larsen: That makes total sense. Okay okay. So we've gone through ... Okay. Gone through how you make the list, psychology of ... I love your approach by the way. That is just pure gold. Choose the hardest way possible because that becomes a system. That way all the objections popup and you can address those in scripts. Things like that. Just brilliant.

How to actually ... What do you do with the Dream 100 next? How can we help each other? On to promoting. Okay.

You are notoriously known in the inner circle, in pretty much everywhere who's ever come in contact with you, for your incredible packages that you do send.

Dana Derricks: Oh man.

Steve Larsen: Could you talk a little bit about the way that you do that? I know that Dream 100 itself is not packages, but obviously that is a strategy and a method. Could you tell us a little bit about what it is that you're sending out and what you're working through as you go through each person?

Because I've heard some pretty amazing stuff get sent around from you.

Dana Derricks: Oh man. Well do I have your address? I'll have to get it. So yeah. Russell talks about ... Because somebody asked him this once, and he had a great response. He said that he likes to theme things. And I didn't even realize that I was doing it, but he mentioned me as well. But he does superheroes.

You know. So that kind of takes some of the question out of what you should be sending is if you can latch onto a theme. So for me, obviously goats. So I've got ... Let's see if I have one. Oh I must have sent it out. Oh no I have one. Hold on, wait for it.

Steve Larsen: Is that the screaming goat thing?

Dana Derricks: That's the screaming goat.

Steve Larsen: Nice.

Dana Derricks: Oh I got to get you one man. Oh my gosh. That's the best way to crush any awkward silence ever right there.

Steve Larsen: Just play that.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So my stuff is really goat related. And then the other thing that I look at is ... And the other thing, if you're creative you don't have to spend a lot of money. I know that's a concern for people, and at the end of the day though this stuff is so valuable, as soon as you get one, yes everything's paid for.

So I keep that in the back of my mind. That keeps me going. But as far as like making it stand out and be cool, because I get stuff ... People send me stuff and I hope ... I don't care if they're listening or not.

Steve Larsen: It's a lesson. It's a lesson. We're all good.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Like I love you guys. Keep sending me stuff. There is a difference though between something that somebody personally put together in a box, and somebody that just sends me a gift from Amazon with like a gift card, or the typed out thing from Amazon. Like both are cool, and you doing just the Amazon thing is better than 99% of people. But like there's something to be said about that hand touch and stuff.

So for me like, I guess my creativity comes out because one of the things I sent to everybody in the inner circle that kind of got everybody kind of, I don't know, in a frenzy was -

Steve Larsen: Yeah..

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Was a wizard stick. So long story short, my dad lives in Texas, I'm in Wisconsin and I like to send to his Christmas gifts. So a couple years ago I bought this weird like weed puller thing where it's like you don't have to bend over to pull weeds out. It's like ... You know what I'm talking about?

Steve Larsen: Yeah yeah. Totally.

Dana Derricks: And I open it up from Amazon or whatever, and then I forgot. Threw the box away and then I was like, "Oh man. It's like 4:50 PM on a Friday. I need to get this out to my dad." So I went to the post office and I'm like, "Do you have a box that this would maybe fit in?" And they're like, "No not at all." And I'm like, "Oh crap." But he's like, the post master was like, "But we could send it like that." I'm like, "What?" He's like, "Yeah."

Like picture basically like a shovel. Essentially a shovel. He's like, "We could send it just like that." I'm like, "Wait what? You don't have to put in a box?" He's like, "No."

So basically, picture the shovel. They just printed off the label, and then like stuck it to the handle of the shovel, and then the shovel got sent in the mail just like that. Like no box. And so I'm like, "Huh. You don't have to put things in boxes. That's amazing."

So I sent out these wizard staffs or whatever, and I zip tied a wizard hat on top, and didn't put it in a box, and all these sticks essentially showed up at people's mailboxes and it was just this big crazy viral thing. And stuff like that that's just way more memorable and exciting when stuff like that shows up than just a box from Amazon. You know?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Yeah yeah yeah. Let's say ... Okay. So I've identified my Dream 100, I've contributed some things to the community, I really want to do things to grab their attention, what are some of the ... I mean, how much money are you spending on each one of these packages?

You mentioned it could be cheap, and sometimes that's better, but how much money per package do you expect, or ... I guess that's the question. How much money do you expect to be spending on each one of them?

Dana Derricks: If I can keep it under ... So depends on the target too. I segment my Dream 100 with A, B, and C.

Steve Larsen: Oh really?

Dana Derricks: Yeah. A is being like the top, B is being like middle, and then C is being like quick wins. Reason for that is because another things that people ask is like, "Well how high should I shoot?" And if you have all like, Russell, Gary V., Grant Cardone's on your list, like it's not that it won't happen, it's just that's not going to happen any time soon. You know? So I learned an expensive lesson from my football scholarship.

And that was I ended up playing in a division two school, which they still give great football scholarships, and mine was a huge one, but wasn't a D one school because I listened to the doubt in my head that I was never good enough to play D one so I didn't even print off any D one schools. I really regret that to this day.

So I just had B's on the list. And so if I'm looking at ... Typically for a B campaign, or even some C's, if I can keep my packages between $20 and $40 a piece, I'm pretty happy with that. But again, there come ... It comes with like, pretty relentless followup. Because if you just sent the box to somebody, good luck. But you got to do more than that. You know?

Steve Larsen: Right. Right right. Followup process. What does your followup process typically look like?

Dana Derricks: Oh man. So -

Steve Larsen: Because you're a beast at this man. I'm pumped to hear this.

Dana Derricks: It's very extensive. So ... Oh man. Do you want the whole ... Not like the whole thing, but do you want to know the extent I go?

Steve Larsen: Yeah, totally. I do. Because I feel like what people do is, let's say I go put the package together, I go to the mailbox, I drop the thing off. Boom. I've now done Dream 100. You know? That's kind of it, and people kind of like rinse their hands. "Yes, I get my success cookie for the day."

But it's really not over...

Dana Derricks: No. It's just beginning.

Steve Larsen: You're brilliant at this part. I'm so pumped.

Dana Derricks: Thanks man. So that's like ... If you're running a marathon, that's the gun that just started the marathon. But you can go home with your marathon number on, and you've dressed up, and congrats you participated, but you didn't finish. Right? So for me it's like, I'll send them ... For me really the lumpy mail is permission to follow up with them.

That's all it is. Because if I send somebody a gift card, or I don't care, wizard stick in the mail, like I have the right to follow up with you now. Right? I've spent money, invested time and money into you, now you don't have to work with me, or say yes to what I'm asking, but you do have to reply. Like that's the decent thing to do.

So I will then send them an email followup, and it's never like, "Hey did you get my email?" Like have you ever had somebody message you 17 times on 17 platforms saying, "Did you see my email?"

Steve Larsen: Yeah. "I called you. I called you. I called you. I called you." You're like, "Oh my. I know. I saw it, okay?"

Dana Derricks: Dude. Yeah. Like we saw it. Like -

Steve Larsen: It drives me nuts.

Dana Derricks: Right. But if it's like, "Hey did you see the package I sent?" That's a different ball game. That's like, "Whoa you spent money on me, and you took the time and energy to cut through and go to me in the mail." Right? So I'm always like, "Hey did you get the box yet that I sent," or whatever. And I'm not like ... I'm never annoying about it because like, I'll look at the tracking and make sure the thing was delivered before I'm like, "Hey did you get the box?" And they're like, "No, what box?" Right? It's like ... So that ... So it's basically multi-channel followup. It's really ... It's extensive. So it'll go from emails and Facebook messages and whatever they are on, and then if I get no response from them, and I know that they're potentially seeing my messages and I've gone to the extent of like, two, three, four weeks of followups, next is a dodge ball in the mail.

Steve Larsen: Wait you send them an actual dodge ball in the mail?

Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

Steve Larsen: So you're calling them out?

Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. If I have their address, they're so screwed man.

Steve Larsen: I didn't know you do that. That's funny man.

Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. Well that's because you've replied to me.

Steve Larsen: Oh that's funny.

Dana Derricks: So dodge ball. Rubber snakes work really well. It's literally ... And it's always ... Here's a thing. It's always got to be around humor though, and sarcastic, otherwise it's just ... It wouldn't work. So like the dodge ball's like, "Come on man. You're dodging me." And they know I'm not going to stop at this point. And the rubber snake, I think it's just to hilarious to think of the thought of them opening a box to see a snake inside. Like, it's just so funny. So I've never had to go past the snake, but the next one ...

This is kind of naughty, but I will, I am prepared to send a certified with like a W9 inside that basically says, "All right man, have it your way. If you don't want to reply, then I guess you can pay the taxes on all this stuff I sent you." It's all a big joke, but that's the extent.

Like people don't see ... They think you ... Like you said, they just send something and then all these good things happen and it's not. You have to really work.

Steve Larsen: You have to really keep going on them.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. And just be ... But being like ... Not badgering them though either.

Steve Larsen: There's a line.

Dana Derricks: Value. Yeah. For sure.

Steve Larsen: Okay, so someone ... Is the package ... I've heard you say this before, but just for everyone listening. Is the package the first thing you send to them?

Dana Derricks: No. So what I've found is ... I'm not sure the number, like the percentage. I'd say it's close to half. Probably close to half the Dream 100 deals I've made, I've never had to send anything in the mail.

Steve Larsen: Wow.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So that's more of like, it's in the tool belt, it's like a special kind of like drill. Right? You can use it when you need to, but you don't have to use it. So for me it's like more so cutting through the noise, and then giving me permission to continue to followup.

Steve Larsen: Interesting. Okay. You just turn up the heat when you get to packages.

Dana Derricks: For sure. And then also though, it's also about nurturing too. So I send my existing affiliate Dream 100 people, like my number one affiliate last year, I sent him ... I think I probably told you this before, but I sent him a big screen TV and surround sound just out of the blue. Right?

Just to keep him happy and yeah. So that's when it comes back in is really just spoiling people and giving them gifts and all that good stuff.

Steve Larsen: So ... Okay. So I mean you've given a lot of ways to actually pull this off, to get attention. As far as like pulling off a JV with them, and them ... Could you go through some of the practices that you have when someone says yes. Like, "Yeah I'm super super excited to dropout." You know, my people [ Dana. I've heard a lot of people that go by ... I don't know.

They'll pull like a URL up. There's a whole lot of like small little isms and little practices that are out there. Do you mind going through just a few of those?

Dana Derricks: Yeah, sure. So is this ... What's the goal? To get them to promote?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I guess as far as like they've said yes. As far as pulling off the JV with them. What are some of the things that you do to make that go smoothly?

Dana Derricks: Sure. Great question. So the number one hurdle that you'll have to get through first is getting them to actually do it. Because all these people will tell you yes because they don't want to disappoint you or whatever. But few will actually follow through and do the promotion.

Steve Larsen: Interesting.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. And Russell talked about this too. He said ... I don't know if he's faxed me this or where I heard it but, he said for every hundred people you target, you'll probably only end up with maybe about six that actually do the promotion with you. And of those six probably only about three will actually be worth all that time and energy.

Steve Larsen: Totally believe that.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. Right? So I break it down like this for ... And my students do it this way. So it's like, first things first. Once we're to the point where we think we can ask, we do. And then when they say yes, we're always selling the thing that sells the thing. So it's not like ... It's getting the calendar. Getting it penciled in on the calendar.

That is like the next win we need. That's what we're trying to sell. If we can get that dang spot locked up, I can remember there were ... I was on the phone with the CEO of very well known company in our space, and he's just like, "Yeah we're booked through whatever."

And I'm just like, "Dude. You know what? That's totally cool. Let's just do October. Right? How's that? Like, October clean for you?"

He's like, "Yeah, yeah okay." And then I'm like, "All right cool. How about the 12th?" And then just getting it on there because if they're going to be like, "Oh I want to look at my schedule, I have to view calendar, I'll have to get back to you," or whatever. But more friction right?

Steve Larsen: Sidestep. Yeah.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So I found too like where it was ... Excuse the sirens this is a big deal for a town of 1000.

Steve Larsen: You're good. No worries.

Dana Derricks: So like, also I've been surprised too where like I had it penciled in, I'm thinking, "Yeah they just told me that so I would keep them happy, or keep me happy." And then they actually did do it on that date and time. So it was like, "Wow, this is awesome." So that's the first big thing. And then making sure that you take everything off their plate.

Because the minute they thing that they're going to have to lift a finger for this, they don't want to do it. Right? So from beginning to end, we do every single thing. We will create all the swipe files for them to send out. We'll create all the affiliate ... I call them co-branded funnels.

So if we're pushing a webinar for example, it'll be a co-branded webinar funnel. We'll offer to host a webinar if they are cool with that.

And then we deliver everything to them about like two weeks in advance just so that everything's done. And then we followup and make sure. That's what's really cool about having an affiliate manager is that they kind of take care of all that, but like we'll make sure that every step of the way is covered so they don't -

Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. Oh man that's super ... Okay wow. That's crazy cool. And what do you when you ... Because I mean, I'm sure it happens right? You go out and you're getting ... I mean I've had those people ...I've had this happen also. Like you go out and someone says yes. You get the few yes's. Six say yes, three actually do it. What do you do with those other three?

Dana Derricks: Good question. So -

Steve Larsen: Is that when you send them the W9?

Dana Derricks: So if they've said yes but you just haven't got it scheduled yet, right? So I would try, just throw it way out in the future, and if you still don't then there's something there they want to do something with you, but apparently the way that it presented was ... That might not be what they're actually going to be comfortable doing. So I would like at trying to down sell it somehow. So if it was originally, "We're going to do a, you know, a joint venture webinar together," maybe starting out with a Facebook live might be better right?

Something that's a little bit easier them to not have to fully commit to, or even just like doing an email to their list or something like that. Because even that's going to be better than nothing, and if you look at ... That's another thing that we ... Is pretty cool.

So if you can do something successful with them, even if it's something small, you can go back to them and do something big. So you know, look at Russell with Grant Cardone. He went to 10X last year, and basically wasn't given ... He got on stage, and he was allowed to pitch kind of, but he wasn't allowed to do half of what he asked to do.

Steve Larsen: Right. The true Russell style.

Dana Derricks: Exactly right. Grant's like, "We're going to do it my way." He's like, "Okay, fine." And Russell did it Grant's way, got some wins out of it, but then look what happened the next year. Russell go to to go there and call the shots. He said, "I want this. I need that." Grant and his team said, "Okay. Whatever. You proved yourself last time."

And then boom. Closes $3 million in an hour and a half. Right? But he would have never been able to do that had it not been the year before doing it Grant's way, doing it smaller, doing it in a way that Grant was more comfortable with.

Steve Larsen: That's cool. That's cool. Okay. I know I'm just pounding you man. I got one more question for you. Scenario is, right, you go off, you've done the successful ones with the three, you're obviously continuing to work and warm up the leads for the other 97 as you go through. With the ones that you have done it with though, what's kind of your play as you move forward? Are you hitting them again for the next promo? Are you ... I guess post successful campaign, what kind of actions do you take with that person?

Dana Derricks: Yeah. So for me, especially like once you've figured out who's good, for me it's like how can we integrate? So I just want to turn and take it to the next level. So for me personally, like let's say that I'm JVing with somebody from my course, and we do a webinar together, kill it. We do five, six figures together, whatever. I want to work with that person. I don't want to just do once a year, once a quarter.

I want like full on, how can we work together. So I always offer ... What I've been doing a lot is I'll create a bonus module for whatever their thing is, if they've got a course. I'll come in there and basically teach a bonus module, or I will throw in my book in their value stack, or whatever just so that I can get not just access to their audience, on the one off promotions, but for every single buyer that comes into their world, they see me and the affiliate doesn't have to do a thing. Right?

And it comes back to value. Like this module I make, it's not like a pitch necessarily. There might be call to action. There is a call to action of course, but this is value, value, value and it's always enhancing the thing that they already sold. That's kind of the secret there. So I look at integration after a successful one.

Steve Larsen: Oh man, that's interesting. That's so cool. Man you have just like, just divulged. I have a full page of notes. Just given so much. I just appreciate that like crazy. I mean right, there's only a few people that ever really even written about this topic. The Chet Holmes. Amazing Chet Holmes, Russell himself, and you. That's it man. Like those are the options.

I know you have a book that has come out and is amazing. You have a lot of people ... I have a lot people who'd come and ... The book's incredible. And I'm very very excited for it. Where can people go get the book? How do they find out more about you and follow you?

Dana Derricks: Yeah. For sure. For anybody that's kind of vibing with this, and you're like, "Oh man, that sounds a lot better than running Facebook ads or running after the next shiny object," Stephen and I are totally Dream 100 junkies, and I'd love for you guys to do the same. So it's called The Dream 100 Book. Actually had the foreword written by Russell. It's pretty cool. I think Stephen's read it.

Steve Larsen: Woo-hoo. Yeah.

Dana Derricks: There is a caveat. Actually listen to Stephen's advice. So one of things you have really made famous Stephen is the concept of sell it before you make it. Right? Which I love by the way. I actually did that. Stephen said to do that -

Steve Larsen: No way.

Dana Derricks: Yeah dude. So I sold a copy of The Dream 100 Book, my first copy, for $2000 before I wrote one page of it.

Steve Larsen: No way. I didn't know that.

Dana Derricks: Yeah dude. Because Russell says writing a book is similar to giving childbirth. Which is...None of us know, but it's probably true. And so there was no better incentive to write a book than to have somebody on the hook for two grand that's waiting for it. Right? So anyway, that's the caveat. It is $2000. However, because Stephen was so gracious to put on a chicken suit and drive around on a motorcycle in Boise, Idaho -

Steve Larsen: I secretly just loved it. I was excited.

Dana Derricks: Yeah. I mean if he didn't like it, he was putting on a good show. So for you guys listening, if you're vibing with this, I'm actually going to let you guys get a copy of it for free.

Steve Larsen: Holy crap.

Dana Derricks: I don't do this really for money that much anymore, so I'm cool with that as long as you guys don't share this with the rest of the world. [inaudible 00:48:48] The mad buyers that paid two grand for it. So the link is going to be ListentoStephen.com. ListentoStephen.com.

Steve Larsen: That's cool man. Appreciate that. It's S-T-E-P-H-E-N. Yeah?

Dana Derricks: Correct. The good spelling.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, the good spelling. The biblical way. No but seriously, just echo what Dana's saying here like I ... Funnel's nothing without traffic. And especially as an entrepreneur and those of you guys who were listening. I know you guys are go getters. This podcast is getting a significant amount of downloads daily now and I thank you all for listening, but what I want you to know ... And that's the way that I think about it too.

Russell thinks about it, Dana thinks about it. Like all these top guys, they're not out looking usually for like this little tiny trick insight of a platform. Right? A Facebook trick. A Twitter trick. They're not looking ... That's not how they do it. Instead, they outsource that piece of it, because we all know it's still important, and they go focus 100% of the time on developing these kinds of relationships.
So anyway, I'm super excited.

That was very very generous of you give that Dana. So it's ListentoStephen.com.

Dana Derricks: Totally. And you all should listen to Stephen. Keep listening to him.

Steve Larsen: I appreciate that. Well thanks for being on the show man, and where can everyone go to follow you as well?

Dana Derricks: So being the farmer I am, I don't think I'm on instant grams. I'm over on Facebook, or DanaDerricks.com, or just keep listening to Stephen, and every once in a while I'll probably pop up.

Steve Larsen: Absolutely. All right. Hey, thanks so much for being on the show. And everyone go to ListentoStephen.com and get the free copy of ... It's literally called Dream 100. Was two grand, for this audience it's free.

Dana Derricks: Go get it.

Steve Larsen: Boom. Just try to tell me you didn't like that. Hey whoever controls content controls the game. Want to interview or get interviewed yourself? Grab a time now at SteveJLarsen.com.

Lessons from my 2-day deep dive (caffeine and dubstep abound)...

What's going on everyone? It's Steve Larsen and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

Hi guys, I'm excited to share this with you. These were ... These are the patterns that I noticed while I was kind of deconstructing some of the most profitable webinars, and especially their sequences. Okay? I was specifically looking at sequences.

The funnel part I didn't look at as much, frankly because on some of these I helped build them, but it's the actual copy itself that I'm trying to go through and show some of these neat patterns that are inside of every one of them.

Anyway, so I'm going to walk through some of these. I've got notes all around me right now. So if there's like a little pause, or little ums, or little ah, just stick with me, bear with me, because I'm going to walk through these. I just sent a lot of these lessons over to several people as well.

Anyway ... Okay. So I'm going to walk through some of the scenarios here, okay? And what's funny is, man just going in and just adding one of these things in. Like it's going to increase my ... It'll increase my show up rate, it'll increase the amount of people who purchase.

There's a lot of pros and benefits to what it'll actually do for actually sequencing itself. And what's funny is while going through and looking at these things, I almost started getting this feeling like, "Man I actually owe it to my prospective customer to do this stuff. To actually make these changes. It actually will increase the experience.

...They'll actually have a better experience during the buying process." I actually feel like it'll serve them more. And so this is like ... These aren't like little tricks like, "Oh these are cool tricks to like do that very thing. Trick them." Okay. I actually think that the level of clarity that this added was very fascinating as well.

Anyway, so I'm going to go through some of these lists as well here, and specifically there's like ... Let's see. One, two, three. There's ten.

Actually ten things that I want to walk you guys through and show you how to vastly, I believe, especially from watching the way each of these webinars are pulling off, increase your cart value, but like I was saying before, I think like followup sales. Right. Dropping refund rates. Does that make sense?

And all the things that come with it. Anyway, so I'm excited for this. Here's the first thing though. So number one here, these are the interesting webinar followup lessons from my hacking expose. Okay.

Anyways, number one here, what I ... Some of these might be like, "Oh kind of cool," and some of them are just like massive super huge bombs. Anyway, so the first one here is on these webinars. The confirmation email ... And almost every one of these scenarios, and every one of these normal webinars, the confirmation email itself has an origin story in it.

Now think about this, okay? Does everybody buy the same way? No. People do not all purchase in the same manner, right? I am not going to sit and read sales copy. I want a video. Right? I do not sit and read a blog. I want to listen to a podcast. Okay. I do not consume content.

All right, but there are other people that exact opposite. And as one of the biggest lessons I think I can give to you, especially one of the themes you'll see throughout as I kind of draw up these lessons, you're actually giving the webinar script in several manners, not just on the webinar. Okay.

There's a group of people that want to see it on the webinar. There's a group of people that do not.

And so you actually threw the scenario. You're actually going hit several different modalities to deliver the sales message, to deliver the offer and the stack. To actually give the scarcity and urgency to close.

To give the time close for them to actually act. To give the bonuses away. It's actually hitting them in several different manners which is really interesting. It's really three heavy ones.

But anyways, think about this right? The first email they're going to be seeing is let's say they're not actually going to go and watch the webinar. But most of them are still going to go check out the confirmation email, right? Or a good portion of them are going to.

That's still an opportunity for you to sell them the origin story. Why you got into this thing, an opportunity for them to fall in love with you, an opportunity for them to actually fall in love as to why they should listen to the rest of the offer.

So just think of that. Okay. So first spot, one of these major touchpoints. Again, when we're talking about the last podcast episode, right? About the hook, story, offer. You're still doing the hook through the email. You're still doing the story.

Your actual origin story is the first, very first thing that's coming over to them regardless of if it's a webinar, regardless of whatever you're selling, you still have an opportunity to ... Right. It's one of the major things too. I remember I was hacking ... I was funnel hacking ... This was again one of the first really profitable funnels I ever built.

Again probably like three, four years ago. I was hacking this guy, and I noticed that he was doing this very thing. He had a soap opera series and the first email after you opted in was the first email of the soap opera series. If you don't know what I'm talking about, go read DotCom Secrets. And he was following that format.

But along with the first email came a second email of just his origin story. And he was like, "Hey, just wanted a chance to introduce myself and blah." He went right into the origin story. So I started doing that as well.

And it was really cool because I got a lot more feedback from people replying to that email saying, "Man I'm totally in this for the exact same reason Steven. Oh my gosh, that's super cool. Thanks for sharing that. I'm actually ... Sounds like you're telling my story."

I got more feedback from me telling my origin story, than I did from that first email with the soap opera series which is fascinating. Anyways, that's kind of cool. So to reinforce the point. Okay, so number one, write ... You're hitting from these different areas.

Here's another one. On webinars that lead to application funnels, the confirmation email has a case studies origin story. Okay this is a pretty powerful thing to notice and recognize. When you think about these, if you're trying to sell something that's high ticket, the way that you present these stories ... Right.

Let's think about some coaching. If you're trying to sell coaching or a high ticket mastermind, or a high ticket event or experience, something like that, a lot of times the ... Like when you think about the way Russell sells his inner circle, or when you think about the way really expensive people sell their stuff, there's really two modalities.

The first one I absolutely hate which is when ... In fact I was ... I can't say his name. You guys would all know him. He's on a very famous TV show that I'm sure many of you guys consume.

I got offered to go help build an application, high ticket application funnel for him, and I said no actually for a lot of reasons. Which kind of made me sad. I wanted to go do it, but just scheduling wise, just logistically too many things going on.

Anyways, it was fascinating because I looked at the current application funnel they had and it was this guy, who's a celebrity, and he ... You could tell he was being told what to say which is fine.

And the first video though was him saying like, "I'm so and so, and I've done this and this and been on these TV shows, and you've seen all this, and you've done this, and you know that I can get you," and I, I, I, I, me, me, me. It has total me syndrome. Okay? It's the me monster.

Okay. Me monster was all over it...
And I was like, "Gosh that's ..." It's very hard to sell super high ticket stuff like that. Right?

Really high ticket funnels are very very client result based stories that you're using as your sales letter. The Liz Benny story. Right? The Drew Cannoli story. Right? Those are the stories.

Do you ever really ... You hardly ever see Russell ever on any of the application funnels that are out there. That's not what's selling it. Results are selling it. The fact that he's been successful with other people is what's selling it.

And it's the same thing when you're selling a webinar funnel into a high ticket application funnel. So I was looking at CF Certified right, and that's a webinar that pushes into an application funnel. And so the actual ... Right, when it's just a webinar funnel for usually like a $1000 to $20000 product, it's the protagonist origin story.

It's the entrepreneur's origin story...

But when it's moving ... This is one of the things I recognize. When it's moving into an application funnel though, it's one of your most successful case studies, it's their origin story. So there's a split that happens right?

There's a very stark, very powerful difference as I was looking at this. Anyway, the indoctrination series, when you think through life you're like, I've had a lot of people reach out and ask like, "Steve you're talking about indoctrination series, what is that? Is that a soap series?"

No. It is specifically for a webinar. It is specifically for ... Think of it as like a ... I make indoctrination series on one of my podcast funnels, and it's actually my other podcast show. I have a really strong podcast funnel there. And it gets like 62% opt in rate, and just it kicks butt. It's really really awesome.

But they get a series from me, I sell it as a course. I'm like, it's free and it's just for the listening. Does that make sense?...

So it's a free course, but really it's an indoctrination series. Anyway, if you study and you look carefully specifically at like the Followup Funnel webinar, the Funnel Hacks webinar, even Software Secrets, the Software Secrets webinar, all of the indoctrination series are actually a product launch funnel. What?

What? I'm like recreating so much stuff because of that. Think about this. Right, some people do not like buying on the webinar. Some people do not like buying from blogs. Some people do not like buying from product launch funnel.

But you can deliver the same message and offer in each one of those modalities. And so that's one of the things I'm doing is I'm looking at my followup sequence. It's not longer just a webinar that's delivering my offer, and the story, and the sales message pieces. Okay.

It's actually ... I have it coming across as text which I'm going to show you in just a second. I have it coming across now ... There's actual hidden product launch funnel inside of my followup sequence.

It's a product launch funnel. This is what I'm building out next which is so exciting. So I have a ... The product launch funnel as well matches and follows up with my close cart sequence. So at the end of video number four, like if you think of Jeff Walker's product style funnels, video number four is where a lot of the call to actions dropping in right?

But it coincides with my close cart timeline. So in the email I'm saying, "Hey the cart's closing. If you want, go ahead and check it out here." They're actually watching video number four though, which is the stack portion. It's me reselling a whole ... Anyway. Super cool.

Super super cool. Hope there's massive aha's with that. Delivering in these multiple ways...

So anyways, it is a product launch funnel the indoctrination series. And I don't know that I've ever heard many people really teach that which is kind of cool. Like if you think through and you're looking at these replay sequences which is ... I'll tell you guys.

Most of my money comes in my replay sequence. Right? I still make sales on the webinar, but I don't know why. Like there's something in my webinar followup sequence that works really really really well. I've not totally identified what that is yet, but most of my money comes in the replay sequence.

If I can turn the sexy up though on that sequence, right, which includes the urgency and scarcity aspect, and I'm putting them through a product launch version of the same webinar, people are going to go check this ... Most people watch ... Most people can't actually join me on the live webinar.

They watch the replay sequence. Everyone's timeline is different. They just login, they sign up so that they know they'll be on the sequence, they can watch it later.
Well, heck. If you can't watch the full hour, hour and a half webinar, might as well drop it out to you in 20, 30 minute little episodes.

And across the top bar on each page, they can progress forward just by clicking if they want to, or it'll drip out to them anyway and match my close cart sequence. Anyway, this is like a far more technical episode and I know that.

Just stick with me. These are like ... Man, these simple little elements guys are going to change the way I do the game a lot.

Anyway, let's see. Post webinar, all emails focused on how to get the offer for free. Yeah. Yep. Anyway, I'm reading what I wrote just so I would remember what to say. Anyway the post ... Yeah. That was right.

All post webinar, pretty much all email focuses on how to get it for free, and if I'm at the part where it's not like the blatant call to action, there's still some piece in every email where they can either number one, go watch the replay, or number two pushes them over to buy.

But it's reinforcing the fact that they can go get it for free. Think of it like this, right? There's some aspect in your stack slide, in your offer, that's the thing that everyone actually wants.

It's not that they don't want the bonuses, it's not that they don't want the other pieces inside what you're actually offering, but there's one thing that you're giving away that's the thing that they actually want.

Let's say I went in and I was on Amazon, and I was creating an offer on Amazon. Actually here's a better example, right? Okay.

Okay. So I've been working out a lot more. I'm super excited. Trying to like ... One of the inner circle member, it's Brian Bowman, what's up buddy? Big shout out to you. You're the man. He was pointing out to me, he's like, "Dude you do literally nothing but funnel stuff." And I said, "Yeah, I know. Isn't cool."

And he's like, "No like, yes that's a good thing, but like you're in a phase now where you should maybe ... You could do something else also. Enjoy other parts of life." I was like, "I'm doing what I love brother." He's like, "Come on dude."

Anyway, so I've been trying to do other stuff as well which is kind of hard. It's funny. I like suck at like this life thing. I'm better at just living in funnels. Anyway I was like, "I got to go lift. I go to go exercise. Get more into that phase more," which has been fun.

Not very sedentary anymore which is awesome. So I've been lifting a lot more and exercising, and one of the workout things I'm following, I'm on two different three month programs which I'm super pumped about and it's going well so far. Trying to get ready for that two comic club cruise. Okay?

It's coming up in January you guys. So excited. But I don't want to be a tubby bubby on that baby...

So anyway, super excited. I was looking and there was a jump rope. This guy was saying, "Hey, whenever you start, one of the cool things to go and do is just jump rope for five minutes, and you're going to burn a lot of calories just like that," which shockingly, oh my gosh, is true.

Anyway. Way harder than I thought. Anyway, so I go on Amazon right? I go on Amazon and I start looking around for a jump rope. A speed rope. And these guys have nailed the offer creation piece on Amazon for ecom stuff, for these jump ropes. When I got the jump rope, it was so funny guys.

Like anyway, part of me felt like a little bit of a pansy for buying a jump rope, and another part of me felt like Rocky. You know. Anyway, and there was ... So the main thing right? I wanted the speed rope. Right? But what came with it? It was so cool guys. They had made an offer in their ecom stuff.

And the offer was, "Hey. You know what? Just because you probably don't know all the cool things ... You think you're literally just going to jump a little piece of rope for a while. A little cord. This little piece of plastic.

But look at this. This is actually going to come with 12 workouts that you can do. By the way, here's a whole bunch of before and after pictures of people who've been doing it. By the way, did you know that this comes with the most awesome cool carrying case?

It's also featured to have extra ends and parts and pieces." Like they made an offer out of it. It was really interesting, and they totally had ... And I was like, "Man I'm buying from you guys just because you did that."

Anyway, it's fascinating right? So if you think through all the different pieces of your offer, there's one thing on there that I really wanted though. It's the reason that I got ... I want the jump rope.

And so all of these followup communication after somebody goes through either a webinar, or a free plus shipping funnel, or I don't care. Whatever it is, all of it is focusing on how you can get the main thing you actually want for free.

So one of the biggest tweaks I would have made to that offer is I would have said, "Hey, actually the jump rope is free."

I would have priced it the same as everybody else, but the copy I would have changed it to would be, "Hey the jump rope is free when you get this other stuff, which happens to be the same price as all the competitors." But does that make sense?

Now the copy made it an offer. Even more of an offer. You still get all these other things, but it makes the thing they actually want free.

And so it's the exact same thing...

Think about that with like funnel hacks. With Click Funnel's offer. Right? "Here's how to get Click Funnels for free for the next six months. You buy Funnel Hacks." Does that make sense? So think through the thing. I'm starting to call it the anchor of the offer.

There's one anchor...

I call it the anchor product, okay? And it's the thing that they actually want in your offer so bad, and when you tell them it's free when they buy those other things, oh man.

Really cool way to turn up the sexy in your offer, and all of the followup sequences, all the emails, all the pieces of copy, post pitch, post webinar, reinforce the point of how to get that thing for free.

Okay. And the fact that there's limited time actually to get it. Anyway. That was really really powerful. So I started looking through that.

This is also a really cool commonality as well. I typically after my webinars, one of the things that I'll go do is I immediately dropout to them the opportunity to go and watch the replay. That almost is never the case in any of these webinars. Isn't it interesting? Almost none of the time is the replay email sent first.

Like post webinar. It's over. Or it could be post ... You know they've gone through your free plus shipping book funnel, or ecom funnel, or high ticket funnel, or I don't care whatever it is. Right? Post call to action. Post offer.

Post you actually going and trying to get them to purchase. Right? The first thing in here, the very first email, was actually another call to action email. It was an email that reinforced the stack. It actually redelivered the stack. Right?

"Thanks so much for joining the web class. I appreciate it. For those of you guys who weren't actually able to get on here, here's what it is," and actually just went straight through the stack slide. First thing you're going to get is X, Y, and Z. In fact which ... There's one of the sequences here.

...Hold on let me look real quick here. I'll include the whiteboard screenshot in the blog just so you guys know. Actually I'll put it on Instagram. It'll be one of my posts. There's my hook right there. Go follow me on Instagram. Okay. At Steve Larsen HQ, and I'm going to make it one of the posts there.

You can see the screenshot of the lessons that I learned from each sequence and then right next to it, I made like this ultimate followup sequence, and I mapped the different webinar emails to each ... Anyways. Super super cool. You can go check it out if you want to on my Instagram which I'm far far more into now which is awesome.

But anyway, so post webinar it was let me followup ... Yeah yeah yeah. Follow funnels. Hold on, let me look at it. Okay, follow funnels. Okay very first ... I've got all the emails I printed out right here. Very first email that goes out post webinar, let me get to it. Okay here. Okay. Yeah. Check this out. Okay.

Okay. So right after the very first email that goes out, right afterwards is this. Okay this is the followup funnel's webinar. Okay cool. Yeah. Check this out. I'm just going to read part of this to you, okay. Reinforcing a stack slide on the very first email post webinar.

Okay. The second email is the one that actually pushes the replay. Okay. But there's another opportunity to purchase right from the get go which is so interesting because I've always just sent immediately a replay email.

Anyway, I don't know if you guys are geeking out about this, and maybe I'm going too deep on this. Hopefully this episode's super valuable. For me, this is going to make ... I feel like the vehicle I've just designed here, because I not only am fixing all the stuff here.

Like I rebuilt an entire funnel that just totally kicked butt. I feel like it's the difference between a $1 million webinar and a three million. And, so excited. Calling the shot on that one by the way. That'll be cool. All right so anyway it says, "So the web class just ended. I hope you had a chance to watch it live.

If so you saw the power of followup funnels. You saw how we were able to literally make $16 for every dollar made on the front end funnels.

You see how this is the way our company's growing.

We talk a lot about the tip of the iceberg, some of you only saw the tip but I showed the rest of the iceberg today.

And that copy is linked over ... Actually it's just underlined I think.
Anyway. "Hopefully you love the presentation. I wanted to send you a quick email because people are blowing up our help desk.

They saw the presentation and weren't sure if they should be all in. What does it mean to go all in? Being all in is something we talked about towards the end of the presentation." And here we go.

He goes into what I'm calling a benefits stack. The benefits stack is one of the things that is included inside of that first email out. So there's an actual stack, but it's not always like, you know, "First you're going to get software secrets. Then you're going get this. Then you're going to get this. You're getting this."

It's like a benefits stack. It's the benefits of actually getting. It's really really interesting. So I don't know what else to call it, so I'm calling it a benefits stack.
And he goes into it. This is the copy part of the email where he goes into benefits of those getting it.

And then he puts a call to action at the end. "It means you're using Click Funnels, backpacks, acitionetics, all the tools inside Click Funnels help dramatically scale your business. When you go all in we've got a huge gift for you.

First off, I'm going to give you 15 followup funnels." So he's still going to go in, and he's selling each part of the stack, but he's diving a little more deeply into the benefits of it because it doesn't ... Like if you didn't see the webinar, right, who cares what the things are in the stack? There's no value behind it.

So he's actually selling the whole ... Anyway, this is interesting...

He goes, "First thing I'm going to give you 15 followup funnels. These are the exact followup funnels I use to one get people to actually show up for the webinar, two get people to purchase after the webinar, three get people to buy high ticket coaching, and much more.

You get all these 15 funnels, total value is 9.97. Second," he's now on the second item in the stack, "We're going to give you a T-shirt that says, 'We're not confusion soft.' If you missed the presentation, you need to watch to get the inside joke, but this shirt is amazing. I'm going to send you it. Third, I'm going to give you," Right. He actually is writing out ... I've never seen this. This is crazy.

"Third I'm going to give you, 'I build funnels,' laptop sticker. Fourth I'm going to give you the, 'All in' temporary tattoo." And then he goes in and he talks about the total value. Anyway, "These are all the insane bonuses you get. Click here to go all in."

He actually literally pushes a stack and immediately back to the call to action is the first email. I have never ... I have always done that like the very dead last thing when my cart's about to close. Not first.

So anyways, huge realization. And later on, right before this email's over, the same email, he goes, "If you didn't get a chance to watch the webinar, don't worry. I'll try to get you guys a replay tomorrow." Is that interesting? So he's baiting the hook for the next.

Totally Seinfeld thing right there. Does that make sense? But he's pushing it.

Anyway. I might have gone too deep on that. But that is like crazy cool stuff. That is so lucrative to know that. This is pretty interesting too. He did this in a lot of webinars. Not all of them. And several of the followup sequences, he actually has two different replay pages.

Okay. The first replay he pushes out. So let's say it's the next day, he pushes a replay out. All right. It's kind of the normal, "Hey you can go check out the replay here. By the way this is only open for the next 36 hours," or whatever. And then a few hours later he'll be like the hook. Right? The hook of the email.

The reason. The curiosity...

The reason why he's emailing again is he says, "Look, a lot of you guys are emailing saying, 'I actually saw most of it Russell. I just don't want to actually watch all the things I've already seen before. I want to fast forward to the point where I left off.'" And he says, "I get it. I totally get it. So we did something special for you guys. Here's a replay with scroll bars."

So he unlocks ... He just makes another page and he just, on the video element, he makes it so that they can fast forward. That's it. But it's another reason to email. It's another hook to go email and get it out into their hands. What? Crazy.

So I now have two replay pages in my personal webinar, and one of them is ... I want another reason to email them. Another logical reason to email them after they've ... "Check it out. There's scroll bars in this." Okay.

Anyway that's a big one. One of the things too is as part of the first replay email that goes out, he drops in ... You can see this specifically in Funnel Hacks if you go check this out. Actually I think there's few others as well. High Ticket Secrets have this.

There's a few other webinars that had it. But this was brilliant. Oh this was brilliant. I was just saying how not everyone buys the same way...

Okay. If you go to Funnel Hacks. You know, go opt into Funnel Hacks, buy it again if you want, but if you go opt in to Funnel Hacks, and just watch the replay sequence that's coming out, there's something very interesting that comes in. Let me grab it here real quick.

Something very interesting that pops in in this sequence as well where he dives deeply into ... He actually gives ... He calls it, "Hey for those of you guys who didn't get a chance to, or you'd rather skip around, I'm going to toss in for you cliff notes to the webinar."

Oh man. Funnel Hacks has an awesome product launch funnel in it. Let me find it here. Anyways, whatever. I'll just tell you guys what it is. What he did is he took all of his slides and printed them all out, and transcribed the webinar so that you could see the slide, and you could look at the slide and you could read the webinar.

This is brilliant. Guys, he has somebody go through and they actually printed out all the slides, and transcribed everything that he said in the webinar underneath each one of the slides so that you can see the slide, and then read. See slide and then read it. See slide, read it. It's huge.

Okay. I don't even know how many pages ... It's absolutely gigantic. Right. But when somebody goes through, somebody who's a reader, they want to read stuff, they want the little nitty gritty details. They want, right. Especially those who are like the engineer mindsets. They really like that kind of thing, right?

They want to go through, and they want to read the webinar.

And so he gives them the option to do so inside Funnel Hacks.

And they go through and they read it. What happens when somebody spends like an eternity reading the webinar?

They buy. You know what I mean?...

Oh there it is. All right. This is a day three post webinar. "24 hour warning. Want the cliff notes? Okay in less than 24 hours they're pulling that Funnel Hacks web class and the special offer we made.

We can get Click Funnels for free for the next six months," he's reinforcing the ability to get free for the anchor product of the offer, "Because you're almost out of time, I had one of my team members type up the cliff notes of the web class just in case you missed it to recap.

So here's what you need to do now." Straight on to call to action. "First download the cliff notes. Second watch the replay here. Third get a huge Funnel Hacks discount, six months for free by clicking here." So number one, want to see the cliff notes. Number two, just watch the replay here. Or number three, you want to go buy.

So towards the end it's more ... And that's the whole email. It's a super short email. But towards the end of the replay sequence, I've noticed that the emails actually get far shorter as well. Almost across the board.

The email's towards the beginning of the replay sequence are much longer. They're telling the whole origin story. They're telling the secrets. They're telling the reasons you should get in there. And usually the copy, copy wise is actually getting smaller and shorter, and shorter, and shorter as the replay sequence goes.

Anyway, I'm almost done here...

Okay. There's something called ... I don't remember if I go this from Russell or ... Anyway, I've seen this from several people, but I'm calling it ... It's a hidden cart close.

So they'll close the cart down, scarcity, urgency is the only reasons why anyone does anything. So it's important to close the cart I believe. So close the cart down, and legitimately take the bonuses away.

They can still go get the main thing I'm sure on your main page, they can still go buy Click Funnels for example somewhere else. But the actual main thing they want, they can't get that for free. They can't get all the bonuses.

There's some aspect of it that you take away for the scarcity aspect. But there's a hidden ... What was it? It was like 72 hours later ... Yeah. Something like that. There's a case study that people can go in and they can read. I think I saw Dan Henry do this too once.

They can go in and read a case study of another successful person. The cart closed, they clearly did not purchase. And you don't really ... You're like, that's fine. Instead a little while later, you drop this amazing case study after the cart's closed, with a link to a limited secret replay that they could go watch it again just to scoop off the top.

So the hidden cart close thing. Cart close, and then hidden cart close. That was kind of cool. One of the things that I'm doing is I'm going to put Facebook, the actual Facebook comments element. I'm going to put it below the broadcast page. Below the replay page.

Below my indoctrination, which is going to be a product launch funnel page. And it's going to be the same link though, so any comment on any one of them is going to populate to all those pages. Massive social proof. Super excited about that.

If somebody ... So on the actual order page, and on the broadcast page and replay, an exit pop that I'm dropping on, I'm going to drop in like the Facebook live chat element. So if they're leaving ... It's kind of like...and one of the reasons why he would make so much cash as well on his ... And if you don't know, like he made ... I can't say the exact number.

He made tens of millions of dollars in only a few months. Like a couple months. Right. Made a lot of money, tons of revenue dropping in. And one of the reasons why is because he understood his buyer, and understood that everyone does not buy the same way.

So some people wanted to buy on the website, but then ... Or on the funnel. But when they tried to leave the funnel, there was an exit pop that said, "Hey got a final question? Why don't you just call us?" Right? And there was a phone number.

Well I'm going to do the exact same thing with a Facebook live chat. So when they're leaving, and I'll just change the copy to whatever it needs to be. If they're on the order page ... Like, I'm noticing for every four people who actually check out the order page after the webinar, about one purchases which is pretty standard.

I mean that's pretty normal. What if I just doubled that? I mean, does that make sense? People are clearly going to the order page. They're checking it on out. They want to see it. So they got some last burning dying question. Well I'm going to go in, I'm going to drop in the ability for them to ask a question live.

So on the order page, when they exit, it will be a Facebook live element, or a Facebook live chat element. Probably through mini chat or something like that. That way they can chat immediately with somebody on my team and get the final questions answered. Or let's say they're on the broadcast page and they try to leave. Right?

"Oh you got a final question? We got a live moderator right now. Go ahead and drop it in." And there's probably going to be some ... Like a page profile or something like that. Probably for the main product that someone's just moderating at all times and trying to get back to almost instantly. Right.

So we can keep on there. Keep the last few questions going. Because most of the questions I get now are ... They're not, "Hey, I don't believe this product works." The questions I get now from my webinar are primarily, "Hey, will this work for my scenario?"

And if I could just have someone answer that question, we'll double our sales right off the bat. And so I'm going to do that on the replay pages, I'm going to do it on the broadcast pages, on the order page, and just to get the last few ... Anyway.

So I'm super stoked about it. It's going to be awesome, and all right. That's a lot of stuff. Anyway, that was deep. That was heavy. If you need to listen to that again, go for it. I would love to do like a full blown out course just walking through all the cool stuff I'm dropping in. There's so many ways.

Now that my ... Because I recreated my whole offer, and it's so much more sexy.

It already was sexy, but it is like ... I got the correct response this time guys. People were emailing me, they were Facebooking me, they were all saying, "Dude are you sure you want to give all that value away for that price?"

But I was like, "Yes. Yes. That means I hit it. That means I did it right. That means ... Okay. That is the correct response that I want," and I got a lot of them.

And I'm like, "Yes. Okay, sweet." Right? And I'm finishing the last few pieces that I want to go get for the stack slides, and stack section itself. I'm getting the webinar funnel where I want to be now. And I'm obsessing over the little things now that'll add just another two percent conversion here.

Extra half percent conversion there. Now I can obsess over that tiny stuff because for a while it's just making sure that freaking offer is amazing. Anyway. So I'm excited about that. And I'm going to go put these different pieces together, and anyways it's going to be epic.

All right guys, hey go crush it. And please for the love, if you have not left a review, I get so excited. Thank you guys for dropping those reviews in there. I just spent two days studying and learning the stuff that I just dropped you guys in 30 minutes to an hour here. Over these last few episodes.

I would love a review if you wouldn't mind...

If you could drop it on over. That drastically helps. I'm certainly always trying to increase the reach of this. We are pushing stuff all over on Instagram. I'm getting my content machine all put together. But I would love that, and anyway.

In fact, I think I got a cool little special bonus coming up for those of you guys who do coming up soon. So anyways ... Because I can see your name on it which is awesome. Anyways guys, thanks so much, appreciate it. There's my ask. All right guys. Talk to you later. Bye.

Hey thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Want today's best opt in funnels for free? Get your free opt in funnel pack by going to SalesFunnelBroker.com/Free Funnels to kickstart your opt ins today.

In this episode let's look at the Hook, Story, and Offer of 5 of the most profitable webinars...

What's going on everyone? It's Steve Larsen, and you're listening to sales funnel radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today, and now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million-dollar business.

The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?...

This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio...

What's up everyone? Hey, I am excited for today. I'm excited to share some things with you. I actually have been preparing for this episode alone for, I think, at least a month.

And I know that's kind of crazy, but honestly I've been trying to figure out and distill down how to actually share with you these lessons over an audio without actually visually seeing it.

So, I'm excited to go through this. What I want to do is, I want to walk through, if you guys haven't noticed in the last little bit here, I'm going to talk about Russell Brunson again here, right? And if you noticed, especially those of you guys at the last FunnelHacking Live, Russell sold a 2 Comma Club coaching The X Program.

It's amazing. It's incredible. We have tons of people in there. We took the program that we created about a year ago, and we made it this full-out, blown-out thing. We brought all the coaches in. And it's just been a bunch of fun.

So, I have the incredible honor to continue to teach, offer creation and sales message development to all the new students. It's just been a lot of fun. The more I get into it, just like anything, I continue to learn.

We don't teach the same thing every single time...

I constantly look for new patterns, new ways not just to teach it, but to understand it and make it more and more simple and more and more applicable, and more and more ...

The biggest thing I fight is, I treat every individual who bought the coaching program like they're my customer.

Therefore, what are your false beliefs? What are the ways I can get you to learn the most?...

So, anyways. If you notice, one of the first videos in there for those of you guys that were able to go in and grab it, you guys have probably seen this. It's an absolutely amazing video. For those of you guys who have not, I don't know when Russell will open up 2 Comma Club coaching X again, but seriously look into it, okay?

I'm blown away...

I've never seen him create an offer like this and it's just been amazing...

So, anyways, one of the first videos you see when you log into these ... It's part of the core training, before you come over to my course which is Secrets Master class, is this training that Russell does about the hook, the story, and the offer.

He actually did a podcast episode about this recently as well. In all things, all we're trying to do is make things more and more and more simple. In a world where sometimes we confuse complexity with prestige, which is stupid. That's not true at all, okay?

Needing to sound smart, that's not serving anybody except your own self, which ultimately doesn't serve you ever.

We try and make it more and more and more and more simple. It's actually harder to make things more simple, to bring things down to a place where it's like, "Look, you need this, this, and that." For my little 15 minute speech I gave at FunnelHacking Live, I prepared for nine hours.

Seriously, nine hours for 15 minutes. I remember I voxed Russell and I was like, "Dude, 15 minutes, man. It took me nine hours," and he was laughing and he was like, "Yeah, that's the price of simplicity."

And it's so true...

So, anyways, what I wanted to do is, I want to show you that framework all over the place. If you look at some of the most profitable webinar follow-up sequences ever, I want you to know the hook, story, and offer pattern is everywhere. It's not just hook for sales message as a whole.

It's not just story for the entire thing as a whole. It's not just offer for the entire thing you're trying to sell. It's in every little aspect, every little piece.

So, what I did a little while ago is, you guys know January I left Click Funnels, and I was like, "Hey, I'm going to call my shot here." This is pretty nervous. I left Click Funnels with no offer, no message, I had no funnel, nothing. Two kids and a pregnant wife.

That's part of my hook, me telling you that right now. It's like, "Holy crap, what did you do?" House payment, payments all over the place, that's pretty ballsy, right? That's why I was doing it.

I was trying to call my own shot with it, and say where I was going to go and make my story for it...

Which is exactly right, hook, story, and then I put together an offer. What I did is, when I first launched my webinar, I launched it, I did just this basic version. I knew it was broken. Guys, my funnel is still limping on one foot.

I know it is...

There's so much that's wrong with it, so much that's wrong with it. I've been going through and re-writing the entire script and just re-did it again, and did it in front of a live audience again, and it was awesome. We did really well.

But I'm constantly refining these things down. After about two months, so about the beginning of March, I was like, "I need to go re-write the entire webinar." I want to re-build the entire funnel, but I want to make it like, super awesome.

To the tenth degree, go all the way, which is kind of my mentality on everything. But I want to make it go all the way, just make it awesome. And so I started thinking, webinar is what I teach all the time and I'm good at them, and I like writing offers and scripts and sales message and message to market match.

I love that stuff. It's super fun. It's my obsession, even more than funnel building, which might shock you. I obsess over this topic greatly, offer creation and sales messages. But I was like, "I want to go do it on a deep, deep funnel hack of the top webinars that are out there."

Biggest webinars, most successful webinars that I could go find, that are easy for me to go grab data on real quick. I have a list of some of the top webinar gurus on my whiteboard. Lots of them. Anyone from Russell, of course, to Sam Ovens, and tons of these different webinar junkies, on guys that make big cash primarily through that method.

And what I did is I started logging into all their stuff, I started grabbing everything they've got and I started going through and grabbing all the email sequences.

Anyways, I specifically wanted to go through Russell's follow-up sequences for some of the most profitable webinars I've ever seen him do, ever.

And so what I've got here next to me, and what I started going and doing was I was, of course I'm opted in everywhere, for everything that that man puts out, but I went through and I printed off all of the webinar sequences.

Specifically the email copy for the FunnelHacks webinar. That thing's done like, 50 million, 60 million, something like that. Which is crazy. In like, three years? The CF certified webinar, man, that thing made a ton of money. I don't know the exact number on that one but it's millions and millions and millions and millions, right?

Lots of money...

High ticket secrets, that was one of the most profitable webinars that Russell ever had as well. High ticket secrets. I grabbed that one and the follow-up sequence for that. You know what I mean? I just opted in. I printed out the emails that came. Does that make sense?

So I opted in, waited a while, printed it out, and then I laid them all out. Software secrets, that one was a huge one. Follow-up funnels, oh baby. Anyway. So I have five sequences of these webinars in front of me. This is actually going to be a two-part episode. There's no way I'm going to get through all this right now.

But what I wanted to do is, I did like, for like two straight days my blood was surging with caffeine, dub-step blasting, but I laid out all of the sequences across my floor. Some of you guys saw my Facebook live as I went through that at a pretty high level.

I pretty much for two straight days, I read the sequences and I studied them very, very, very in-depthly. What I went through afterwards is writing on my whiteboard the ultimate sequence. When you are reading that much copy...

It was a lot of paper. It was like 50 pages at least. I don't even know. This is fat, I mean, I'm holding them all together. It's a pretty fat stack.

When you go through that depth, you start to see patterns. Especially when you're studying from the same person. That's one of the reasons why I dive so deeply on everything Russell has done, is because I want to see where his head is.

Not just what he's writing. Not just what he's putting out. Not just this hook, story, and offer. I want to see what progression is going on in his noggin. Right? And, by doing so, I can see where he's actually looking and what he's trying to accomplish.

It's been cool to do that. When you have that kind of ... Proximity's power, right? It's huge. It's why I always encourage everyone to get a coach, be a coach, anyway...

So, what I did is, I laid them all out and I started doing this deep dive and I realized that there were these intense patterns throughout the sequences that I don't know that I've ever heard him teach, and I don't know that I've ever taught them that way either.

Next episode, what I want to do is dive into a lot of the actual commonalities and lessons between them on a pretty in-depth level. For this episode, what I wanted to do is I wanted to walk through and show you guys hook, story, and offer in each one of these sequences.

And show you and let you know that they're actually in every single one of them. It's not just like this overarching thing. I want to sell X product. I'm going to create this offer, but first I'm going to go test it with this sales message. Oh, awesome, the sales message is making cash now.

Sweet, I should go finish making the offer and make the funnel amazing. It's the reason I haven't made my funnel amazing yet, is because I've been waiting to make sure I've got all the pieces together. I'm so glad I did because of all the stuff that I found while doing this.

Anyway. I'm holding right now the sequence for the follow-up funnels webinar, and it's pretty ridiculous. And if you don't know what this one is, this is one FunnelHacking Live 2017 Russell wanted to go backwards and look and see how much money is actually being made after the initial cash is taken from somebody.

How much money does each dollar turn into? And he found out, this is the hook, yes, $16.49 for every one dollar. Crazy. The subject line is the hook. The subject line is the hook. You're not selling anything inside the email. The only thing the subject line's selling is they want you to open the email.

The subject line of an email is selling you opening it. That's it. They just want you to open the email. But it's this hook, massive curiosity, and for a long time we've been trying to figure out how to better describe what a hook is.

If you think about it, a hook is really just a piece of curiosity that pulls you along. That's why we call it a hook. It hooks you. Hooks you like, "Wait a second, what?" It's what grabs your attention, both eyeballs, and makes it go, "Wait, what?"

That's another way to think of a hook...

So it's usually some element of a story. It can be part of a headline. It could be before a headline. It's a little bit fluid and for a while, we've had a hard time to explain it because they're a little bit, I don't know, almost ... They're so fluid and evasive it's like, how do you ... Anyway.

So, think of it that why. The hook is the crazy piece of the story that makes people want to listen to the rest of it. It's the thing that makes people say, "Oh my gosh, I have to stop what I'm doing immediately and watch what the rest of this is."

So what I want to go do is, I'm going to dive through hook, story, and offer through each one of these sequences because it's extremely powerful when you start looking through all of it. Think about this real quick, right?

We got a webinar registration page. On the webinar registration page, or free plus shipping page, or high ticket application page, or if you're selling retail or SAS it doesn't matter. Any page where it's the first interaction with somebody.

Or it could be even on the ad. The first touch point with a perspective or a current customer, that is the place you're tossing your hook in.

So the registration page in this scenario has a hook, a story, and an offer on just that page. Each email has a hook, story, an offer. On each email, the hook is the subject line. The story is the first part of the email.

Usually there's some kind of offer or call to action at the end of the email. On most cases. Every once in a while, there's ... Anyway. Definitely for emails that are selling stuff this is always the pattern.

I was looking through and I was studying this and I saw Russell dropped that out there and I was like, "Yeah, that's true. Look how this fits in. Boom, boom, boom, all over here." By the way, it's on the thank you page, it's a reinforcement of that hook. It's a reinforcement of the story.

It's a reinforcement of why the offer's amazing, why you should show up and cancel everything during that webinar time and show up. All the indoctrination sequences, all they're doing, it's another shot at a hook that makes you again want to go clear your schedule.

You're literally telling the story for secret number one. The offer is get on the freaking webinar and it will tell you the rest of this.

Does that make sense? It literally ... Think of that. If you're like, "Steven, I like building in Click Funnels, I like building webinar pages, I like building pages in general, all this stuff is fun to me but I don't know what to always put on the pages." At a very top high level, just think through hook, story, offer.

Hook, story, offer...

Per page. Per email sequence. Per touchpoint. Per engagement. Per content. Guess what I did, literally, on my legal pad right next to me before I started recording this episode? I wrote H, S, O. Hook, story, offer.

The hook: I'm going to talk to you guys about the most profitable webinar follow-up series on the internet, or series-es. The story: I'm starting with the story so you guys have backstory on why this stuff matters, because I'll tell you more about that in just a second.

And then I have somewhat of an offer and call to action at the end of this. And me delivering this chunk of content is the offer. When you think of it that way, it's not always a stack, slide. Stack, slide is a framework to create an offer.

Anyway, so I want to walk through this here real quick. Because I'm just going to be honest with you guys. When I first started going through and into this stuff, what am I doing? I'm writing a story. Here's the story, okay? When I first started doing this stuff, and I got interested in it, I started following ...

It was actually Pat Flynn from Smart Passive Income. He really got me going on internet stuff. Listening to his podcast, I had not heard of Russell Brunson at the time. I was listening to a lot of a guy named Sean Terry and was doing a lot of house flipping stuff. He had a great podcast.

He got me going as well on some other things...

This was like, six years ago. Those guys have been awesome and really were the catalysts to get me along and then finally I was like, "Oh my gosh, who's this Russell guy?" And I started diving deep into his stuff.

But honestly, when I first started learning these things, I started going through and I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is so cool but, how do I do this without writing?" I hated English. I hated writing papers. I hated ...

I got good at them because I wanted to get through the pain as fast as I could. But I didn't actually want to get good at the writing aspect. All this internet stuff, I was like, "Yeah, it's all about the copy." I kind of wanted that to not be true. I wanted it to not matter.

So I dove deep, you guys, I was huge into design stuff. I got two state ... I'm sorry, I got three. Three Colorado State awards for my layout and designs in high school. I was the head editor of yearbook. For layout, not writing. For layout, not photography.

For layouts...

So I've been studying page layout and design for like, probably, a lot of my life. The majority of it now, which is awesome. I wanted the design to be the thing that sold. I wanted the design ... And the farther I got into this, you guys, you have to know I started realizing that wasn't true.

For example, insert testimonial, here it comes. When I was driving traffic for Paul Mitchell, I was in college, and a buddy and I ... It's funny, a lot of the Paul Mitchell schools in the area started coming over and they were like, "Hey, how do we get more of the social media crap going?"

And all of our professors were like, "We don't know what these two kids are doing, but hire them." So they did. And from our marketing classes, we got hired out to go actually do the stuff, not just learn it, which was really funny.

And we started driving lots of traffic for Paul Mitchell schools, so that they would have more walk-ins into their stores...

And it was interesting. And still, to that time, and this was four years ago, still to this day, I was still to that time, I was not ... I was still kind of hoping that design was the thing that would do it. That the layout ... and there's certain element that totally matters of that.

But what actually does the actual selling is the copy. We spent, I think, three hours on the headline for one of the campaigns we were running for Paul Mitchell. And it was working. And it was at that time that I started realizing like, "Gosh," because it was an active thought of mine like, I was trying to avoid the whole topic of writing. I did not want that to be true.

I did terrible most of the time in English...

I did terrible. When it was about stories, I actually did really well in English. When it was about research papers, I did terrible. I hated them. Just completely awful at them. Anyway. So it was around that ... I started realizing, "Oh my gosh, I gotta learn more about this thing, this copy writing thing."

And I started diving more deeply and that's when I ran into the Dotcom Secrets X. A lot of you guys know that story...

This stuff matters like crazy. If you look at some of those profitable funnels now that are out there, you wouldn't say that they visually are actually that attractive. Some of them are. And I'm not saying it doesn't matter.

I'm not saying you can't make it aesthetically pleasing. I do everything that I can to do that, but the ultimate bar that actually turns the dollar, the actual crank is obviously the words on the page. So obsess over that. The ability to write and the ability to put out ideas...

If there's anything else I would have done, if I could look back and like classes I wish I would have taken, I would've take debate. I would've taken a lot more creative writing. I would've taken a lot more stage presenting styled stuff. Which I actually did do a lot of that.

But, anyway. So I want you to know, I'm going to walk through real quick, as the one that Click Funnels hires to go teach this stuff to other people, with my lens.

Not to beat my chest, but meaning I want you to know that what I'm looking at here and what I'm looking for has taken not just a lot of time personally studying this stuff, but the lens that I'm looking at it through, this stuff's popping off the page at me.

Anyways, I want to walk through some of the most profitable ... This is part one of two. First of all, I'm going to go through hook, story, offer on each one of these funnels. There's five webinar funnels. Very, very, very lucrative funnels and dive deep.

In fact, I encourage you to do that very thing and I would go print out the top selling stuff. Go get it. Print it out. Study it like crazy. There's no other higher leverage activity I can think of, you spending your time on, than studying the copy of previously vastly successful sales letters.

Anyway. So one of the first things I want to point out is, before I dive into this as well is that each one of these email sequences, what's fascinating is, when I printed them out and I put them all across the floor, I already knew it would do this but it's just cool how it reinforced it was.

You can read them like a story...

The whole webinar follow-up sequence is a story, all of it. All of it goes and it wraps in together. It did not feel like there was anything random sert in. Random little inserts put in. It's almost like a ... Very similar to a Seinfeld episode, right?

Where when one episode ends, I'm begging for the next one to start because it was awesome...

Each one of these reads like a story. There's a logical progression throughout them. They're connected. It's not like these little tiny pop-shot emails all over the place. "Three hours left." "Two hours left."

Three hours left, but like, what's the story?...

Two hours left okay, but what's the story? How did it tie into the last one? What's the logical progression? So these are like works of art when I look at them...

I'm sorry it's taken me 19 minutes already to get to this, but I'm excited to. Let me just go through each one of these real quick here and walk you through some of the hook, story, offer of each one of these sequences.

So first I'm looking at the follow-up funnels webinar and it's the one where Russell did a really awesome up-sale to get a lot of people to upgrade to Actionetics at FunnelHacking Live 2017.

So what's the hook? The hook, the piece of curiosity. What? 16 dollars on the back end for every dollar on the front end? Whoa. There's the hook. It's also part story there.

The story there is Russell saying, he goes, "First off, I want to thank you so much for registering for the webclass. I wanted to make sure that you have a chance to watch it in the next 24 hours because as I mentioned, you get a special bonus that you don't get if you wait until tomorrow to watch it."

Whoa. Now let's dive a little bit here into the origin story. Which is what he did. This is the first email they're getting after they register. Great time for an origin story. Here it goes. He's starting right into it.

"During this webinar I am hoping to save you, hoping you'll have the same epiphany I did." He's actually pulling it on out. Here it goes. Here it goes, the origin story. "As the owner of Click Funnels, I obviously create a lot of funnels. Sometimes I'm not aware where all of our sales and profit is coming from.

...So last December I pulled all of our numbers, and I wanted to see which funnels made us a lot of money and they work together." There's some curiosity there. It's kind of like a second hook. This is the barb on the hook.

"What we found, which is crazy, is that for every dollar we made on the front end, we made 16 dollars through our back end follow-up funnels. What are follow-up funnels? That's what this presentation is all about.

In fact, I'm going to show you how a page-by-page, step-by-step, every single thing we do inside our follow-up funnels." Now I have desire to show up for this. There's a reason for me to clear my schedule.

And sometimes if you're like, "I don't know what the hook is," sometimes it's just the title for the story you're about to tell. Does that make sense? It's one of the easiest ways to think of a hook. These headlines.

The headline for secret number one...

The headline for your webinar. The headline for the webinar is literally the title for the origin story you're about to tell. A lot of times it is. It doesn't have to be, but a lot of times it is. It's one way to think of it.

"Secret number one: how to blank without blank." That's literally the title for the story that you're about to tell in secret number one.

If you're feeling this mismatch between your sales letters, it doesn't matter if you're making a webinar or not, any of your sales, if there's this mismatch in your titles and the stories you're telling, that's why...

The headline is the promise that ... It's the reason you should listen to the story. "How I blank without blank." "How to blank without blank." And that's kind of like the base format we use and more from another formats after that.

Software secrets. Next one. Software secrets goes through and hook, story, offer. Hook is, let's read through here real quick. Subject line for the very first email you get. "Your webclass is starting. Thanks for registering.

...Upcoming class, your training is about to start. Here's the access link to the webclass about to begin. Click on the link now and join all three of us inside this free training." So this is like a confirmation email. There hasn't been so much of it yet, but look, it'll keep going.

"If you've been wanting to create your own software, do not miss this webclass." Did he tell me how to? No. That's it. Just that one sentence right there, he salted curiosity throughout. "If you've been wanting to create your own software, do not miss this."

He goes on. "Did you catch the free webclass that you signed up for?" Little bit of a hook there. This is like the main hook of the second email you get after the webinar. "How much money will it cost to actually build my software program?

Hands down, that's the number one question we get from the webclass. Fun fact: did I ever tell you the first time ..." Now we're going into the story.
"The first time I made my first software for a whopping 20 dollars. True story."

He literally calls it a story. There we go: there's hook, there's story, and then he goes into the offer. "In fact I made a quick and fun video."

As we move on here he goes, "Here's what you need to do next if you want to learn this. Step number one, watch the Q and A video to find out how much you can expect your software to cost. Step number two: access the webinar replay here." That is the offer. There's a reason to take the call to action.

That's the offer right there, to grab that...

Anyway, in each one of these sequences there is one of those things. Let's go with High Ticket Secrets right now. Just grabbing the next one here. High Ticket Secrets right now. High Ticket Secrets, the title is the hook on this case. "Starting now, High Ticket secrets."

And he says, "I'm going to show you how to instantly add high ticket sales to any funnel without you personally talking to anyone on the phone ever." That is the hook. I don't want to talk to anybody on the phone for high ticket sales.

You don't have to do that. Are you kidding me? You give me the reason. In this case, the title of the webinar is the hook coming in here...

And he dives into the story and he starts talking about how he's done that. "How to plug in a new business. How to sell high ticket stuff without feeling like a used car salesperson." Two pages that you can add to any ...

If you think about it, think about it this way too. If I'm looking at just the headline of my webinar, and I'm looking at like the three secrets or whatever it is you're going to share inside there, whether it's a free plus shipping funnel or a high ticket funnel, the headline is the hook.

The headline, the title for the entire thing, that's the hook...

The three secrets? A lot of times, just the titles, the actual headlines themselves, is the story. I hope there's some a-has there. Does that make sense? Wait for, pause for effect. You think through it that way.

Anyway, I'm just moving quickly here. So I can dive into the next one as well...

CF certified. This one's pretty interesting too. Hook here is extremely strong and obvious as well. "The highest-paying part-time job in the world." This is for CF certified. "Funnel consulting: the highest-paying part-time job in the world."

That's pretty strong hook. That's pretty strong hook. That webinar sold really, really, really, just fantastically well. And as we look through here, just to prove the point, secret one, two, and three, that is the story in this case.

So we know what the hook is, let's look at the story. Here's the story: "How Amanda went from reluctant click-funnels rookie to selling 12 funnels her first 47 days." What?...

"The results first, cookie-cutter method that will give you unlimited clients. And how to easily shift from six figures a year to six figures per client per year, and a whole bunch more." What? Those are all titles of stories but he salted the oats in a way there's so much curiosity inside there I have got to go check that out.

It also happens to be the offer on that ... Anyway. What's funny is that each one of these emails is a hook, story, offer as well. Sometimes there's some elements that are stronger than others, but as kind of like a rough outline, that's another way to think about each one of these emails.

Each content piece...

When I write my podcast headlines, the title of each podcast, I'm trying to create a hook. I'm trying to salt an amassive promise in there, without you actually knowing what it is. That's the hook. Also happens to be the headline.

Not always has to be the case, but in this case it is...

All right, for FunnelHacks. This is amazing. "Anatomy of a 500,000 dollar per month sales funnel." Okay, that's a pretty strong hook. The right audience sees that and they're like, "What?"

The other kind of audience sees that and they're like, "Yeah, right." Isn't that interesting? The right person needs to see that...

In fact, when I saw his title of his webinar, "Weird niche funnel currently making me 17,000 dollars per day and how to ethically knock it off in less than ten minutes," I think that's what the hook was, but it had such a profound effect on me, I was like, "I'm in."

I didn't even have to see the webinar. I was pumped to see it. It made me even more excited. But I was the right person to see it...

That's why when you think about and when you're writing these hooks, and the stories and headlines and offers and all that stuff, who you're talking to matters so much. If I go talk to some ... Do you think it's ...

Imagine I walk up to Russell and I'm like, "Dude, I got this amazing idea. Imagine a website, but like instead of a website, it's like when they say yes to one thing, we send them to something else, like another page automatically, and we ask for more money. Again. And then we do it again. And if they say no to that, it's okay, we'll like, give them like a payment plan on something."

Is that a new opportunity of Russell? No. You have to think through when you're writing these hooks and you're writing these stories, you're putting these offers, the very first step to go through is figuring out who you're actually speaking to and to that person, is it a new opportunity? Is it a blue ocean?

It's one of the reasons my webinar does so well. I'm taking things that are already well known in another industry, I'm just changing who's hearing it. Does that make sense? Big a-has?

Reason why I wasn't a psycho for leaving and being able to with all the expenses I had and a family to pay for? Does that make sense?

Anyway. All right, so, hook. "Anatomy of a 500,000 dollar per month sales funnel." And he actually says it in the email. One of the very first things says, "While you're waiting I've got a fun story to show you. To share with you so you can be prepared.

Video one: we'll show you the anatomy of a 500,000 dollar per month sales funnel. Want to see it? Also in this video, you can see one of the most trusted website designers battle a tiny blond female in a cage fight." What? Isn't that interesting?

So every single email, every single piece of copy, every single page, every touch point with the customer. A lot of times why people don't have enough engagement is because they have the story and they've got the offer.

They got the sales message and they got the offer but every sales message has a reason why you should be listening to the story. Which is the hook. We brainstorm many times hours on that.

It is one of the easiest ways to give yourself a raise...

Just come up with a better hook.

These guys that have these offers that've been out there and they've been making tons of money with the exact same offer for years, the reason they can do it, they don't change the offer, they hardly change the story ever.

What they're doing is coming up with new hooks. And they're just dropping new hooks and they're trying to drop new hooks to the same audience, and try to expand the audience.

Anyway, I hope that that is making sense to you. And if you go through, start looking at it from that lens.

Look at the way that people go through and they come up with this hook and that hook. That's the reason why we have swipe files and swipe files and swipe files just loaded with different cool ads...

Because if we knew it was profitable, what was the hook inside that ad? And also the story inside that ad? Usually there's both inside an ad. And some kind of offer inside the ad as well.

And then they go to the next page, there's another little mini-hook, story, and offer. And they go inside, and then finally you get to the main offer of the whole thing. Then you get to the main story. Does that make sense?

Anyway, start looking at it that way and I'm going to ruin you because you're going to look at all ads, all commercials. That's the reason why we'll geek out about infomercials. If I'm late for a movie at a movie theater, I don't want to go to the movie. I don't.

I actually want to turn around, and just go to the next time because I want to see the previews. Because I'm looking for hook, story, and offer inside each one of them. If you go and you ... In fact I did a very funny thing. Go Google ... I did this probably like a year and a half ago.

I went through and I started looking ... I Googled "top phrases". "Most common phrases in movie previews." And what's funny is, guys, even though there's different movies, it's technically a different story, it's the exact same story most of the time. And you can go through and you can start looking.

They're using the same pieces of copy in almost every single movie preview. The hook might be a little bit different, it's the same story though. Some dude's freaking out, "Oh, my gosh, unexpected event." We like him because of some affinity that the commercial made us have for him or the preview.

We go through and the little tiny hero's too journey going on. Little epiphany bridge, epiphany bridge, epiphany bridge, unexpected, unexpected. It's this exact same ... It'll ruin you a little bit. But you also become a really good copy writer.

Anyway, so take it from a guy who hated actually the copy side of this whole game for a long time. It is incredibly important to go through and just if anything else, just start looking for those patterns and how you're being sold.

And how you're selling. And if it's not intentional, my guess is you can give yourself a very fast raise by making it intentional...

All right guys. Hey, thanks so much. Hopefully this is helpful to you. I'm excited for the next episode as well. I'm going to dive more into the strategies I saw in a very deep level in each one of these email sequences and the patterns and commonalities between all of them, and how it actually drastically has effected my funnel.

There's like, this whole other series and thing that I'm going and creating because of what I studied and learned, which I don't think we've really talked about. I know I haven't. I don't think I've ever heard Russell talk about it either, so.

Anyways guys, hey, thanks so much and I will talk to you and see you, well, you'll hear me on the next show. Hey, thanks for listening.

Hey, look, can't decide what funnel you need or need more in-depth training on how to use your current funnel? Find out which funnel you need at salesfunnelbroker.com and get your premium, pre-built funnels and training today.

I wanna dive deep into Disney's offer...

What's going on everyone it's Steve Larsen and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio...

I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my 9-5 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch?

This podcast is here to give you the answer...

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business, using only today's best internet sales funnels. My Name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

What's up, guys? Hey, just barely got back from Disneyland and it was a bunch of fun. Brought the whole family over and had our first kind of real vacation ever, and it was a lot of fun. We went and we stayed at a Disneyland hotel and it was kind of nice, especially with little ones.

We could kind of monorail in and out of the park when we wanted to and get in an hour early. Anyway, even with a four-year-old and a two-year-old and my wife being pregnant, we still pretty much went on every single ride at Disneyland and California Adventure. And it was just a bunch of fun.

It was really fun to go do that...

And as we were walking around my wife and I could not help but just kind of contemplate the crazy journey we've been on for the past two years and just to look backward and go, "Oh my gosh. Two years ago there's no way we could have afforded this for all the things we were doing and the experiences."

I always read stories, I always heard stories of guys that'd be like, "Yeah, man I went on vacation. I made more money on vacation then we spent to get on there, and we spent a lot." And I was almost in disbelief.

I would listen to those stories and be like, "Okay, that's cool for that guy, there's no way I'll ever do that." Or I had to work from that place to believe to a spot where I felt like I could actually do that. And it was crazy because it happened. It was amazing. I'd be on a ride, I'd come out and be like, "Well, got seven more sales on that ride."

It's crazy how much, anyway...

So if you're like, "Man Steven, I don't know if this stuff can work or whatever." Just use myself as a point of reference an realize that oh my gosh it's completely doable for wherever you are. And keep moving forward on it. One of the fastest paths to cash that I've ever found ever is selling info products, and doing it through webinars.

You guys know that you guys know I'm a huge advocate of that, and obviously using Click Funnels to do so...

Anyway, it was fascinating though to walk around and see that and look at that. And we'd be like, "Man, we just spent like $100 more just to go hang out with Goofy one morning." You know what I mean? Just like really interesting stuff that we would never have been able to do that kind of stuff.

I mean overall, it was like five grand but it was a ton of fun and it was really, really cool to have that experience with the family, with the kids. And more importantly, I think it was just this really cool milestone for my wife and I, and what we've been doing, and what I've been working on, and all the stuff that we've been doing and going forward on it. It was cool, it was very rewarding. Very, very rewarding to sit back and be like, "Holy crap."

It's the first time I really stopped...

I felt like I was in a bit of a funk there for a little bit and I talked to Russel about it and he was like, "Dude, we've been running hard for so long, this is the first time we've had a chance to breathe."

It's like maybe that's it...

So, anyway, it was a bunch of fun.

Totally got rejuvenated. Very excited for the day. Got a chance to get up work out this morning, do my hit training and scream like crazy on Instagram. If you guys aren't following me on there I think you guys would like it. I get to do really official episodes and thoughts here, however, a lot of the smaller day-to-day things and isms that I'm going through and learning I like to drop on Instagram now, so anyway, would love to have you guys follow me there if you want to.

It's Steve Larsen HQ, that's my handle...

Hey, I wanted to drop something out to you guys here. There was an interesting question that kept getting asked right before I left actually. It was about a couple of weeks ago, two weeks ago. We were there for a week. And right beforehand some interesting questions started getting asked, and one of them was, Steven, how did you get so good at offer creation?...

And I just said the answer, "It's practicing." I practice offer creation like someone would practice their sport, I do, I practice it. It's one of my favorite things to do on an airplane, for some reason. Put some music on, for some reason, 30,000 feet, little caffeine and some dubstep, man you can make some sweet offers. But I'll do that a lot.

I do it a lot for the eComm space a lot. That's a fun one to practice on. I'll pick a random industry and I'll start creating an offer. So, what I wanted to do real quick, it was hard for me to not see the offer that was being handed over to us throughout our Disney experience. I wanted to go through and as an example of how I practice offer creation, I want to use Disney as an example.

So, I'm going to show you what their offer is. You're going to see it, you're going to go, oh my gosh. But I want to point out why it's the offer, what they're doing, and when. They definitely have upsells. They definitely have continuity they're offering. They're breaking and rebuilding belief patterns.

Anyway ... It's pretty strong to see what their culture is. Fascinating stuff, right?

So, one of the ways to think about this because there really are a lot of ways to create an offer, there's a lot of modalities to do so. You can do it through Ask campaigns, and do it explicitly off of what the market's telling you to do, which is great. But if you do that you still have to come in with your own glaze and creativity to make something that's new.

It can't be completely reactionary. It has to be reactionary with a little bit of the ingenuity. You could do it straight off of finding out what false beliefs are, which kind of gets gleaned from Ask campaigns, they might be one and the same.

Another way to think about this offer creation thing if you're like, "Steven, I have no idea how to come up with this offer. I have no idea how to create an offer. I don't get it."...

Here's another way to think about it and look at it. Whatever your main product is, whatever the main product is, let's say it's socks. Whatever the main product is, let's say you're selling socks, you're selling on Amazon, I don't care what it is. You're selling socks or you're a retail store and you sell food.

Think through when you sell your product to somebody, you have to understand that it is like the laws of nature that when you create something you also create something else. When you create something, when you give a product to somebody else you hand them a solution to a problem, but you also hand them a problem.

Most of us don't think of our businesses in that light. And this is where a lot of opportunity actually lies. And if people can learn to see this it is very easy to create offers very quickly.

And if you're like, "Man Steven, I don't totally understand." A lot of people reached out and be like, "I don't understand this whole false belief thing, what is that? I don't understand how does this all happen from the ..."

Another way to think about, if that whole side totally confuses you, one of the ways to do it is to sit back and think to yourself, "What follow-up problem do I create for my customer when they buy my product?" When I had it over ... It's the nature of all opportunity. In order to get the opportunity, you have to solve a bunch of problems.

One of my classic examples is the Olympics. The Olympics just happened. Winter Olympics, my family I grew up skiing like crazy a lot actually.

By the time I was five we were skiing hitting the slopes a lot. All we wanted for Christmas was a ski pass so we'd go 20-25 plus times in a season.

And we skied a lot as a family, and it was just a bunch of fun...

But in order for me to be a really good skier, let's say an Olympic skier, there's a lot of problems I have to go solve in order to get that opportunity. There's a lot of problems I have to solve in order just to qualify for the opportunity to do something like Olympic skiing. What's my coach? What's my diet? What's my daily schedule like? Who am I coaching with? Who am I conveying myself to? What are the times I have to hit? What's my ski's like? What are the brand of my skis? Are they polish are they wax? You know what I mean?

There's a bunch of stuff that you have to go solve, not just to qualify for the opportunity but when you actually get it there's a lot of other follow-up problems.

Let's say I go and I actually get a gold medal in Olympic skiing. What happens? I have to turn around, there's a lot of other follow-up problems that you have to solve. Are you going to do it again? Are you going to stay with the same coach? Who are you going to train with? Who's the person you're going to be competing against? What's the diet? It's more problems. Sometimes it's more of the same problem, but you have to think through this.

And another way to think of it is, what's the follow-up problem I create for my customer when they're using my product? That's the basic question to ask. I have a product, I go forward, I show them the product, there's follow-up problems.

Let's take Disney and what I want to do is I want to walk through Disney's offer with that question in mind. So, let's say I'm Walt Disney. 1955, that's when Disneyland started, I believe. 1955, and I'm Walt Disney, and I'm sitting back and I'm like, "I want to make a sweet theme park." And he's like, "Cool, I'm going to go make a cool theme park." And I start making this theme park and I'm like, "Sweet."...

People are like, "Hey this looks really, really cool." And let's say they call me on the phone. What would be some questions that somebody would ask me about my theme park? These are the follow-up problems.

"Oh my gosh, you know this is super cool but I just don't know where I'm going to stay." The follow-up problem I have created for my customer is I gotta know where a hotel is.

Like, "Oh, you know what this is so cool but I don't know what I'm going to eat." The follow-up problem I've created is they now need to find some food. Does that make sense?...

Transportation, "I don't know how to get there." Does that make sense? This one way to think about that. And so, a by-product of Disneyland the theme park, a byproduct, the business, the side business that they had to get into in order to sell the theme park, they had to get into hotels.

They have hotels. They had to get into the restaurant business. They've got restaurants all over the place. They had to go and they had to get into some kind of transportation business. We took this cool bus into the ... We stayed at the Disneyland Hotel, it was really fun. Does that make sense?

When you hand your product to somebody else, yes you do create, you solve problems, but you also create problems. And when you are a smart marketer who can foresee the problems that you will be creating for them and then you solve those problems, my friends that is one of the keys to creating an amazing offer.

Think of Click Funnels, for example, you guys all know I'm a forever die-hard Click Funnels fan. Russel Brunson comes out he's like, "We're going to make this thing called Click Funnels," or he and Todd. And they go and they put the whole thing together. What's the follow-up problem he created for us? What is it?
"Crap. This tech stuff is like figured out now, I actually have to know how to freaking market now."

Russel's like, "Don't worry about it. We got a butt load of info products that's going to teach you how to do the exact same thing." Does that make sense?
"Crap. I don't know what to write."

"Don't worry about it. We created Funnel Scripts." Does that make sense?
Whatever product you've got there's a follow-up problem, lots of them, that you created for your customer. And if you can just go solve the major ones that you can foresee and bundle it with the original product, man it's like so easy to destroy your competition because they're not thinking that.

Most people are not thinking that...

Instead, they just have their product and like, "This product's the best. This product's the best. Best, best, best, best, best ..."
And like, "Okay, cool."

I remember when I was a traffic driver for Paul Mitchell in college. It was one of the Paul Mitchell schools and we ended up chatting with and working with either other Paul Mitchell's down in California. Anyway, it was a bunch of fun.

Bunch of fun...

Well, we were driving traffic to them but the follow-up problem that we created for our customer, Paul Mitchell Schools, that we didn't realize we would have, the follow-up problem that we created was, "Oh my gosh, I don't know if their websites good." We were just driving it to a flat website, we didn't know any different at the time.

It was like four years ago, five years ago. And we were driving traffic directly to their website.
And then they're like, "Sweet we're getting lots of traffic but why isn't it converting?"

And I was like, "Crap." And I had to go learn what makes websites convert. And then I was like, "Crap. They don't. I gotta make funnels." And I had to get into the business of the follow-up problem. And that literally guys is actually what put me into funnels. That's what got me started in funnels.

Working for Paul Mitchell, realizing we were driving lots of traffic and it was not converting. And I was like, "Crap. How do I make websites convert?" And then websites weren't converting. And then I went through and I found what funnels were. Does that make sense?

That's literally ... I was trying to solve the follow-up problem. Some of you guys are too concerned with the actual product itself.

Now, it's great to be concerned with the product, obviously, be really, really concerned with it. It's gotta be amazing, obviously, it's gotta over deliver. I'm a huge fan of if you over deliver in the present it sets up your success in the future.

That's one of my little isms...

Over-deliver it's awesome. But if you can foresee the follow-up issue that you created, solve that problem, and then give it away or bundle it when they buy the original product, oh my lanta, you're in business. Does that make sense?
So, I was thinking through a lot of their ... like that's their core thing.

You think about like one of the things we always try and teach you and I want you to get as well, you've gotta understand what the core of your business is. One of my favorite books is the book Rework I love that book Rework, go buy that book, go read it. Very, very good, one of my favorites, definitely a top 10.

And in there it gives the example, can you have a hot dog business without ketchup? Sure. Some people won't like it but you could, right? Could you have a hot dog business without the bun? Technically. Could you have a hot dog business without the hot dog? No. Right? Figure out what the core of the business is, that is the core of the business.

Disneyland the theme park is the core of the business. So, let's think this through on a stack slide real fast. Okay. This is a bit more of a technical episode, hopefully, that's cool with you guys. But, let's think through the main item, the first thing on a stack slide is the main item. Theme park.

That's the first thing that we're delivering...

The second thing on the stack slide is what I call the anchor product, it's what they really want. They want to go to the theme park but why? They want to go to the theme park because of the rides. They want to get on the rides, they want to go and they want to experience thrills and you're selling an experience.

They're selling experiences. Pretty much all of us are. If you can start to sell experiences it's a lot more lucrative. So, the theme parks, the anchor product is rides, that's the anchor of the product is rides. That's what they really, really want, that's the anchor.

Then we think about vehicle and when we think about vehicle ... It was kind of funny walking around, we got upsold like crazy ... Anyway, I won't get to the upsells yet. No upsells yet.

The vehicle, they're delivering relationships. They're not promising wealth, they're certainly not promising health. They're promising relationships. Disney sells relationships, that's what they sell. They sell relationships through the commodity of theme parks, of the movies. Does that make sense?

And what they're selling, what their message is, "I'm going to show you how to be at the happiest place on Earth without worrying about a thing." It's going to cost you a lot but you're going to go to the happiest place on Earth without worrying about anything, how amazing is that? They're selling experiences.

That's exactly what, and they're selling relationships, with you, with your family.

You always see pictures with the families. "Let's do it for the kids. You didn't take your kids to Disney when they were young? What kind of parents were you?" That's kind of what they say.

That's what their messaging is...

So, if you think about like a vehicle-related product, there might be, "Man you know what, I really want to go to Disney." What's the false belief that I might have about Disney being able to deliver a relationship? "Oh gosh, you know what I just don't know. I don't know. I don't know if anyone's going to believe me that I went there."

"Don't even worry about it." Well, they have a billion photographers all over the place snapping pictures you weren't asking them to take and then we're just going to sell them straight back to you for $100. That's totally what they do.

We walked into several different restaurants, lots of different rides, in front of the castle, all over the place, pictures, pictures, pictures, pictures, pictures all over the place.

"No one's going to believe that I was there without a billion pictures. Rather than just me saying it."

"What are the kids going to say when you tell them, yeah we went to Disney. What are you going to show them?" It's like a pride game a little bit that they throw on you.

I'm not bashing Disney but think about the sales message. When it comes to internal, maybe some of my insecurities it kind of ties into the last one too, "No one's going to believe me. How am I going to remember this experience afterward?"

"Don't even worry about it." Disney comes back, don't even worry about it we're going to through Mickey ears down your throat. There's going to be a billion different styles, don't you dare just buy one style. There's going to be tons of t-shirts, lots of stuff, tons of shops, which basically sell all the exact same thing.

Lots of swag...

Don't worry about it we're going to give you pictures so everyone knows you're there." And the way you're going to remember it is swag galore. In fact, right now I'm wearing a Disney shirt because I felt the pressure of doing that. And I'm a buyer, I buy stuff real easy.

As far as an external related belief, usually I say time, money, and resources. You might say, "Oh my gosh, I don't know. Time wise, how long are we going to be there?"

"You know what, there's so much for you to experience there's no way you could ever get it done in a single day. You have to spend a few extra days and we'll actually create a special package for you."

If you notice when you go in and you buy stuff their offer is, "You can buy for one day or for slightly cheaper you can buy for three days." I don't think there's an option to buy for two, which is kind of interesting when you think about that.

Three-day hopper pass. They don't sell a two-day option. It's almost like when you're selling supplements, you go from one bottle to three bottles, there's no two. That's obviously drastically increasing their average car value per customer.

Now they have to stay another day in the hotel, they gotta spend $100 a day on food. Lots more opportunity for swag drops. Does that make sense? Very, very interesting. So, as far as external related beliefs like time, money, resources.

Time, "Don't worry about it, it's three days, that's the best."
Money, "Don't worry about it if you bundle together if you buy this package here go to the Disney Hotel we'll package it this way."

When it comes to resources things like that, food, hotels, transportation. Disney hotels, Disney food, Disney transportation, Disney restaurants. Does that make sense? They're in the business of all these follow-up businesses because those are problems they created for the customer.

Anyway, that's kind of the stack slide, which is a little bit hard to say over a podcast. But hopefully, that made sense though.
In fact, it was funny, literally every single ... Let's talk about upsells. There were upsells all over the place. And I loved it, I was reading them, I was seeing them.

And I was like, "Yes. This is good right here."...

We were offered upsells both in the way of continuity, but also in ways of just more expensive experiences. Upsells, every cashier asked us if we were an annual passholder. "Are you an annual passholder?" And I had to say no every time. No one likes to say that.

No one likes to say that.... For the first time in my life, I've considered being an annual passholder. I doubt we'll ever go back for like three years, four years. It's going to be quite a while before we ever go back to Disney, but I seriously considered becoming an annual passholder simply because they asked me.

And like every cashier asked me, every single photographer asked me, every single ... it was fascinating. They all clearly were trained to do that. And I did not feel bombarded all the way, but just the mere tick tack ninja kick you in the face nugget of just asking is what got me to start thinking about it. Anyway.

There were handouts. There were handouts like crazy. As you exit the park. They're not doing it when you're in the park, which I thought that was a really nice touch. I wasn't walking around being handed all this stuff, which I actually really appreciate, that would have been over ... It already is a little bit sensory overload, but that would have been too much.

As you're exiting the park there's handouts all over the place and they want to ask you, "Hey," you see things for Disney cruises, that's a vastly more expensive experience than what we went through. Actually, it was probably about the same by the time we were done. Does that make sense?

There was upsells all over the place. The parade, guess what, they do a massive parade every single day and fireworks show pretty much every single day. Why? I was listening carefully to the words in the parade. They have thousands, tens of thousands of people lined up all over the streets, I mean it's huge.

If you guys have never been there, it's a cool experience you should go. To look at it as a marketer if anything. Because it was cool. They had tens of thousands of people just lined up all over the place over I don't know how many miles of road. This parade went for quite some time and it was big, it was a huge production.

Guess what it was? It was a freaking sales letter...

I was watching it and I was listening to all the words. And they're singing about how happy it is to be on a Disney Cruise, no joke. They were singing about how cool it is, "Oh my gosh I found out that I got an annual pass." Seriously.

They were singing about other stuff as well but literally, that was the lyrics of the songs and it was a lot of times the exact same songs over, and over, and over, and over, just on repeat. And they're dancing and going all over the place. And your favorite Disney characters are coming out, they're all dressed up, but they're singing.

They definitely had shock and awe value. It was subtle but it was there.
And I never in my life have considered that until ... you know what I mean? It works. It totally works.

And they have an ascension process built just after you bought their latest thing. They do exactly what we're teaching you to do. That's why I was laughing so hard about it because I was sitting back and I was like, "Oh my gosh, I just paid for this. They're already asking for the next purchase."

Let alone spending several hundred dollars a day on food sometimes. Let alone all the other stuff that's going to go along with it, all the incidentals, the experiences.

Of course, we gotta get pictures with Mickey, of course, we gotta go to the restaurants, of course, we gotta get the swag and everything, of course, we're going to ... we want the experience. We want to be able to go back and tell about it, no one's going to believe the fact that we were there without us having all this stuff. You know what I mean?

That's exactly ... Anyway, it was so funny. There were many in the rooms themselves. There's stuff all over the place for Disney cruises, there's stuff for annual passes. When we checked into the hotel people were asking, "Well, are you an annual passholder?

"No."...

"Okay." And they don't offer it afterward. That was interesting. I thought that was kind of cool. No one said, "Well do you want to become one?" That was cool.
That was clever because that made me ask, "Well, how much is it?"

Which is the only question I wanted to get people to ask on the doors when I did door to door sales. As soon as I got them to ask the question, "How much is it?" That's a buying question. We just shifted from essentially the sales message to the stack section of the pitch. "Well you get this and you get this and you get this. And it's only this much, but if you go there it's only this much."

"What?" And they do a stack, right there. Disney has a stack.

Disney does a stack slide...

It was pretty interesting too, I noticed every single ride was an epiphany bridge script, literally. When you're waiting sometimes an hour in line two hours or whatever. When you're waiting in line, are the liens just normal? Is it literally just a fence? No. They're themed out to the max. You've got whatever ride it is, whatever the theme park ride, like Toy Story ride or whatever.

There's Buzz Lightyear himself he's talking to the people in the line. There's pre-frames galore. Themed stuff all over the place. And opportunity for you to buy swag so you remember that exact ride. At the end of every single ride, the opportunity for an upsell, for swag for that specific ride.

Think about that. Very, very interesting. Very cool, very clever. I imagine their average car value goes way up because of that.

They don't just have shops on like the Main Street there and as you're exiting and entering the park. Literally, after every ride is an opportunity for an upsell. Very fascinating. Every ride was an epiphany bridge scrip. There was a pre-frame, especially even in the ... actually not just in the kid rides.

There was conflict, there was resolution, there was literally, every ride was a story. Sometimes literally, and it would say, "And they lived happily ever after." Or, "Once upon a time ..." and then the ride would start, especially in the kid rides, but even on the roller coasters when you're getting on there was still some theme. There was still some story being told throughout it. Script being said or not, experienced.

Anyway, very fascinating...
By the way, how did we know that this whole thing existed? Disney. We would not have gone. Let's just think about this for a second ... last thing I'll say, I know this was a long episode.

But let's just think about this for a second. How did I know that Disney was going to be cool? How did I know that Disney was what they said they were? Besides them constantly putting out the paraphernalia, constantly putting out the stuff. I knew.

Guys, they publish, yes I'm going to get back to that I shove it down your throats I know I do. They publish. How do they publish? Okay, they make full out movies. They make full out movies. Do you think people in the theme parks have seen the movies? Of course, they have.

Who do you think the people in the theme parks represent? Who do you think? It's the fanatic purchasers. They change the selling environment. You get on a freaking airplane, you go and you spend far more money than the eight dollars it costs you to watch the movie in the movie theater.

They went from an eight dollar price point, maybe $15, I don't know. And you go in and you spend ... I mean we spent a grand for our tickets for three days for three of us. Our little one was free. It as another two grand for the hotel. It was another grand for the flights and all that stuff. Does that make sense?

I easily probably spent another grand combined with food and swag and all that stuff...

That's exactly what we're doing. Guys, we're trying to show you that very ... I'm trying to help you understand, when you go in and you start selling your thing there is going to be a percentage of the people who purchase from you who want to spend more money for you.

And the reason that they're willing to do so is because they love your culture...

Culture is brand...

We know that guys. Forever I thought Disney, I thought that first letter was a backward G, I'm sure I'm not the only one that thought that when I was a kid...

But Disney, the word Disney all over the place. Disney, Disney, Disney. What does it mean? What does it represent? What do you feel? What do you experience when you read the word? Their brand is so freaking powerful because they have so much culture that's built.

They've got the swag, they've got the movies, they're telling stories literally through their movies. Then you can go and you can have the extra experiences, have the experiences all over the place. I'm going to go to the theme park, I'm going to meet the characters themselves real or not. I'm going to go over here and I'm going to find other ways to spend. Disney, Disney, Disney, Disney.

Can I go on a different cruise? Of course, I could, but there's a Disney cruise. Can I go to a different theme park? Of course, I could, but there's a Disney theme park. And they just expanded. Guys, their business model, and their value ladder is so freaking nailed down. Continuity programs were all over the place.

Ways for them to purchase more, annual passholder, that's an annual continuity program. You get a different experience with that pass. You get a different experience with this. Core experience, anyway ... Very fascinating.

It was funny, when we were about to go we realized that our little four year old had not seen hardly any of the movies that were going to be rides for. So, we had to go buy all the movies and watch a whole bunch of them.

We had to...

That's exactly what I'm talking about though is that when the brand is that strong when the culture is that strong when the stories. There's heroes to journey stories all over the place. That's all it is. Their actual movies are all about that.

I'm going to go leave ... You know you think about their movies, the protagonist leaves their home, they go towards this main thing but really there's this internal transformation. Cars example, Lightning McQueen, from Expert Secrets, that one's all over that.

But each ride was that...

They're trying to give you the same experience. You're the protagonist, you leave your freaking home, you go over to Disney, you feel as if you have this cool magical experience, actually what you had is this internal transformation, you're closer together with your family or you're closer with yourself.

Does that make sense? It's all throughout it, and it was just buzzing my nogging all over the place. And it is so incredibly important to recognize that. The biggest freaking brands on the planet, a billion dollar industries they're using exactly what we use also to sell seven dollar things.

Guys, hopefully, I was helpful. If you want to know how to get good at offer creation just practice it. I literally wrote out, I figured out their offer, I figured out the storylines, I used all the frameworks that I typically use to coach somebody for Disney.

And I'll go do that for like I said eComm, we'll do that for some retail thing, I'll do it for real estate. It doesn't matter. It's persuasion. This is Persuasion 101. Marketing, not selling, marketing. And it's not something that's taught often.

Anyways guys, hey, thank you so much. Hopefully, that was helpful to you and I'll talk to you later...

Whoa, thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Hey, you want me to speak at your next event or mastermind? Let me know what I can share that would be most valuable by going to SteveJLarsen.com and book my time now.

Let's dive into WHAT gets you paid. It's not the offer!...

Hey. What's going on, everyone? This is Steve Larsen. You're listening to probably one of my favorite episodes of Sales Funnel Radio so far. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today.

Now, I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt? Completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio...

What's up, guys? Hey, I know probably every episode is my favorite episode when I'm doing it. Anyway, this is one of the core reasons and ways to actually make more money...

What? Hopefully, that's an exciting topic for you. Hey. Next to me to my right right now, it's a chest. I've got a bunch of random stuff in there. Some guns in there. Frankly, it's extremely very thin, brittle chest. It's slightly painted green. There's these little latches on it that are all rusted out.

Frankly, it looks like a piece of junk. It does. For right now in today's value, you probably wouldn't get much for this, which is interesting. How many guys want to buy it? I would love to maybe ship it out to you if you guys want to buy it.

Anyway, that'd be really, really awesome if you guys want to purchase it. You're like, "What, Steve? Are you kidding me?" All right. Let me shift it up for you now. Let me tell you that this chest belonged to Captain Wayne Kartchner, an ancestor of mine.

This thing is old, guys. This is an heirloom. It's next to me. it's rusted out. I do keep a few things in it but it's next to me here. Captain Wayne Kartchner.

I've got several military members that have been in my bloodline, which is part of why I went into as well for myself.

Interesting. How many guys want to buy it now? Would you be shocked if the price that I sold this for after telling you that story would be a little bit higher? No. It wouldn't shock you, would it? It would not shock you at all that I'd actually charge more money for that.

Hey. I've got some pieces of dead tree over here. It's awesome. There's some blank ink on them. It's a book. Anyway, how many guys want it? Sweet. Sweet. Cool. You know, I'm going to sell it for 100 bucks. If you guys want it, just message me right now. Is that cool? All right.

What if I was to tell you that this one book has made me a butt ton of money and has actually given me the life that I have been wanting really, really bad? Cool. Is it worth 795? You guys get what I'm getting at? Hopefully, you are.

One of the questions I've been getting a lot lately...

Some guy wrote out and he said, "Hey. This is one of the topics I've been pounding on a lot lately for my coaching students." I wanted to be able to go in and I wanted to teach you guys the same thing. This is important.

This is very important...

What I want you to know is we're about offer creation. Offer creation and storytelling. Those are the only two things that I really care about anymore. Okay? Those are the two most lucrative skillsets I can even think of.

The farther I follow this rabbit hole down, the farther I've realized, the more I've realized that that's really it.

That's really it...

I don't have to be an amazing, creative individual with Photoshop. I like Photoshop. I don't have to be an amazing, creative individual with ... I don't have to know how to code. There's a lot of people that know how to do this. Okay.

I can outsource all that stuff but the thing that I cannot outsource very well is this whole storytelling offer creation piece. Why?

Why?..

Let me tell you a story real quick. A man walks down the street. It's actually an alley. He walks down the street. He's creeping. He gets shot and dies. Okay? Let me switch it up for you though and give you some context. It's a war zone and he's a soldier.

Okay? Huh? Right? In one second, you might think that someone was murdered. In another, you might think that they were just killed in the battle zone. Fascinating context. Context is everything. Context is what actually delivers value. Okay?

Offers is not where value is created...

I want you to know that. That's what I'm trying to tell you. I'm trying to help you guys. Look around at these objects that are around you. One of my favorite stories is a story of this violin. I don't know if it's true or not. It's a movie. You guys might know it.

This movie where this violin is being shown. It's at an auction. They're auctioning off this super old violin. Somebody's like, "Yeah. I don't remember the price once were but it was super low." Everyone's like, "Really?"

The auctioneer's like, "You only paid that much for it and no one would go any higher." Suddenly, this old gentleman just starts walking up to the front of the room. He takes the violin. In front of everybody, he starts to clean it.

He cleans the violin. He polishes it. He tunes it. He plays the most incredible song and just hands it back to the auctioneers and goes and sits back down. The offers for the violin go through the roof. Why? Context, guys. Story.

A story creates context for things. Okay? When we're thinking about offer creation and products and value and how to make more money, you have to understand.

Your offer is not what creates value. Offers do not create value. They deliver it. They don't make it. Okay.

They deliver it...

They scratch the edge but they don't make value. What makes value is the sales message. Okay? For example, a lot of you guys know that I'm religious. Here's a biblical example. There's a woman. She goes and she pays tithing. She gives away just two pieces of coin, whatever it was. I can't remember how much.

Some rich people next to her make fun of her because she only gave just a little. Okay? Now, from a monetary standpoint, she gave just a little bit. These other people give a ton because they have a lot of money. Christ, he's sitting on the side.

He says, "Who gave more?" Everyone said, "Well, the rich people." Actually, let's get some context here. That was almost all of her money. How much more worth were those coins that she gave?

Think about it in those kinds of terms. Think about it. Okay? There's a lot of things, objects, heirlooms you may be even given. For example, I go over to Cache Valley every once in a while. I've got family over there. I had no idea that one of my ancestors in I think, Sweden or Denmark.

I can't remember now...

I could say this if I wasn't recording an episode right now. One of my ancestors got on a ship and lived on a ship going back and forth between. This is in the mid 1800s. Going back and forth between America and England until he had enough money to get off the ship and he walked across America seven times helping people from the East Coast all the way over to the West Coast.

Back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. He did it seven times...

The guy was so intense and such a leader but a humble leader. No one else really knew. Anyway, they wanted him to settle in this area, Cache Valley. They wanted him to be the mayor. He said no. He did not want to be the mayor. They went in and they literally voted him to be the mayor without him wanting to be the mayor.

They made him the mayor. Okay?...

They called him to be the leadership and he did not want to be in it. He constantly fought back. The only way is because by public vote, they just chose him to be and they decided to be. He ran from it. He didn't want to be.

Now that I go into Cache Valley, that place means more to me. That means more to me. He settled part of that area over there. He helped create the towns and everything. When I go in there, it means more to me now.
Why? Context. Okay? Story.

I know the story now. I went and I saw his gravestone. That guy was a crazy entrepreneur. I had no idea until I learned that. That gravestone means a lot more to me now because I know the story. I know the context.

Value is created in story...

Story changes context.

Context is what creates value. When I sit back and I say, "Hey. Go get this thing called ClickFunnels. Go get this product over here.

I've got this cool product over here called Secret MLM Hacks. It's killing it. It's awesome. We have a lot of cool success stories. People are doing great in it." If I just go say that, you'd be like, "Oh, sweet. An opportunity for Steven to take my money." Right?...

If I start telling my actual story though, if I develop a sales message, if I use some frameworks that's meant to change the way that the people see the world, that people see the product, value is created in a sales message, not an offer. It's the reason I laugh so hard.

People are like, "Well, I would go selling it but I'm not done creating the offer. I don't think anybody will pay for the offer yet." I'm always like, "My gosh. That is not how value is created." Okay? Value is not created through the offer.

It is delivered through it but it's not created in it. It's created inside the sales message. Because the sales message delivers context. The sales message changes frames. It changes the blueprint of how we see the world, of how we see the object, of how we see the offer. Okay?

Get good at developing those stories. Get good at telling those stories. That's the whole reason why I keep trying to preach that just a little bit. I know I've pounded it hard in the past little bit but it's the reason why, too. I was telling them to go publish. Publish, publish, publish.

I know I'm a broken record with the publishing thing. Okay? I know I am but it's because when you publish, people see you differently. You are changing the context that they're looking at you with. How many of you guys when you first saw me, you're like, "Oh, yeah. That's the lead funnel brother ClickFunnels."

Without listening to this podcast, how many of you guys ... You guys didn't know much about me. You didn't have affinity for my brand and what I'm doing. You didn't. That's fine. I know that. I knew that.

Therefore, I publish. Does that make sense? Now, when I say, "Hey. I'm out at an event. Hey. I'm out on a mastermind. Hey. This is a sweet book." By the way, I'm writing a book right now about all the lessons I learned next to the desk of Russell Brunson.

Okay? It's freaking awesome. Okay? I'm so excited. My gosh, it's so good. It's 300 pages. It's really, really good. Anyway, you guys don't care about that though until I deliver context. Until I deliver context. I need you to know that. I'm just trying to help you understand that.

When you are developing your offers, when you're coming up with something new to sell, that's the reason why first, you start with the sales message piece...

You're going to have to figure out on a very rough draft 30,000 foot view level of what your offer is or an idea of what it's going to be. They don't make the thing until you know that actually turns money. It's not the offer that's turning money, okay? You don't get paid because of an offer. You don't. Okay?

You get paid because of a sales message, because of a sales letter. That's what gets you paid. That's the thing to obsess over. If there's any skillset I can beg you guys to go learn and be obsessive over, it is the skillset of telling stories.

Okay? It is the skillset of selling stuff. It's the skillset. Thankfully, one more step back on that ladder is becoming a good marketer. Because being a good marketer, you don't have to sell as hard, which is awesome.

At the core of marketing, it's storytelling. It's educating. It's educating with the intent that they go and purchase something. Okay? That's what marketing is. You're changing belief patterns. How do you do that? You're changing context.

You're adding context. You're taking away context. You're adding things to it so they look differently at an object that might otherwise be four pieces of thin wood next to me on the side, right here on the floor. You know what I mean? There's context with it now. I know that there's a story behind it.

I know that there is a story... People will pay more because now, they know the story. They know the context. They see the value. It's four pieces of wood that's pretty destroyed. You know what I mean?

Did the monetary actual value of this chest right next to me changed when I told you that story? Not really. No, it did. It's the same pieces of wood. It's not like it's an appreciating asset. It's this piece of wood right here. Why does it have a lot of value? Because of the context, because of the story that you now know.

When you're developing your offers, please know that that's not where you get paid. You get paid because of story, which ultimately is your sales message. Anyway, that's the whole point I'm trying to help you guys.

The products and offers, it's not where the value is created. It's in the sales message. The product and offer just delivers. It delivers on the value but that's not where the value is created. If you're having a hard time selling your stuff, number one, yeah, definitely.

Look at your offer. Maybe there's certain things in there that ... I don't know. It just sucks. The reality is, is that you could go in and have a crappy offer with a fantastic sales message. It's a classic example when you go and buy something on the internet and it shows up and it's pure garbage.

Why did that work? It worked because the sales message was amazing. It was incredible. The actual product itself was terrible. Okay? That's a two-step method of getting paid more. Just number one, bring it from a product and turn it into an offer. Don't sell products. Sell offers.

Number two. Man, make this incredible story. Make an amazing sales message because that's really what assigns value. I will never get rid of my ClickFunnels account. Never. Ever.

Why? Not just because of the money that comes from it, because of all the story. The stories that Russell tells where he goes out and he says, "Hey, look." I even saw it. When people, they had never used their ClickFunnels account ever. They just like the t-shirt because they liked the culture that's behind it.

They've got t-shirts. They've got the context behind why that t-shirt matters. Does that make sense? I'm trying to close you, guys. You guys getting this? Anyway, I hope that that is hitting home for you. This is such a huge topic and I'm trying to hit it straight between the eyes. Because there's a lot of people who've been saying this stuff to me lately.

They're saying this to me lately. All right?...

"Hey. I'm not done with my offer yet. Therefore, I cannot sell anything." It's like, "Well, that's not how things are sold. Yes, you can." All right? Someone reached out to me today and I can't remember who said it. Snippy is not the right word. They're very forward though.

How would somebody purchase something that's not created yet? When I say, "Hey. Go create a sales message and start selling before the actual offer and products are created." Somebody's like, "Who would do that?" Like, "Well, a lot of people do that that's why I've launched everything."

When we launched Funnel Builder Secrets, that whole offer went out there. Incredible offer. The offer wasn't made yet. We knew what it was but it wasn't created. We actually didn't put it together yet.

An amazing sales message put this together. We made millions of dollars off that thing before it was even done. Lots of money. The original Two Comma Club Coaching program secrets master class, when I was putting that together, we're selling that thing.

It wasn't a Two Comma Club before the thing was even done. Why? Because the value was already assigned. Now, the value was assigned, people were paying for it because the value was higher in perceived value than they were actually paying for it.

Then I could go in and I could just create it. I literally created it one week ahead of them. Who does that? A lot of people. I just listened to a sweet interview with Ezra Firestone and Ryan Moran. Actually, Russell sent it over to me. He was saying this exact type of thing.

Ezra Firestone does the same exact thing. He creates this cool sales message, makes sure that it sells. He sells to his Beta users for $1,000. The future people have to purchase it for $1500. That first Beta group helps him create the product that they purchased. That makes sense?

Anyway, I think I said that, does that make sense too many times. I got to start breaking up more trial closes. Anyway, I hope though that like I said, that's hitting home. That you guys are getting it. Okay? The ability to develop a marketing and sales message is so powerful. That is where value is created.

That is where value is assigned because it's where context is delivered. Okay? It's where context is given. We see the blueprint of the object differently.

Even though this water bottle in front of me, I used to backpack a lot growing up. There was this Nalgene water bottle that I had. That thing went with me everywhere. I took that water bottle. I don't know how many hundreds of miles I backpacked with that water bottle.

I would never get rid of it...

There was this value I had assigned to it. When we were backpacking to different areas, we ran out of water. We had to ration water and be a little bit scary actually. Different creek. That's the water bottle. For some reason, I don't know why. I won't get rid of that water bottle. I can't find it now.

That was a lot of years ago. Okay? For a long time, that was it. It was not just a piece of plastic to me. There was a story, lots of them behind that very water bottle.

Does that make sense? Sounds cheesy. Totally true though.

Completely accurate and applies to every object that you're selling. Okay? Find ways to deliver new context. Another way to say that. Find ways to break and rebuild belief patterns. That's what that is. Anyway, all right.

For fear of saying the same thing over and over again, just probably in this episode. All right, guys. You're all awesome. Appreciate you.

Go forth ahead and tell them a profitable story. Bye. Hey. Thanks for listening.

Hey, look. Can't decide what funnel you need or need more in-depth training on how to use your current funnel, find out which funnel you need at salesfunnelbroker.com and get your premium pre-built funnels and training today.

Most of us never said, "I wanna be a marketer" when we were 7. I'm come learn from Ed's persistence and watch how his new business is blowing up!...

What's going on everyone this is Steve Larsen and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today and now I've left my 9 to 5, to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

The real question is: how will I do it without VC funding or debt completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business.
Using only today's best internet sales funnels.

My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio...

Hey, how's it going everyone. Real quick, I've got a really special treat for you guys here today and before I introduce our special guest I don't know how long it was ago, maybe four, five, six months ago I was walking down the street with Russell in Vegas and we had just gone to some convention.

I don't actually remember what it was but we were walking down the street and there was a moment where he and I were chatting and I said, "Russell, is it interesting that we have the best of the best tools that have ever been available ever?

...The best of the best training. The best of the best coaching. The best of the best of all these different things. The insights. What really does it come down to, then, to a person taking action?"

We were chatting about that and I said, "I think it has to do with just belief. Just telling stories of people who are actually doing it. Telling stories of people who have actually gone through and figured it out and gone through what looks like is kind of the mire for a little while but really is not."

Anyways, I'm excited to have our guest on today who has done incredible things and, anyway, we were at a master mind right before Funnel Hacking live and this gentleman was here and I saw him, heard him speak, and immediately thought I've got to interview this gentleman.

Lot of respect for him even for just the brief amount of time that we were able to meet together. Anyways his name is Edward Bordi. Ed, how you doing man?

Ed Bordi: I'm doing great. Thanks for having me.

Steve Larsen: Awesome. Yeah, yeah. I'm glad that you're here. Thanks for jumping on the show with us.

Ed Bordi: Of course.

Steve Larsen: You were telling this story. You were telling a little bit about your backstory and it's what pulled me to you, to be honest. I don't know, led me to you, and I think it's inspiring for other people to hear.

...Do you mind sharing a little bit about your backstory and how you got into this whole internet entrepreneurship game?

Ed Bordi: Yeah, no, sure. Actually, it was about 10 years ago when I just stumbled into it really. I was working in a corporate environment, had a 9 to 5 job and my career goals for a long time, back then, were to climb the corporate ladder.

I had planned on becoming an executive in the company I was in and that's the path I was taking. My company had paid for me to go back to school and get my masters. I did some study at Wharton Business School.

I studied marketing and I was taking that path and in the middle of that process I had a situation happen at home.

My wife had, she had become ill. She had develop a chronic illness that had made her bedridden. Probably 80% of her day was stuck in bed and that put a monkey wrench in our whole life, really. My plans were the least of my worries as the point, it was just at that time just taking care of my family and I had babies at the time...

I had a like a five year old and a newborn when this happened. I put my career on hold and just was focusing on taking care of my family. I really wanted to do something more and especially now because of the situation that I had in my life.

I wanted to have more freedom because I ended up having to work from home full time to take care of my wife, plus do a full time job. I was always thinking, I really wanted to be able to, if I could, have my own business.

Maybe work from home, not have somebody else dictate my time and my hours and all that so I was always thinking about what I could do and I really had no idea at the time what internet marketing was or being able to have my own business for working from home.

I just had no idea...

I heard this ad on the radio. It was, I'll never forget it, I mean I can literally hear the guys voice right now. His name was Andy Willoughby and he had this program called the Three Step Plan. I listened to him every single day as my morning routine.

...You know, "Hey, this is Andy Willoughby and how in the world are you?" Anyway, that was the way he started his radio pitch and then he went off and he talked about ... Yeah. It was just, it was catchy and it was all about working from home.

I think months probably passed, I heard this radio ad over and over again and I just called him up one day. I'm like, "What is this all about?" It was no details, it was just, "Make money working from home, Andy Wilabee's three step plan." I called the number and a gentleman called me back.

...A guy by the name of Brian McCoy who ended up becoming a very good friend of mine and who is actually, today, probably one of the top money earners in one of the biggest companies in the direct selling industry today.

I think he's the number one earner in one of those companies today. I haven't talked to him in a couple years but anyway, Brian McCoy was an amazing guy. He ended up becoming a mentor of mine and I worked with him in the direct selling industry.

That's where I started but that was really me learning, it was a network marketing business and I learned selling, I learned talking with people on the phone and doing all those sort of things and I actually struggled for quite a long time with that business.

I don't think I actually made any money with it for probably six months or more.

Then, this is when I learned about internet marketing. Up until then I was just working with the network marketing and just cold calling people, generating buying leads. Calling them up, trying to sell them my product. I was struggling with that.

I wasn't really getting anywhere. I was learning how to do sales and call calls and I was getting better but I really wasn't doing well, and then one of the people. I was making progress. I think I had a few people on my down line at the time and one of the people in my down line came across this book by a guy named Mike Dillard.

I remember telling him, "That's not going to help you in your business. Don't worry about that, just ignore that. Just keep doing what we're supposed to do. Keeping having cold call line and doing all this stuff."

Then, I picked it up...

He gave it to me and I read it one day. I was intrigued. It was all about generating your own leads and creating a business of your own. Your own identity. Branding yourself and not somebody else and I really liked the idea and I just dove into that and I had some success pretty quickly, actually.

Just little bit of background on me. My background is technology. My job was in the IT.

I was a software developer, so for years I would develop systems.

...Yeah, so one of my software jobs early on, I developed an application that was a direct competitor to visual basic, so it's pretty cool stuff I was developing as a software developer.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing.

Ed Bordi: Yeah, and so I decided to build an online website to capture leads to generate for myself and Mike Dillard talked about this. I built a website, I wrote the code and I just literally typed in the HTML in my editor and did some code and some developing. Launched a website.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome, wow.

Ed Bordi: Yeah, it was a simple squeeze page. It was the first one I ever did. It looked just like Mike Dillard's example in his book and I started getting leads. People started to literally call me up and I was like, "Wow, this really works."

I was spending 100s of dollars on these leads that had no idea who I was, what I was selling and all of the sudden I created leads on my own and they were calling me up and I was ... They were qualified better because they knew who I was ahead of time and what my opportunity was.

That's how I got started and I tweaked it, and I learned it, and I ended up building ... I built a sales funnel is what I built. It was like a simple page. It was a squeeze page that linked to an A web or email autoresponder and I had a 10 day email sequence that I wrote and I just followed up with them, and they called me.

It was literally ... And I had a thank you page. It was a two step funnel. Squeeze page to a thank you page and email sold Mike's book. The offer was sell his book as an affiliate.

Then I called them up after they bought the book and I would sign them up into my program and I ended up doing pretty good with that. That's how I got into the internet marketing and, at that point, after I got good at that I totally just reinvented my business.

I was still doing network marketing but I didn't do the whole having meetings at my house and cold calling people. I was just using this as something I had learned.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing, first of all. You go through, you hear the ad, you see the model, you do the model and actually build out the squeeze page itself. Build out thank you page. What was that doing for you personally at that time, I guess?

Ed Bordi: As soon as I got my first lead I couldn't believe it. I wasn't making any money at all at that point, but I just saw that it was working and the fact that I saw that it worked. That I could put something up there, somebody would respond to it and buy without me ever talking to them at all.

I mean, that totally blew my mind. I couldn't believe that, that actually was possible...

Steve Larsen: So cool, wasn't it?

Ed Bordi: Yeah. I literally was so excited I became obsessed with it. I was like, "If I was able to do this. Even just like this tiny little success that I had. If I really got good at this, what could happen?" I just knew the possibilities were endless and that's what I did. I ended up just really diving into study.

I mean, I ended up buying stuff from other people. Perry Marshal taught a Google AdWorks course. I bought all his stuff. I learned about Dan Kennedy and I started buying a lot of his stuff.

Steve Larsen: Nice.

Ed Bordi: Everything that Mike Dillard put out, I literally bought every one of his courses and devoured them and implemented them and I ended up doing really well. It was probably six months after that. After I started studying I managed a good business at that point.

I was actually making money now. I was probably making close to 1,000 dollars a month at that point. My business, which was really good, especially when I was in the negative before I hadn't earned all this stuff.

Then, what really changed my business back then was Dan Kennedy talked about, and Mike Dillard too, this idea of magnetic marketing.

It really, it's just attraction marketing where instead of pushing your message out to the world and just hunting down leads is you create a persona for yourself and people are literally attracted to you and you don't have to do as much work going out and hunting down people to be customers.

They just come find you because you've created this authority ... You've elevated yourself to somebody who is in authority.

I just, I liked that idea and I wrote a book and it was based on my six months of the success that I had at the time and because I was a software developer I built a replicable system. It was like an affiliate marketing system, basically. People could download.

It was a free download...

They could download my book for free, which was my front end offer and then they would get free access to my system and then in the system they would basically get a complete funnel built out for them with all their information just built into it. They could just promote that.

...I built that whole system and I ended up doing my own ... Now they have this dream 100 idea. Back then I learned the idea, it was called sneezers. Seth Goaden wrote about it.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, yeah. I know about sneezers. Seth Goaden's the man.

Ed Bordi: Seth Goaden called those people sneezers and those are people who are really highly influential people in your market who, if you can get them to buy into your product then they'll do all the work of promoting it for you and then you just need to work on dealing with them.

Same idea as the dream 100. I did that, I got all the people in my upline who had a lot of influence and could start promoting my book and my system. I literally, once I did ... I think I had 1,000 downloads in one night.

I, literally, this was just a couple months after I still was struggling. I just, literally my head was spinning at the time and I was just still figuring things out. Nothing was, I mean the system was a little bit buggy and nothing was perfect but I was just working through it.

Learning and making progress. I just got to experience all those things and it was just a lot. I remember just enjoying every minute of it and I was hooked.

I was just hooked on it...

The great thing is, I was able to, I studied really hard and I implemented and the thing that worked is I studied really hard and I implemented what I learned right away. I think that was the reason that I had success. I didn't just sit on ideas. I put what I learned into action immediately and it's surprising. If you do that, you can get results.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. You actually do with your are learning for sure. What kind of stumbling blocks did you hit along the way, though? I mean, that sounds, that's amazing and someone who's listening to this might think like, "Oh, man. I could just put the stuff together and it'll work."

Ed Bordi: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: Certainly it can but what did you hit along the way?

Ed Bordi: Yeah, no. Seriously I hit a lot of stumbling blocks. First of all, those are the successes.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Ed B

ordi: The issues that I had along the way were when I first built my website, my first version of it, it looked terrible and I don't think anybody ... I think I spent 100s of dollars on Google AdWorks and I don't think I got anybody to opt in.

It's just a process of learning and testing

and tweaking and then going over and over again. It's a very frustrating process but because I stuck to it and I just didn't give up. I think that was they key, why I had success.

I just didn't give up...

I knew it worked, I've seen other people do it and make it work and I was just going to make as many iterations and as many tests as I could until it worked.

I probably went through, easily, 20 or 30 different versions of a squeeze page or a funnel at the time before I got one that worked.

I mean, that's, I mean literally ... That was 10 years ago before there was anything like ClickFunnels. This was me, literally, building them out. It would take me two days to write one of these.

Steve Larsen: Just for one page?

Ed Bordi: Just for one page, to build it out, to make sure it's all working and tested and then get it up and running. Then it would just totally flop and then I like, "Okay," then I would throw that out and then I would just start over again. That was definitely one of the big stumbling blocks for me.

Steve Larsen: I mean, how much time, I guess, since you started that to the time when it all started clicking?

Ed Bordi: Yeah, I think I just learned about it and I just started putting things into action. I had a couple wins right away but I think they were just lucky things. Like I was leveraging Mike Dillard's systems so it was an established proven system at the time. When I was doing that, that was easy...

Easier, excuse me. It wasn't easy because I had to learn how to do the AdWords. You had to ... It's not just the technology part too, and understanding the steps. It's all the stuff that the supporting systems and processes and steps that you need to do.

To have a successful squeeze page it's not just putting up some HTML, it's understanding who your customer is. It's really understanding the psychology of the person who's looking at your page. It's having the skill set to know what to put on the page.

What's the copywriting supposed to look like? What's the headline supposed to say? That, it wasn't just the technical piece of it and the steps. Squeeze page to a thank you page and some emails.

It was understanding who the customer is and knowing how to word your emails and how to word your headline and that was a lot of study too.

I mean, I was literally devouring books. I was reading a couple books a week, probably, and I was reading them cover to cover and then I would go back and reread them. I remember, I was really into Dan Kennedy at the time and Mike Dillard, and a couple other copywriters.

I would literally take Mike Dillard's sales letter and I would read through it, every word, and then I would take it out and I would literally write it. Rewrite his sales letter just to internalize the process and I did that.

I would rewrite the best sales letters that I could find. I would do that over, and over, and over again and I think that was one of the biggest things that helped me because the technology piece. You know, anybody can just throw up a website or hire someone to throw up a website.

It was really understanding the psychology and the copywriting is really what helped me get better and I struggle with that. All those first 20 versions I was telling you about. It wasn't just necessarily the page, it was the message wasn't probably right was the issue. That was something that took quite a while to figure out.

I'm even today, 10 years later, I'm still trying to refine my ability to deliver the right message. It's a process and that was the part that was the hardest. I struggled with getting leads initially because of the process of figuring out the right messaging.

Steve Larsen: That's fascinating that ... I wish more people do what you just said that you did. I just want to point this out to everyone who's listening because right now behind me I've got sales copy literally printed out across my floor that I laid in a row. I'm marking it up and I'm going all over the place.

...Some of the first sales copy I ever learned how to actually write I, by hand, transcribed it and rewrote it and reread it and did it in front of the mirror. I loved that approach to it. There's no other way, in my mind, it's one of the fastest ways to shortcut process of learning this stuff.

Ed Bordi: I agree with you. I mean, I think that may be, people have asked me why I've been able to have some success with selling and with the writing and the copy that I've done and I think it's probably because of that. As I said, I really, I followed a lot of different copywriters and one of the things that I picked up early on was this whole idea of swiped copy.

I have a massive swipe file. I have boxes and boxes of literally junk mail and sales letters that I've printed out and advertisements that I've grabbed off the internet and I've printed them out.

Whenever I'm writing anything, I dig through my swipe copy and I find something that's similar or relevant and I take good ideas and I mix different pieces of that version and that person together and that's how I end up writing most of my copy but it's a process, and it really helps you internalize what works.

Steve Larsen: Absolutely. Ed, could you tell us what you're doing right now? What is that's taking your time now, business wise?

Ed Bordi: Yeah. Right now I am growing my business three different ways. Well, first of all, I should say I still have a full time day job. Although I don't probably need to keep it, if I didn't want to, I'm making enough from my side business right now to quit my job but I'm keeping it mainly.

Well there's a couple reasons...

First reason is, it's a good story because the people that I'm trying to help probably already have some side of an existing career or a 9 to 5 themselves and I wanted to be able to show them that you can do this.

Look, I'm still doing it. I have a full time day job and I was able to double my income on the side.

Steve Larsen: Yes, so for that.

Ed Bordi: Yeah, and I can do it then you can do it. Not only do I have a full time day job, but I'm still the full time caregiver for my wife. I still have two kids. I do all the cooking and the cleaning and the shopping and the running the kids back and forth, and I run a side business at the same time.

That's currently what's on my plate and my business is this. I have a marketing agency and some of the services I do for my marketing agency are if companies are startups, they have this idea but they don't know how to develop that idea into a real business.

I will help them write a business plan and then put that, crystallize their ideas and put it into a clear plan and a strategy to implement. A lot of times, companies that I work with or the people that I work with, they want to launch a brick and mortar business.

Not always, sometimes they want to have an information business or an internet business too. If they want to open a brick and mortar business, I have from when I went to school 10 years ago, I learned how to develop business plans and actually get funding from different places.

One of my recent customers I helped them, I wrote a business plan for them and we secured one and a half million dollars to launch a business for them.

Steve Larsen: Wow, congrats.

Ed Bordi: Yeah. That was one of the services I had and then once I launched, I helped ... They developed this relationship with me, I helped them get their funding and now they had the money to start their business and they naturally wanted to hire me because we built this relationship and they know me, and the like me, and they trust me.

What I'll do, is for that business and for other customers, if I get them funding the next step is to hire me to actually do your marketing for you.

My marketing agency is like a full done for you type services. I will do everything for them and there's various services from figuring out, getting their websites up and running and redefining their sales processes, and making sure that they have the right messaging and whatever it may be.

That's what I'm doing right now. I have two customers and both of them are brick and mortar businesses where I help them write their business plan, get funding, and launch their businesses and they hired me to do their marketing for them.

I also have a growing coaching business. If somebody wants to, they have their own business but they don't ... They want to do it themselves, they can hire me to help coach them through the process. That is another part of my business that I have as well and I'm mainly focusing on, I'll help anybody...

Any kind of a business that needs help, but I've been focusing on people who are just transitioning from an idea to a business. Mainly startups is who I'm focusing on helping.

Steve Larsen: Right, sure, sure. Now, I know hindsight is 20/20. We always say we could go into the future and look backwards a little bit. Just you've obviously going at this for quite some time and then all of a sudden it hit and things are happening and things are starting to fall in place.

You've got the cash flow coming in and what road blocks, when you look backwards, what road blocks do you see that you realize, "Oh man I totally could've side-stepped that?"

Ed Bordi: Absolutely.

Steve Larsen: You know what I mean? What might some of those be if you were advising someone else?

Ed Bordi: Well, I went from how I started to where I am now, but there was a whole middle area there where I had a lot of struggles. I mean, I literally, when I first started out and I told you my story. How I was having all that success?

Steve Larsen: Right.

Ed Bordi: There was a point, back then, where it became so overwhelming that I didn't know how to handle it and I literally just dissolved my entire business. I just couldn't do it. It was way too much on me because I had the job and I had babies, and I had to take care of my wife.

It was just, I literally was just completely overwhelmed...

I was doing everything myself. I was building websites, I was getting customers. I was coaching customers. I was creating products, I was writing books. I mean, I was doing everything.

Plus, I had a full time day job, I was raising a family. I think that was a major ... I just was not handling, just the operations of my own business properly. I didn't know how to just get help.

I didn't know how to outsource. I didn't know how to be efficient with just the things I do from day to day. I really, really struggled with that and it destroyed my business. I literally went from having a very successful business years ago, to just giving it all up and making nothing.

I went back to just doing ... I said, "I just can't take it anymore." I dropped it all and I just went back and did just a regular full time day job. I think the main reason was I tried to do everything myself and I didn't look for help. I didn't outsource any of the work. I didn't have a coach to tell me what I was doing wrong or help me course correct if I needed it.

I was just inefficient with my time and I had a lot of fear in me that I was afraid that because I had so much on my plate that I was not only going to disappoint my customers, that I was going to just ... It was just going to be too hard on my family as well.

I just had all these worries and fears and it just became too much so those are some of the things that ... Those are some of the reasons that I stopped before and I decided recently. In fact, by the way the success that I'm having right now with my business. The coaching clients that I have and the marketing clients that I just told you about.

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Ed Bordi: All this happened within the last few months.

Steve Larsen: That's great.

Ed Bordi: I did not even have a business until October. October 31st.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. That's how fast it can happen.

Ed Bordi: I literally just decided that and there was a lot of stuff that happened in between but I always wanted to do something but I wasn't quite ready yet. I just decided that if I was going to do it, I needed to fix the few things that I just told you about, that I did before wrong.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Ed Bordi: I needed to make sure that I had a way to do it without completely getting overwhelmed. That I had, I learned how to be more efficient over the years or some other things that I did to help with that. I started to reach out to my network. One of the things, actually, I think that helped me more than anything was just making sure that I was around people that thought like I thought.

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Ed Bordi: People like yourself, Stephen, and just other entrepreneurs who have a positive attitude and do what the right thing is and are not the people who want to blame other people for their failures or mistakes. But they're really just, they take accountability for what they do and they're positive.

Those are the things I needed to make changes with and once I figured out how to fix those things, then I was able to ... Decided that I was ready to start up again.

I will say, today, that not much has changed in my family.

My wife is still sick. I still have a full time day job and my business, today, is bigger than it ever was and I don't have any stress. I won't say that completely. There's always a certain amount of stress ... but I will say that it's not ... The troubles and the worries that I had before, I'm not really dealing with them now.

I'm feeling happy and confident and I have clarity in my business and I'm not overwhelmed because I do have help.
I'm outsourcing things that are not things that I, necessarily, have to do.

Steve Larsen: Is that what the difference is when you say happy/confident? Is that the big difference? The outsourcing part?

Ed Bordi: I think it's just the difference is, I made sure I surrounded myself with a network of people who are already where I want to be. I hired a coach to help me. I made sure that I had outsourcing in place and I started surrounding myself with people like myself.

Where in the past it was just all the people that I was surrounding with, maybe people in my family, or friends around me that just didn't understand why I was working that hard and doing that. I can't blame people. Not everybody has the same ideas and vision that I have, but if those are the only things you hear, sometimes you start to believe that maybe it is too much and maybe you shouldn't be doing those things.

I made sure that I had the right people around me this time...

Steve Larsen: Right, right. That's so key and for such a long time I wasn't quite sure if that was ... I didn't know if that was fluff or if that was real, either. It's so funny, I've experienced the exact same thing you're talking about.

Where you jump out, you do stuff on your own, and then you turn back around and you realize you're either sinking or you can't handle it all, or there's ... And, man, proximity of power. Getting close to those people who are the coaches, who are the right networks, who are ... There is so much to that.

Ed Bordi: I would actually say that, that may be the one thing above all other things that I changed, that helped. It's just knowing that you have somebody to lean on if there's a question or a problem.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Ed Bordi: Sometimes no matter how sure you are and confident in yourself, it's always nice to bounce ideas off of somebody else. It gives you that extra bit of confidence and belief. I think that was one of the biggest things for me, for sure.

Steve Larsen: It's so huge. Well, Ed, what are you hoping to get done in the next three, six months? Where are you hoping to take it?

Ed Bordi: I am hoping to, I doubled my income in the last couple months.

Steve Larsen: Woo hoo.

Ed Bordi: I'm looking to double it again in the next six months, at least. I have a plan to get there and I'm actually very confident that it can happen. I have the systems in place. I have the people in place to help me scale to that level.

To me, at this point, it's just a matter of doing the work and because I really enjoy helping people. I mean, I literally, one of the things that I love to do. I love the systems and I'm a technology guy. I can get so excited about building funnels and software and stuff.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, you're right at home.

Ed Bordi: Yeah, I love that stuff. As great as all that is, there's nothing like helping somebody change their life. I mean, it's literally, it's an unbelievable feeling of somebody really wants to make a change in their life and if you're able to help them get there, that's pretty neat.

...That's what I'm excited about doing and that's my goal over the next few months. I'll probably keep my job.

I don't have any plans on getting rid of it, but if at some point this year things progress the way I hope then I guess I'll see about that but right now I don't have plans of quitting my job.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. That's not an end that I usually rush to.

Ed Bordi: Yeah.

Steve Larsen: Make sure that it's going for a while. Yeah, totally.

Ed Bordi: Yeah, I want to make sure ... To me, it just makes a lot of sense that if I could build my side business. Instead of just taking all that money and buying all kinds of fun toys. I have a family and I have a home, maybe I'll pay off my mortgage. Maybe I'll put a bunch of money away.

...Maybe I'll pour a lot of it into my business to help my business grow even faster. If I have a job, I have some of those options available to me. If I don't, then I'm maybe putting myself back in some of those stressful scenarios that I was talking about before. I'm not in a rush just yet. I'm just leaving that open as an option.

Steve Larsen: Sure, sure. Absolutely. Ed, I want to thank you for your time here. Where could people reach out to you or find out more about you, learn from you?

Ed Bordi: I have a website. It's edwardbordi.com and on my website and on my website you can see all the different things that I'm doing. I can help people with business plans or I can, if they need coaching I can help them with coaching. I also, I am available to speak and whatever.

If somebody needs help with their business in various ways they can learn about those things on my website. I also have a URL, it's called startup and you can get there from my main website too.

That's my coaching program for startup companies...

Steve Larsen: It cut out for a second there. What was that? It was startup what?

Ed Bordi: Startupsuccesspath.com.

Steve Larsen: Success path. I'm just writing it all down. Okay.

Ed Bordi: Yeah, and that's where you can learn more about how to start working with me if you want to join my coaching program.

Steve Larsen: Awesome. Sorry, go ahead.

Ed Bordi: Yeah, so those are the two ways right now that you can get a hold of me and basically what I'm doing right now is trying to find people who are just not sure where they want to be with their business or they know where they want to be and the don't quite know how to get there. They can either hire me to help you to do the work for you, or just come alongside of you and be a coach.

Steve Larsen: Awesome, awesome. Well, hey thank you so much. I appreciate your time here and just going for it and staying with it. That's really, when it comes down to it, just firing a lot of times. Eventually something starts to stick and I think at the crux of it, that's just really nice to hear and see others doing that.

Thank you so much for your time, for your inspiration as well here and appreciate it.

Hey, thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Got a question you want answered live on the show? Head over to salesfunnelradio.com and ask your question now.

Noah Lenz: I'm doing great. Awesome to be here today on Sales Funnel Radio.

Steve Larsen: It's good to have you. It's very good to have you. That time when you were dancing circles around me while I was building these funnels live. I was like man, who is this guy? This is awesome. I was like whoa. That's incredible.

Noah Lenz: Yeah, I listen to the show all the time. I'm at school and it's like new Sales Funnel Radio episode. I'm going to listen to this at lunch. Okay, good, good, good. I don't need to wait until I get home. And it's so awesome to actually be on the show right now. I always listen to it but to be on the show, it's just amazing.

Steve Larsen: You're an inspiration. And I know that every person is going to be ... will kill me if I don't ask the question, how on earth did you get started doing this? This is not a normal thing for a 12 year old to do? It's amazing.

Noah Lenz: That is literally the most common question I get asked.

Steve Larsen: I'm sure.

Noah Lenz: In terms of the whole entrepreneurship game, I'm not really sure what drew me to it entirely. But when I was about eight-ish, I really got into the business of making websites using WordPress and all that.

...And I eventually, my dad's like you need to start making some money off this, start doing it for some other people. My first one was actually for a political candidate in the local area. And I made a website for him and all that.

And then, about a year ago I saw video from who is now my good friend and mentor, and I actually build funnels for him, Caleb Maddix. And everybody needs to read the book Dot Com Secrets. And like okay, I'll go do it. And it turns out we already had the book on our bookshelf so that night I literally ... I could not put the thing down...

It's like oh my gosh. You can have a one click upsell. You don't even need to type in their credit card. Oh my gosh. And I just got so, so into it. And eventually, I'm like how can I do this? Hmm.

And I had ideas going in my mind about what different funnels I could build. But I was never crazy about it for a while. And then, eventually I remembered that a while back I had done a website for this political candidate. And I'm like I really liked doing websites for political candidates. It's things that were kind of easy to deal with. It's the same type thing.

I need to get serious about this...

So I was thinking how could I do this? I could send out stuff in the mail. I could maybe hire somebody to code comp. And then, I remembered Dot Com Secrets. And I'm like, whoa, I can make a funnel for this. So that's how I basically got started with the funnel game and ever since I've just been obsessed with it.

Steve Larsen: That's incredible. That's incredible. So you go through and you read Dot Com Secrets. That is so interesting to me that you did that. As you've been going through and building this stuff and putting all these things together, first of all, you said something that I thought was really, really interesting. You said that your dad eventually said hey, it's time to go try and make money with this.

...That's very wise for a parent to do that. What was your reaction when he said that?

Noah Lenz: Well, it wasn't like full intensity but just one day I remember this vividly. My brother and my mom were at some sort of play or something. And I was at my dad's office. And he was like so you make these websites for other people.

...Are you doing it for fun? How about you think maybe you could get something going here. And I'm like oh wow. And I just was like you know, rather than sitting around all day and playing video games, I just got it going.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. That's awesome. And did he ... Was he able to help you on certain things? You seem like you're just full steam ahead on your own and don't really need ... No one's pushing you along to do this.

Noah Lenz: Well, he gave me the resources.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Noah Lenz: We always joke around about he taught me how to use cPanel wrong or something. But he gave me the resources. He gave me all the resources that I needed. And then, he taught me a little about what to do here, here, and there. But after he gave me the resources, honestly I just watched YouTube videos, read books, listened to podcasts. I just mostly learned it on my own but if it weren't for him introducing me to the resources, I wouldn't be where I am to.

Steve Larsen: What's your favorite part of the entire funnel building process itself? What do you like to actually do with it?

Noah Lenz: Oh, in terms of my favorite type of funnel.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, type of funnel or is it the building or do you like writing the copy, the sales message?

Noah Lenz: Honestly, it's the offer creation. The page building's cool. But I like the offer creation figuring out okay, we have this, what else can I give? What else can I give? What else can I give?

...To make it as awesome as possible but really all around I like just doing webinar slides. I love doing webinars. And then, I also it turns out I'm really good at high ticket funnels so I need to do some more of those. But I like the high ticket funnels but then I also like webinars and offer creation.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. So high ticket funnels and webinars. And I saw recently, you've been really active on Instagram.

You've been publishing like crazy...

You're probably one of my best students ever from the podcast. You're actually doing all of it which is awesome. Now when you're doing webinars, you just barely did one. What is it that you're selling now? What are you doing now?

Noah Lenz: Okay, so right now I need to get more focused and one of Russell's ... Actually, the very first one he did at Funnel Hacking Live has helped a lot with that. But on the most recent webinar I did, I think I mentioned Caleb Maddix earlier, but he used to have a program called Summa Success.

And he also did it with somebody called Emily Shay. And it went great. I think you actually built the funnel for that originally, the webinar, didn't you, Steve?

Steve Larsen: I think so. It might not be the same one but definitely did a while ago.

Noah Lenz: Yeah, on like Funnel Hacker TV or something.

Steve Larsen: It was a long time ago. I don't remember honestly.

Noah Lenz: Yeah, no problem. But you built so many funnels that it's just crazy. So he had all this content for Maddix book clubs, Summa Success, YouTube channel. And he was spending crazy amounts of time on it when it was really just a trip wire kind of like Funnel-U or just like a middle offer.

...And he was spending a ton of time on it. And he also had a publishing company at the time which he was spending just as much time on. And the publishing company was just far exceeding his expectations.

And there were a whole bunch of problems going on with Summa. So he had to shut it down. But it was driving me nuts because I was like he has all this good content but we're just not doing anything with it.

So I talked him in kind of like what you did with Secrets Mastery class to taking all his content and putting it together in chronological order and getting that all like first, in order to do this, you need to do this and this.

So I got it all together in one huge membership site. Got it all mapped out on a spreadsheet, plugged it in and all that. And there's hundreds of lessons in there. But the goal is to help kids become successful and all that. And so, that's what the webinar is for right now.

Steve Larsen: That's incredible. So you built ... Oh my gosh, I'm just blown away right now. You're probably the smartest kid I've ever met in my entire life, Noah. That is so, so incredible.

Oh my gosh...

So you went through ... You put his content in an order that's more easy to consume and actually apply and do stuff with.

And then, you built a webinar to sell it.

Noah Lenz: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Steve Larsen: Congratulations man. It takes the rest of us adults a while just to do that alone. That's really, really ... You should be very proud. I hope that you are, man. That's incredible.

Noah Lenz: And the goal with that was we actually code named it Project Passive Income. So the goal of this, we just wanted to take all the content that he already had and then basically just put me in charge or actually selling it. So that's what we've been doing.

Steve Larsen: Now what kind of roadblocks have you hit along the way as you've been doing this?

Noah Lenz: I've hit a lot of them. Not huge things but one of them is at first, to be honest, I was very hesitant to actually want to use ClickFunnels.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Noah Lenz: I was like that's $97 a month. Blah, blah, blah. False, belief, false belief. So I'm like ugh. But eventually, it's like you know what, I need to get this out there but I don't want to use ClickFunnels. I don't want to use WordPress. I know, I'm going to use Leadpages which I now call Loki Pages.

So I sign up for Leadpages, $25 a month, four times cheaper. So I signed up Leadpages and I get in there and it was not good. I get in there to Loki Pages and I'm starting building out my thing. And I say, perfect. Now it's time to go do the checkout page. Perfect. Great.

So I go in there to the checkout page and it says checkout page is not available unless you upgrade to the whatever a month plan. And it was more than ClickFunnels. And I'm like ah! But I don't want ClickFunnels. SamCart, what about SamCart? So I go run over to SamCart. $25, perfect. As much as Leadpages. Go over there. What do you mean my landing page can only have 100 characters?

Come on now. Well, 100 character landing pages sell better. Okay, sure thing.
I just got so tired of it and I ran over to ClickFunnels and it was the best decision of my life.

And I wish I would have just saved myself that time and all that and just originally went with ClickFunnels. So that was the main one.

Steve Larsen: That's incredible. Noah, that's amazing. What other kind of things do you run into? You like the offer creation piece. The actual building of it obviously I'm sure. What are you doing to get traffic to your stuff right now?

Noah Lenz: Traffic. That's been a major roadblock for me in terms of initial question. But I have been studying traffic like crazy lately. So I am doing a lot of Facebook ads. And what I found out is I'm not very good with the actual conversion type, traffic type.

We need a 2.5 frequency with a $17 ad cap or whatever. I don't understand all that. But I'm fairly good with the copy and just the actual ad type. So right now I'm figuring out how we can take Facebook ads to the next level and all of that.

But I've just been running my own but I'm looking to hire an ads manager where I deal with the creative piece. They deal with all that. And then, I've also been for Summa Success, I've been working on Dream 100 strategy for other big players in this spot, in this space. And that's what I've been doing a lot of. Getting cool gift packages together.

And then, also you can never underestimate the power of events. You can get a ton of traffic into your funnels just from going to events. So that's what I've been doing a lot of too. And I've also ... I used to do a lot more Google Ads. I'm not a huge fan of Google Ads but that's mainly where I've been getting my traffic.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. I'm going ads. Facebook, I'm not honestly ... I don't want to learn how to do that stuff. I can write the copy, the hook part, all that stuff. I love that part.

Noah Lenz: Same here.

Steve Larsen: But the mechanics of it, it's like oh. I'd rather do Dream 100 stuff, things like that.

Noah Lenz: Exactly.

Steve Larsen: Now what are you doing for traffic as far as going to events? That was kind of interesting.

Noah Lenz: So whenever I went to Funnel Hacking Live, I had this funnel built out. And it was a funnel and it was basically like a home page funnel if you guys have ever heard of that. But it was only for Epic Shell attendees. And so I had something on there and it's like, do you want this exact funnel for yourself?

You can get it for only $47 or whatever. And so, it was also just a great list grower. And a lot of it too is just networking and then you can get connections there and then later on, you can go back to those people you know keep providing value, helping them with everything.

And then later on, you can say hey, I have this real special offer I think would be great for you. And then, also I went to one of Caleb's entrepreneurial retreats a while back and there's a couple people there that are on a waiting list right now wanting me to build their funnels around. So that's what a lot of it has been.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Thanks for sharing that. You know I wanted to ... I mean, it's no doubt that you're going to be successful in this. I'm sure you already are which is awesome. As far as looking back to again what got you where you are, what are the books or the courses of the educational things that really helped you get where you are? You know what I mean? If you were to sit down, this is something I'm thinking of right now.

Wow, I wish ... My little girl is four years old and I hope so much that in four more years I can get her going on these kinds of things too. You know what I mean? What kinds of things do you think I should indoctrinate her with, I mean, teach her, that would help? You know what I mean? As a parent, what are the things you look back and like thanks dad, that helped me a lot.

Noah Lenz: Really, it would really rather than waiting, just actually doing something and just going forward with it. And then, Expert Secrets, obviously. I've read that book I don't know how many times now. Dot Com Secrets. And then, also the Funnel-U Gift Package.

That's an amazing, just an awesome package that has a lot of stuff. And then, of course, we also have the Funnel Hacks membership. And just that alone has so much content in there that you can easily be successful with it.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. That's awesome. And where do you go to keep learning the information as well without getting overwhelmed? How do you choose what to learn and what not to learn?

Noah Lenz: Okay, so more or less, I listen basically ... I listen to you, Dave Woodward, and Uncle Russell, as I like to call him.

Steve Larsen: Uncle Russell, nice.

Noah Lenz: Caleb calls him Uncle Russell all the time. And somebody the other day was like no wonder you're so successful, your uncle is Russell Brunson. Anyways, so I basically I study a few other players in the business game but I mainly just study you three. And I just study everything you have out there.

Russell, some days I constantly reload my Instagram like every five minutes just to see if he's posted a new story. I have a zap set up so that whenever he posts a new YouTube video I get a text. So I like crazy study his stuff. And Funnel-U obviously, whenever the new edition comes in the mail I rip the package open, read it right away.

And then, I'm also just always go back and study his old stuff. I got the little marketing in your car MP3 drive and I'm listening to all 257 episodes like crazy. Just going through trying to take away little nuggets. Rather than getting overwhelmed with a whole bunch of gurus, I just study deeply with a couple of them.

Steve Larsen: I think that's really key. I think that's really smart. And I'm noticing more and more, just drinking really deeply from the two or three you love and broadly from the rest. I absolutely love that.

What do you think is driving you to do this? You know what I mean?

Noah Lenz: I think it's more or less the impact because especially with Summa Success, that's what helped me. And I know that if other kids can get that, it's just amazing. But just also at the end of the day, I just love marketing too. Marketing is my favorite thing on planet earth other than my family and God and all that. But marketing, I love it.

Steve Larsen: That's so cool.

Noah Lenz: I'm so obsessed with it. So that's a lot of it.

Steve Larsen: That's so cool. I will never bash public education or anything like that but more and more and more, it's no longer enough to actually make a real difference in the long run for how to actually make money. So I think it's really amazing that you've dove into it this early.

And honestly, with Summa Success and you basically are bringing in your own students. Other kids, students that you're teaching. You're helping them be successful as well. That's awesome. I'm sure that's fast tracking what you're doing as well.

Now what advice would you give for somebody who just, I don't know, they just feel kind of stuck. They see what could happen but they're like oh, I don't even know where to start on this.

Noah Lenz: Well, what I would do is I wouldn't try and be perfect at first. I would just get your ClickFunnels account. Don't try Leadpages. Don't try SamCart. Get your ClickFunnels account and go sign up and literally make a webinar funnel.

Or just read Expert Secrets, Read Dot Com Secrets, and Brenda and Calen, what they did was they would watch a video for like 30 seconds. Stop it. Go do it. And you should do the same thing.

Read Expert Secrets. Do a webinar. Okay, let me ... I'll sign up for Funnel Scripts here. Enter my stuff in. Oh perfect, got a webinar. Let's run some traffic to it. Boom.

So I think other than just being obsessed with it, of course, I'm a huge Russell fan.

I study him like crazy. But don't wait six months to study and then execute. Just execute and then keep studying along the way.

Steve Larsen: That's incredible. That's incredible. Well hey, what's coming up for you next? What's the next thing that you want to go do?

Noah Lenz: A few months actually ago, my teacher has this thing called self-paced math, my math teacher. And I'm like that's cool, whatever. And I really liked it actually. I liked it better than the normal math.

But she was using this Google site and all that and so I was like this needs to be a ClickFunnels membership site. So I went in and I spent like a week building it out in ClickFunnels and then, I came in and I showed it to her. And I showed her that and it's funny because she was like ... There was another teacher there and she was saying wow, that's awesome.

And then, she somehow, I don't know. I messed up. Got caught off guard. She asked me about my ClickFunnels stuff and whatnot so I must have said something about that, I don't know.

But anyways, so then she's like ... What's funny though is there was this science teacher there also in the room and he's like awesome soft skills. And then, we had a science presentation and he didn't want me to use the perfect webinar.

Steve Larsen: Are you serious?

Noah Lenz: Well, that's how I convinced her to use this math program.

Steve Larsen: You're putting your school presentations into perfect webinar format?

Noah Lenz: More or less.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Do you trial close all the way to get an A?

Noah Lenz: Exactly what I was going to say. Does that make sense?

Steve Larsen: Does that make sense? It does, yeah. Oh man.

Noah Lenz: I'm glad you think that. Do you do that in your webinar?

Steve Larsen: Noah, that's incredible. So somehow your teachers are finding out about what you're doing behind the scenes.

Noah Lenz: Yeah, exactly. But what I'm excited about is that ... he's like I need to do this. And I'm like you know what? You can do this as long as we can partner on selling this to other schools and then I'll just give you a certain percent of the sales. And she's like okay. Sounds good.

So what I'm excited about is this summer, she's going to be refilming all the videos and all that, making it even better. And then we're going to do it kind of like Summa Success where we make it entertaining for the kids and throw in funny memes and stuff.

But anyways, so we're going to do that this summer and then, I think we're going to do a webinar to sell it. So that's what I'm excited about too just getting that out there and making math more interesting, at least it was for me.

Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. So you're literally partnering with teachers and showing them. That's incredible. You know that, Noah. I mean, that's amazing. I've just got to stop and acknowledge that real quick.

Noah Lenz: Thank you.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. I mean, I was doing that in college. I had never thought of doing it ... I was that kid that was trying to not get in trouble in high school for selling just random knick knacks.

Noah Lenz: Oh yeah, like the pen.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. That's right. I forget you know all my stuff as well. Yeah, yeah. That is so cool to me that you're doing that. Just congrats to you for moving forward on those things.

What is it that you ... How should I ask this? What is it that you, I guess, as far as this impact. You're developing this talent. You're developing this skill. You're developing the ability to sell face to face, sell ideas. So right now you're going to go off and partner with the teachers and stuff.

What about 10 years from now? You know what I mean? It's that question that I always got tired of all the adults asking me. What do you want to be when you grow up? But I'm going to go ahead and ask you. What do you want to be when you grow up?

Noah Lenz: Really, at the end of the day, I just want to be doing this same thing that I'm doing right now. I mean, I'm working on writing my first book right now. So I'm hoping that I can have multiple ... I just want to keep marketing, just helping as many people as possible.

Maybe having some kind of funnel building agency or other business owners. But really, more than anything just keep marketing, keep doing what I'm more or less doing now, just trying to help as many people as possible.

Steve Larsen: Now I just want to ask one final question here because it seems to be something that you've mastered which is just fantastic. When you have something that is...

Okay, let's say that you're like oh man, I don't know what a funnel is? Or I don't know what this is? I don't know what that is? When you encounter something that is new that you need to learn, what is your process for learning something quickly so that you can actually use it? Because you seem to be very good at that?

Noah Lenz: Really, I don't know. I've just gotten so used to it. I guess I go to youtube.com and I search into the search box how to do it.

It's not that simple but more or less, actually it is...

Steve Larsen: Yeah, isn't that interesting.

Noah Lenz: But I will look it up and sometimes I might get a book on it. I might subscribe to a podcast and listen to a few episodes on it.

And then, if it's something that I'm really interested in, I'll immerse myself in it. But if it's just more or less a simple skill, I'll learn it quickly and then implement on it.

What's funny is the other day, I had a webinar and I realized that there was no chat box because we weren't doing it for GoToWebinar or anything. We were just doing it through YouTube Live with an iFrame on the ClickFunnel page.

Steve Larsen: Sure.

Noah Lenz: So I realized that there was no chat box and it was like 20 minutes before the webinar. And what's funny is in school they probably would have spent two hours saying you know, here's how to configure the chat box and make it look all pretty.

Make sure the welcome message says welcome to this webinar. Make the title is blah, blah, blah. But really, I just wanted to get it going because the webinar was so soon. So I more or less just googled chat box or something. Or I think I might have logged into a membership site or something wherever there was a chat box resource. And I real quick just signed up for it and did it.

So I think more than anything it's just taking action and then, the one thing you should immerse yourself in, if it's anything, is offer creation and then just file building. All the other things that supplement that. Those I like to spend time on but not as much as that.

So when I need to learn those more than anything, I just hop on over to YouTube or Google and look up how to do it...

Steve Larsen: That's incredible. Noah, thank you so much for taking the time to do this and teach the rest of us and share your journey. I mean, it's really, really fascinating to see everything that you're doing here. And the speed, I think that's something that's really just blown me away. Very, very fascinating. Where can people learn more about you and connect with you?

Noah Lenz: So right before this call, I made a real cool link that you guys can actually go to and get this special marketing guide that I normally sell for anywhere from $7-$97. And it just has some checklists and things like that that you need to make sure you have in place before you launch your funnel.

Because I remember when I was learning my very first funnel and then I realized that half the things were wrong, out of order, didn't have everything that you needed on the checklist. And I don't want you guys to have to go through that.

So I decided that since you guys are listening to this really awesome podcast, I will give you guys this entirely free. All you need to do is go to noahlenz ... That's noahlenz.com/steve. And you will be able to get this marketing guide 100% free. No trip wire, no nothing. 100% free. Just because I want to give value to everybody here on the podcast.

Steve Larsen: That's very nice of you, Noah. So it's noahlenz ... L-E-N-Z as in zebra ... .com/steve. Awesome man. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Thanks for taking the time. This has meant quite a lot.

Noah Lenz: Yeah, thank you for having me on today.

Steve Larsen: Hey, thanks for listening. The most common question I get is Steve, will you look at my funnel? Of course. Whether you want me to coach you, give some hand holding and guidance during your funnel build, or simply review the one you have, head over to coachmesteve.com and book your session now.

I have the most incredible respect for Myron. Come learn some of the laws of wealth from his gift of clarity... 

What's going on everyone? This is Steve Larson and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. I have a very special episode for you today. I'm going to be interviewing and going and through and chatting with one of my favorite people in this planet. His name is Myron Golden.

There's a lot of voices out there, there's a lot of people out there that tell you to do this or tell you to do that. I'm not calling them out but every once in a while some not done this, they're not walking with their talking. They haven't actually been down the path.

Myron is one of those people that I have come to not just know and like and become friends with but I trust him, I trust what he says, I trust what he's saying because I know that he's been down that path. I learn so much from him every time he speaks, very excited to have him on the show here.

I would take notes during this episode. I would do during all my episodes but specifically this one. You're going to learn a lot about different, not just formulas but the personal attributes and formulas and steps of the process somebody goes through as they start to learn this whole game.

As I've mentioned before, a lot of it has to do with personal development that's tailored directly to you. That's what you're going to find out as you listen to this episode. He's going to go through and dive in and do also a bit of a recap of what he spoke about at this last Funnel Hacking Live. Very honored to have him on the show to be honest.

He is a published author...

He's spoken for years. He's helped a lot of people gain their goals. He started out as a trash man. He has made millions of dollars now, very fascinating to watch the process and watch what he's done and his attitude towards that kind of learning, towards that kind of process.

Very fascinating, please take notes, you guys are in for a special treat. Just stick around if you want to, decided to toss in some of the conversation that he and I had before we were actually officially making the episode together, a fun conversation will be afterwards, after the very last little outro piece...

I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today...

Now, I've left my 9 to 5 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is how will I do it with VC funding or debt, completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

How's it going everyone? I am very excited. You have a very special treat today. Whatever you're doing, stop.

If you're driving somewhere, pull over, take out a pen and paper, everything that you're about to hear it can be life-changing to you, certainly has been as I've learned from them. We have a very special guest on today who has blessed my life immensely.

In fact, he just barely spoke at Funnel Hacking Live. I went home immediately and I started teaching my wife and my friends and family all the things that I heard from this man.

I have learned incredible things from him. I have immense respect for everything that he does. Every time he speaks I feel like there's just gold that just falls on the floor and I run to pick it up. Anyway, I am very, very excited for the guest today. I want to welcome Myron Golden. How are you doing Myron?

Myron Golden: I am excellent as always, Steve, and better now that I'm talking to you. Thank you for all those kind words by the way.

Steve Larsen: Absolutely. I remember the first time that we chatted really face to face. I've seen you in Russell's inner circle around the ClickFunnels office, places like that. It was after a Funnel Hackathon event, one of those 3-day Death Marches.

Myron Golden: Intense, intense.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, intense, right? You walked up to me and you said something to me that I actually wrote on my wall and I'm looking at it right now.

Myron Golden: Can't imagine. Hope it was something good.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, it was really good. It totally helped. Anyway, I have a wall full of quotes and you're on my quote wall. You said, "What makes you you is the ability to see things others can't."

...You said that and I wrote it on my wall, and I look at that a lot. It has made me look for more connections, it's made me look for more things. I really believe that it's brought me in places that I may not otherwise have been in. I just want to, anyway, thank you for that.

Myron Golden: Wow! Absolutely my pleasure, bro. I call it like I see it. I just say it.

Steve Larsen: I love it, I love it. You have a lot of ... you have a book, "From the Trash Man to the Cash Man", in ways that anyone can become profitable. Really, you obsess this expertise about how the laws of how money work. Could you tell us a little bit of your backstory and how you got into that? It's an area, it's not something you learn that from school. It's not like you ... you know what I mean?

...You obviously have this obsession about this topic and it's impressive.

Myron Golden: You know what I learned from school? I learned to hate school. Anyway, that's all another conversation. I was a trash man, I wrote the book long time after that, but I was a trash man. I was making $6.25 an hour. It's the first job that I got after I got married.

...I can remember saying to my young wife, who I love more than life itself, and I can remember saying to her, if we can just make $300 a week, if I can just make $300 a week with overtime from this job, we're going to be okay. That was my vision.

When I think about that now, $300 a week, that's where my head was. I drove a trash truck during the day but I had a business at night. I had a part time business at night where I sold insurance and investments. I say, I shouldn't say I sold insurance and investments, I should say I sold that insurance and investments.

...When I got started Steven, I was probably the worst salesman in world history. If there was a Guinness Book of World Records for a salesperson who could be in sales the longest without making a sale, I probably would have gotten that award and it would probably last until this day. That's how ... it took me literally that long to make my first sale.

Steve Larsen: Looking at you now, that's hard to believe.

Myron Golden: I know. Even when I think about it, and the beauty of that is ... let me just tell you. I got started in the insurance business, the financial services business in October of 1985. You pro weren't even born yet, October 1985.

Steve Larsen: I was not.

Myron Golden: Right. This is way before that. October of 1985, I did not make my first sale until April of 1987. I was working, I was doing presentation, I was talking to people, I was talking to friends, I was doing presentation to the family, I was doing presentation with strangers, I'd knock on people's doors, I'd talk to people I meet, and it literally took me 18 months to make my first sale and my first check was $125.66.

If you take ... you have to note that if you take $125.66 and you divide it by 18, that's not very much a month. Quite less than [inaudible 00:07:39] a month. I was horrible.

...You say, "Well", you look at me now and not know that. Here's the beauty of that whole thing. I'm really good at sales now. I've made millions of dollars in sales. I've done millions of dollars in sales from the stage in less than an hour. I'm good at selling but I wasn't always good, and that should give everybody hope.

...This is Sales Funnel Radio. You don't have to be good to get started in sales but you have to get started to get good. I got started but getting started is not enough.
The second thing you got to do to get good in sales, you got to lash through the learning curve. For me, the learning curve was 18 months.

Most people think that selling is a talent...

People who can sell are people who have a gift of gab and they're good at talking. I've discovered that people who are good at sales are people who have the gift of listening and people who are good at shutting up.

...Anyway, if you're not good at sales and you're listening to this right now, don't think that it's hopeless for you. That just means that when you get there, you'll understand what you're doing better than the average person who had just came easy for.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, that's true. Absolutely. What did you do to lash through that learning curve like you said? That's an interesting way to put that.

Myron Golden: How did I lash through the learning curve? I was basically optionless. I think one of the reason people fail is because they have too many choices. I didn't have any other choice.

...Steven, you know me so you know I walk with a limp, I've got a brace on my leg. I had polio as an infant. I'm a very athletic individual, I'm a black belter in martial Arts, I'm a single-digit handicapped golfer, but there were no sports teams trying to recruit me in my 20s.

It wasn't like I was going to go and get recruited by a professional football team or a professional basketball, or a professional baseball team. That wasn't going to happen.

I didn't have a college degree so as far as jobs were concerned, manual labor was basically was left. I couldn't lift things and carry them a long way so that was out. It was ... if I desire to be wealthy, I desire to build a life worth living for my family but I've got to make this work. I don't have any other choice.

...The only people that I knew in the world that were making, this is back at the 80s now, that we're making $10,000 a month where people who are in that business. In my mind, the only hope I ever had to get to $10,000 a month or $100,000 a year was to last and get good at this thing that other people had gotten good at. The fact that other people had gotten good at it, let me know that I could get good at it as well.

Steve Larsen: That's amazing. It's optionless. I think the back against the wall mentality, got to get plata o plomo just like girls was talking about, looking at other model, you're modeling other people, you talked a lot about ... there was something that you said right at the beginning of Funnel Hacking Live.

Your speech is just amazing. You said, I wrote it down as fast I can, looking at your page of notes that I took from your speech right now. You said, "Some of you are not willing to be bad at something long enough to get good at it. I stayed in the game long enough to learn the game." It just exploded my head when you said that.

Myron Golden: Yup. I really didn't have a choice. I am a very determined person. That's not the word my parents used or my brothers. They called me stubborn. I like the word determined better. I can remember going to work with my dad when I was a kid.

We might be working on a car or something maybe and a bolt that stuck and it won't come out. I said, "Wow dad, it won't come out." He said, "Oh it's going to come out, it didn't have a choice. It didn't have a brain, we have a brain, it has to come out." I was like, "Wow! It doesn't have a choice. Okay." When I look at learning how to sell I look at, get it, becoming good at business.

...Business is not going to be one of those things that's going to evade me. It doesn't have a choice. I have a brain, it doesn't have a brain, this is something I can learn, I'm going to learn.

Steve Larsen: Where did you turn to? I think one of the things that people run into ... I've got this desire. I get a lot of people reach out to me asking thing actually. Steven, I want to go get this done. I really want to learn this funnel game. I really want to be wealthy.

...I really want to learn these pieces. There is so much noise. There's places all over. We could get distracted with the next book, the next CD, whatever, the next guru, the next thing. How did you figure out what to learn?

Myron Golden: I didn't figure out what to learn. That's the reality of it. I literally learned everything I could from everywhere I could. We're talking about the 80s, there was no Internet. There was an Internet for the government but there was no Internet for the rest of us. There was no Internet, there was no YouTube, there was no Facebook, there were no webinars, there was none of that stuff. On the weekends, I would go to seminars, at least one seminar a month, I would go to one seminar a month.

...Every week they had trainings at our office. I went to all the trainings. I was bad at selling so guess what I did. Watch this. I was broke and I was bad at selling so guess what I did. I went to the library. Remember those things they used to have, the buildings with all the books in them?

Steve Larsen: Yeah, I've heard of them.

Myron Golden: I went to the library and I said, "okay, I'm going to find a book on selling." Guess what book I found. Tom Hopkins, "How To Master The Art Of Selling Anything".

Steve Larsen: That sounds like the exact answer.

Myron Golden: Exactly. I started reading that book. There are three things that I got from Tom Hopkins book in the forefront of my mind even to this very day. They were something that I put a lot of conscious effort into and now they've become subconscious parts of me.

One, he had this thing called STP20. This is old school now. He said, "The key to success in sales see 20 people, STP, see 20 people belly to belly every day and you will be successful in sales. See 20 people. I said, "Okay. Well, I can see 20 people." Guess what. It all starts with seeing that first one. That's the first thing I got from Tom Hopkins, see 20 people.

...What would that translate into in Internet jargon? How about this? Generate 20 leads a day. Generate 20 leads a day that's 600 leads a month. 600 leads a month x 12 months, that's 7,200 lead a year. In two years, you've got 14,400 leads. Every lead on your list is worth at low end a dollar a month for you. You want to make $15,000 a month or $14,000 a month, generate 20 leads a day. It translates, it's just a little different. The second thing that I got from him was there's pain in change until the benefits of that change appear.

Steve Larsen: Interesting.

Myron Golden: There's pain in change. In other words, if I'm going to change from being who I am to being some ... from being the Myron who can't sell to being the Myron who can sell, it's going to be painful.

Steve Larsen: What happens after you got-

Myron Golden: It's always going to be painful until I get good at it. There's pain in change until the benefits of that change appear.

Steve Larsen: I imagine that.

Myron Golden: You're going to say what?

Steve Larsen: I'm sorry, I was going to say what happened after you got that first $125.66 check.

Myron Golden: It was like a floodgate opened. It was like, "Oh! I got this." Then I became the top salesperson in our office like month after month after month after month because I got one.

...A lot of people don't realize there are things that you can only learn about doing the thing by doing the thing. People want to learn how to do a webinar by watching Russell's perfect webinar. There are things you can learn from Russell's Perfect Webinar, no doubt, we all have, but there are things that you will only learn about doing a webinar by doing a webinar, which is why people ignore it.

...He says, Russell says, "Do your webinar 100 times before you turn it into an automated webinar." We want easy streak. Here's the problem, Steven, how I perceive the problem to be. People want to have wealth. People want to have things without doing the things that give them the right to have them. People are frustrated because they can't do a thing but they haven't become the person who can do them.

Here's how God set it up in the beginning. Some people may not believe the Bible, that's okay, I'm going to say this anyway because I believe it since you're all listening to me.

Steve Larsen: We're good. They know, me too.

Myron Golden: Here's how God set it up. The very first thing that God ever said to a human being, to Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden, the first thing he ever said to them, I call it the first command which came a thousand years before the Ten Commandments. Here's what he said, "Be, do, have."

...I'm going to give you the whole thing he said but I just want you to get the essence of it. Be, do have, here's what that means. That means, "Don't be can't do, don't do can't have."

Some people say, "Where did God say Be, do, have?" I forgot "made man". Here's what he said, "Be fruitful and multiply." Fruitfulness is something that you've become. Be fruitful. He said, "Multiply". Multiply is not a be, it's a do. Be fruitful and do multiply. He didn't say "do multiply", just the multiple but the do is...

Be fruitful, multiply, that's a do. Replenish the Earth, that's a do. Subdue the Earth, that's a do...

Then, have dominion over the works of my hands. If you don't become fruitful, if you won't be fruitful, you can't do multiply, do subdue or do replenish. If you don't do subdue and multiply and replenish, you can't have dominion.

Be, do, have, that's the formula. Stop trying to have success without doing things successful people do. Stop attempting to do things successful people do without becoming a successful person. If you will focus more on becoming the person you should be, everything else will fall into place.

Anyway, that's my rant...

Steve Larsen: I love the rant. I don't want to stop you. This is awesome. I think that's a ... there's a little phrase I've been saying. It's interesting people want to ... they want to enjoy progression but have a hard time enjoying the process of progression...

There's this process that you have to go through. I remember when it clicked for me as well. It's fascinating that you said that. I was like, "Wait a second. The first taste of success suddenly all these ceilings got a lot higher and breaking. I was like, "Whoa! Look at everything we go do and create. Pretty amazing."

One of the things that I ran home and taught my wife from your ... from Funnel Hacking Live, from what you taught was this whole concept of these four levels of money, oh my goodness.

I went nuts when I saw that...

I wrote down everything I could, I was writing as fast as you were talking and getting all these pieces together. Do you mind teaching that here? I've put it on the spot but that was life-changing.

Myron Golden: I'm here already so whatever you want me to do, I'm all in. I talk about the fours levels of value. Here's what it boils down to. A lot of people would go through life whining about the fact that life isn't fair.

Here's what I'm going to ... I've got a good word for all of you who are whining about the fact that life isn't fair.

Get over it...

Steve Larsen: Woohoo! Thanks for saying it, yes.

Myron Golden: If life was fair, a chicken would have you sitting on its dining room table tonight for supper. Get over it. Life isn't fair. My dad taught me that one, I was in elementary school.

Steve Larsen: Amen.

Myron Golden: Hey Steven, how about this?

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Myron Golden: I was born, this is so hard for you to wrap your mind around. I was born in a segregated hospital that was started by a civil war nurse because the black soldiers couldn't be treated by the white soldiers. Granted, I wasn't born during the Civil War. I was born almost a hundred years later.

Here's what people say. "That's not fair." Get over it. The conditions of that hospital were so poor that I contracted polio. My parents moved all the way from Tampa, Florida to somewhere in Pennsylvania before I even got diagnosed to be treated. My left leg doesn't ... basically there's a placeholder. That's pretty funny, placeholder. Somebody will say, "Well, that's not fair."

Get over it. Life is not supposed to be fair. Everybody has a different assignment...

A lot of people will talk about, they'll scream from their ... but it's not fair, income inequality.

We have to understand something. We have to understand that income inequality does not exist in a vacuum. Income inequality is the result of something. What produces income? The only thing that produces income is value. If there's income inequality, there has to be value creation inequality. Okay? If you desire to make more money, you don't make more money by whining about how unfair it is.

...Here's what you do. You go create so much value that the marketplace has no choice but to pay you because they want what you have so desperately. That's the foundation of the four levels of value.

There are four levels of value. If you offer value at the lowest level, you will always make the least amount of money. If you offer value at the highest level, you'll always make the most amount of money. You don't make more money by working harder on a lower level of value.

That's something that people really have a hard ... but I'm working really hard. I know but you're working really hard at something the marketplace doesn't value.

Now they have the framework, here we go. Here are the four levels of value. By the way, the three lowest levels have one resource that we use on those levels. The top level has two resources that we use. Here are the four levels of value. Here we go.

Steve Larsen: Please go take notes everybody. Oh my gosh, go get a piece a paper.

Myron Golden: The lowest level of value is called implementation. Those are the people who do the thing. They mow the grass, they hammer the nail, they dig the hole, they drive the truck, they type the paper, they clean the room. These are the people who do that thing. They are implementers. That is not to imply, it's not to say nor is it to imply, that the work that the implementers do is not valuable.

It's just to say that ... it's not to say that those people aren't valuable. Obviously, one person is not more valuable than another person. What it does say is the value that they deliver in the marketplace is not something that the marketplace values as highly as things they pay more money for.

For instance, I travel a lot, Steven. I stay in a lot of hotel rooms. I think only maybe once in the thousands of times I've stayed in hotels, if I ever checked into the room and the room was dirty, I won't back down to the front desk and say, "This room is dirty. Clean the room." None of us are willing to stay in a dirty hotel room that the beds were all messed, there's not clean towels. None of us are going to do that.

We would have to all agree that the housekeeping staff in the hotel are some of the most important staff in the hotel. You can't even run up the rooms if you don't have a housekeeping staff. The housekeeping staff makes the least amount of money of everybody who works at a hotel.

Some may say it's not fair. It may or may not be fair, I don't know if it's fair or not, I just know that that's the way it is.

The key to making more money is not to whine about the fact that you're a housekeeping staff and you're not making as much money. The key is stop being housekeeping staff and go do something else.

That's the key...

Implementation, if you offer value in the implementation level, the resource that you use to make money is your muscles. You make use of your muscles to make money. Because, I'm going to have to do this part quickly, because the essence of money is spiritual, in order to earn more money you have to operate on a higher spiritual plane.

Physicality is the opposite of spirituality. If you're using your muscles, a physical resource to make something to create, to earn something that's essence is spiritual, then no wonder you're having a hard time making money.

I'm going to go to the next level. The next to the lowest level is called unification. These are not the people who do the things, these are the people who manage the people who do the things. You keep the housekeeping staff or you keep the work crew from killing each other, from stealing from the company, and from messing up the company's reputation.

You manage people...

The unification level, you use your management skills to make money. You will make more money than people who operate on the implementation level. On the implementation level, you're going to make on the low end. You're going to make about minimum wage on the low end.

On the high end, you might make $80,000 if you work on Bentleys or Rolls Royce. When I take my Bentley to the shop, they charge me $215 an hour. They have to apy that mechanic probably I would guess $100 an hour. If you're a mechanic working on Rolls Royces, or Bentleys or even Mercedes probably, you might make $60,000 to $80,000 a year as an implement. Why? Because those people value getting their car fixed at a higher level.

The next level is unification. Unification you use your management skills to make money. On the low end, you might make $40,000 a year, if you're a manager at Taco Bell. On the high end, you might $250,000 a year if you're middle manager of Lockheed Martin.

...It all depends on where you're using your unification skills. That's the second from the bottom level of value. We're talking about the potential to make a high five figures or low six figures on the unification level. But the next level-

Steve Larsen: Sorry, I love also that you said in Funnel Hacking Live, you said, "Unification, the lie those people believe."

Myron Golden: People believe, okay.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, so good. When you said that my brain went nuts, sorry man.

Myron Golden: I don't have yet the PowerPoint in front so I'm glad you reminded me that day.

The lie that keep a people stuck on the implementation level, the lie they believe is that the key to success is hard work. They work harder at something that's a lower level of value. They don't get ahead and they think life has dealt them a bad hand.

...The reality is they just signed up for the wrong program. The next level is unification and on the unification level, the lie they believe that keeps them stuck is the key to success is more education so people going back to school and get another degree.

A degree on top of the degree. They get to master the Greek. They get the Master's Degree, they get Doctor's degree and they can't even earn as much per year as they pay for their education.

Mindblowing...

Steve Larsen: It is mindblowing. I went nuts when you said that.

Myron Golden: I don't have a college degree. I don't have a college degree. Steven, as far as income is concerned, on multiple occasions I've made multiple six figures in an hour. It almost doesn't even sound real. I'm not ... it doesn't make me wonderful. I figured out which level of value to work on and I just work in those levels. I do a little bit of implementation on my business but very little.

I do a little unification in my business but very little. I operate predominantly on the top two levels. The second to the highest level of value, by the way, is a higher spiritual plane. You're saying that managing people is a higher spiritual, on a higher spiritual plane, but just going out and digging a hole. It requires a higher, that's why it earns more money.

The next to the highest level of value. This is the third level from the top, I mean the second level from the top is called communication. This is the second highest level of value. The reason communication earns more money is because language is spiritual. Everything about language is spiritual.

The only creatures that have language are spiritual creatures. I don't mean like parrots. Parrots can say words but they don't have language. A parent can say the word concept but has no concept of the word, what the word concept means.

When I talk about having language, I'm talking about as a means of communicating a message. Language is ... communication is the second highest level of value. We see all throughout our society people who operate on this level. You're going to earn on the low end $100,000 a year, on a higher level, you might earn a hundred million dollars a year as a communicator.

I'm talking about singers, I'm talking about politicians, I'm talking about talk show hosts. I'm talking about talk show hosts, I'm talking about authors, speakers, coached, seminar speaker, salespeople. All of these people operate on the level of called communication.

When I say communication, I'm not talking about words that come from your mouth into somebody else's ears. I'm not talking about a conversation for the head. I'm talking about a message that moves the masses. I'm talking about having conversations that create cash flow.

People are really horrible at conversation to create cash flow...

It's really interesting, Steven...When I think about why people struggle in their presenting like people who are in sales. They've got something for sale, they want to sell it on the internet or they create an add and the ad doesn't convert.

...I can almost guarantee you the number one reason ads don't convert and offers don't convert above all over things, the number one reason, sales, messages don't convert is because they were selfish.

Steve Larsen: Interesting.

Myron Golden: What I mean selfish is, you're talking to your potential customer about you. If they don't care about you, you either talk to them about your product, you're talking to him about your opportunity. You're talking to them about your website, you're talking to him about your invention.

You're talking to about your stuff and they don't care about your stuff at all, they only care about them. Until you have like the greatest quality of a very high performing salesperson, the most important quality, in my opinion or a high performing sales person is a high level of empathy. You have to be able to feel what other people were feeling while they're feeling.

Anyway, communication, messages that move the masses, conversations that create cash flow.

...Then the highest level of value. By the way, the use your management skills in the implementation level, use your muscles on the implementation level. You use your management skills on therapy unification level. On a communication level, you use your mouth.

Then we get to the highest level of value which is, drum roll please, Imagination.

...Imagination is the highest level of value that exists in the world. These were the people who came up with the ideas. We were just at Funnel Hacking Live a few weeks ago. My drove on to that Disney property and I thought to myself, "My goodness! This man had an imagination like nobody's- just that one Disney property that we are all. Just that one hotel, that one conversation center that we were on. It was like a small town.

Steve Larsen: Awesome.

Myron Golden: Only somebody would say, "Really, really powerful imagination could come up with something that's great. Steven, I did this at Funnel Hacking Live. I don't know if you remember that part or not. I said, "I'm going to name a company and I want you to tell me the first person that comes to mind. Do you remember me doing this?

Steve Larsen: Yeah.

Myron Golden: Then I said, "I'm going to name a company. I'm going to name the company, if you're listening to the podcast right now, will you say the first person's name that comes to mind. Apple, and everybody said-

Steve Larsen: Steve Jobs.

Myron Golden: Steve Jobs. I say that's fascinating. Why does everybody say Steve Jobs? Steve Jobs didn't invent the first Apple computer, Steve Wozniak did. When people think of the Apple computer, they don't think of Steve Wozniak, they think of Steve Jobs. Why? Because Steve Wozniak was an implementer and Steve Jobs was an imagineer. Steve Wozniak knew how to make it, Steve Jobs knew what Steve Wozniak had made...

I'm going to tell you something. When you learn to use your imagination, when I say use your imagination, the resource that you use at this level is your mind. When you learn to use your mind at a higher level, it's going to create for you opportunities the like of which nothing else can touch.

...Now, the other resource that you use the highest level of value is your money.

You use your mind and your money on the imagination level. When I talk about using your mind, I'm going to do this really quickly. There are a couple of things that you have to ... there are a couple of mind skills that you must master if you're going to create wealth.

...The first one you have to master is you master learning. In order for you to master learning, you have to first learn what learning is, what learning is not, and then learn how to learn.

Steve Larsen: This is so good. Again, it's so good. I wrote all this down too. I'm a big Myron Golden fanboy.

Myron Golden: I'm a big Steven Larsen fan too. We already have that conversation so you know. Here's the reality. Most people don't know the purpose of learning, like the stuff .. like school.

The purpose of school is not learning. The educational system is not designed for people who are ... In fact, I believe that the educational, really, is one of the biggest hindrance in learning because they teach you that the purpose of learning is knowing.

The purpose of learning is not knowing. In fact, knowing is the enemy of learning. In fact, if somebody attempts to teach you something that you think already know, you'll stop listening because you all say to yourself, "I know that already."

Knowing is the enemy of learning...

The purpose of learning, first you got to learn what the purpose of learning is. I'm going to tell you the purpose of learning and then I'm going to tell you how to learn. Okay? The purpose of learning is not knowing but the purpose of learning is mastery.

I'm not going to say, the purpose of learning is mastery...

Then, we're done. Two many teachers use words without defining those world and leave people hanging. I'm not going to do that. I'm going to define Mastery. Mastery is the ability to execute effortlessly without the use of conscious resources. Let me say that again.

Steve Larsen: Wow!

Myron Golden: Mastery is the ability to execute effortlessly without the use of conscious resources. What do I mean by that? I mean you've mastered, I know there's at least one thing in your life you've mastered. You Amy have mastered several but I know there's one thing you've completely mastered, requires no conscious resources. It's called tying your shoe.

You can tie your shoe, have a conversation, and be holding something under your arm all at the same time. Why? Because you're not using any of your random access memory to tie your shoes. Why? Tying your shoes is in the cache. For computer people, you understand exactly. Cache, CACHE.

...When you get to the point where doing a webinar is in your cache, it doesn't require conscious resources. When you get to the point that the one thing, the three secrets on the stack is in your cache, then you've mastered it. Most people are far too content with subpar, unmastered skill sets. That's why like people think, "I'm overwhelmed because this is too much for me."

No, the reason you're overwhelmed is because you never learned how to learn. What you do is you learn about something and you think that's the same as learning.

You take this things that you've learned about and you attempt to implement it while you attempt to learn about something else and then you stack one unlearn thing on top of another unlearn thing on top of another unlearn thing, so you're stacking lack of clarity, on top of lack of clarity, on top of lack of clarity, until finally you feel like you can't breathe. I'm overwhelmed.

...The reason you're overwhelmed is because you have mastered any of those steps. Here's what I know. When you master one component of the thing that you are doing, and you don't add anything else to that until you've mastered that thing, now you'd learn another thing and you master that, now you got two, components master's on top of each other.

You can do a webinar without using a conscious resources. I have been selling, I don't want to sound like I'm patting myself on the back but I've been selling for so long, for me, selling doesn't require any conscious effort at all.

I can totally sell unconsciously. I can stand on stage, I can do a presentation, I can close, I can sell without any conscious resources. I can do a webinar, I'd close without any- I can do a strategy session, close somebody on a $50,000 or $100,000 high ticket offer without any conscious resources.

Why? Because I've done it so many times that I've mastered the skills. Most people are so impatient they won't become a person of mastery. They can't do things masterfully so they don't get to have what only masters have.

Steve Larsen: Interesting. You should pat yourself on the back, that's quite a talent. You married the process, you didn't sidestep or look for a short cut or look for an easy way out. You do it.

Myron Golden: I used to look for shortcuts. You know what I found out about shortcuts? They take too long.

Steve Larsen: They're actually longer.

Myron Golden: They're a huge waste of time. I'm going to tell you something. People who get out of their car, they ate a candy bar, they get out of the car. They said, we'll I'd get that candy wrapper later. Right?

Steve Larsen: Right.

Myron Golden: It takes more time to get it later than it does to take it now. People who leave messes everywhere they go, they think, well, I'll get to it later. Later they get to it and guess what? It's a big mess that they have to take all this time to cleanup. They could have really done it as a ... I'm a little Geeky and a little work but I already know that so I've accepted that.

Steve Larsen: Join the club, I'm right with you, right at home.

Myron Golden: If I'm making food, if I'm making ... I like fried eggs and I eat fried eggs maybe three or four times a month. If I make fried eggs and turkey bacon and toast and breakfast potatoes from some leftover potatoes or something, if I make that breakfast, I will not eat one morsel until I put away every condiment that I used to make those eggs. I put away the cooking oil, the salt, the pepper, the garlic powder, I quashed the pants that I cooked it in.

I dried the pants, put them away ... you say, "Don't let your food get cold." It doesn't get cold because I'm putting stuff away as I'm using it. When I'm done, that's given the ability to save so much time. Wheat happens, the reason I'm talking about cooking it's because it's just what?

How you do anything is how you do everything?

If you are going to always get to it later, that's exactly how you live your business life and you think, "I'll master it later, I'll master it later I'll masters it later. What happens if, you have never network mastered. You end up being just a person who's average and ordinary and you wonder why you never get great . you never get the great results because you've never become the great person who does the great things.

Master one thing at a time...

The other resource you use at the highest level is your money. Let me talk about, can I talk about the other learning thing? I know I've been going ranting forever and ever.

Steve Larsen: I'm loving it. This is great. I'm afraid I'll say something it'll take you out of your flow. I'm not saying anything.

Myron Golden: The other thing that we have to learn to use our mind for after we learned to use our mind for learning, we have to learn to use our mind to harness our superpower.

Every human being like whose of normal mental capacity has a superpower that if you don't learn to harness and use it for your own good and for the good of others, the machine, a cultural hypnotic societal mechanism also know as the matrix, the machine, the powers that be, whatever you want to call it. That thing is going to use your superpower against you.

I'm going to tell, I believe that the biggest things holding people back in their lives is the very thing that could catapult them for, and that is their superpower. They've been programmed all their life to use their own superpower against themselves. I'm going to tell, now that I've talked the superpower, I'm going to tell you what it is. Are you ready?

Steve Larsen: Yeah. Writing it down.

Myron Golden: It's called expectations. Expectation is your greatest superpower. Here's the challenge though. Expectation manifests itself into mental manifestations and two, emotional manifestations. Mental manifestation number one is called faith. Mental manifestation number two is called doubt.

The mental manifestation of faith and doubt are a big deal because ... but those are concepts. One of the things that I've learned and am learning is that people don't do the things they know how to do, people do therapy things they feel like doing.

Most people don't know how to make themselves do you thing, feel like doing the things that are in their own best interest. What I just said right there, that's a gold mine. If you can learn to make yourself feel like doing the things that are in your own best interest, it will change your life for the rest of your life. For instance, people will say, "Steven, I've got a procrastination problem."

I'm going to argue. People will say, "Steven, I've got a procrastination problem. I'm going to argue but I don't like to argue but I'm going to argue right now. There's not a single solitary human being on planet Earth that has a procrastination problem. That's a bold statement, right?

Steve Larsen: Yeah it is.

Myron Golden: The reason I say that is because I recognize procrastination for what it is. It is not a problem, it is a symptom of a problem. It's a symptom of the emotional effect of your superpower, expectation being used against you.

I'm going to tell you what that is. It's called anxiety. Procrastination is always the result of anxiety. Notice I didn't say it sometimes a result of anxiety. I know I'm speaking in absolute and that's because I'm absolutely certain of...

Steve Larsen: It's on purpose everyone.

Myron Golden: Yes, I know. Oh no, but you don't understand. The reason I put off working out is because I don't have now. The reason you put off working out is because you have more anxiety about working out than you do about having a heart attack. Period.

...The expectation, the feeling that it manifest self in and our lives, that steals all of our dreams is anxiety. Anxiety is the thief of all your dreams.

When expectation manifests itself as a positive feeling, that positive feeling is called Anticipation. One of the things that I teach people to do when I'm coaching them, and I'm helping them break through the thing that's holding them back. I teach them how to replace the anxious apprehension of the outcome the don't desire with a joyful anticipation of the outcome they do desire.

That will always, without exception, like there are no exceptions where I'm talking about, that we'll always help a person to take the action they desire to take. We've been programmed to believe or doubt and doubt our beliefs. We have to reprogram ourselves to believe our beliefs and doubt our doubts.

Steve Larsen: I love that because it seems like one of this was a thought that gets tossed around which I have a hard time with is, well, if you're not doing something in life it just means you haven't felt enough pain around it.

...I was like, "whoa! Instead if we flip that around and say, let's find the things that we are in ... and switch that, foot that into anticipation, that's so much more positive than let's go to a place of pain all the time to get something done.

Myron Golden: Pain can sometimes cause people to move but that's because that now they finally have anxiety about the negative result about not taking action. That's all that is...

One of the things that I am learning to do, notice I didn't say I've learned to do, I do it pretty well most of the time but I don't do it all the way, but it's something that I do remind when I catch myself not doing, I remind myself too.

That is to never give any energy at all to outcomes that are undesirable to me. Most people give most of their energy to undesirable outcomes and then they wonder why they have all this junk in their life that they don't desire.

Steve Larsen: Gave it attention.

Myron Golden: That's right. Where attention goes, intention follows. Anyway, that's my rant on the highest level of value. If you learn to use your superpower of expectation, like you can make yourself believe anything is possible. The biggest sale that I ever made like one sell to one person Steven, the biggest sale I ever made was a $400,000 sale.

Steve Larsen: Wow,

Myron Golden: I made that sale to a guy I met that day I had never seen him before in my life. I met him that day. We talked, had lunch, we connected, we thought, "Okay, we'll do some business in the future."

Then I thought to myself, "Why wait till the future? Why don't I just make him an offer now? I made him an offer for $400,000. In a big company, and they needed some help with their marketing, and I came up with an idea that could help a little marketing. This offer that I made them was an offer for $400,000 and it was $200,000 profit for me in my pocket.

Steve Larsen: Wow.

Myron Golden: I made the offer and I say, it's only $200,000 down and $200,000 in delivery. You know what he said to me when I made the offer? He said, "You'd do that for us?" As I thought to myself, "Just as sure as you write that check."

Steve Larsen: Thought I was, should've gone higher.

Myron Golden: Exactly. He picks up his phone he calls his accounting department. He says, "Bring me a check for $200,000". He says, "Do you want it made out to you? Do you want to make it out to your company?" Make it out to my company. Then i called my assistant, had her fax me a purchase order and we closed that deal on the spot.

Steve Larsen: Wow, that's incredible.

Myron Golden: That was because I didn't allow myself to talk myself out of making an offer just because I just met this guy today. I only gave him like a 15-minute presentation with no flip chart, no brochures, no nothing just told him what I could do for him. He's like, "I'll take that deal."

My expectation was ... let me talk about that for a hot second. My expectation is that when I create an offer people will buy it. If I'm talking to you Steven, even though I expect you to buy it I am not attached to you buying it. I will do nothing whatsoever, I will not use any of my powers to convince you to buy it. But I will use all of my powers to persuade you to buy it. Just thought I threw that out there.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, I'm just writing it. I'm just writing everything.

Myron Golden: To clarify, for those of you who were saying, "Didn't he just say he's not going to use any of his powers?" And then he say he's going, I said, "I'm not going to use any of my powers to convince people to buy it.

...I'm going to use all of my powers to persuade them to buy it. Most people don't understand that there's a ... not only is there a difference between convincing and persuading. Convincing and persuading are exact opposites of each other.

Steve Larsen: Interesting. I never thought of that before, that they're opposites.

Myron Golden: When you convince somebody to do something you're attempting to get them to do something you desire them to do for your reasons.

Steve Larsen: Interesting.

Myron Golden: But when you persuade somebody you are helping them come to a conclusion that you've already come to for their own reasons.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome.

Myron Golden: I don't use any of my power whatsoever to convince anybody. I'll never try to talk to somebody into buying something from me. In fact, if somebody gives me a little resistance, like does anybody ever ask you like if you're closing, why should I buy this from you? People say that in sales, right Steven?

Steve Larsen: Totally.

Myron Golden: Ask me that question.

Steve Larsen: I don't know if I should get this from you, Myron.

Myron Golden: Then you probably shouldn't.

Steve Larsen: I love it. I do something similar now, it's so nice.

Myron Golden: If you don't instantly recognize that what I have can help you, you should not get it from me. In fact, you should go buy something from somebody else and see if it works and I hope it does. If you've got any doubt at all, I'm not your dude.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Myron Golden: By the way, that's not a ploy. I am so not ... I already know if somebody's going to buy it. I also know that it don't have to be you. I know that it would be a blessing in your life, in your family's life to have the privilege of working with me. I don't mean that in an arrogant way, I just mean I know what I'm doing.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Myron Golden: If you can't see that, then congratulations, you get to stay on the search a little while. What that does is that frees me from needing them to need me. I am a leader of people, I am not a needer of people. I will lead someone to buy but I will never need someone to buy.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Those are like side ... what's the word? It's like a by product of staying in the game long enough to gain the confidence to have that expectation.

Myron Golden: Absolutely. I know that somebody's going to buy this that's why I don't need it to be you. Maybe you've got somebody who's going to come along and change your life for the better and teach you how to create wealth and maybe you don't. I don't know.

You are not my best chance. I don't say this to people but this is what I'm thinking when I'm a one on one selling situation. You are not my best chance at making a sale but I am your best chance of creating wealth. What are you going to do about it?

Steve Larsen: That's great. It gives them a chance to flex their own agency.

Myron Golden: Exactly. Now, they can't say, "because you talked me into", I didn't talk to you in anything, not me, I don't do that. That is not a game I participate in.

Steve Larsen: I want to thank you for this. Before we jump out here, what would you say to people, I don't know, who are in the thick of it, they're still in the, they're still lashing through the learning curve.

I've often learned that especially from listening to guys like you and my own experience, this little game is really a relationship with yourself, kind of a side story. It's just some kind of piece of advice as well you could give to someone who's in the thick of it. They're still learning to have that vision, that grand vision.

Myron Golden: Yes. Here's what I would say. The struggle is not real, it's imagined.

Steve Larsen: That just made the quote wall.

Myron Golden: What do I mean by that? People say the struggle is real. The struggle is not real, the struggle is imagined. You could take the very thing that you're struggling with and turn it into a game and make it fun. To me, selling is like a game.

It's like the whole business is like a game. If you're in the thick of it, learn the rules of the game, master the moves of the game, and become a winner of the game, and stop convincing yourself that it's hard. The things that's hard about business is becoming the person who can do the thing.

Steve Larsen: Whether or not you are that person yet, that's fascinating. Whether or not you're the person yet.

Myron Golden: If you're not that person, become that person and be cool with becoming. Be cool with all. The other thing that I didn't tell you that I learned from Tom Hopkins, the third thing I never told so it just brought me back to that. He said, "You got to learn to love no."

Steve Larsen: I'm writing it down.

Myron Golden: Learn to love no.

Steve Larsen: That's true, learn to love no.

Myron Golden: One of the things that I created in my training back in the days when I used to do a lot of one on one selling was a fast no is better than a slow yes and a hundred percent better than a forever maybe.

Steve Larsen: That's so true.

Myron Golden: Get people to get off the fence. The reason you're struggling is because you want to get off the fence on the yes side. You got to get over your need of needing them. You got to stop needing people to need you. You just got to go ahead with people and say, "Look, do it or don't do it, I don't care. This is where the train's going.

...Get on the train or miss the train. Be sure not to get run over by the train. Stay off the track." I don't want people to think I'm mean though because I'm a really nice guy. Business is like, you got to have a level of conviction if you're going to be a business owner. Pretend to believe the stuff, you got to believe it.

Steve Larsen: My product's good, I guess. That's not true. That's not how it works.

Myron Golden: Exactly.

Steve Larsen: Absolutely. Myron, I appreciate it. This has been huge. You call your business Skillionnaire and clearly you are. Where can people go to follow you, to get your stuff, buy everything you have, which everybody should by the way.

Myron Golden: You know what, can I start by giving people something free and the only place I have, the only place I have it is on a website that I put up for Funnel hacking Live. I've got a video on procrastination, on how to overcome procrastination and three videos on how the law of attraction really works, they're going to blow your mind. They're mindblowing.

...If you think you know something about it, it's nothing you've heard.

If they will go myrongoldenconsulting.com/fhl2018. If they go there, they put their name and email just send, they'll get the three videos for free. Then, they'll get emails from me now and then. If they want to follow me on Facebook, I'm TheMyronGolden. I think I'm TheMyronGolden on Instagram too. I think it's the same time.

Steve Larsen: I think you are, yeah.

Myron Golden: It might be Myron Golden. If you want to follow me there, those are good places to go. If you want to get a free of my book just pay shipping, go to trashmantocashman.com. Those are a couple of places you can go.

Start with the free stuff to see if you like me. You might just think you like because Steven like alley-oop me with all these fun questions. Go get the free stuff before you buy something. Make sure you really like me, you just don't think you like me.

Steve Larsen: I'm a huge fan. Also it's myrongoldenconsulting.com/fhl2018. Awesome. Thank you so much Myron, appreciate it, this has been very, very helpful. Thanks for going a little longer than I think we talked right even to.

Myron Golden: No worries.

Steve Larsen: Fun to have you in flow.

Myron Golden: It was fun, it was fun. Wow, we went for a long time did we?

Steve Larsen: We did. I didn't even realize that actually.

Myron Golden: I didn't either I was looking at my clock and I was, "Woo!" We got some videos to shoot today so that's good. All good, man.

Steve Larsen: We appreciate it, thank you so much. Hey, thanks for listening. The most common question I get is Steve, will you look at my funnel? Of course. Whether you want me to coach you, give some handholding and guidance during your funnel build, or simply review the one you have, head over to coachmesteve.com and book your session now.

Myron Golden: I got some pretty cool millionaire formulas that are pretty epic.

Steve Larsen: Yeah. I'm actually very excited to hear more about them. I'm trying not to dive into what I want to say in the actual show because what you taught at Funnel Hacking Live was so good.

Myron Golden: Really? Thank you.

Steve Larsen: I ran home and taught my wife immediately.

Myron Golden: Wow, that's awesome, that's awesome. I'm glad it was helpful for you, bro.

Steve Larsen: Absolutely.

Myron Golden: That's why we do what we do.

Steve Larsen: Thank you, thank you.

Myron Golden: I love your podcast too, by the way.

Steve Larsen: Oh yeah, you listen?

Myron Golden: Yeah, I do.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome.

Myron Golden: In fact, I need to leave you a review. You'll know it's me because it's going to start with Esteban. Yeah, I'm going to tell you, when I came to the Funnel Hackathon, you changed my life seriously. I'm not just saying that. I'm not a workaholic like a lot of people in the inner circle, at least I haven't been. I guess I am now that I signed up for this too comical act.

I'm more chillionaire. I'm 57, I'll be 57 next month so I've worked hard for a very long time and I don't really need to make more money. You get to a certain point and more money is like it's totally nebulous. I like living my life. The reason I decided to become rich is so that I could have my time freedom so I could have two things, more time and then choose what I do with that time. I wasn't really a workaholic.

When you talked about the funnels ... I was using ClickFunnels but I wasn't like Russ talks about, "All you want to do in your spare time is build funnels?" I could think of a lot of stuff I want to do in my spare time. Building a funnel ain't even on the list. When you taught about, you need three things.

...You need the big domino, the one thing, the three secrets and the stack. I'm like, "See, I like that. That's like boiled down." I like boiled down. I didn't get lost to the details when you did that. I said, "You know what? I can do that."

I took Russell's Perfect Webinar script and I turned it into an outline and that's how I build all my stuff now.

Steve Larsen: That's awesome.

Myron Golden: Based on one thing, three secrets, stack. Bro, I can do that.

Steve Larsen: Right.

Myron Golden: Shoot. Man, you must got me confused with the other Myron Golden, I can do that.

...Anyway, that helped me tremendously because a lot of the details like are just ... they're just grueling for me because some because somewhat I already know and do intuitively because I've been doing this for a long time, and some of this just because, if I don't see where it's going, the details to me, if I can't see the big picture, the details to me don't matter. I can't process them.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, I get lost.

Myron Golden: You too?

Steve Larsen: I get lost in them 100%.

Myron Golden: If I feel like I'm teaching somebody something ... my gift is pastor teacher. I like to teach people like they're make and do better if they knew better. People could do better if they knew better.

Steve Larsen: That's a good t-shirt right there. That's the next ClickFunnels t-shirt. I think that's one reason I've been so drawn to following is I'm learning that about myself. I feel alive, I feel aflow, I feel like I can help people most. For some reason, teaching on stage, it's my.

Myron Golden: You already know I'm not a workaholic, I'm a chillionaire so I'm not a workaholic, but I love teaching. I breathe it. When I learn something I'm like, "This is so cool. Anybody should know this." Anyway, I don't mean to get all Myronesque on you. I didn't mean to go all soapbox [inaudible 01:04:29]. It is my nature.

Steve Larsen: I love it.

Myron Golden: The name of my company is Skillionnaire Enterprises, Inc.

Steve Larsen: Yeah, I wrote that down when you said it at Funnel Hacking Live, I was like, "That's awesome."

Myron Golden: Got to have the skills if you want to be a millionaire.

Steve Larsen: Absolutely. I'm taking notes like crazy as you say stuff.

Myron Golden: That's hilarious.

Steve Larsen: I always do. I got a full, I got a lot on you from Funnel Hacking Live.

Myron Golden: That's funny. I'm glad it was helpful, bro. You helped me. Teamwork makes the dream work.

Steve Larsen: Absolutely. I'm all for that.

Myron Golden: Me too.

Steve Larsen: Awesome, I'll do my little intro here and we'll go ahead and we'll get started.

It's been said that 80% of success is just showing up. If you haven't made a sale yet... that may be the issue!

What's going on everyone? This is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio.

I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now, I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million-dollar business. The real question is, how will I do it without VC funding or debt? Completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer.

Join me, and follow along, as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business, using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

What's up guys? Hopefully everyone's doing great. I've been outside today, it's a Saturday, putting together this episode. Been outside. A lot of you guys might know this, actually, most of you probably don't: I actually really like yard work, which sounds weird, as a teenager I would have never said that in my life.

But I do. I was the oldest, which meant I did a lot of the yard work. Oldest of six kids, so growing up I did a lot of yard work. And for a while I hated it and then, realize though, for whatever reason now, especially too, it's almost therapeutic, for me to just get outside, work with my hands. Almost all my jobs growing up were labor jobs; physical labor jobs, things like that. I like working with my hands.

Anyway, so I was outside, I just chopped a tree down in our backyard, which is awesome, I'm doing a whole bunch of stuff. Anyway, I'm fixing our pond, a lot of stuff. I really love doing that kind of stuff.

Anyway, I was outside just a few minutes ago, maybe like two hours ago, but I was outside. I was mowing the lawn, I was trimming the hedges, all the stuff I...

Usually I'll either listen to music and just zone out, which typically for me is just as advantageous as me listening to a chorus: the chance to have nothing going on in my head and just let my mind drift. And that's one of the reasons why I like it so much.

Anyway, so I was out there and out of the corner of my eye, I saw the most incredible opportunity start walking up to me. I love it when this happens. There was a door-to-door salesman, he was walking on up, all awkward like.

We saw each other, he was trying to ... does he call out from far away? Does he kind of sneak on up? I love talking to door-to-door salesman because I was one, right? So he starts walking up, and I'm listening to Foo Fighters. I'm blasting Foo Fighters, I'm trimming up the sides and stuff, and I'm just ... I was thinking ... I was thinking about a lot of different stuff. I was thinking, you know I'm a full-time nerd, and I'm very proud of it. I was thinking about offer creation and different things like that.

Anyway, bunch of fun...

Anyways, he walks on up, and he hands me this flyer. He just, I hate it when people just put things directly into my hands. Most people will take it, I don't. Whenever I'm in the mall, or whatever, and someone just walks by and just hands something to me, I don't take it. I put my hands up, I'm like, "What is this?"

Anyway, so I did that...

I was like, "Well, what is it?" He goes, and he starts talking. He's like, "Well, yeah, I do spot removal on like carpets, things like that. We're going to be here real soon, and want to see who else in the area wants to get it." I was like, "Sweet, that was very similar to the pitch I used to give, and it worked really, really well."

And I was thinking about it, I was like oh my gosh, this is so cool. My wife and I just barely were talking about how we want our carpets cleaned. Right, we've lived in this house for a year now, we should clean the carpets, you know. We got a new little one on the way, in like a month, and ... Or month and a half-ish. We're just trying to prep things around the house.

This our third kid, we know everything kind of goes into a coma. You're just trying to survive the first month or two with a newborn. Sort of like, hey, we should have the carpets cleaned. Oh, sweet. That's awesome, do you do full service? And he said, "Yes, yes, I do actually." I said, "Cool, how much do you charge?"

And he told me very briefly in just like one sentence what it was that he does, what's different about him, and how much he charges, and I was like, gosh, thank you for getting right to the point. I'm asking a buying question. The guy identified it, and he immediately gave me a very fast answer of what I wanted, and let me started asking the questions.

And finally, which is super cool, because he did not turn around, and he did not lead with his, he did not lead with this super expensive thing. And even then it wasn't actually that much money. He's gonna clean the carpets, and such, soon. And I almost was selling him on it, 'k ... He lead with what was the lowest barrier thing that he had, spot removal.

Right, it's not an even full out carpet cleaning. Spot removal, that's it. That's what he was doing, and if you think about it. That's really fascinating. We're talking about different value ladder steps, right?

Selling this really high ticket thing in the backend, that's awesome, but usually you got to sell it to really hot people. Hot market, right? Middle of the value ladder stuff, that's more usually the core of your business, but if you lead with something that's super pricey you cut out this whole other market, right? Which is eventually why we will go, and we will start doing smaller ticket things.

Well, when you're talking face to face with people, or even in a trip wire funnel, we don't lead out saying here's all the money that you're gonna spend in this funnel. We lead out with the smallest barrier, the lowest barrier, free, plus shipping. That's super low bare, even though the average car value could be 50, 60, 70, 80 bucks, right?

Right, it is free if that's the only thing they get. That doesn't mean we're not gonna take the opportunity to pitch them on other stuff, right, but we're leading with the lowest barrier product we have....

Anyway, I started talking to the guy more. Turns out he and I actually had a lot of stuff in common. I did door-to-door for a long time, so, did he for a while. He's around my age, and he's like, "I was working for this other company, I graduated only a little bit ago, and I just got to do my own thing, so, I'm just doing carpet cleaning for people." And so, I was like, "Sweet, I can totally relate with that." He's like, "Yeah, I had a sweet job." I was like, "Ah, me too." I just got this thing inside of me says, go do your thing, and so, I did, and it's been freaky.

Yeah, it totally freaky...

Anyways, we start talking for a little while, and struck up a good conversation. Anyways, he's coming back. I'm totally gonna talk to him about funnel building. It's what I do. I always talk with people. Talk about that with people. Gonna get my haircut, I always talk to the haircut person about funnels usually.

Anyway, so, here's the whole lesson though. This podcast maybe a little short. The lesson is ... I've been teaching a lot of people lately, right? Obviously, You guys know that one of the things that I ... One of my isms is to just publish.

Just publish, and one of the reasons why, is this principle about just being present. Did this guy have to sell me at all on carpet cleaning?

No, no, he didn't. He didn't have to sell me at all. I literally, I basically, sold him. I had to ask him like two times. So, you can just come do the full thing? He's like, "Yeah, totally." I was like, "Sweet, so, you will, when can you come by?" I was selling him, why, right?

You have to understand that one of the things that's always shoved down our throats when I was a door-to-door sales guy is that, if we go out and we knock on a hundred doors a day, or if when I was doing telemarketing, if we called a hundred people a day, one or two of those people, of those hundred, there's just gonna be one or two that just say, yes, just because they're just interested naturally.

They're just ...

You didn't have to sell them. This is the part of the market who likes to buy stuff. This is the part of the market, who actually was just talking about getting something similar that you actually sell, something similar to that. Right? This is the part of the market who just, you know what, yeah, I would, sure, whatever, come on, do it. Does that make sense?

There's this principle...

There's this principle of just being present that I feel a lot of people miss. They get this façade of needing to be perfect. That's actually ... It's good enough to just be present to your market. You don't even have to be a hundred percent right. Your offer doesn't even need to be a hundred percent the best.

Right, just being visible is huge power, massive power, and it's very, very important for people ... For example, right, I always tell you guys, right, go publish. Are you serious about this? You go publish. There's this correlation I'm finding between those who actually have successful funnels, and those who don't. Those who do, 90% of the time, they also, go figure, are also publishing regularly. Whether that's a podcast, a blog, whatever it is. They're regularly getting out there.

Why?...

Why? Even if I'm just putting this stuff out there, right now, this episode, this very one I'm recording right now. I know that it is getting in front of people. I'm getting about 500 downloads a day right now. I've got this cool strategy to go grow bigger, and I'm excited about that, but I've got this cool ...

Right, I'm gonna go stay present. I'm staying in front of you right now, right? And I know that next episode, you are going to want to listen to it. It is incredible. It is an interview I did with somebody who is very prestigious. You guys all know who he is. He's an absolutely amazing. It ended up being an hour long.

Tons of fun. I had lots of fun with him, right?

Salting the oats, letting you guys know what's going on, but that's the very point of what I'm trying to make. Just being present, just being in front of people. There will be lay down sales. There will be people who walk up to you.

That's the reason why I hardly ever work with a startup ever. The answer is pretty much always no. And the reason is because if someone is a startup, and they're not getting any sales, and they've never sold ever.

To me that means that they're not even trying because if they're just being present to the market that they're trying to sell to, they should get with enough repetition some sales. With zero sales skill. With zero, even marketing ability. Just by finding people, talking to the right people, who are like, "You know what, yeah, I was thinking about carpet cleaning. Yeah, I was just talking about this. Yeah, totally." And I was like, "Price? Yeah, okay, let's do it awesome. Hey, can you come back in like six months?" He's like, "Yeah." He actually said 12 months. Oh, yeah, I'll come back in a year. I was like, "No, I want it faster than that. We've got kids. There's like ...

Our Carpets are nasty a lot. Yeah, right. Come faster, right?
I was selling him. How interesting is that? Think about this, right? We always teach, right? That a new offer, like a new opportunity, goes and it sells to the masses. An improvement based offer, sells to those who are ambitious, and since most people are not ambitious. We don't create improvement based offers. Right?

We try and we go and create new opportunities, but you have to understand that just by being present, you will find people like myself, who are ambitious, and asking to be sold. Does that make sense? We always knew those people who were slacking off on the phone. Those people who are slacking off on the door ... Because there sales just totally stopped. Just by them walking around with this pest control badge on their shoulder, right? People would ask to buy. Right?

Be seen. That's all I'm trying to tell you. Be seen. Be in front of people. Be there. Be visible...

Right?

Now, there might be a lot of people out there who are not quite at the opportunity ... The opportune moment in their mind to purchase. Right? They should buy from you. They should buy from you, but they're like it's not quite time yet. Right? I've got a few other people that are trying to sell me stuff right now, and I'm like, well, it's not quite time for me to get this. It's not quite time yet for me to do this. Right? But there's a huge market, right?

Out there. Bigger than I know. I shouldn't say huge, but bigger than I realize, right? Who are the ambitious people, who are just gonna say yes, frankly because they know it's an improvement, frankly because the opportunity is there, frankly because we are just talking about getting our carpets cleaned. Is this making sense? Are you guys getting this? I hope it makes sense.

And so, I'm like stop obsessing so much over the actual product, and just be out there talking about it, selling it, right? Even if the pitch isn't perfect. Who cares. Just be out doing it. Right? That will perfect your pitch faster than you sitting in a room days for doing it.

Okay. It's funny because I'm in this cool place in my webinar building right now, where I'm actually recreating the entire thing. Okay, and that's what I've been doing basically this last week. I feel like my momentum has been a little bit slow, as far as output because I'm solely focusing on my webinar script.

I am destroying it. I did it live quite enough times, talked to a lot of customers, talked to a lot of people realizing that, oh, my gosh, this is what they liked. This is what they didn't like. This is what they didn't buy. This is why they did buy, right? And understanding what those things really were. This is a progression beyond a simple ask campaign to people who have never bought from you.

I'm talking with people who have bought from me, right? People who did start filling out their credit card, but end up pressing purchase, right? Those people. That's way more amazing data, and I'm going to them, right? And I've just been present. I know my pitch wasn't perfect, but my funnel is still limping on a single leg. I know it is.

There's so much that's wrong with it, okay, but I've not obsessed over it so much yet...

I know I will...

I know it's gonna be amazing, but what I'm waiting for is this awesome blend between what I know people are struggling with, right? Not just there needs, but what they want, and what I'm offering, and the sales message that delivers that offer. And it's coming. It's real close, it's real close, okay?

I just spent six hours yesterday going through and ripping apart my webinar. Ripping apart the script. Tearing apart my offer. I'm basically restructuring the entire thing. I'm very, very excited. Probably in like another week, we're gonna be gone for a little bit here, but probably in a week, I'm gonna turn back around, I'll redo the whole thing.

All that mattered for me, phase number one though. Right? If you're like "Steven, I don't get it." When you say "Steven go out, Steven go out and just start selling first," but I don't have the product totally perfect yet. Another way to think about it is just go be present. Just be there when people are looking.

Some of the power of publishing. Some of the power of you being out there, is just merely, right, just whenever their eyes look when they're like, okay, I'm finally ready. Okay, I'm looking. You know what? We just talked about how it'd be cool to do this, you know what I mean. You know what we talked about ... You know ... You know what I mean?

Boy, if somebody walked around here and says "Hey, we do sprinkler service." I'm hiring them on the spot. Right? There's stuff I need done with the sprinklers. I know how to do it, I don't want to do it. Okay, I dug sprinkler trenches by hand for a whole summer. I put up false sprinkler lines up, that was, I know how to do it, I don't wanna. Okay, if some guy walks up, does that make sense?

There are things that I see inside my life that I just not need, but also want. And same with you, and you're actually selling stuff, guys, it is ridiculous how many people are asking me for my product right now.

Coming to me, asking me, without me selling them. That means I have found a want, not just a need. I am hitting directly on the pain point. I am hitting directly on the spot where it is an insatiable blue ocean.

And just by me publishing, just by me being present, I am getting sales...

That's the whole point. If you still have not had any sales yet, I dare say you are not present. No one knows about you. No one has any clue that you exist if you have zero sales and you have been in business for awhile.

Just be visible...

It doesn't matter if it's not perfect, it doesn't matter if it's not ... anyway...

Okay, that's all I'm trying to say in this episode, be present. Okay. Publish. Okay. Be out there, be talking with people, be understanding who you're actually selling, okay. Your dream customer, not who could buy it, the dream person of who you want to buy it. Okay? And actually get intimate with that individual, understand who they are, understand that their needs, wants, and desires and go forward that way.

Anyways, guys, hopefully this was helpful to you. Hopefully it simplified things and it's keeping you from, I don't want you to over complicate things. I don't want you to over ... okay, because there's a lot of stuff we teach, especially those of you guys who came in the Two Comma Club Coaching Program, the new batch that we just got, right?

You guys represent my now twelve hundredth person, that I've taken through this process, okay? And understand that, the way the whole game is played, there's so much that we put out there, we know that. I don't want overwhelm to happen. Keep it simple, understand that just being visible with something imperfect is going to be so much better than waiting for something to be perfect. Every time, bar none, every time.

Anyway, there's a cool book, just the title that even says what it, it's call "The Consuming Instinct". That's exactly what this is playing in to. I'm actually looking at it right now. But it's called "The Consuming Instinct," right? Just got it. Very, very excited to start reading through it. Right? This is another reason why you go and sell wants, because eventually you walk into somebody and they're like "Oh, yeah, I've been wanting that lately. Yeah, I really do. I've been looking for something like this." We've been looking to get our carpet cleaned. Right? It's a consuming instinct.

People want to buy from you. So half you guys just aren't talking about your stuff enough, and being loud enough...

Final thing I'll say, there was a teacher that I had, a professor that I had. He was one of my first real mentors. It was probably about four years ago. He and I were chatting', a lot of you guys heard me talking about him, he was the CMO of Denny's, and of Pizza Hut.

He invented stuffed crust pizza. I was running a business at the time, we were doing three grand a week, and it was cool. You know, it was a fun business, it was like training wheels for me, for a lot of different things. Anyway, I started talking to him, and I was like, "Yeah, you know, I feel like I'm just annoying people from what what I'm doing. I'm saying the same things and I'm getting the same messages out there. And I feel like I'm just trying to annoy people."

And he brought me to the side and he goes "You've got to start understand that like" ... It's funny that Russell started telling me this too, but this is the guy that I learned it from, and he goes,

"You've to to understand that you're going to get so much more tired of your thing before other people. Like when you start being annoying, when you feel you're being annoying, that's when people are even starting to notice you exist. Right? You're gonna get tired of your stuff way before the market is, because the market really has no idea who you are for awhile. Right?

You've got to shake them, you've to to grab their shoulders and say "I'm here." Right? I'm here. When you, right, even if there is no pitch or sale, right, you're just being open and present. Anyway, just know that this is going to happen to you, and expect it to. And if it's not that way, you're not marketing enough, right? I'm tired of the things that they teach over and over again. Okay? I am. But I know that people barely starting to know from me, or know me for what I do. So why the heck would I ever stop? Right? I'm just being present.

It takes awhile for a whole mar...it takes, right? To think that an entire market will have your attention, too, is also ludicrous. It's ridiculous. I'm not gonna sway 100 percent of the market. To think that I'm going to have 100 percent of the market, that's not true. I'm just looking for my sliver, that I can go serve, that I can effect positively, that I can bless in their life. And in turn, they will support my life. Right? Like 90 percent of it is just getting out of the door and just talking about it. Just being where people are looking.

Anyway, you guys are awesome. Thanks so much for listening and I appreciate you guys being on here. Hopefully you guys enjoyed the last podcast. That topic, oh man, Questions that Invite Revelations is one of my favorites. I got a sweet one coming up for you next, as well, It's ready, it's ready to rock. I'm just salting the oats, here, okay.

Get ready to listen to it, it's very, very good. It's one to take out a piece of paper and listen with. It has blessed my life immensely. As soon as I learned what you guys are going to learn in the very next episode, I ran home and taught my wife, and I taught tons of people, because it was one of those things I learned that I said "Oh my gosh, this, this is life changing." And it has been already.

So, anyway guys, thank you so much, and I'll see you on the next episode...

Hey, thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Want today's best opt-in funnels for free? Get your free opt-in funnel pack by going to salesfunnelbroker.com/freefunnels to kick in your opt-ins today.

Good questions get good answers. Yet, the opposite is true as well. Solving marketing problems starts with checking that your asking the right questions...

I'm Steve Larsen. This is Sales Funnel Radio, and this episode is gonna just totally rock. It's pretty freaking awesome.

I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine-to-five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is, how will I do it without VC Funding or debt, completely from scratch. This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

What's up guys. Hey, I'm very excited for this episode to be honest though. It's funny as I look back I officially got hired by ClickFunnels two years ago almost to the day of me recording this. Which is awesome. Super, super cool. And essentially when I look back and realize everything that's happened, and a lot of you guys come up and congratulate and stuff like that and that means a lot and I appreciate it. But what's been more powerful for me is to look back and see what I had to do personally to really start winning at the game.

You know what I mean? One of my favorite things that were said in this last Funnel Hacking Live is by Myron Golden, which he just said he'd get on the show, which I'm very excited about.

So when that happens obviously, anyway, super stoked about that. But he said that one of the things that he did to win is he just stayed in the game long enough to just know what the game was, you know what I mean?

He stayed in the game long enough to be able to actually win at the game. And sometimes people jump in like, "This is a scam." Right?

But they were in there for like three months. I've been going at it for like five, six years there, guys and been a ton of fun, really enjoyed it, specifically the Internet game anyway. Anyway, as I was kind of looking back, I've been thinking heavily along the time when we were broke. I mean we were just living paycheck to paycheck.

We're literally living on loans, you know what I mean?...

A lot of guys know my story, the way it started. We were getting these student loans because it was the way we were eating.

And then finally I was like, "Man, I gotta make some money...."

And so I started flipping real estate And there were some complexities with where I was living that weren't allowing how I was doing it. I was doing some double escrows and flipping it that way, it's tons of fun. Put out those street signs all over the place, had 300 people call me in a month and anyways, I was working my butt off. I've never really not.

I just keep moving and make mistakes of commission instead of omission, you know what I mean? so I was sitting back and I was thinking through and there are these times, I guess multiple times and I'm sure that if you really have been wanting this, you've had the same thought. And I guess I'm religious and I'd be kneeling down at night praying and I'm asking God like, "Why am I struggling so much? Like, why? Why am I struggling so much? How come I haven't made it yet? Right? How come I ...?"

Those are the questions I was asking and it took some internal maturing for me to sit back and realize that number one, that's a stupid question to ask. And number two, what was I doing about it? And I was active, I was in motion, I was learning like crazy. I hustled my butt off, went and joined the army so we could eat, you know.

And I had a ton of fun there and learned like crazy and a lot of self discovery for sure. I certainly enjoyed my time there. Glad to finally be out of it, but glad that I did it though. Anyway, I had this guy tell me about 10 years ago, I went on a mission for my church for about two years and you know, he's a guy, we call him the mission president and he's the guy over all of us and he always taught us this one thing.

And I had this come to my mind couple of weeks ago as somebody asked me, they were considering joining the Two Comma Club ex coaching program and it was at the Funnel Hacking Live event, if you know what I'm talking about, go buy your ticket for next year. Okay?

It's, it's one of the best investments you'll ever make...

That event solely has changed my life...

There's not a doubt in my mind. I've a marketing degree and four Funnel Hacking Live events, I can tell you I've learned way more doing that, than I have in the marketing degree.

Not that I'm not thankful for that either, but anyway. But I had this idea, this mission president, he reached out when I did a two year mission for my church. Because I'm talking about those guys were in the white tee shirt and ties with the name badges on bikes. I did that for two years when I was 20 years old. He always taught us that the questions invite revelation.

Now I understand that from a religious context, you can understand what he's teaching there, but I want to take that out of the religious context and let you know that that's still true regardless of any area of your life.

And so when I was sitting down and I was thinking the question, "Gosh, oh, why? Why is this not working?" You know, like, "Please God, how come I'm not making money here? Why are we struggling so bad? Why am I not making the cash? How come it's not coming in? I'm serving? I'm working hard?" It's funny, it's interesting, you know, hindsight 2020 And I look back and I'm like,

"Oh, it's because I wasn't doing this. I wasn't doing that. I wasn't doing this, I wasn't doing that." But one of the things that I realized though is that the questions invite revelation. And that is so true for every area of my life. And rather than sit back and think the question, "How come I'm not making it?"
Instead, I should totally have been asking the question,

"How do I sell this better?"...

You see what I'm saying? Totally different question, and the question affects the outcome. So you guys know why I like putting some dubstep on, taking some caffeine and stand in front of a whiteboard? It's because I'm standing up and most of my ideas will come during that because I'm asking a question....

But the quality of the question affects the quality of the answer and instead of me standing back, start asking yourself the questions that you're asking yourself. Become cognizant of what they are and step back and start saying to yourself, "What questions have I been asking myself?" And if you're like,

"Ah, I don't know why I haven't been effective in this game. How come I'm not making money here or there?"...

Those are valid questions, but is it the right one? You know what I mean? And so there was somebody I was chatting with right at the Funnel Hacking Live Event and there were like, one of the questions that they started asking was ...

I'm sure some other people do this. I know that they did. Right. And I'm not making fun of the individual at all. I just think it's an important lesson. And as I looked back, it's one of the soul things that I have focused on kind of almost subconsciously. Certain times consciously and other times subconsciously.

If I ask the right question, it exposes my brain to that kind of answer. Meaning, how do I sell this product better? How do I make my offer better?
How do i market this in a better way? How do I get it right? And when I start asking those kinds of questions, I will get different answers. Like Steven, look at what you're asking yourself and sit back and be like, "Am I asking a question of ...

Anyway, let me go back. I've already jumped around enough times. Let me go back to Funnel Hacking Live. Somebody is asking the question, "Oh man, Russell, it's $18,000 or $1,800 a month either or for this program." How many people sat back and thought, "Huh, I wonder if they would offer a discount." I had somebody reach out to me and ask me that about my program just a little bit ago. Many people do. "There's no payment plan?"

No, no there's not.

And here's the reason why, and this is exactly what I was trying to teach this person at Funnel Hacking Live. I was just trying to teach. Look, if I asked the question, "How do I get a discount on this? Or maybe I can collaborate with three or four other people and we'll all split the cost."

What are you immediately doing? You're sitting back and you're asking yourself how can I stay in a place of poverty instead of paying for premium. That's what you're doing. And one of the things that has changed my life, and I know I've said it like a billion times, but was changing the question. And instead of me asking the question, because I've always wanted to be part of Russel's inner circle and I'm so thankful to be part of it now.

I am honored to the hilt to be a part of it. But I asked myself the question, how can I afford this? Rather than, "I wonder if you would give me a discount on inner circle."

No, I even worked with him, next to him. I still vox him all the time, but it's not what I am doing. I'm not sitting back asking the question. Maybe he'll just let me in. Maybe he'll just let me get inside. Maybe I can get just this little, you know, this brotherly side, open door, straight into the inner circle. Maybe I can find some kind of discount. No. Are you freaking kidding me? No. What you do is you ask the question, instead of asking, "How can I get a discount?" First of all, take that question and burn it.

Second of all, ask the question, "How can I afford the most premium services on this planet?" Answer that question.

Change it up...

Do whatever it is that gets you in flow, a little Caffeine and dub step for me, right? Whatever gets you in flow. Go to a whiteboard or however it is you brainstorm.

I encourage you to write though, there's something to that. And write out the question, "How can I afford the most premium price ever? How can I afford that?" And when you answer that question, you will be surprised.

First off, nothing will come to your head for awhile, but do not move on. Let your head sit on the problem. Most people will not sit on the problem long enough to hear an answer. They won't, they won't. And instead they turn around and they start walking and go, "Oh, well I can't afford that. He didn't offer a discount. There was no payment plan."

If questions invite revelation I have used this countless times in my business you guys, it's not just over in the place of religion where I was taught, it applies to everything. And so I asked myself specific questions and I do not move on when it is uncomfortable because I don't know the answer. I let my head stay there and

I start asking instead and I start brainstorming, "Well maybe I could do this. No. Dang, that's not going to work. Maybe I could do this. No." And it's usually as I start to brainstorm, little ideas will come to my head like, "Wait a second, what if I did this?" And I follow that thread for a while and I follow it.

"No. This part won't work with that. But you know what? This first half does. Let me take that first half, now we're working with this first half of that answer. Okay now from this point, let me ask the question again. "How do I afford the most premium services on the planet?" Okay, now I got this far, cool. Let's brainstorm, let my head sit on the problem. It's uncomfortable. I don't know the answer. Gosh, I don't know the answer. What is this answer, God?"

And I'll sit there and I start thinking, and my head's going a million miles a minute. I'm finding the spot and then all of a sudden I start finding more the answer.

So people are asking too many questions that are the wrong questions. Just get cognizant of what those things are. So stop asking, how do I get a discount? How do I get a payment plan? How do I do this? And here's the reason why you ask the other question, how do I afford the most premium prices on this planet?

When you do that, what it forces you to do is you end up creating an asset that pays for the most premium services on this planet. So then when you actually are through experiencing that most premium experience, you are left with both the experience and the asset.

If I go the other way and I start asking the question, how do I get a discount? How do we get a discount? How do I get a discount? You find a way to get a discount because that's what you're asking.

You were looking for that answer, so you find it, but then when you're done with it, usually you experience a discounted experience. You have a discounted experience with the thing that you pay for and you're not left with an asset at the end of it. Change the way you're asking this. Look at a different direction.

Anyway, so that's exactly what I asked myself about a month ago.

I was like, "Hey, we've got this cash coming in. My funnels are doing well. I know what's wrong with them, I know I need to tweak certain things on them. How can I make the funnel better? How can I sell it better? How can I over-deliver? How can I get this in front of more people?"

Those are the questions that I asked myself, but then I started asking myself the question, "How do I get in Russell's inner circle like that?" And I told you guys a few episodes ago, I told you about this, right? And I ended up walking into this hotel room and this was the biggest thing on my mind, I was just, how can I give myself a raise today? And that was the question on my mind, and guess what? I answered the question because it was the question I have in my head, not "Will Russell just let me get grandfathered into the inner circle because I sat next to him?"

Stupid question.

Whoever said there's no such thing as a stupid question, got Straight A's in school. That's a stupid statement. That's not true at all.

There are stupid questions...

That's the question that you've taken no time to try and get the answer on your own. That's a stupid question. That's the definition of it. Understand and call yourself out if you've been asking stupid questions, change the question and you will get a different answer.

And it will be uncomfortable, especially if you've never done this before. And if you've been living your life in a way where it's following the patterns of poverty and you're sitting back and instead, how you know you're asking the question, "Why are things so expensive? People would spend that much money on a shirt, a pair of pants at the store?"

Oh my gosh, whatever it is, whatever your thing is, people would do this instead of asking that.I'm not saying you change your personality. That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying change the freaking question.

Start asking questions of wealth and start asking questions of good business and offer creation and delivering for the customer. And speed of cash. So that is the question I'm asking myself now. When I was standing ... And this is the whole reason I'm doing this episode, when I was standing on stage at Funnel Hacking

Live and I was teaching and I'm in my zone. I love that. If there's nothing else I could do the rest of my life it would be to teach on stage is super fun. I feel like I'm really good at it and I practice it a lot and I get my flow and I help people in a way.

It's a lot of fun for me anyways, and had a lot of good results for other people with it too. And so I'm sitting there and I'm teaching on stage and before I got on there, Russell said, he told me that I should stand up and I should call my shot.

He said, "Dude, stand up and call your shot and say when you think this funnel that you built at the beginning of the year is actually going to get in the Two Comma Club." I was like, "You want to put a date on it?" And he's like, "Yeah, it's going to be awesome." And I was like, "Holy crap! Yes coach make it hard." So okay, "Publicly you want me to state this?" And he's like, "Yeah." I said, "Okay, all right." So what I did was I stood up and I taught my portion and you know, I loved it. Anyway, I am extremely proud of the way it went and I delivered it and it was awesome.

And I knew I had connected pieces for people. And then at the end of it, he wanted me to tell everyone what kind of the results were that I've been getting. And for the last month, I'm just being totally honest with you, I've been too obsessed with the question, "How do I develop these other assets?"

And so I haven't really been focusing as much on the Webinar. I'll call myself out and pull myself to the carpet there, call us up to the carpet...

But, I went in, as soon as I stood on stage and without realizing what month it is I publicly told everybody that I'm going to get my funnel into the two comma club for my second ward. I got a spot already on my wall for it that I was going to do by August 1st. I was like, "Oh my gosh."

After the event, I mean, literally just like a fewdays ago I was home, I didn't even think about it. Like, "Wait, August 1st, I told everyone that. What month is it? Oh my gosh. It's freaking April." Okay, April, May, June, July. I got four months.

And I started thinking through backwards, like, "Hey, okay, it's here where I am for that. From here we really are like another 800 grand on this thing, ish. That's like eight, nine grand a day. I was like ... Okay, that's a lot. I've never done that before. I've made eight grand in a day several times, many times. I made nine grand, 10 grand a day, 11 grand day. So, I've done that but consistently, that's a lot, you know, and I'm excited for it. And so that is the question I'm asking myself.

It is uncomfortable and I'm brainstorming. I brainstormed out four different ways that I'm going to be able to do that over the next four months and I only need one of them to hit to really get it. There are four Hail Marys. I'm super excited about it but I got to pull nine grand a freaking day in four months. I mean every day for the next four months to hit it.

So I'm going to kill myself trying to get it. I think I can. And in my head is asking that question, how do I make nine grand a day, which basically for me means I need to be pitching anywhere from, you know, 80 to 90 people a day, which means they need to be getting about 300 registrants per day, I spend about $1,500 a day in ads, which is totally do-able.

So that's just one method. I was thinking back like, just reversing, doing all the numbers. The problem is that when people ask the question, they don't do enough to try and answer the question on their own, out of their own head.

New ideas don't come until you have literally exhausted all the current ideas you have. So as you're sitting there and you're on your whiteboard or whatever, I drastically encourage y'all have one, and write stuff by hand not just on digitally. That's something.

Anyway, I don't know why, but I'm very convinced that, that is far more effective than just doing things digitally all the time for everything. I got legal pads all over the place here, but anyway, I feel like the reason people will screw this up and this method up is because they'll sit back and they'll ask the question and then do nothing to try and solve it on their own. I got books all over the place. I'm reading, I'm grabbing it. "Oh, this looks like I might have some answers for that."
"Boom. I just did that this morning I'm reading some pieces of books for that." Oh, cool.

Okay. Next one, boom, and I'm reading for purpose. I'm reading with the intent. I'm studying, I'm listening, I'm learning for the intent of answering the question. How do I do nine K a day? And that is what I have been focusing on. So, that's the question on my head. It is uncomfortable.

I'm excited. It is a growing one...

Regardless if I hit it, I know that the outcome will be better processes, better performance for myself, discovering new ways to sell things that probably people in the market aren't doing. Cash. The byproduct is that I can't think of a thing that's going to be negative as I try and solve this problem. So that's what I'm trying to say.

Upgrade your problem, upgrade your question and ask the right ones. Make sure the questions you're asking are questions of wealth, not poverty. Make sure that you're trying to find ways like literally, that's what I'm saying before.

I was like, "How can I afford Russell's inner circle stuff? Guys, now I went and I created an asset in the last month. It pays me like at least 15 to $30,000 a month from now besides my funnel. Boom, boom, boom, boom. Right? Crazy. Crazy. I'm so excited.

That's nuts...

I removed my cost of goods for this funnel there. I don't take cash. And anyway, that's a whole different thing. And I went and I have already talked about that, but that's what I asked myself. So that's what I answered. And so now it's time for me to change the question and go focus on that and I'm excited to do so.

So anyway, that was an intense episode. Hey guys, thanks so much. I appreciate it. Again, this is my ... I would love again to get some reviews from you guys on iTunes. That would be super helpful and if you've had any piece of nuggets or any nugget or whatever or something like that, that's really helped you, I would love to hear about it.

Whether if it's a personally or that's what you put in the review on iTunes. Or, if you just tell someone else even. I really appreciate that. I am very serious about what I'm doing here, but it's a ton of fun and really been enjoying this ride with you guys. So, anyways, thank you so much.

I appreciate it. I will continue to document both my processes and methods and why I'm doing what I'm doing as I move down this path. So anyways guys, thank you so much. I appreciate it. And I will talk to you later.

Thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Hey, you want me to speak at your next event or mastermind? Let me know what I can share. It will be most valuable by going to stevejlarsen.com and book my time now.